Armor donning times

[Skrum]

Armor takes a long time to put on or take off. Shields take an action to do the same. I don't mind the armor times so much; changing clothes in combat is silly.

But - the shield time really bothers me. Losing an action is incredibly punishing, but I also hate the idea of characters *always* having their shield on and ready to go. Should be a bonus action, so characters can plausibly do things like drop their shield for a grapple, or quickly ready their shield if they're ambushed.

How do your tables manage this?

[Mastikator]

If I'm using a shield then my character is just strapped in. He still has a free hand and if need be can switch out and in easy peasy lemon squeezy.

[Skrum]

If I'm using a shield then my character is just strapped in. He still has a free hand and if need be can switch out and in easy peasy lemon squeezy.

So you're literally sleeping, walking around town, conducting business, all with a shield strapped to your arm?

[Psyren]

You could rule that Shield Master allows the character to Don and Doff it either as a bonus action or object interaction

[Zhorn]

I run the shield don/doff timing RAW at baseline.
The action cost makes it a meaningful tactical choice to swap about during combat, or to force such an exchange on an opponent.

However, I also take the approach of awarding my players extra perks while levelling up to match their quest objectives and personal style/arcs. As a small bonus, the benefits of the Shield Training feat from the 2020 Feats UA has a nice benefit that I find works well for characters that have invested into shields in their primary build, or have built around dynamically adjusting their weapon arrangements during combat.

So; Action don/doff most of the time
Object interaction if your character has invested in a way to justify the perk.

[Catullus64]

I've broken shields into three types, with their AC bonus scaling inversely with action requirements.

Small Shields grant +1 AC, and can be donned or doffed as part of the same Interaction with the Environment that you use to draw or stow a weapon.

Medium Shields grant +2 AC, and can be donned or doffed as a bonus action.

Large Shields grant +3 AC, and require your action to don/doff as normal.

Rather than have shield proficiency be its own thing, I tie proficiency with each type of shield to Light, Medium, and Heavy armor proficiency respectively.

Personally, I find the 10 minutes to don heavy armor a little silly in all cases except plate. No way it should take that long to put on a mail hauberk, even with gauntlets included. I absolutely understand why it is written that way by default, and the simplicity is probably valuable at most tables. Me, I play the donning/doffing times of all armors by ear, based on the description of the armor itself, and haven't had any serious complaints.

Looking at the PHB, it also seems that the halved time from having assistance only applies to doffing armor, not donning it. Weird.

[Yakk]

Don armor: Every minute you gain 1 AC. (The dex cap applies immediately for simplicities sake, enchanted bonus after you gain at least 1 point of AC).

You can make a DC equal to the armor's full (no dex) AC Strength(Athletics) check to instead gain 1d4 points of AC in a minute, but on failure you have damaged the armor and go backwards 1d4 points (and are unable to advance until you repair the armor). (if you are doing this with leather armor and get a 4 on the 1d4, it takes 3 rounds).

Add +10 to the DC and gain 1d4 points of AC per action; a 18 strength expertise athletics (+10) character has a +14 modifier. Trying to put on Plate insanely fast (DC 28) with help (advantage) they need a 14+; 42% chance of failure per action, ~3 rounds to put it on, so under 20% chance of being able to fully gear up in 3 rounds (but not a zero chance!)


Doff armor: Removing armor without damaging it requires 1 minute per 2 AC. AC is lost at the start of the minute (as the armor is askew). Removing armor while damaging it requires 1 action per 1d4 AC (cutting straps etc), and requires the armor to be repaired. It can only be done on helpless unwilling targets, or on a willing target.

Doff shield: 1 bonus action if you are willing to damage it, 1 action otherwise.

Shield Master Feat: Donning/doffing a shield is a bonus action. You can doff a shield as an object interaction if you are willing to damage it.

Repairing damaged armor/shields requires appropriate tools and proficiencies, supplies and an hour of work per 2 points of AC.

---

So if subject to heat metal, someone in plate could start cutting their armor off and get someone else to help, and remove 2d4 points of AC; after 1-2 rounds no longer have it on. The resulting armor would be damaged, and require 4 hours of work with appropriate tools to repair (probably cut leather straps).

Being able to put on armor quickly is somewhat possible.

[Greywander]

So you're literally sleeping, walking around town, conducting business, all with a shield strapped to your arm?
No, you only don the shield when you're expecting trouble. This is one of the reasons why bucklers and parrying daggers were popular, despite being much less effective than a shield: they were easier to carry around for self defense.

It's like how polearms were much more effective than swords, but you're not exactly going to bring a pike with you when you go grocery shopping.

[cZak]

So does a plasmoid just disregard this?

Amorphous - You can squeeze through a space as narrow as 1 inch wide, provided you are wearing and carrying nothing

Just flow into/out of as an action

[Slipjig]

So does a plasmoid just disregard this?

Amorphous - You can squeeze through a space as narrow as 1 inch wide, provided you are wearing and carrying nothing

Just flow into/out of as an action

Flowing out of it, definitely. Flowing into it... I'd let them do it faster, but still probably more than an action for multi-piece armor, unless the armor is deliberately laid out in the exact layout they'll be assuming.

[Psyren]

So does a plasmoid just disregard this?

Amorphous - You can squeeze through a space as narrow as 1 inch wide, provided you are wearing and carrying nothing

Just flow into/out of as an action

If the DM wants them to. As with all unspecified/improvised actions, you state what you want to do and the DM narrates the result - which can be "you can't."

[Idkwhatmyscreen]

Enforcement of Armor Donning is just a needless penalty to enforce on martial characters, especially ones who use Str instead of Dex as thier primary stat

Is it realistic? Sure, but the end result is that you wear your armor everywhere at all time no exceptions. Sure you have to take it off to sleep, but you could always play one of those races that doesn't sleep. It's better then having 9-11 AC during a random encounter

[Sigreid]

Thanks to a hobby I used to have, I've worn the armor and carried the shields. They do indeed take time to get ready for battle, so that's fair. I also know first hand that it is extremely comfortable to sleep in most armor types. So there's no real reason to make them sleep out of armor except writers not really knowing what that's like.

[Skrum]

Enforcement of Armor Donning is just a needless penalty to enforce on martial characters, especially ones who use Str instead of Dex as thier primary stat

Is it realistic? Sure, but the end result is that you wear your armor everywhere at all time no exceptions. Sure you have to take it off to sleep, but you could always play one of those races that doesn't sleep. It's better then having 9-11 AC during a random encounter

I don't mind characters always wearing armor so much. I'm more bothered by then walking everywhere with their shield on their arm.

Further, shields take up one of your hands in a very inconvenient way. I'd prefer if characters had a possible tactical choice to drop their shield in combat, if they really needed another hand. Usually for grappling, but also for casting a spell.

[Greywander]

I seem to remember some time ago working on an overhaul of the armor system, part of which was revamping shields. I broadly divided shields into either centergrip or strap-on, with centergrip shields being donnable as an object interaction, same as drawing a weapon, while strap-on shields require the full action. Centergrip shields could be disarmed, though, and strap-on shields allowed you to hold and use items, but you couldn't wield a weapon in that hand. I also had a buckler, a small centergrip shield you could easily carry on your person without needing to hold it in your hand, but it only gave +1 AC.

In any case, I think this is one of those things where there's some room to expand on what's already there. Having only one type of shield makes things nice and simple, but having more options with slightly different features allows for more nuance and customization.

[Mastikator]

So you're literally sleeping, walking around town, conducting business, all with a shield strapped to your arm?

If I'm expecting to be ambushed at any time, yes, I'll sleep in light armor, shielded up and with a sword under my pillow. If I expect business to involve violent negotiations then I'll wear my shield and armor to the meeting.

[Schwann145]

Nothing in the rules says a shield is definitely strapped to your arm, so the rule that it takes a full action to doff it is absolutely stupid.

Did some shields strap to your arm? Sure.
Did some shields just have a handle and nothing else? You bet.

If I envision my character's shield as the latter (like a bossed round shield) then I'm going to be quite upset that "opening my hand and dropping my shield" is going to cost me an entire action.

[5eNeedsDarksun]

We allow a shield as a BA.
Also, a chain shirt doff or don as an action.

[Greywander]

Nothing in the rules says a shield is definitely strapped to your arm, so the rule that it takes a full action to doff it is absolutely stupid.

Did some shields strap to your arm? Sure.
Did some shields just have a handle and nothing else? You bet.

If I envision my character's shield as the latter (like a bossed round shield) then I'm going to be quite upset that "opening my hand and dropping my shield" is going to cost me an entire action.
Then you have to house rule additional types of shields into the game (see my previous post). RAW, shields, any shield, all shields, require an action to don, and an action to doff. As you say, it would be ridiculous if it requires an action to simply let go of a centergrip shield, which most likely means that such shields do not exist in D&D. Every shield is strapped onto the arm.

Personally, I'm in favor of adding some variety to shields. A strap-on shield that allows you to use items or manipulate the environment (e.g. open doors) using that hand offers a nice utility trade-off compared to a centergrip shield that can be more quickly equipped or dropped but takes up the entire hand.

[Mastikator]

Armor Proficiency. Anyone can put on a suit of armor or strap a shield to an arm.

On a side note I think you'd be REAL annoyed when suddenly every enemy starts using shields with only their bonus action. Players often argue in favor of "realism" or that "the rules are stupid" when it benefits them, it always turns sour when it hurts them instead.

It'd be cool if there were different kinds of shields and straps were optional and did something. But that's a different game.

[Psyren]

Eh, most monsters either have no shield at all, or it's already baked into their AC. And even when you're fighting someone who isn't already using one but can pick one up, you'd have to be fighting them somewhere where one is lying around.

Making shields easier to don is much more likely to benefit the players than it is to benefit monsters I'd say.

[diplomancer]

Eh, most monsters either have no shield at all, or it's already baked into their AC. And even when you're fighting someone who isn't already using one but can pick one up, you'd have to be fighting them somewhere where one is lying around.

Making shields easier to don is much more likely to benefit the players than it is to benefit monsters I'd say.

Goblin's 15 AC is notorious for that; their AC should be 13 without shields, 15 with shields... but one of their actions is shortbow, and that doesn't change their AC.

[Martin Greywolf]

Speaking from historical perspective - if you are wearing armor and/or shield on yourself about town, you are about to get thrown into the city dungeon by the watch and then either fined or publicly spanked. Hell, even carrying a full-sized sword at your side is illegal, often times even if you are a noble.

Point is, there are social expectations for you, and if you break them it will have consequences. Wandering around town in armor with shields strapped to your arm is kinda like going to Wallmart in bulletproof vest, carrying a grenade launcher. Is it legal? Sometimes. Will any and all authorities watch you really, really closely? You bet. Will people think you are a weirdo who is not to be trusted? Probably.

This sort of fidelity in social interactions isn't for every game, if you are doing the wilderness survival dungeoncrawl with minimal social interaction, ignore it. But if you aren't, the people should react to your character pretty much how people in Bree reacted to Aragorn - with great suspicion.

That said, this goes both ways. If you are DMing a game where these social expectations exist, you need to account for them in encounter design. And the players need to be on board. Being ambushed by assassins that don't follow the law every session gets tiresome and the players will be right to just keep armor on at all times.

Shields specifically are odd. Some types of shields can take a few seconds to put on and off, but others don't. One of the main features of a centergrip shield is that you can drop it in fraction of a second if it gets too damaged or someone tries to break your arm with it. Then and again, you need to consider that most shields are worn on the back via guige and to properly use the shield, you need to remove the guige from your back entirely. Unless you don't, because kite shields work just fine with a guige still on you, unlike round or heater.

The long and short of it is that DnD doesn't handle shield variety really well. Its shield seems to be your standard herladic strapped heater shield and no other types exist. If we're talking from a simulationist point of view, yeah, that one should probably take an action to deploy, but it also should give you hell of a lot more to AC, maybe even as much as +3 or +5.

[Leon]

It's like how polearms were much more effective than swords, but you're not exactly going to bring a pike with you when you go grocery shopping.

Its why you buy the Pike at the fishmongers last

[Kurt Kurageous]

Thanks to a hobby I used to have, I've worn the armor and carried the shields. They do indeed take time to get ready for battle, so that's fair. I also know first hand that it is extremely comfortable to sleep in most armor types. So there's no real reason to make them sleep out of armor except writers not really knowing what that's like.

Pretty sure I had the same hobby, and I agree with all of your conclusions. Sleeping in a helmet is not comfortable, though.

I have ignored the don/doff table for the same reason you do. Almost all armors are meant to be put on about as quickly as clothes, and come off the same way. Perhaps full/field/jousting plate takes a little longer as the legs require suspenders, but a chainmail hauberk? It practically slides on (unless it tangles with hair).

[Damon_Tor]

Personally, I find the 10 minutes to don heavy armor a little silly in all cases except plate. No way it should take that long to put on a mail hauberk, even with gauntlets included. I absolutely understand why it is written that way by default, and the simplicity is probably valuable at most tables. Me, I play the donning/doffing times of all armors by ear, based on the description of the armor itself, and haven't had any serious complaints.

If I were inclined to houserule this I would simply do it by weight/10. So Full Plate would take 6.5 minutes to don, Half Plate would take 4, Studded Leather Armor would take 1.3.

[Schwann145]

The thing about armor is that you're not just wearing the named armor. For instance:
If you're putting on chain, first you have to start by putting on your gambeson (padded armor) which requires a bit of tying in place. Then you slip the actual chain overtop and, basically, jump/shake it into place. Then you secure a belt. Then you strap gauntlets on (strap, not slip). Then you put your helmet or coif on, which doesn't take long but isn't as quick as tossing on a hat - you actually have to place it correctly so the chain drapes properly.
Then, assuming you didn't have foot or leg protection (the game doesn't mention any so I didn't assume it), you're done.
Now, that certainly doesn't take the 10 minutes that plate armor would require, but it definitely takes several minutes, and absolutely more than a couple rounds.

And, just to point out, for plate armor it would actually take about 10 minutes with help to be accurate. The fact that you can do it in 5 w/ help in-game is already unrealistically speedy.

I stand by my earlier complaint about shields though. :P

[Sigreid]

In the ancient days, it was probably an attempt to be realistic. now days I think it's probably there just to give DM's the option of depriving their heavily armored types of their armor for a fight once in a while. Similar to an anti magic zone to deprive casters of their tricks and make them think outside the box. Which is fine if it's not over done.

[Corsair14]

Pretty sure I had the same hobby, and I agree with all of your conclusions. Sleeping in a helmet is not comfortable, though.

I have ignored the don/doff table for the same reason you do. Almost all armors are meant to be put on about as quickly as clothes, and come off the same way. Perhaps full/field/jousting plate takes a little longer as the legs require suspenders, but a chainmail hauberk? It practically slides on (unless it tangles with hair).

Yes and no. A chain mail suit requires you to don not only the chain, and belt it. But you also have the gambeson under it and padding under the head piece. If you arent wearing the gambeson then dont bother with the armor as you will get bludgeoned to death by the very weapons chain is designed to stop. Also unbelted, then it is going to throw your balance off as it tangles, all the weight will sit at the shoulder throwing your swings off and tiring you quickly and it will probably get caught on your legs quite a bit as it hangs low as well.

Ye Ol breastplate is more than just a clam shell. To get the full effect you still have the full chain mail suit + helm and everything under it with a breastplate on top. All of which has to be put in in a certain order.

Historically speaking, not taking SCA short cuts like we all do(did) even a simple chain suit takes a while and has a lot of parts. Thats not even counting glove/mittons/gauntlets. In a cool environment you could probably get away with sleeping in a gambeson, but nothing warmer than cool, same with the head padding.

Shields are their own thing and while center grips are common in early period, they do phase out later on and strapped are the norm by the chivalric middle ages where most DND campaigns are set. I dont even count bucklers, dex fighters did not exist in real life outside dueling clubs. Its easier just to say it takes a round to strap one on and make it a universal houserule unless you want to go granular.

I wore gladiator armor and as minimal armor as that was(literal society minimums+ shoulder), it would take a good 5-10 minutes to get fully geared up when I was in a hurry. A suit of plate armor, even 14th century, with a page helping would take 20 minutes easy. If armor only consisted of the hard kit then sure, maybe ten minutes but there is a lot more to it than that. There are a few videos on youtube that go through the process of armoring up at different century standards. I would post them but mods dont seem to like outside links. Ola Onsrud and the Metatron have some very good videos on the subject, Ola's especially is great