Outsider Vampires

[tepes]

So on this forum and others I have heard tale of a web article that wizards made that detailed how to apply vampirism to outsiders using a demon as the example, but for the life of me I cant find it.
so my question to my fellow playground'ers is whether anyone has a link the exact article archive or if not if anyone could list off everything important (like whether they're outsiders or undead... or both?)

thanks in advance:smalltongue:


EDIT: secondary question, what happens when a template would cause a undead to loose the undead type (specifically turned to an outsider)? can it not happen by raw or would the type simply change and they loose the features of the type or would they loose ALL the powers & ability's related to they're undead status?

[ShurikVch]

Vampiric Dog-Demon - in Creatures That Cannot Be (https://web.archive.org/web/20161031214958/http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/eo/20060407a)

[tepes]

Vampiric Dog-Demon - in Creatures That Cannot Be (https://web.archive.org/web/20161031214958/http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/eo/20060407a)

thank you ;)

[Biggus]

A couple of similar things which might or might not be of interest:

The ELH monster the Atropal (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/monsters/abomination.htm#atropal) is treated as both an undead and an outsider in some respects: it has both abomination traits ("Abominations are a grouping of the outsider type in the same way that demons are a grouping of the outsider type") and undead traits, and is listed as both in the 3e monster index (https://web.archive.org/web/20161101181239/http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/lists/monsters&tablesort=5).

The spell Vile Death (SpC) allows you to "summon the spirit of a fiend from the depths of the Nine Hells or the Abyss and bind it into the body of a corporeal undead creature", which gives it the fiendish template permanently.

[redking]

The blood fiend is an outsider vampire.

[Inevitability]

EDIT: secondary question, what happens when a template would cause a undead to loose the undead type (specifically turned to an outsider)? can it not happen by raw or would the type simply change and they loose the features of the type or would they loose ALL the powers & ability's related to they're undead status?

Savage Species says:


Once a creature becomes an undead or a construct through the application of a template, it cannot become something else.

Of course, this is part of the very questionable 'type pyramid' that might just be considered obsolete in the face of 3.5, and at any rate it wouldn't cover non-templated undead like nightshades.

A templated undead creature would keep most undead features (depending on the template that causes it to stop becoming undead), but whether or not it possesses undead traits still is unclear. There's a school of thought where templated creatures keep their original and new traits both, and a school where they only possess the traits of their newest type. Both have their issues: if creatures keep their old traits, that leads to obvious contradictions (outsiders breathe, but undead don't, so do undead outsiders? what about outsider undead?). However, if creatures lose traits of their old type, that leads to weird situations like a warhorse suddenly losing its armor proficiency if it becomes a magical beast somehow (such as by casting Demonic Blood Infusion on it)

[Saintheart]

Of course, this is part of the very questionable 'type pyramid' that might just be considered obsolete in the face of 3.5, and at any rate it wouldn't cover non-templated undead like nightshades.

It also presumably doesn't cover the Incarnate Construct template, which is from the same book and which changes the type to humanoid.