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View Full Version : Optimization Sentinel + Polearm Master + Tunnel Fighter + War Caster + Booming Blade



Kerilstrasz
2022-09-17, 02:54 PM
I guess everyone knows where i'm going with it,
but i want to run the specifics, and have you correct me where i am wrong.

First of all, some spoilers for each of those feat/ures for your ease of access.

Sentinel
Source: Player's Handbook
You have mastered techniques to take advantage of every drop in any enemy's guard, gaining the following benefits.
When you hit a creature with an opportunity attack, the creature's speed becomes 0 for the rest of the turn.
Creatures provoke opportunity attacks from you even if they take the Disengage action before leaving your reach.
When a creature makes an attack against a target other than you (and that target doesn't have this feat),
you can use your reaction to make a melee weapon attack against the attacking creature.

Polearm Master
Source: Player's Handbook
You gain the following benefits:
When you take the Attack action and attack with only a glaive, halberd, quarterstaff, or spear,
you can use a bonus action to make a melee attack with the opposite end of the weapon.
This attack uses the same ability modifier as the primary attack. The weapon's damage die for this attack is a d4, and it deals bludgeoning damage.
While you are wielding a glaive, halberd, pike, quarterstaff, or spear, other creatures provoke an opportunity attack from you when they enter the reach you have with that weapon.

Tunnel Fighter (UA).
As a bonus action, you can enter a defensive stance that lasts until the start of your next turn.
While in your defensive stance, you can make opportunity attacks without using your reaction,
and you can use your reaction to make a melee attack against a creature that moves more than 5 feet while within your reach.

War Caster
Source: Player's Handbook
Prerequisite: The ability to cast at least one spell
You have practiced casting spells in the midst of combat, learning techniques that grant you the following benefits:
You have advantage on Constitution saving throws that you make to maintain your concentration on a spell when you take damage.
You can perform the somatic components of spells even when you have weapons or a shield in one or both hands.
When a hostile creature's movement provokes an opportunity attack from you, you can use your reaction to cast a spell at the creature,
rather than making an opportunity attack. The spell must have a casting time of 1 action and must target only that creature.

Booming Blade
Source: Tasha's Cauldron of Everything
Evocation cantrip
Casting Time: 1 action
Range: Self (5-foot radius)
Components: S, M (a melee weapon worth at least 1 sp)
Duration: 1 round
You brandish the weapon used in the spell’s casting and make a melee attack with it against one creature within 5 feet of you.
On a hit, the target suffers the weapon attack’s normal effects and then becomes sheathed in booming energy until the start of your next turn.
If the target willingly moves 5 feet or more before then, the target takes 1d8 thunder damage, and the spell ends.
At Higher Levels. At 5th level, the melee attack deals an extra 1d8 thunder damage to the target on a hit, and the damage the target takes
for moving increases to 2d8. Both damage rolls increase by 1d8 at 11th level (2d8 and 3d8) and again at 17th level (3d8 and 4d8).
Spell Lists. Artificer, Sorcerer, Warlock, Wizard

Ok...
We all know Sentinel/P.Master combo.
Enemies entering your reach (assume 10ft) provoke an opportunity attack (an if hit, their speed goes to 0).
Let's add Tunnel Fighter.
Now i can make opportunity attacks against any and all that enter my reach?
It effectively says that Op.Attack isn't bound to reaction any more.

War caster...
From the wording, regardless of Tunnel Fighter, i assume i still have to use my reaction to hit with BB.
So... i hit em all, and choose 1 to BB.
Does this work with Tunnel fighter?
Creature moves within my reach->AoO using reaction->Using reaction to cast BB ???

So.. we up against a horde of enemies.
Move action to position at a chokehold (up to 25ft wide).
Dodge Action
Bonus action from tunnel fighter.
Now, every and all creature that enter my reach (P.Master) or move within my reach (Tunnel Fighter) provoke AoO.
Assuming i hit all, their speed goes to 0 and they stop. Commence Horde Kitting.

Anything wrong??


PS: I can accomplish the above with a V.Human Fighter by lvl6.
What multiclass you propose for after that?
Maybe Pala for an aura?
Abjurer for the Ward?
Something to boost my saves &/or magic defenses?

Mellack
2022-09-17, 04:29 PM
You cannot use booming blade at the 10' reach of your polearm. It specifies that they have to be within 5 feet of you.
This also assumes your DM allows UA material.

Phhase
2022-09-17, 04:52 PM
With the amount of speccing required, I'd allow it. It sounds cool.

Person_Man
2022-09-17, 08:56 PM
It a pretty standard build for people who read forums. But “typical” DMs might be unhappy about it, and/or unwilling to allow unofficial material.

I’d also note that you’re still vulnerable to spells. So maybe Paladin as a base class?

Talamare
2022-09-17, 08:58 PM
There is a reason why Tunnel Fighter never became official

This is basically it

animorte
2022-09-17, 08:59 PM
I don't think there's too much wrong with it. Sure, put everything into being exceptional at this one thing. I won't get in the way of that. It balances out enough strictly because it just doesn't make you better than everybody else at everything. You're just god-mode at this. one. thing.

Talamare
2022-09-17, 09:00 PM
You know there is a Ranger subclass that makes you into a Tree that gains like +20' Reach, or something absurd like that

Person_Man
2022-09-18, 01:22 PM
You know there is a Ranger subclass that makes you into a Tree that gains like +20' Reach, or something absurd like that

Primeval Guardian, which is a great subclass for PAM using Rangers, but also UA. The super reach doesn’t kick in until level 15.

KorvinStarmast
2022-09-18, 01:37 PM
There is a reason why Tunnel Fighter never became official

This is basically it how many plusses can I give this? :smallsmile:

elyktsorb
2022-09-18, 07:54 PM
Tunnel Fighter (UA).
As a bonus action, you can enter a defensive stance that lasts until the start of your next turn.
While in your defensive stance, you can make opportunity attacks without using your reaction,
and you can use your reaction to make a melee attack against a creature that moves more than 5 feet while within your reach.

War Caster
Source: Player's Handbook
Prerequisite: The ability to cast at least one spell
You have practiced casting spells in the midst of combat, learning techniques that grant you the following benefits:
You have advantage on Constitution saving throws that you make to maintain your concentration on a spell when you take damage.
You can perform the somatic components of spells even when you have weapons or a shield in one or both hands.
When a hostile creature's movement provokes an opportunity attack from you, you can use your reaction to cast a spell at the creature,
rather than making an opportunity attack. The spell must have a casting time of 1 action and must target only that creature.



So by this wording, using a spell will spend your reaction. As War Caster says 'When a hostile creature's movement provokes an opportunity attack from you, you can use your reaction to cast a spell at the creature'

You aren't actually using your reaction to make an opportunity attack, your using it to cast a spell, a spell that can be activated under the same conditions as an opportunity attack thanks to War Caster, but Tunnel Fighter only allows you to make opportunity attacks without spending your reaction. War Caster does not make spells into opportunity attacks, it just allows you to spend a reaction to cast a spell when you would be able to make an opportunity attack, but that does not actually make the spell an opportunity attack. Heck, the actual wording of War Caster even states 'you can use your reaction to cast a spell at the creature, rather than making an opportunity attack.'

As War Caster states it uses your reaction to allow you to cast a spell in a situation where you could opportunity attack, you aren't actually making an opportunity attack, so Tunnel Fighter wouldn't save this reaction from being spent as it was not spent on an actual opportunity attack, just that the spell is allowed to be cast when an opportunity attack would normally be used.

Basically, spells cast with War Caster are Spells that use your reaction and are not opportunity attacks, and therefor that reaction is not saved by Tunnel Fighter.


But yeah you already know that and everything else works, just have to get a dm okay with ua stuff.

Sception
2022-09-23, 07:42 AM
yeah, warcaster uses your reaction even if the opportunity attack it's replacing wouldn't have, and the range of booming blade is 5', not the range of the weapon you attack with as part of the spell. So in general getting booming blade in on this combo isn't really worth it.

Otherwise, yeah very strong, fairly obvious, and the reason tunnel fighter is about as deprecated as UA content comes, and something the overwhelming majority of DMs are unlikely to allow. It was fun to play, though. If your DM allows tunnel fighter, then by all means grab a halberd, PAM, and sentinel, and give it a go.

Kenny_Snoggins
2022-09-26, 09:54 AM
I think an easier and possibly more effective method of Tunnel Fighter abuse is with a rogue with whip and mounted combatant.

So take a level of fighter for the armor, fighting style (Tunnel Fighter) etc. Then rogue after that. Get a mount of some kind, either a magical one (ring of spell storing from bard or paladin, whatever) or a regular one. Assume it's size large, whichever you end up with. So then you're getting advantage on anything smaller than your mount, which is a fair number of things, and enables sneak attacks at a distance and if they are close you get it anyway from having your ally (the mount) nearby. Then you can whip anything in 10' from your mount, which is a fairly large area, any number of times with opportunity attacks. Since it's not your turn when they move, you can apply sneak attack damage to all those hits. And that just takes one level of fighter (not a terrible idea for a rogue anyway) and one feat.

MThurston
2022-09-26, 10:13 AM
3 feats? Tunnel Fighter is a Fighting style? Booming Blade spell

Arkhios
2022-09-26, 10:21 AM
Technically you need the Spell Sniper feat to be able to cast Booming Blade so that it has a 10 ft. range.

All those feats to accomplish one shenanigan with one (or maybe two) cantrip? Hardly worth it imho. You're aiming to become a one trick pony. Those are never good in the long run.

MThurston
2022-09-26, 10:35 AM
Here is the issue with this.

So you would hold down 25 foot by 10 foot space.

10 targets.

On the next turn those 10 would surround you and you would get 6 attacks with advantage. Maybe 10 if they have reach weapons. This would negate your dodge.

No new target come into range and just wait.

So you hold the group for 2 rounds and then go down.

Also, any spell that takes your reaction away would end this trick.