3.5 Artificer Creation of Helpers and lowest possible costs - request help

[samduke]

Hey Playgrounders

I have a Pure Artificer (no multiclass) that I am looking for help on getting the lowest possible costs to create it's helper(s)
any 1st party WoTC is allowed no 3rd party or dragon anything.
presume all level dependent things, attributes, feats, skills or other requirements to be met.


This is what I have so far.

Wizard Circle spellcasting guild (sharn city of towers p146)
Fifth, if she uses the resources of the sanctum, the cost (in both XP and gp) to create a magic item is reduced by 10%.

exceptional artisan
When determining the time you need to craft any item, reduce the base time by 25%.

extraordinary artisan
When determining the gold piece cost in raw materials you need to craft any item, reduce the base price by 25%.

legendary artisan
When determining your XP cost for creating any magic item, reduce the base cost by 25%.

magical artisan -applied to (extraordinary artisan & legendary artisan)
Each time you take this feat, choose one item creation feat you know. When determining your cost in XP and raw materials for creating items with this feat, multiply the base price by 75%.

Cost to Craft (gp) = Adjusted Market Price / 2
Cost to Craft (xp) = Adjusted Market Price / 25
Time to Craft (in days) = Adjusted Market Price / 1,000


Helper in this instance a Dedicated Wright with 3 HD at 4,100 GP Market Price > using the above I get this down to
<1,038.15 GP , 84 XP , 4 days> if my math is correct.

Can this get any lower in total costs, if so, please provide Source & Page
Thanks in advance

[Telonius]

This post (https://minmaxforum.com/index.php?topic=1000.0) has a pretty comprehensive list of all cost reducers. Some of it is very DM-dependent (planar touchstones, guild affiliation, etc).

[Tohron]

Magical Artisan can be applied separately to both Extraordinary Artisan and Craft Construct to get a 43.75% reduction to construct crafting costs. If you're binding an elemental to it, you can apply another instance of Magical Artisan to Bind Elemental for even more cost reduction.

[ShurikVch]

Apprentice, Craftsman (Dungeon Master's Guide II): A craftsman grants his apprentice a +2 competence bonus on all Craft checks and a 10% discount when he purchases raw
Favored in Guild, Arcane (Dungeon Master's Guide II): The guild subsidizes the creation of magic items, reducing your raw material costs by 5%

Sacrifice rules (Book of Vile Darkness): Dark Craft Rewards

Item Requires Specific Class (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/creatingMagicItems.htm#otherConsiderations) -30% gp

[samduke]

well with feats and things I can get the GP cost to almost 10% of original so I guess that is something

thanks for the links

[Arcanist]

*snip*

Don't bother making a Dedicated Wright. Instead just get Least Dragonmark (Making) for free from the Altar of the Dragon's Eye and cast an extended Summon Marked Homunculus to get one for free. Unfortunately you have to be a Human to do this. So tragic.

[sreservoir]

Don't bother making a Dedicated Wright. Instead just get Least Dragonmark (Making) for free from the Altar of the Dragon's Eye and cast an extended Summon Marked Homunculus to get one for free. Unfortunately you have to be a Human to do this. So tragic.

You don't have to be human, you can have an aberrant dragonmark and wand Mask Aberrant Dragonmark from the same book, which explicitly lets you cast spells that require a particular dragonmark.

[Arcanist]

You don't have to be human, you can have an aberrant dragonmark and wand Mask Aberrant Dragonmark from the same book, which explicitly lets you cast spells that require a particular dragonmark.

Mask Aberrant Dragonmark isn't on the Artificer spell list so for the sake of simplicity, I forewent making note of it. Yes, you can do this as well if you are so inclined to do so.

[Jack_Simth]

Don't bother making a Dedicated Wright. Instead just get Least Dragonmark (Making) for free from the Altar of the Dragon's Eye and cast an extended Summon Marked Homunculus to get one for free. Unfortunately you have to be a Human to do this. So tragic.

Even at CL 20, that still only lasts 40 hours. That's only two workdays. Low level items only. You'll need some serious CL boosting in order to make much worthwhile this way.

[Arcanist]

Even at CL 20, that still only lasts 40 hours. That's only two workdays. Low level items only. You'll need some serious CL boosting in order to make much worthwhile this way.

That isn't a problem.


The caster works for 8 hours each day. He cannot rush the process by working longer each day. But the days need not be consecutive, and the caster can use the rest of his time as he sees fit.

So your Dedicated Wright works 8 of the 10 hours you have it for, stops, and then the next day you set it up to continue until the craft is finished. Nothing about the Dedicated Wright changes how many 8 hour instances are dedicated towards crafting an item. The only thing it does is free up your time to craft the item.

[Jack_Simth]

That isn't a problem.



So your Dedicated Wright works 8 of the 10 hours you have it for, stops, and then the next day you set it up to continue until the craft is finished. Nothing about the Dedicated Wright changes how many 8 hour instances are dedicated towards crafting an item. The only thing it does is free up your time to craft the item.

A summoned Dedicated Wright doesn't just "stop" - it "vanishes". What makes you think the freshly-summoned one can pick up where the prior one left off?

[Arcanist]

What makes you think the freshly-summoned one can pick up where the prior one left off?

Because the item creation rules say that you can do that yourself, why do you think it would be any different if you were doing it through a Dedicated Wright or multiple Dedicated Wrights? Again, the work doesn't even have to be consecutive, as long as you don't start crafting another item, you can resume item creation whenever you want.

[Jervis]

Because the item creation rules say that you can do that yourself, why do you think it would be any different if you were doing it through a Dedicated Wright or multiple Dedicated Wrights? Again, the work doesn't even have to be consecutive, as long as you don't start crafting another item, you can resume item creation whenever you want.

Yes but can two people work on making the same item? There’s nothing saying explicitly that it’s the same one summoned each time IIRC

[Arcanist]

Yes but can two people work on making the same item?

Given that the Dedicated Wright only crafts as an extension of you, I'd argue this it not be the case. The Dedicated Wright simply serves the time requirement, however given that two or more people can already assist one another with magic item creation (Magic Item Compendium p.232), this is not an issue. I will include the relevant text as well for the sake of clarity.


All items have prerequisites in their descriptions. These prerequisites must be met for the item to be created. Most of the time, they take the form of feats and spells that the item's creator must know, although access through another magic item or spellcaster is allowed. It's perfectly acceptable for two or more characters to work together to create a magic item, with each character supplying some of the prerequisites. (In all places where this text refers to the "creator" of a magic item, it includes all characters supplying at least one prerequisite for the item's creation.) The XP cost must always be paid by the character who supplies the item creation feat required by the item, no matter how many other characters cooperate in its creation.

So it doesn't matter if it is the same Dedicated Wright, another Dedicated Wright, or a Dedicated Wright you summoned so and so many units of time after the fact, it and they all function exactly the same for the purposes of fulfilling the time requirement.

[Jervis]

Given that the Dedicated Wright only crafts as an extension of you, I'd argue this it not be the case. The Dedicated Wright simply serves the time requirement, however given that two or more people can already assist one another with magic item creation (Magic Item Compendium p.232), this is not an issue. I will include the relevant text as well for the sake of clarity.



So it doesn't matter if it is the same Dedicated Wright, another Dedicated Wright, or a Dedicated Wright you summoned so and so many units of time after the fact, it and they all function exactly the same for the purposes of fulfilling the time requirement.

That is a fair point, for some reason I thought it took a feat to let people collaborate on crafting something

[Jack_Simth]

Because the item creation rules say that you can do that yourself, why do you think it would be any different if you were doing it through a Dedicated Wright or multiple Dedicated Wrights? Again, the work doesn't even have to be consecutive, as long as you don't start crafting another item, you can resume item creation whenever you want.

Do they say you can pick up someone else's partially completed project? Because that's what the fresh dw is doing.

[samduke]

amusing for certain but off topic. as I was primarily interested in getting the GP cost of down as low as I could, thus far roughly 10% of original.

as far as the topic of Time, the artificer starts it and then has its related dedicated wrights as applicable to their skills and the project , they work together to shorten the time. there is no summoning or otherwise.

So unless you have information that might help in the reduction of GP costs short of the above links... lets keep to the topic at hand.

I appreciate the help given thus far.

[Arcanist]

Do they say you can pick up someone else's partially completed project?

Literally? No. That phrasing is never mentioned, nor is it discussed. Technically? Yes. At no point is the amount of members dedicated to the crafting of the magic item limited, nor is it defined when someone else can or cannot join the process. However, given that the former negatively interacts with the Dedicated Wright's Item Creation abilities phrasing ("allowing the wright to carry the process through to completion." seems to imply that you've already begun the process in some capacity), I am inclined to go with the latter.

However, the OP is correct. This is getting off topic. I said my peace, explained why I believe the rules work the way they do in this regard and am simply going to just agree to disagree at this point.