PDA

View Full Version : Cake throwing wizards?



Project_Mayhem
2007-11-30, 07:21 PM
Ok, this might be somewhat unimportant, but I noticed that the material component for the spell Hideous laughter is


Material Component
Tiny tarts that are thrown at the target and a feather that is waved in the air.


Tiny tarts? Or is it a typo for darts?

While darts doesn't really fit with the spell concept, it kinda makes more sense than a spellcaster carrying very small cakes around.

Obviously this doesnt really matter - I just felt it killed the vermilsitude, which I cant spell.

Lord Lorac Silvanos
2007-11-30, 07:24 PM
Ohhh, it is tarts. :smallwink:

RandomNPC
2007-11-30, 07:27 PM
my wife laughs at it and i don't even have spell components, trust me, it's tiny cake.

Riffington
2007-11-30, 07:30 PM
It makes more sense if you imagine that he throws a pie in the victim's face

SmartAlec
2007-11-30, 07:31 PM
Wizards do carry around a lot of weird stuff. I mean, Grease is cast using a bit of pork rind. Horrid Wilting with a sponge.

J.Gellert
2007-11-30, 07:32 PM
I had never noticed that - the things you miss when you houserule spell components out :smallbiggrin:

Edit: Horrid Wilting with a sponge?
Wizard: "Here, here, dirty gnolls, time for your bath!"

Project_Mayhem
2007-11-30, 07:32 PM
my wife laughs at it and i don't even have spell components, trust me, it's tiny cake.

Yeah, I suppose the cake throwing is part of what makes the target laugh:smallbiggrin:

Still a silly idea though. I mean, they'd go off quickly, smell, and splat in the component pouch. (Shakes head)

Crow
2007-11-30, 07:35 PM
It could be promiscuous pixies...

Riffington
2007-11-30, 07:44 PM
It could be promiscuous pixies...

Who are in fact the ones doing the feather-waving, as they tickle the victim senseless?

AslanCross
2007-11-30, 07:52 PM
On the subject of spell components and foci, I love how ray of stupidity uses a miniature dunce hat.

Project_Mayhem
2007-11-30, 07:57 PM
Oh my god, they're all stupid. I never actually read the components before I noticed this - hell, the even well known stuff makes no sense. What's bat turd got to do with anything magical?

WOTC ARE TOYING WITH OUR SANITY!!?!

Chronos
2007-11-30, 07:58 PM
A small nitpick: A tart is a little pie, not a cake.

A larger nitpick: A "tiny" tart, as the spell specifies, is a large enough object that it'd be a full-fledged pie, not a tart.

SmartAlec
2007-11-30, 08:00 PM
Hold on. A tart is smaller than a pie, but a tiny tart is the same size as a pie?

Altair_the_Vexed
2007-11-30, 08:00 PM
It's been said before - the material components are [usually] a joke.

Okay, some components are important, cause they're meant to balance the spell out with a cost. My house rule is that there are no material components for spells that have no listed cost for the component.

Mewtarthio
2007-11-30, 08:10 PM
Hold on. A tart is smaller than a pie, but a tiny tart is the same size as a pie?

It's Tiny sized. Though that could also mean that it's sized for Tiny creatures...

Anyway, yeah, the material components are truly horrible. Take a look at the component for detect thoughts. Shameful, really.

Sleet
2007-11-30, 08:34 PM
What's bat turd got to do with anything magical?

Bat guano is highly flammable. Seriously.

deadseashoals
2007-11-30, 08:46 PM
It's supposed evoke a whimsical and absurd flavor for a spell that makes you literally roll around on the floor laughing your *** off. At least, that's what I figured when I read the components.

AslanCross
2007-11-30, 09:01 PM
WOTC ARE TOYING WITH OUR SANITY!!?!

If that was their intention, it seems to have worked. o_O

Edited for typoness.

Crow
2007-11-30, 09:02 PM
Bat guano is highly flammable. Seriously.

So is non-dairy creamer. Little known fact.

kpenguin
2007-11-30, 09:04 PM
WOTC ARE TOYING WITH OUR SANITY!!?!

Actually, I think bat guano goes back to TSR days.

Kaelik
2007-11-30, 09:17 PM
All the components end up being examples where the component itself could create the same effect even if you didn't cast the spell.

See Invisibility: Through flour at them
Glitterdust: Throw Glitter at them
Fireball: Throw flammable substance at them
Hideous Laughter: Throw a Pie in their face
ect.

Sleet
2007-11-30, 09:18 PM
So is non-dairy creamer. Little known fact.

Dude. I have a bottle of Coffee-mate, a box of strike-anywhere matches, and a night off. I know what I'm doing.

Chronos
2007-11-30, 09:25 PM
So is non-dairy creamer. Little known fact.I knew that, too. But while creamer produces an impressive little explosion, you can actually make gunpowder out of bat guano.
All the components end up being examples where the component itself could create the same effect even if you didn't cast the spell.Most of these, while the component could have a similar effect, it wouldn't be nearly as impressive as the spell. But a rotten egg, all by itself, produces a perfectly effective Stinking Cloud.

F.L.
2007-11-30, 09:36 PM
Bat guano is highly flammable. Seriously.

I thought it wasn't. It's merely potassium nitrate, that serves as the oxidizer for flammable things, like charcoal, sulphur, gasoline, etc. Similar to perchlorate or lox in other mixtures, or the nitro groups on high explosives.

And, you could, I suppose, make gunpowder out of KNO3+dairy creamer.

Mr.Moron
2007-11-30, 09:44 PM
So is non-dairy creamer. Little known fact.

Just don't put in the microwave, you could turn into a mouse.

Mewtarthio
2007-11-30, 10:02 PM
Just don't put in the microwave, you could turn into a mouse.

Anything could happen, really. Nobody really knows how non-dairy creamer works. You could always sue, of course...


Actually, I think bat guano goes back to TSR days.

I've seen some of the original VSM components. To be quite honest, I'm not sure if I believe that they existed. They were really... strange.

Maerok
2007-11-30, 11:55 PM
Or is it a typo for darts?

So... so... the cake is a lie? :smallamused:

I've rolled a natural 20 on my eternal damnation!!! :smallbiggrin:

BCOVertigo
2007-12-01, 12:15 AM
So... so... the cake is a lie? :smallamused:

I've rolled a natural 20 on my eternal damnation!!! :smallbiggrin:

You....
:smallannoyed:

Pandaren
2007-12-01, 12:20 AM
That kind of reminds me of Finger of Death...

GIANT BLACK FLOATING SKELETON HAND
*tickle*
*tickle*
*tickletickle*
*tickletickle*
*BLARF*

Roderick_BR
2007-12-01, 12:31 AM
It's Tiny sized. Though that could also mean that it's sized for Tiny creatures...

Anyway, yeah, the material components are truly horrible. Take a look at the component for detect thoughts. Shameful, really.
Lol! I never used that spell before, but I know what I'll say next time I play a spellcaster and we need to interrogate someone...:smallbiggrin:

John Campbell
2007-12-01, 12:58 AM
Actually, I think bat guano goes back to TSR days.

It does indeed. The AD&D2 PHB lists the material components for fireball as bat guano and sulphur. Throw some charcoal into the mix, in appropriate proportions, and you can make real fireballs with that.

It's called "black powder", folks. Gunpowder.

(I vaguely recall that AD&D1 included the charcoal, too, but I don't really remember, and don't have that PHB handy to check.)

You can throw sparks with the lightning bolt material components, too.

OneWinged4ngel
2007-12-01, 02:40 AM
Ok, this might be somewhat unimportant, but I noticed that the material component for the spell Hideous laughter is

Tiny tarts? Or is it a typo for darts?

While darts doesn't really fit with the spell concept, it kinda makes more sense than a spellcaster carrying very small cakes around.

You're just noticing one now? You still think WotC wouldn't be that stupid and that it must be a typo? Hoo-boy.

If you'll notice, LOTS of the spells in the PHB are like this. They're really, really bad jokes. To make someone laugh, you throw a pie in their face. To scry someone, you build an archaic TV rigged up to a primitive battery. To see invisibility, you throw talc all over the place, which obviously reveals invisible people. For Tongues you build a little tower of Babel. For Fireball you're supposed to light up some guano (which explodes quite dramatically in movies). Some spells mimic classic magic tricks, complete with silly showmanship. The list goes on through the whole bloody PHB. They're all a running quasi-MacGuyver gag, and enforcing material components in your game dooms it to be a bad joke.

Seriously, just go down the list of spells in the PHB, and count the number of spells with costless material components that DON'T immediately leap out at you as a joke. For alarm you're supposed to make a simple trap with a tripwire that rings a bell, which obviously tips you off. For Grease you're supposed to grease the floor with pork rinds and butter. For mage armor you're supposed to actually take some material for light armor and strap it on. For Summon Monster you're supposed to pull a monster out of a tiny bag. For True Strike you're supposed to put up a bullseye. For Ventriloquism you're supposed to wrap up a parchment into a small cone, the use for which is obvious. For color spray you throw a variety of colored sands at people. I won't go on. If you somehow didn't get the picture before, you should by now.


Obviously this doesnt really matter - I just felt it killed the vermilsitude, which I cant spell. Verisimilitude. And I'm surprised that you didn't notice the silliness of gygaxian legacy material components before.

Riffington
2007-12-01, 06:47 AM
In TSR's defense, that may just be their interpretation of the Magical Law of Sympathy. Like produces like. So a bag of flour may only be useful for revealing invisible creatures if you get the flour to spread *just right*, and the wizard may be incapable of such a feat. Yet still the principle remains... a little flour in the air should assist the magic of revelation of invisibility.

So it's not a pun, it's valid magical theory. The real question is why TSR doesn't use more of the laws of magic. The Law of Contagion in particular would be a superb way to bring magic users back to an appropriate power level while maintaining their value as villains.

Project_Mayhem
2007-12-01, 08:13 AM
And I'm surprised that you didn't notice the silliness of gygaxian legacy material components before

I never actually read them or thought about them until someone linked to the spell in another thread. I genuinely had never noticed.

Project_Mayhem
2007-12-01, 08:18 AM
A tart is a little pie, not a cake

I was going to post a snide link to a dictionary until I realised you were in fact right. Damn. I still think of them as general cake-like dessert though:smallwink:

Greenfaun
2007-12-01, 09:23 AM
I was going to post a snide link to a dictionary until I realised you were in fact right. Damn. I still think of them as general cake-like dessert though:smallwink:

You may be thinking of "torte" which is a very dense, moist variety of cake.

Also, Maerok: damn you, _I_ wanted to say the cake is a lie! Curses, out-geeked again. :)

Maerok
2007-12-01, 10:03 AM
:smallbiggrin: Too good to pass up. I generally find it being said more often than typed.

Project_Mayhem
2007-12-01, 10:06 AM
You may be thinking of "torte" which is a very dense, moist variety of cake.

nope, I definately think we mean the same thing, as in a tasty blueberry tart. I just never thought of it as a pie I guess. Anyway, if we've devolved into a discussion of dessert taxonomy, then we're probably off topic, lol

Attilargh
2007-12-01, 10:13 AM
Anything could happen, really. Nobody really knows how non-dairy creamer works. You could always sue, of course...
This reminds me of a certain webcomic (http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/diet_coke_mentos.png).

On topic for a change, where would a wizard keep the live spider necessary for Spide Climb? :smallconfused:

Chronos
2007-12-01, 01:40 PM
On topic for a change, where would a wizard keep the live spider necessary for Spide Climb?In his beard, of course.

What, you didn't think those were just for show, did you?

Rolaran
2007-12-01, 02:04 PM
Those of you with Complete Scoundrel, take a look at the Disobedience spell. It blocks attempts to read or control the subjects mind, the spell description says that "a ghostly great helm appears around your companion's head", and the material component is "A scrap of tin".

Yes, it's a magical tinfoil hat.

Also, an interesting note if you decide to roll with the silly and admit that material components are generally jokes, is the material component that our group houseruled in for Prestidigitation.

Basically, there's enough magic in your typical component pouch, that anything in there eventually becomes infused with enough arcane energy to make at least a minor effect. So to cast Prestidigitation, you just reach into one of the corners of the bag, and pull out some magically charged pocket lint...

OneWinged4ngel
2007-12-01, 02:53 PM
So it's not a pun, it's valid magical theory. No. Making a little tower of Babel for Tongues is a pun, not valid magical theory. Especially since the Tower of Babel doesn't exist in most D&D settings. Your theory doesn't hold to the entirety of the PHB, and at best excuses a scant few spells.