SangoProduction
2022-11-22, 11:15 PM
Preamble: Armiger is a strange class that's got relatively few talents, but can flex a few sets of talents. And I honestly still having difficulties figuring out what sorts of talents you would want to flex. And how you would create a build that best capitalizes on having 3+ sets of non-interacting talents
Post-Review Analysis: Perhaps the most dramatic shift of my opinion from pre-to-post review. I thought it was a gimmicky, probably middling *thing,* that probably has *some* build out there somewhere. Now I'm pretty sure it's among the top martial spheres classes, without actually being OP, due to having the budget set aside for adaptability rather than raw focused power. (And just really good design.) And I think that's among the best praise I have given any class. The only thing I could say to criticize it is just how many "Just gain a talent/feat" Prowess there are.
(1) Superb: You always want this if it's relevant to you. And it probably is.
(1.5) Really Good: Particularly useful bits of kit, but aren't quite must-haves. (Kept it decimal, because spreading out Good so far from Superb felt unrepresentative. But I needed a step between)
(2) Good: These make useful additions to the right builds. Among your first picks.
(3) Meh: Doesn't hurt to have. Wouldn't go out of your way for it.
(4) No: It technically has a use, but the cost to take simply doesn't outweigh the benefit.
(5) Never: There’s no non-trivial reason to pick it up, from its mechanics.
(6+) Harmful: Taking/using this is actively detrimental to your character.
<Angle brackets> around a rating indicates situational usefulness, and how good it is in that favorable situation.
[Square brackets] indicate a reliance on the group (players or DM) or campaign you’re playing in, and how well it does in those select groups.
Special Ratings:
(C) Cheese: A talent so broken that it will be instantly banned if you use it as you could.
(?) Unrated: I choose not to rate it. Often because it is just so far out of my wheelhouse, or it’s far too ambiguous.
(F) Flavor: This indicates that the main draw to the talent is going to be its inherent fluff or flavor, rather than raw power or utility.
(D) D***bag: Used for when your character wants to be a D***bag.
Combat Training: Half-Combatant talent progression. But that's fine, in context.
Customized Weapons (1): Easily *the* reason you get into this class. Now this is real funky. 3 weapon sets to start with, including potentially sets of ammo and thrown weapons. And they provide you (1.5 + 1/4 level) talents each, which can be swapped out every day.
But you only access the talents while they are Active, and you can only have one Active weapon set at a time. So, optimally, you want to have your "regular" talents be the core of your character, and then the weapon sets being different modes by which your core expresses itself.. Such as melee vs range, or defense or poison, or some such. The core should be relatively weapon-agnostic, unless you are simply letting your non-primary weapon be sets of flex talents... which is reasonable.
Speaking of which, if you do go that route, where you have a "primary", default weapon, you can consider yourself to be a mid-combatant, with 1-2 more talents, and flex talents. So, unlike most other less-than-full combatants, you actually don't "lose out" on any class talents until level 4, and you still have the extra flex talents that you can swap to when more appropriate / if your primary build is inappropriate. After all, you're not going to have multiple weapons that just do the same job in the same way. It wouldn't make sense. So this actually forces you to have a well-rounded, encounter-resilient character, and simultaneously not feel like you're *giving up* power in exchange for not being worthless every so many encounters. I actually love it.
Talk with your DM about how this interacts with Alchemy/Tech sphere, before adding such spheres to your weapon sets.
Quick Change (1): The class literally would scarcely function without Quick Draw. And this is better than Quick Draw.
Prowess (?): Gained every 2 levels, worth 1 talent/feat each. In total, if you're building for your primary weapon set, this class *potentially* grants more than 1 talent per level, not including the flex weapon sets.
(Each Prowess is rated in its own section)
Focusing Switch (3): On crit, combat maneuver, or defeat of a foe, immediate action regain combat focus, swapping out weapon sets. Could scarcely care less. CMs are generally a bad thing to go for (even more so here, since the extra weapon sets have less to build off of). Crits at super unreliable, and defeating a foe? Tends to happen around the time combat is finishing up already. Not really something you probably wish to rely on as your engine.
Rapid Assault (1.5): Swift action bonus attack, after hitting with a customized weapon. Made with a different customized weapon. Basically the dual wielding sphere, with no dual wielding restrictions (like no need to have both weapons equipped at once, letting you use two-handed weapons).
No specification as to whether you (briefly or otherwise) "activate" the other customized weapon.
Enhanced Customization (1): May be slightly overrating this, but holy cow. I think this is actually the first time I've seen enhancement b onus of a weapon be increased, rather than assigned.
Lightning Change (1.5): Yet another free action store and draw weapons. But out of turn this time. So, if you have an immediate action set, you can draw that whenever you need it, and then on your turn, put it back as a free action, and draw your primary set. Granted, by level 7, you already have 2 free action stow/draws, letting you already do this... but... um... Well, maybe some of your immediate actions are split across multiple sets of weapons, and now you can draw whichever one is most appropriate, *when* it is appropriate.
Lightning Assault (1): Makes 2 attack actions with different customized weapons, by spending a full round action, and martial focus. I don't particularly appreciate the return of full attacking, but it's level 15, and it's unique.
No specification as to whether you (briefly or otherwise) "activate" the other customized weapon.
Unlimited Assault (1.5): ...huh. Alright then. Lightning Assault no longer costs martial focus. Which is actually pretty big. It does imply that without this, you can't normally proc Rapid Assault with Lightning Assault. Which is strange. But it's an implication of now being explicitly being allowed at level 20, rather than explicitly saying that you aren't without being level 20.
Menagerie Trainer / Share Customized Weapon (1): Share your weapon set talents with an "animal ally," and gain the beast mastery sphere. An actual, unironic, game changer. Animal companions tend to "just" be fighters-in-a-can, without the feats. Now you can give them those feats...as talents. Which you can swap through mid-combat. Imagine a giant wartortoise that is able to patrol an additional 20-foot area around itself.
Extra Focus (1.5): A second martial focus (through gaining the Great Focus feat). As always, pretty useful.
Variable Prowess (1.5): Re-flex one talent on a customized weapon in just 10 minutes. No daily use limit. Very useful, for certain time-sensitive missions, where you can't take a day off to respec for the ghost encounter, but you can take 10 minutes.
Mobile Assault (1.5): Allows movement before the trigger attack, as well as the granted attack(s). And even if you don't have a move action available, you can still charge the credit card for your next turn's move action to get it this turn. No interest.
Bare-Fisted Training / Improvisationalist (1.5): You gain an additional potential weapon set (unarmed / improvised), and a talent. Neat. Build enabling.
Transfigurative Construction (2): Most of these are worth a talent, and you get access to each of them (at least within level ranges), though only one per weapon. (The same modification can be given to different weapons though, to clarify.)
Sacrifice Weapon (2): Saves yourself or an ally, by redirecting the damage to your weapon. Not to yourself - the weapon. Impressive.
Armored Armiger / Champion / Customized Bond / Deadly Prowess / Ranged Prowess / Spell Dabbler / Warhorn (2): An extra talent / feat, if you need it.
Penetrating Assault (2): Total all attacks before applying DR/hardness/energy resistance. Only when using rapid assault. But, depending on your build, that's super useful.
Faith in Steel [2]: Only equivalent to Iron Will starting at level 9. As a conditional competence bonus. But maybe you already have Iron Will, and your DM is just throwing out will saves that suck your enjoyment every single freaking session... then maybe have a talk with him. Or perhaps you're starting at a particularly high level, where this is superior to Iron Will.
Practiced Initiative (2): Uninspiring +2 and some change to initiative. But there are some initiative junkies out there, and they really want to say that initiative is good. I have been bullied into this rating. Send help.
Linebreaker (3): During Rapid Assault, don't provoke on movement. Neat. I guess.
Open Wound (3): Effectively allows you to transfer any DR-reduction efsects to all attacks against your target until the beginning of your next turn. I mean, it's a neat concept, no doubt.
Customized Bond (3): Maybe underrating this, but I legitimately don't see much in the way of synergy here between Armiger and Armorist. I mean, maybe you take a 1 level dip in Armorist, and let your Armiger level half-progress the bonus for one of your weapons. I mean, that does net you an effective +1 bonus per 4 armorist levels... for one weapon. I would prefer more talents on that weapon, personally. But it's... build-enabling, I suppose. But classes really want your full attention though. I would much prefer to multiclass Whitesmith Blacksmith.
Clockwork Custom Weapons (5): Requires successful melee damage, expending martial focus, and failed will save in order to inflict Slow (as time sphere) for 1 round... Very light penalty. Even if just as a rider effect, it soaks your martial focus to apply the penalty for 1 round. If it was ranged, you would have at least the option of saying "Hey, it's for kiting." Even though Sniper and such already have options for that without even spending your martial focus.
Exotic Weaponry (5): Literally just worse than Customized Training talent in Equipment sphere. In every way possible. Your proficiency is conditional with this (even if it is an easy condition).
Guarded Weapon (6): +1 (+1/5 lvls) CMD against your weapons. And ignore broken condition. (Doesn't ignore destroyed condition though.) Even if this was a substantial boost (it's not)... you've got more weapons. That's kinda the entire deal of the class. If they want to spend their turn battering down your weapon, or attempting to disarm you... let them. That's an actively good thing, because they aren't hurting you. And you have backup weapons. That is literally your gimmick!
--Archetypes--
Note: Temporarily changing my ratings for archetypes, because I'm not quite sure if a high rating means "it's optimal to change from base to this," or if it means "this does its own thing, and does it well."
GOOD: Has a strong theming, and changes things sufficiently to fit the theme, without gutting the class.
BAD: Has no real character, and/or the changes aren't overall positive.
Reduces BAB and HD to mid, in order to become a martial whose weapons (can) cast spells. Can't actually take spell talents herself except through external feats. So the core of the class remains martial I love it.
Trades out 1 customized weapon, and the bonus attacks, in order to be able to summon companions for each of their weapons. Only one at a time though. Not viable at all if you have low practitioner modifier and low level. You have more talents than your little spirit weapon buddy, meaning that it's probably better for you to spend your turn attacking, if you're not actually getting a good number of turns out of them.
So the actual apparent intent is for you to have a primary weapon, and also a weapon that your buddy will have. Maybe swapping who gets what when appropriate. It's really neat. I'm not sure it's particularly powerful. But it certainly isn't weak. Having a tank minion who can patrol, while you snipe away is unsurprisingly useful. Or a flank buddy (who also sneak attacks). Or literally anything else a rounds-duration summon would be able to do.
Note: the cast time is a "full round action" not "1 round," so it happens at the end of your turn, and explicitly gets to immediately attack, not beginning of your next round.
It resembled the Blue Dragon game/anime so much, that it's the first time in years that I had even a passing thought about it, and I got the name perfect... on the second recall. Thus I am happy because I rather enjoyed the game. Too bad I don't have a 360 any more.
Permanent free action swapping of "modes" (weapon-sets), allowing you to swap between each attack, and then end with your interrupt actions set. but you never use fewer hands than the largest. Although you still don't benefit from all of the talents at one time, and thus can't use each "mode" to progress your main build, your talents are as on-demand as possible. You also can't add sets of weapons, just actual weapons. But you still have the option of adding a double weapon, which is inherently dual-wieldable.
However, you only ever get 3 sets, period. At levels 11 and 19, when you'd normally get bonus sets, you instead 1 extra talent to each mode.
Giving up Rapid Assault for weapon improvements as a technician? Pretty good. Probably an improvement, if you use my Technician guide to select the right improvements.
Legitimately? This doesn't do a bunch, but it does enough.
Enough to make it incompatible (by default) with most other archetypes, unfortunately. A reasonable DM would probably say that the modifications don't actually bar it from mixing with others though.
Most of the changes are net positive in power, except that stance changing must be done as a swift or move action, rather than the free action swapping with weapon sets.
Due to a strong personal hatred of the prodigy and their mechanics, I cannot say definitively if this pulls it off well. I think it does.
Eh. It really doesn't do much. Rightly so, it's only replacing the prowess. But now, you are forced into spending the first two prowess on relatively minor teleportation stuff. I mean... I guess you use your full level as a- no, wait. Your levels are as a mid-caster for the purpose of warp sphere.
Yeah, this just feels icky.
I generally don't like the removal of options from the options-class-feature. The Doctor, Scholar archetype is good enough at its job that I put up with it.
Very strong theme... I think. And I don't necessarily think it is done poorly. I just think that it goes completely over my head, and I actually don't understand it.
Post-Review Analysis: Perhaps the most dramatic shift of my opinion from pre-to-post review. I thought it was a gimmicky, probably middling *thing,* that probably has *some* build out there somewhere. Now I'm pretty sure it's among the top martial spheres classes, without actually being OP, due to having the budget set aside for adaptability rather than raw focused power. (And just really good design.) And I think that's among the best praise I have given any class. The only thing I could say to criticize it is just how many "Just gain a talent/feat" Prowess there are.
(1) Superb: You always want this if it's relevant to you. And it probably is.
(1.5) Really Good: Particularly useful bits of kit, but aren't quite must-haves. (Kept it decimal, because spreading out Good so far from Superb felt unrepresentative. But I needed a step between)
(2) Good: These make useful additions to the right builds. Among your first picks.
(3) Meh: Doesn't hurt to have. Wouldn't go out of your way for it.
(4) No: It technically has a use, but the cost to take simply doesn't outweigh the benefit.
(5) Never: There’s no non-trivial reason to pick it up, from its mechanics.
(6+) Harmful: Taking/using this is actively detrimental to your character.
<Angle brackets> around a rating indicates situational usefulness, and how good it is in that favorable situation.
[Square brackets] indicate a reliance on the group (players or DM) or campaign you’re playing in, and how well it does in those select groups.
Special Ratings:
(C) Cheese: A talent so broken that it will be instantly banned if you use it as you could.
(?) Unrated: I choose not to rate it. Often because it is just so far out of my wheelhouse, or it’s far too ambiguous.
(F) Flavor: This indicates that the main draw to the talent is going to be its inherent fluff or flavor, rather than raw power or utility.
(D) D***bag: Used for when your character wants to be a D***bag.
Combat Training: Half-Combatant talent progression. But that's fine, in context.
Customized Weapons (1): Easily *the* reason you get into this class. Now this is real funky. 3 weapon sets to start with, including potentially sets of ammo and thrown weapons. And they provide you (1.5 + 1/4 level) talents each, which can be swapped out every day.
But you only access the talents while they are Active, and you can only have one Active weapon set at a time. So, optimally, you want to have your "regular" talents be the core of your character, and then the weapon sets being different modes by which your core expresses itself.. Such as melee vs range, or defense or poison, or some such. The core should be relatively weapon-agnostic, unless you are simply letting your non-primary weapon be sets of flex talents... which is reasonable.
Speaking of which, if you do go that route, where you have a "primary", default weapon, you can consider yourself to be a mid-combatant, with 1-2 more talents, and flex talents. So, unlike most other less-than-full combatants, you actually don't "lose out" on any class talents until level 4, and you still have the extra flex talents that you can swap to when more appropriate / if your primary build is inappropriate. After all, you're not going to have multiple weapons that just do the same job in the same way. It wouldn't make sense. So this actually forces you to have a well-rounded, encounter-resilient character, and simultaneously not feel like you're *giving up* power in exchange for not being worthless every so many encounters. I actually love it.
Talk with your DM about how this interacts with Alchemy/Tech sphere, before adding such spheres to your weapon sets.
Quick Change (1): The class literally would scarcely function without Quick Draw. And this is better than Quick Draw.
Prowess (?): Gained every 2 levels, worth 1 talent/feat each. In total, if you're building for your primary weapon set, this class *potentially* grants more than 1 talent per level, not including the flex weapon sets.
(Each Prowess is rated in its own section)
Focusing Switch (3): On crit, combat maneuver, or defeat of a foe, immediate action regain combat focus, swapping out weapon sets. Could scarcely care less. CMs are generally a bad thing to go for (even more so here, since the extra weapon sets have less to build off of). Crits at super unreliable, and defeating a foe? Tends to happen around the time combat is finishing up already. Not really something you probably wish to rely on as your engine.
Rapid Assault (1.5): Swift action bonus attack, after hitting with a customized weapon. Made with a different customized weapon. Basically the dual wielding sphere, with no dual wielding restrictions (like no need to have both weapons equipped at once, letting you use two-handed weapons).
No specification as to whether you (briefly or otherwise) "activate" the other customized weapon.
Enhanced Customization (1): May be slightly overrating this, but holy cow. I think this is actually the first time I've seen enhancement b onus of a weapon be increased, rather than assigned.
Lightning Change (1.5): Yet another free action store and draw weapons. But out of turn this time. So, if you have an immediate action set, you can draw that whenever you need it, and then on your turn, put it back as a free action, and draw your primary set. Granted, by level 7, you already have 2 free action stow/draws, letting you already do this... but... um... Well, maybe some of your immediate actions are split across multiple sets of weapons, and now you can draw whichever one is most appropriate, *when* it is appropriate.
Lightning Assault (1): Makes 2 attack actions with different customized weapons, by spending a full round action, and martial focus. I don't particularly appreciate the return of full attacking, but it's level 15, and it's unique.
No specification as to whether you (briefly or otherwise) "activate" the other customized weapon.
Unlimited Assault (1.5): ...huh. Alright then. Lightning Assault no longer costs martial focus. Which is actually pretty big. It does imply that without this, you can't normally proc Rapid Assault with Lightning Assault. Which is strange. But it's an implication of now being explicitly being allowed at level 20, rather than explicitly saying that you aren't without being level 20.
Menagerie Trainer / Share Customized Weapon (1): Share your weapon set talents with an "animal ally," and gain the beast mastery sphere. An actual, unironic, game changer. Animal companions tend to "just" be fighters-in-a-can, without the feats. Now you can give them those feats...as talents. Which you can swap through mid-combat. Imagine a giant wartortoise that is able to patrol an additional 20-foot area around itself.
Extra Focus (1.5): A second martial focus (through gaining the Great Focus feat). As always, pretty useful.
Variable Prowess (1.5): Re-flex one talent on a customized weapon in just 10 minutes. No daily use limit. Very useful, for certain time-sensitive missions, where you can't take a day off to respec for the ghost encounter, but you can take 10 minutes.
Mobile Assault (1.5): Allows movement before the trigger attack, as well as the granted attack(s). And even if you don't have a move action available, you can still charge the credit card for your next turn's move action to get it this turn. No interest.
Bare-Fisted Training / Improvisationalist (1.5): You gain an additional potential weapon set (unarmed / improvised), and a talent. Neat. Build enabling.
Transfigurative Construction (2): Most of these are worth a talent, and you get access to each of them (at least within level ranges), though only one per weapon. (The same modification can be given to different weapons though, to clarify.)
Sacrifice Weapon (2): Saves yourself or an ally, by redirecting the damage to your weapon. Not to yourself - the weapon. Impressive.
Armored Armiger / Champion / Customized Bond / Deadly Prowess / Ranged Prowess / Spell Dabbler / Warhorn (2): An extra talent / feat, if you need it.
Penetrating Assault (2): Total all attacks before applying DR/hardness/energy resistance. Only when using rapid assault. But, depending on your build, that's super useful.
Faith in Steel [2]: Only equivalent to Iron Will starting at level 9. As a conditional competence bonus. But maybe you already have Iron Will, and your DM is just throwing out will saves that suck your enjoyment every single freaking session... then maybe have a talk with him. Or perhaps you're starting at a particularly high level, where this is superior to Iron Will.
Practiced Initiative (2): Uninspiring +2 and some change to initiative. But there are some initiative junkies out there, and they really want to say that initiative is good. I have been bullied into this rating. Send help.
Linebreaker (3): During Rapid Assault, don't provoke on movement. Neat. I guess.
Open Wound (3): Effectively allows you to transfer any DR-reduction efsects to all attacks against your target until the beginning of your next turn. I mean, it's a neat concept, no doubt.
Customized Bond (3): Maybe underrating this, but I legitimately don't see much in the way of synergy here between Armiger and Armorist. I mean, maybe you take a 1 level dip in Armorist, and let your Armiger level half-progress the bonus for one of your weapons. I mean, that does net you an effective +1 bonus per 4 armorist levels... for one weapon. I would prefer more talents on that weapon, personally. But it's... build-enabling, I suppose. But classes really want your full attention though. I would much prefer to multiclass Whitesmith Blacksmith.
Clockwork Custom Weapons (5): Requires successful melee damage, expending martial focus, and failed will save in order to inflict Slow (as time sphere) for 1 round... Very light penalty. Even if just as a rider effect, it soaks your martial focus to apply the penalty for 1 round. If it was ranged, you would have at least the option of saying "Hey, it's for kiting." Even though Sniper and such already have options for that without even spending your martial focus.
Exotic Weaponry (5): Literally just worse than Customized Training talent in Equipment sphere. In every way possible. Your proficiency is conditional with this (even if it is an easy condition).
Guarded Weapon (6): +1 (+1/5 lvls) CMD against your weapons. And ignore broken condition. (Doesn't ignore destroyed condition though.) Even if this was a substantial boost (it's not)... you've got more weapons. That's kinda the entire deal of the class. If they want to spend their turn battering down your weapon, or attempting to disarm you... let them. That's an actively good thing, because they aren't hurting you. And you have backup weapons. That is literally your gimmick!
--Archetypes--
Note: Temporarily changing my ratings for archetypes, because I'm not quite sure if a high rating means "it's optimal to change from base to this," or if it means "this does its own thing, and does it well."
GOOD: Has a strong theming, and changes things sufficiently to fit the theme, without gutting the class.
BAD: Has no real character, and/or the changes aren't overall positive.
Reduces BAB and HD to mid, in order to become a martial whose weapons (can) cast spells. Can't actually take spell talents herself except through external feats. So the core of the class remains martial I love it.
Trades out 1 customized weapon, and the bonus attacks, in order to be able to summon companions for each of their weapons. Only one at a time though. Not viable at all if you have low practitioner modifier and low level. You have more talents than your little spirit weapon buddy, meaning that it's probably better for you to spend your turn attacking, if you're not actually getting a good number of turns out of them.
So the actual apparent intent is for you to have a primary weapon, and also a weapon that your buddy will have. Maybe swapping who gets what when appropriate. It's really neat. I'm not sure it's particularly powerful. But it certainly isn't weak. Having a tank minion who can patrol, while you snipe away is unsurprisingly useful. Or a flank buddy (who also sneak attacks). Or literally anything else a rounds-duration summon would be able to do.
Note: the cast time is a "full round action" not "1 round," so it happens at the end of your turn, and explicitly gets to immediately attack, not beginning of your next round.
It resembled the Blue Dragon game/anime so much, that it's the first time in years that I had even a passing thought about it, and I got the name perfect... on the second recall. Thus I am happy because I rather enjoyed the game. Too bad I don't have a 360 any more.
Permanent free action swapping of "modes" (weapon-sets), allowing you to swap between each attack, and then end with your interrupt actions set. but you never use fewer hands than the largest. Although you still don't benefit from all of the talents at one time, and thus can't use each "mode" to progress your main build, your talents are as on-demand as possible. You also can't add sets of weapons, just actual weapons. But you still have the option of adding a double weapon, which is inherently dual-wieldable.
However, you only ever get 3 sets, period. At levels 11 and 19, when you'd normally get bonus sets, you instead 1 extra talent to each mode.
Giving up Rapid Assault for weapon improvements as a technician? Pretty good. Probably an improvement, if you use my Technician guide to select the right improvements.
Legitimately? This doesn't do a bunch, but it does enough.
Enough to make it incompatible (by default) with most other archetypes, unfortunately. A reasonable DM would probably say that the modifications don't actually bar it from mixing with others though.
Most of the changes are net positive in power, except that stance changing must be done as a swift or move action, rather than the free action swapping with weapon sets.
Due to a strong personal hatred of the prodigy and their mechanics, I cannot say definitively if this pulls it off well. I think it does.
Eh. It really doesn't do much. Rightly so, it's only replacing the prowess. But now, you are forced into spending the first two prowess on relatively minor teleportation stuff. I mean... I guess you use your full level as a- no, wait. Your levels are as a mid-caster for the purpose of warp sphere.
Yeah, this just feels icky.
I generally don't like the removal of options from the options-class-feature. The Doctor, Scholar archetype is good enough at its job that I put up with it.
Very strong theme... I think. And I don't necessarily think it is done poorly. I just think that it goes completely over my head, and I actually don't understand it.