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Anthrowhale
2023-01-04, 10:49 PM
Here's a trick which seems kind of fun.


Start with any wizard.
Pick up a metamagic feat you would have chosen anyways.
Take levels in K[arcana] and Spellcraft which you would have taken anyways.
At level 5 take the spontaneous divination ACF (Complete Champion, page 52).
Enter Ultimate Magus and take it for 10 levels.


You qualify for Ultimate Magus out of a single class. Spell access and caster level will only advance one per level since one level of advancement is sufficient to satisfy the tables and one level of advancement is required by the tables at each level. Expanded Spell Knowledge is a noop. Augmented casting does nothing since you do not have 'another arcane class'. You pick up two bonus feats, just like a wizard except that they must be metamagic (...hardly a restriction). And you pick up Arcane Spell Power +4 making all of your spells cast have effectively 4 more caster levels.

So assuming you were going to take 3 metamagic feats and take the relevant skills anyways, the net effect is -1 feat (with a significant side benefit of never needing to prepare divination spells again) for +4 to caster level by level 15. That's not game-breaking, but it's pretty good. This could lead into Archmage 5 to hit a caster level bonus of +9 by level 20, enough to just plain ignore spell resistance in most cases. And all of this comes with no slowing of spell access and no setting-specific material.

Biggus
2023-01-04, 11:47 PM
Archmage taking Spell Power multiple times is dubious. The Hierophant's Spell Power ability includes the words "This ability can be selected more than once, and changes to effective caster level are cumulative" which the Archmage's lacks.

The rest of it works as far as I can see though.

Anthrowhale
2023-01-05, 08:07 AM
Archmage taking Spell Power multiple times is dubious. The Hierophant's Spell Power ability includes the words "This ability can be selected more than once, and changes to effective caster level are cumulative" which the Archmage's lacks.
Interesting, hadn't noticed that.

Is there a better way to use 5 levels to increase caster level? (Without delaying spell access? and avoiding something setting specific?)

Rebel7284
2023-01-05, 10:49 AM
Interesting, hadn't noticed that.

Is there a better way to use 5 levels to increase caster level? (Without delaying spell access? and avoiding something setting specific?)

I mean, Red Wizard is core so not necessarily setting specific anymore? Circle magic is the best way to improve caster level.

In general, caster level increases have been used to compensate for lost casting, sadly, so not a ton of classes give it as-is.

Edit: In general, I have considered this exact entry into UM in the past, and ultimately, while it's nifty that you CAN do it, not being able to use half your class features kinda stings. It's still solid, of course, just not terribly exciting.

MaxiDuRaritry
2023-01-05, 12:48 PM
How about taking a single level in a spontaneous casting base class or spontaneous PrC that grants its own spellcasting so you gain the full benefits of ultimate magus? You'd still qualify as a spontaneous wizard, but now you gain extra CLs and more versatility. How about taking a level in some PrC that progresses wizard and grants bardic music (warrior skald, using items that grant feats to qualify, maybe?), followed by a level in sublime chord? Now ultimate magus can boost both wizard and sublime chord.

Darg
2023-01-05, 01:26 PM
Archmage gaining caster levels is dubious. It's 3.0 version specifically mentions gaining caster levels. However with the 3.5 update it does not gain caster levels per level, only with high arcana. Other than the DMG, progression classes are basically guaranteed to grant caster levels so it's a little interesting the choices WotC decided to make. I just make spell power a +3 bonus that can only be taken twice when I've had players enter the class.

Anthrowhale
2023-01-05, 02:00 PM
I mean, Red Wizard is core so not necessarily setting specific anymore? Circle magic is the best way to improve caster level.

So, for a 1 feat tax (tatoo focus), you can spell power+2 in 5 levels. (And, of course, access to circle magic.) It's reasonable, although enhanced specialization kinda sucks and it's not really divorced from Forgotten Realms given the "Human (From Thay)" requirement.

The other class I see giving an unrestricted spell power is Spellguard of Silverymoon which has a 1 feat tax (Combat Casting) and provides Spell Power+1 at 5th level, along with 2 bonus metamagic feats and selective spell. Again, FR dependent though.

Heirophant could be accessed via Southern Magician although that's FR-dependent. Is there a feat which grants minor divine casting? If so, Alternative Source Spell might be another access method. The downside of Hierophant is that it does not advance spell access, even though it advances caster level. You could take Hierophant for the last 3 levels for spell power +3 without delaying spell access.



Edit: In general, I have considered this exact entry into UM in the past, and ultimately, while it's nifty that you CAN do it, not being able to use half your class features kinda stings. It's still solid, of course, just not terribly exciting.
Yeah, it's really a different class in some sense. On the upside you avoid delaying your spell access, which is easy to miss but very useful for the next 12 or so levels.


How about taking a single level in a spontaneous casting base class or spontaneous PrC that grants its own spellcasting so you gain the full benefits of ultimate magus? You'd still qualify as a spontaneous wizard, but now you gain extra CLs and more versatility. How about taking a level in some PrC that progresses wizard and grants bardic music (warrior skald, using items that grant feats to qualify, maybe?), followed by a level in sublime chord? Now ultimate magus can boost both wizard and sublime chord.

You can do that, though of course you suffer a delayed caster level. My favorite entry here is: Wizard (Abyssal Specialist, Aligned[chaotic], spontaneous divinations) 5/Knight of the Weave 1/Ultimate magus 10/?? 4. That leaves you with wizard 19 spell access, KotW 8 spell access. The KotW caster level is 19(wizard caster level)+8(KotW)=27. You pick up Theurgic Specialist at level 6 which makes your caster level for all [chaotic] spells 19(wizard)+27(KotW)+4(spell power)=50. KotW 8 also gives you access to 6th level spells so you can use persistent spell. Relative to a Sublime Chord approach, there's less monkeying around and the caster level increase hits hard at just 6th level where you are already delivering caster level 11 effects.

Anthrowhale
2023-01-05, 02:04 PM
Archmage gaining caster levels is dubious. It's 3.0 version specifically mentions gaining caster levels. However with the 3.5 update it does not gain caster levels per level, only with high arcana.
Huh, you're right. The text just advances spell access but not caster level by default, in essence a complement to the Hierophant.

Darg
2023-01-05, 03:52 PM
Huh, you're right. The text just advances spell access but not caster level by default, in essence a complement to the Hierophant.

The DMG is far more literal in the benefits caster progression is meant to be. Some don't give spells known, hierophant only gives caster level, and dragon disciple only gives spell slots.

Chronos
2023-01-05, 04:54 PM
Of course, if you take the DMG text literally for Archmage, rather than just considering that an accidental omission, the Spell Power high arcana is completely useless. Any level where you would want to take a level of Archmage with Spell Power, you should instead just take a level of base-class wizard, to get the same spell progression and caster level increase, without giving up a 5th-level spell slot.

Darg
2023-01-05, 06:49 PM
Of course, if you take the DMG text literally for Archmage, rather than just considering that an accidental omission, the Spell Power high arcana is completely useless. Any level where you would want to take a level of Archmage with Spell Power, you should instead just take a level of base-class wizard, to get the same spell progression and caster level increase, without giving up a 5th-level spell slot.

I take the DMG text very literally. I almost never use PRCs as written.

Anthrowhale
2023-01-05, 07:30 PM
Of course, if you take the DMG text literally for Archmage, rather than just considering that an accidental omission, the Spell Power high arcana is completely useless. Any level where you would want to take a level of Archmage with Spell Power, you should instead just take a level of base-class wizard, to get the same spell progression and caster level increase, without giving up a 5th-level spell slot.

Yeah, it seems lame in the literal interpretation.

There is a non-setting-specific way for a wizard to cast 7th level Divine spells. It requires 4(!) feats: God-Touched, Divine Channeler, and Minor Divine Spellcaster from Dragon #305, then Alternate Source Spell from Dragon #325. Thus, you could theoretically leverage Hierophant for character levels 18-20 to get a caster level of 27 without any reduction in spell access. That hardly seems worthwhile though.

Perhaps an interesting question is: what is the highest caster level you can get while never giving up spell advancement?

If you have a chaotic evil wizard[aligned spellcaster[evil], spontaneous divination] 5/Ultimate Magus 10/Wild mage 1/Tainted spellcaster 1/?? 3, then you can pick up:

+4 from Ultimate Magus
+1 from Bands of Hextor
+1 from Fiendish Power [+Fiendish Heritage]
+1 from Planar touchstone[Catalogs of Enlightenment[Evil domain]]
+0 to +3 (average +1) from Wild Mage + Practiced Spellcaster + magical Aptitude
+1 from blood component
+1 from Orange Ioun Stone

for an expected +10 to caster level.

Single class Ultimate Magus really stands out here for costing just a wizard feat to end up with +4 to caster level.

Special holy symbol + Aligned Spellcaster[evil, chaos, or good] also stands out since it comes online extremely early, when +1 caster level makes a big difference for some spells.

Rebel7284
2023-01-05, 07:48 PM
Perhaps an interesting question is: what is the highest caster level you can get while never giving up spell advancement?


- With shenanigans, infinite.
- With slightly less shenanigans, circle magic, consumptive field, and greater consumptive field all allow your caster level to be set to 40 for individual spell or multiplied and the latter two can be persisted.
- Shadowcraft Mage can get a huge boost to caster level with Earth Spell, but it won't be universal
- Combining Reserves of Strength, Elder Giant Magic and possibly Primitive Caster, it's possible to get a fairly high caster level somewhat early.

Anthrowhale
2023-01-05, 08:51 PM
- With shenanigans, infinite.
Such shenanigans seem to be of dubious plausible applicability.


- With slightly less shenanigans, circle magic, consumptive field, and greater consumptive field all allow your caster level to be set to 40 for individual spell or multiplied and the latter two can be persisted.

Circle Magic is setting specific and comes online at L10+. CF and GCF are dispellable and come online at levels 7+ and 13+.


- Shadowcraft Mage can get a huge boost to caster level with Earth Spell, but it won't be universal

Yep, lack of universality.


- Combining Reserves of Strength, Elder Giant Magic and possibly Primitive Caster, it's possible to get a fairly high caster level somewhat early.
RoS is legit, but to use in combat you need to alleviate the stun. There are various approaches here, but they compromise success in various ways.

Elder Giant Magic's delay means you basically can't use it in combat so not universal.

Primitive Caster is ok, although typically only good for +1.

One that I missed before is the "Book of the Stilled Tongue" which traides 1 hp/character level for +1 to caster level each day.

It looks like early access to universal caster level advances are most viable with [good] spells. A Lesser Aasimar could use aligned spellcaster[good] and primitive caster at level 1, then pick up a Bolt of Hieroneous midway to level 2, then at level 3 take Paragnostic Apostle 1 and pick up words of creation. At level 5 take Spontaneous divinations and then at level 6 take Planar Touchstone[Catalogs of Enlightenment[good]] as well as enter Ultimate Magus. That leaves you at caster level 11 for almost all spells by level 6.

Rebel7284
2023-01-07, 08:48 PM
Here is a method that I recently discovered when researching caster level boosts for my Sublime Chord thread.

- Suffer the Flesh is persistable.
- Find a way to heal Con damage quickly (Restoration is the gold standard, but a few hit from a wand of lesser restoration works too)
- Persist early in the day for +5 caster level all day.
- 250 gp. Cost per casting hurts a bit early on, but the huge CL boost is probably worth it.
- Works best with Metamagic Reduction shenanigans, but being a second level spell, you can also just use an 8th level slot to do it fairly if you're in a high-level game.

Anthrowhale
2023-01-08, 09:23 AM
Here is a method that I recently discovered when researching caster level boosts for my Sublime Chord thread.

- Suffer the Flesh is persistable.
- Find a way to heal Con damage quickly (Restoration is the gold standard, but a few hit from a wand of lesser restoration works too)
- Persist early in the day for +5 caster level all day.
- 250 gp. Cost per casting hurts a bit early on, but the huge CL boost is probably worth it.
- Works best with Metamagic Reduction shenanigans, but being a second level spell, you can also just use an 8th level slot to do it fairly if you're in a high-level game.

StF seems most viable on a cleric build for early use since they get the early access to persistent spell and (lesser) restoration. A cleric with the spell and planning domains needs 3 feats (Persist, DMM[Persist], Alternate Source Spell) making it viable at level 6 to get +5 to caster level. That's potent. At high levels it's still subject to MDJ of course.

Is there any lower level access to persistent spell applying to StF without degrading spell access?

Rebel7284
2023-01-08, 12:33 PM
StF seems most viable on a cleric build for early use since they get the early access to persistent spell and (lesser) restoration. A cleric with the spell and planning domains needs 3 feats (Persist, DMM[Persist], Alternate Source Spell) making it viable at level 6 to get +5 to caster level. That's potent. At high levels it's still subject to MDJ of course.

Is there any lower level access to persistent spell applying to StF without degrading spell access?

Well there is the limitation that you need CL 10 to get the full +5 to CL, so doing it too early involves extra steps. Of course, Con score allowing (Bear's Endurance?), those extra steps can be just casting extended StF the round before casting a persisted one, but that doubles the cost. Still nifty that you CAN double your caster level early on.

Other early ways to Persist are:
- A second level Illumian with the Naenhoon sigil can spend turn/rebuke attempts to apply metamagic for free twice a day. Saves a feat and can be used with arcane spells, but the twice a day hard cap is more limited than DMM.
- Artificers get Metamagic Item infusion at 5th level.

Anthrowhale
2023-01-08, 02:46 PM
Well there is the limitation that you need CL 10 to get the full +5 to CL, so doing it too early involves extra steps. Of course, Con score allowing (Bear's Endurance?), those extra steps can be just casting extended StF the round before casting a persisted one, but that doubles the cost. Still nifty that you CAN double your caster level early on.

I was imagining using a lesser rod of extend to reduce the daily cost. Starting at level 6, on the first day you could get +3, on the next casting +4, and on the third casting +5. This allows plenty of time to recover lost Constitution in between.

If you start at caster level 5, it's +2, then +3, then +4, and you can't quite reach +5. However, with some single-use caster level booster (there are many), you could reach +5 and maintain it.

It looks like a caster level 5 approach is viable with Human Cleric 5[spell, planning] and feats: Human: Persistent Spell, 1. DMM[Persistent], 3. Southern Magician. There, of course, we are going into something setting-specific again.

Other early ways to Persist are:
- A second level Illumian with the Naenhoon sigil can spend turn/rebuke attempts to apply metamagic for free twice a day. Saves a feat and can be used with arcane spells, but the twice a day hard cap is more limited than DMM.

This still requires cleric for the Turn Undead. It seems neutral here, since the extra feat could be a racial feat.


- Artificers get Metamagic Item infusion at 5th level.
I don't see how to leverage this effectively in a single character.