Isekai RPG?

[Quertus]

I’ve recently learned that there’s a glut of Isekai anime, fanfics, etc. And a lot of them (if those who talk about them are to be believed) seem to use very similar underlying systems, leading me to wonder if there’s an “Isekai RPG”, so to speak. Anybody seen anything like that?

Also…

On a “completely unrelated” note, I asked myself what kind of RPG I’d enjoy running or playing as a regular RPG or an Isekai, or live in as a character / be trapped in as an Isekai (a “normal” one, not an OP one)*. And my feverish mind responded with at least the template for / beginnings of a magic system, leading me to ask, are there any RPGs out there that work like that?

Simply put, the point-based magic system combines affinities, classes, and skill trees.

In more detail, suppose a character has affinity for mind and animation magic. If they took the Druid class, they could use mind to buy skills (spells) like calm animal, animal friendship, or awaken animal, whereas animation would open up spells like entangle or animating trees as treants. Had they instead become a Necromancer, still using a few examples for D&D, mind would have opened up spells like command undead, Invisibility to undead, speak with dead or awaken undead, while animation would rather obviously allow for the creation of undead. Combined, mind and animation allow for the creation of sentient undead, or actual sentient treants.

So… is there anything like *that* out there as an existing RPG?This may someday become a thread of its own, but what is up with RPGs, rather than providing an escapist power fantasy, often making the PCs be underwhelming compared to the characters in the source material (Star Wars being the usual offender, but it’s hardly unique, especially given the glut of modern OP protagonists in TV/film/etc)?

[Lord Raziere]

No. isekais aren't that different from the fantasy that already exists, its mostly just the position your put in thats different. you could just add in a "from another world" background option to any ttrpg and it would work.

[Anonymouswizard]

Most portal fantasy anime I know of either don't work like an RPG or have what can be best described as 'generic JRPG MMO' system. Basically take something like Final Fantasy or Dragon Quest and let the 'players' define their stats (which in the two I can think of which actually do this, seems to involve maximising Defence). D&D altered to use a spell point system would actually be pretty close. A lot of this is because the anime which caused the portal fantasy boom was explicitly set in an MMO, although the rules were actually pretty unimportant in it (all we really know is that Kirito maxed one handed straight swords and unarmed, along with a fair whack in regeneration).

But the important part, I think, is even those that don't have an underlying RPG system in place can be drawing from those standard JRPG tropes. It can even be the case in non-portal fantasy anime and manga, note how characters in Goblin Slayer are named as if they were minor JRPG NPCs with 'race job' (even the main character follows this, although as he's human he just uses his job of 'goblin slayer').

[Thane of Fife]

There is an old RPG called Multiverser where the premise is that the players play themselves, and every time they die, they are sent to a new universe, which may even follow different rules as well as being a different setting. That's basically an Isekai premise over and over again.

[Mechalich]

The biggest difference with Isekai scenarios that include explicit game elements and/or game awareness is less in the mechanics - which as others have mentioned tend to be extremely generic - and more in how the world-building reflects game structures. This means adventuring guilds, standardized rewards for certain kinds of monster parts, respawning dungeons, teleportation between cities, etc. Overall this tends to result in a world that feels unnatural, and sometimes explicitly is, but that is highly convenient for straightforward monster-hunting play. It is also the case that the more self-aware class of portal fantasy scenarios recognize how levels/skills = power and the government (and the economy, if one exists) tends to restructure accordingly, with the world run by high-level heroes and/or guilds in explicit acknowledgment of how personal power is ultimately the only thing that matters in worlds like this.

[Quertus]

Yes, the very generic nature is why I figured someone may have made such a generic system.


There is an old RPG called Multiverser where the premise is that the players play themselves, and every time they die, they are sent to a new universe, which may even follow different rules as well as being a different setting. That's basically an Isekai premise over and over again.

lol, thanks. I’ll have to look it up.


The biggest difference with Isekai scenarios that include explicit game elements and/or game awareness is less in the mechanics - which as others have mentioned tend to be extremely generic - and more in how the world-building reflects game structures. This means adventuring guilds, standardized rewards for certain kinds of monster parts, respawning dungeons, teleportation between cities, etc. Overall this tends to result in a world that feels unnatural, and sometimes explicitly is, but that is highly convenient for straightforward monster-hunting play. It is also the case that the more self-aware class of portal fantasy scenarios recognize how levels/skills = power and the government (and the economy, if one exists) tends to restructure accordingly, with the world run by high-level heroes and/or guilds in explicit acknowledgment of how personal power is ultimately the only thing that matters in worlds like this.

Eh, “being smart” is a lot more effective than raw power, *especially* for one who leads the powerful. But, yes, this common organization was another reason I suspected perhaps someone had explicitly made an RPG out of this.

[Anymage]

I've seen ideas for D&D where the characters are modern real-world humans or even the players themselves.

As for making it a whole thing, I don't see how that would gain any traction. The rules engine would most likely be whatever's the most recent version of D&D with maybe some small tweaks. The setting has the issue that the more interesting the setting is, the more interesting it would be to play a native instead of some portaled in earthling. And most importantly, most isekai protagonists are clearly protagonists/audience stand ins while TTRPGs are inherently a team game. Someone trying to embrace the main character role is likely to be seen as an annoying spotlight hog at any real table.

[Quertus]

I've seen ideas for D&D where the characters are modern real-world humans or even the players themselves.

As for making it a whole thing, I don't see how that would gain any traction. The rules engine would most likely be whatever's the most recent version of D&D with maybe some small tweaks. The setting has the issue that the more interesting the setting is, the more interesting it would be to play a native instead of some portaled in earthling. And most importantly, most isekai protagonists are clearly protagonists/audience stand ins while TTRPGs are inherently a team game. Someone trying to embrace the main character role is likely to be seen as an annoying spotlight hog at any real table.

That... certainly has become my chief complaint about the Isekai... genre? trope?

And what you've described is... well... the exact inverse of what I described/saw: a system so generic and uninteresting that nobody would care, so the draw would be in playing a "ported earthling". :smallbiggrin:


lol, thanks. I’ll have to look it up.

Wow, Multiverser, I haven't seen reviews this uniformly bad since... 4e? FATAL? Somewhere in between, I think. Pity. The concept sounds interesting; the execution, layout, style, production quality, and affordability are apparently all lacking. :smallfrown:

[JNAProductions]

Wow, Multiverser, I haven't seen reviews this uniformly bad since... 4e? FATAL? Somewhere in between, I think. Pity. The concept sounds interesting; the execution, layout, style, production quality, and affordability are apparently all lacking. :smallfrown:

Did you... Did you just honestly put 4E D&D in the same category as FATAL?

[Anymage]

And what you've described is... well... the exact inverse of what I described/saw: a system so generic and uninteresting that nobody would care, so the draw would be in playing a "ported earthling". :smallbiggrin:

That's kind of the point. If the system and/or setting are so painfully generic that "transplant from modern day earth" is one of the more interesting options, why would anyone pick it up over a setting that's actually interesting in its own right?

[Satinavian]

The isekais don't have enough in common to build a common system for them. Not even the boring generic ones with dungeons, skills, respawning monsters etc. Especially magic systems, abilities and what classes can really do tend to be unique.

Also magic systems tend to be pretty boring and blasting focused to keep with the video game roots or utterly unbalanced and illogical making it unusable for an RPG.



So... No such system really exist. People who want to play an isekai story in such a generic world tend to use a system they already know and like and it will broadly work with a little bit re-flavoring.


That said, maybe look into games meant to capture JRPG feel like Final Fantasy D6. They should have some common tropes inbuilt.

[oxybe]

Did you... Did you just honestly put 4E D&D in the same category as FATAL?

And you're surprised why? Quertus basically made 2-3 threads trying to "define" Roleplaying Games seemingly just so they can say 4e isn't a roleplaying game.

As for Isekai as an RPG game, we have to break down what the term is: "another world".

You are sent to not just another world, but rather different reality then our own. if you just translocate to a different planet in our universe, that's probably closer to a portal fantasy. Note that this doesn't mean you have to be stuck in that other world, more then a few Isekai have characters that can travel between the universes.

Let's look a few Isekai examples:

El Hazard: The Magnificent World is an Isekai since the main characters are transported to the magical world of El-Hazard.
The Dungeons and Dragons cartoon is also an Isekai, as the children are brought into the magical world of D&D.
The most famous isekai is probably Sword Art Online, which is an Isekai even though while the character's physical bodies are still in our world, their consciousness aren't.
A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court might be an Isekai if you view Camelot as a fictional place and not just "a part of historical Brittania we haven't nailed down yet".
In a similar vein to SAO we have The Odyssey, a Canadian tv show about a child in a coma, might be an isekai if you accept that his consciousness is actually in another world while his physical body is rooted in ours... and the content of the show is not just the result of a kid's brain trauma.
The TV show Sliders, is an Isekai as the main cast keeps going through alternate realities.
If you're looking for a more strait-up D&D Isekai it exists and is called "Another World Munchkin". It's not even trying to hide anything and just filed off the serial numbers.


The main draw for an isekai is usally the fish out of water aspect, where the character have to learn and adapt to how their new world works (as well as any power, if any, they gained coming to it works) and how they can make use of their modern day knowledge or tools. In the case of say, Log Horizon, we get to see them combine both as the characters make use of their knowledge of the game mechanics from their time playing it as a game IRL, but adapting that knowledge since it's now real and not a game.

Now some pre-Isekai'd skills transfer pretty directly: carpentry is carpentry. a skilled carpenter can still make a great end product regardless of world, they just need to adapt to the quirks of the new materials they'll likely be working with and the popular style of the region they're in. Other skills, not so much: knowing Python coding language... YMMV if that'll help you learn how to cast Fireball or make a magic sword.


All that to say: D&D, and many other RPGs, in all versions works fine for a fantasy Isekai, your character is an Elf Ranger but your background is Isekai'd Banker from Manhattan. Act a bit genre-saavy and reference things the non-Isekai'd folks wouldn't understand since you read a ton of fantasy before becoming an Elf in another world and some old habits/sayings are hard to break.

At most you'd probably have 2 separate game systems, one for the fantasy world and one for the real world and make analogs for each.

Or just play GURPS.

[Anonymouswizard]

Did you... Did you just honestly put 4E D&D in the same category as FATAL?

I mean, they both involve an endless series of rolls before your inevitable failure. It's just in one case it's Skill Challenges and in the other it's head size :smalltongue:

I'm sure if there had been a FATAL 3e it would have you rolling for finger diameter.


Anyway, I did just think of a portal fantasy RPG. Nest (https://www.drivethrurpg.com/m/product/153980), but it's Fate and based more off of Narnia-style children's fantasythan teen focused stuff. OTOH it does zero in a bit more on what the point of said series are supposed to be: the fantasy world causes character growth in the travellers, and gives antagonist options for both playing it straight and subverting it. Although you could probably move most Fate settings to something like Cortez Prime with ease.

[VonKaiserstein]

I think the main variation would be character creation- you'd take the initial creation out of the player's hands, or go indirect. The old White Wolf RPG Hunter- The Reckoning did this. Have average everyday humans encounter a horrifying monster- based on their responses the DM assigned them a class. You could have your players make normal characters for neo-Tokyo or whatnot, then run each through an average day, giving them opportunities to show their worth, with each day ending with them being run over by a Tractor, bus, train, herd of llamas, whatever. Based on their decisions you'd give them their starting class or role, and they could go from there. LoL, honestly, just have them write you a backstory, you do the stats, and don't even bother telling them what system they're in.

Player buy in would be important, and I'd probably keep the campaign short lived, because very few players want to play a bait and switch character they didn't make themselves, or really wrestle with a system they don't understand. It would, however, be an authentic isekai experience.

[Quertus]

Did you... Did you just honestly put 4E D&D in the same category as FATAL?

lol. As hilarious an image as that is, I was explicitly *not* doing that. That is, since multiverser lives between the two in terms of negative press, they must clearly live at different “tiers” of negative reviews.

Both have amazingly bad reviews, no doubt, but, had the point been to compare 4e and Fatal, then the point would have been that there’s enough difference between them to fit multiverser. Obviously that wasn’t the point, as it would break Character for me to describe 4e in such a positive light.

[False God]

Isekai "RPG" is more about setup and buy-in than a specific emulation mechanic.

I'd just suggest using the system you're most familiar with or have the most fun in and just play it in that.

The "MMO" approach, they all made characters and then get sucked into their character, or the "summoned to another world" as themselves approach wherein they either get specific powerups right off the bat or just now have to play survival in another land.

I typically use D&D for more generic class-based fantasy isekai (it's also better for handling monster PCs; edition determines the particular "theme", 5E is more gritty, 3.5 runs the gamut better, and 4E is great for more "I HAVE TO ANNOUNCE THE POWER I'M USING!" tropes). And I use WoD for less class-based, more point-based gameplay similar to JMMOs.

Typically though, I don't run "game worlds" where the rules of whatever game you were playing only exist for the people outside of the game/world, once you're in the game world, everything is much more open.

[Pauly]

One thing that I think is a requisite for an Isekai type game is that the player provides the mental aspect of the game. So the characters can have their physical stats different from the player’s stats, but it’s the player that provides the INT/CHA/WIS.

As mentioned above it also can bleed over into skills. In some worlds If you want to cook a meal you have to know the real world recipe.

Another issue, as appears in Log Horizon, is that the players are aware of the rules/coding of the game and are able to exploit their knowledge of the coding to make alterations to the way the world is run.

[Rynjin]

But the important part, I think, is even those that don't have an underlying RPG system in place can be drawing from those standard JRPG tropes. It can even be the case in non-portal fantasy anime and manga, note how characters in Goblin Slayer are named as if they were minor JRPG NPCs with 'race job' (even the main character follows this, although as he's human he just uses his job of 'goblin slayer').

So the funny thing is, Goblin Slayer is NOT one of the JRPG fantasy anime...it's a D&D-alike.

Goblin Slayer himself is (at first hinted, then pretty much explicitly stated) to be a random one-off NPC the DM made up for flavor who the party ("the gods", also potentially represented in-game by the Dwarf Shaman, Lizard Priest, and Elf Archer) inexplicably latched onto and kept wanting to know more about, and just grow more and more fascinated with as they observe him further.

The big tagline ("He does not let anyone roll the dice.") is also pretty explicitly clarified later to basically mean that Goblin Slayer literally does not roll dice; he uses preparation to max Circumstance bonuses and then just Takes 10 on everything lol.

[hewhosaysfish]

The setting has the issue that the more interesting the setting is, the more interesting it would be to play a native instead of some portaled in earthling. And most importantly, most isekai protagonists are clearly protagonists/audience stand ins while TTRPGs are inherently a team game.

This makes me think about a game where 1 PC is from modern Earth, 1 is from Middle-Earth, 1 from Eberron, 1 is from Thedas, etc and they all get run over simulatenously by a "tractor, bus, train, herd of llamas, whatever" and they all wake up simulateously in some very generic fantasy setting...

[Anonymouswizard]

So the funny thing is, Goblin Slayer is NOT one of the JRPG fantasy anime...it's a D&D-alike.

Goblin Slayer himself is (at first hinted, then pretty much explicitly stated) to be a random one-off NPC the DM made up for flavor who the party ("the gods", also potentially represented in-game by the Dwarf Shaman, Lizard Priest, and Elf Archer) inexplicably latched onto and kept wanting to know more about, and just grow more and more fascinated with as they observe him further.

The big tagline ("He does not let anyone roll the dice.") is also pretty explicitly clarified later to basically mean that Goblin Slayer literally does not roll dice; he uses preparation to max Circumstance bonuses and then just Takes 10 on everything lol.

It's literally the case of he has straight 10s except for Constitution, because the person running it didn't care. And even then it's just like a 12.

Also, it's a game of OD&D or BD&D with players who are insisting on playing it in a Combat As Sport mode. You can see this in the first chapter, where a party falls to goblins because they didn't think about how their foes were fighting in their natural habitat. It's a very Tucker's Kobolds situation.

[GloatingSwine]

But the important part, I think, is even those that don't have an underlying RPG system in place can be drawing from those standard JRPG tropes. It can even be the case in non-portal fantasy anime and manga, note how characters in Goblin Slayer are named as if they were minor JRPG NPCs with 'race job' (even the main character follows this, although as he's human he just uses his job of 'goblin slayer').

In the case of Goblin Slayer it's as much because the main character is a weird freak who has almost no ability to connect with other people due to his monomania about killing goblins.

The implication is that the other characters *have* names, he just doesn't understand why you would learn them.

[Quertus]

Multiverser where the premise is that the players play themselves

Anybody know the character creation rules for this system? I’m curious if there’s any cool ideas there to consider.


Nest (https://www.drivethrurpg.com/m/product/153980), but it's Fate and based more off of Narnia-style children's fantasythan teen focused stuff.

Another thing for me to look into, thanks.


Log Horizon


Another issue, as appears in Log Horizon, is that the players are aware of the rules/coding of the game and are able to exploit their knowledge of the coding to make alterations to the way the world is run.

Log Horizon is probably my favorite Isekai (I guess?), but I’m not sure what you’re referencing here.

[Prime32]

If you're looking for a more strait-up D&D Isekai it exists and is called "Another World Munchkin". It's not even trying to hide anything and just filed off the serial numbers.
Overlord is based on a max-level player from a fictional MMO (explicitly based on a Neverwinter Nights 2 persistent world but with all 3.5e material available) getting transported to a non-D&D fantasy world* with his whole guild base /dungeon in tow, and slowly becoming a detached murderous tyrant due to a combination of missing his friends, the ludicrous power and resources of a lv40 wizard with a dungeon full of minions and epic-level items, and being in a lich body which dulls his empathy for anything except his minions (who were created by his friends).

* There are D&D-style spellcasters but they were introduced by previous transportees. The protag has managed to figure out partial "stat blocks" for natives but they sometimes have impossible combinations of abilities, and a rare few know native styles of magic and martial arts which don't follow D&D logic and are impossible for otherworlders to learn (they also don't have a NWN2-style level cap, though only the oldest dragons are close to proving it; by contrast there are only four wizards in the world powerful enough to cast 6th-level spells).

[Slipjig]

If you'd like some inspiration, the Dungeon Scrawlers Twitch channel has an ongoing Isekai game where everybody is playing themselves. It's set in the Realms, but the it's based on the 2e rules, so most of the players don't have an encyclopedic knowledge of the rules like they do for 5e. They described their skill sets to the DM, and he's telling them what dice to roll and adjudicating what happens.

[Pauly]

Log Horizon is probably my favorite Isekai (I guess?), but I’m not sure what you’re referencing here.

It’s a while since I watched it so my memory is a little fuzzy, but the best example that comes to mind is when the main characters buy a guild building so they can take over the guild and boot out unsavory characters.,

[Satinavian]

It’s a while since I watched it so my memory is a little fuzzy, but the best example that comes to mind is when the main characters buy a guild building so they can take over the guild and boot out unsavory characters.,
It is not that good an example, as this is something the character noticed which was not in the original MMO. There you only could buy some specific buildings.
Log Horizon is a lot about clashing different incompatible rulesets and unforseen consequences and the rules of the world are changing itself over time.

I also liked it a lot. But my favourite is "Ascendence of a bookworm".


Which brings us to the main point. Are those Isekais really similar enough that building a common system would be a useful endeavor ? I am sceptical unless the result is completely generic. And if it was, why not just use one of he many many other generic systems ?

What exactly is the commonality of isekais that make it a good idea to have a specialized system for the genre ?

[Cactus]

And most importantly, most isekai protagonists are clearly protagonists/audience stand ins while TTRPGs are inherently a team game. Someone trying to embrace the main character role is likely to be seen as an annoying spotlight hog at any real table.

The Dungeons and Dragons cartoon series was about a group transported to a fantasy world. I don't think that's likely to be an obstacle for most gaming groups.

[icefractal]

There's also enough variance that I'm not sure what features would be considered universal. Like, fourth-wall breaking / seeing the system? Some of them don't have it at all (the new reality is entirely real with no game mechanics visible), some of them only the protagonist can perceive the mechanics, some of them everyone (or everyone knowledgeable) can.

For the "overpowered protagonist" style isekei, I think you could get the right feel by running the world extremely stock-WotC-character level, with NPCs not taking any precautions that wouldn't be necessary against a classic tank-Fighter/heal-Cleric/blasty-Wizard/sneaky-Rogue party ... and then have the players bring optimized characters that they play as effectively as they can. Depending on the sub-genre, the rest of the world either remains perpetually on the back foot, or the antagonist faction starts learning from the PCs.

[TinyMushroom]

I'm not that familiar with the genre, but if you were looking for a TTRPG to adapt to a Isekai format, personally I would select Icon. It already handles a seperate class for out-of-combat and in-combat abilities, which could serve as a separation for the character's pre-game life and personality, and their ingame characteristics. Second, it is incredibly open with its information such as enemy types and abilities, which could easily be flavored as "the characters having access to video game information". Third, it has video game staples such as the Fishing Minigame inbuilt into its downtime. Fourth, it expects an over-the-top power fantasy, such that "I can do this because the game is glitched specifically for me" isn't all that out-of-place to explain certain types of abilities.

[JakOfAllTirades]

Mobius Worlds Publishing is kickstarting Well of the Worlds, an isekai setting for use with their Prowlers & Paragons superheroic RPG, in March. I've been involved in one of the playtest campaigns for this project for the last year and a half, and had a great time with it.

[Telonius]

To me, Isekai is more of a theme or a campaign setting element, and not so much a mechanical thing to build a system around. Unless the PCs (as transportees) work in some way differently than the inhabitants of their new home, there's no functional difference between them and an ordinary first-level character. You could plug in an Isekai plot into a pretty wide variety of mechanical systems without making any modification to the mechanics.

That said, I would think that Ravenloft would be a particularly good setting for an Isekai. The whole idea of the Mists suddenly springing up and entrapping people forever is pretty baked-in.

[Crake]

I havent seen any mention of how Overlord is basically a straight rip of dnd 3.5, including spell levels being an in world mechanic, AMF functioning almost exactly like it does in 3.5, metmagicked spells, and a level 20 wizard pretending to be a level 10 warrior due to them having the same bab. Personally, to me, its that last one that really cements that its 3.5 haha

[False God]

I havent seen any mention of how Overlord is basically a straight rip of dnd 3.5, including spell levels being an in world mechanic, AMF functioning almost exactly like it does in 3.5, metmagicked spells, and a level 20 wizard pretending to be a level 10 warrior due to them having the same bab. Personally, to me, its that last one that really cements that its 3.5 haha

I noticed this too upon binging it last week.