Dragonborn with unlimited breath weapon - is there a problem?

[Mastikator]

Either fizban's or PHB's dragonborn. What would break if they just had unlimited uses of their breath weapon?

[JNAProductions]

Either fizban's or PHB's dragonborn. What would break if they just had unlimited uses of their breath weapon?

PHB Dragonborn? Low levels-a 2d6 AoE is a pretty damn potent use of your action in Tier 1.
Fizban's? Same deal, but it scales better since it replaces a single attack, meaning for any non-Rogue Martial, you can just do an extra chunk of damage in Tier 2 and beyond.

What are you trying to achieve with this change?

[stoutstien]

Break is a strong word anytime you are talking about damage. The metallic version might be closer but still not broken.

Would it move them into the top picks for race/ancestry? Definitely.

[JNAProductions]

Break is a strong word anytime you are talking about damage. The metallic version might be closer but still not broken.

Would it move them into the top picks for race/ancestry? Definitely.

I'll echo this, as a new-post addendum to my first post.

It's a significant power increase (PHB at low levels mostly, Fizban's at all levels in the right builds) but it's unlikely to BREAK the game.

[diplomancer]

If it's PHB, put it from level 5 and it might be alright, it's too powerful at early levels.

[Reach Weapon]

[...] unlimited uses of their breath weapon?

Are you thinking with or without “Recharge 5–6”?

[Mastikator]

Are you thinking with or without “Recharge 5–6”?

Without. Just breath weapon every turn. Is 2d6 fire dex for half really that much better than a greatsword?

[LtPowers]

Without. Just breath weapon every turn. Is 2d6 fire dex for half really that much better than a greatsword?

Against a single target, maybe not. But it's a cone or line.


Powers &8^]

[Guy Lombard-O]

If it's PHB, put it from level 5 and it might be alright, it's too powerful at early levels.

Speaking as someone who's currently playing a tier 3 Fizban's fighter with the Dragon Fear feat, I think it'd be a bit too much.

[diplomancer]

Speaking as someone who's currently playing a tier 3 Fizban's fighter with the Dragon Fear feat, I think it'd be a bit too much.

Well, I did say PHB only, not Fizban's. But good point about Dragon Fear feat, I'd keep that use once per short rest.

[Dork_Forge]

I think it's too much in Tier 1 for both and a bit much for Fizban's period. You might not 'break' the game, but you're certainly elevating the damage and minimizing mob encounters.

[Unoriginal]

Without. Just breath weapon every turn. Is 2d6 fire dex for half really that much better than a greatsword?

It's not just fire, though. And as LtPowers said it it's not single-target either.

I think unlimited is too much, personally, at least for low level.

Think of the other options that grant 2d6 damage-dealing AoEs or similar. I don't think anyone get those in an unlimited fashion at lvl 1.

[Kane0]

I'd be happy to settle on Recharge 5-6

[Greywander]

If you just want the fluff, what I'd do is make it a natural weapon with the damage and range of a thrown javelin, but it's a ranged attack and the damage type matches your breath weapon. That way you can spit fire (or acid, lightning, etc.) all day.

If you specifically want an AoE, that's going to require more balance considerations. In that case, I might use spells like Thunderclap as a point of reference, maybe dropping the damage to a scaling d4 since it's a cone or line instead of just the area immediately around you. You want it to be something situational, where it's still effective against large groups but regular attacks still edge it out against single enemies and small groups.

[Eldariel]

I've played for a long while with 2d8 +1d8 per cantrip scaling at 5-6 recharge breath weapon and it's been, while not amazing, quite handy for both, breaking objects and actual combat use. Still not good enough to pick for the breath weapon but at least slightly less useless than it used to be before.

Not strictly worse than an attack for martials nor strictly worse than damage spells for casters. Often enough to give the race identity but rarely enough to have other stuff come up in combat. I fully endorse giving this a go if you wanna see Dragonborn do more; this is kinda nice for all classes too, if not amazing.

[Sigreid]

If I were going to do something like this, I'd give them a recharge die, just like dragons have.

[Amnestic]

If you're after a constant breath kinda deal for a character concept, giving it limited uses of full damage (like it has at the moment) and then dropping it down to cantrip damage with unlimited uses might be a fine balancing point. It's still a buff, obvs, but quite as overwhelming.

[Tawmis]

Either fizban's or PHB's dragonborn. What would break if they just had unlimited uses of their breath weapon?

At the very least, it needs a RECHARGE.

Even DRAGONS require the RECHARGE.

[Jerrykhor]

I generally dont like spammable abilities, especially those that deal damage. There is the tendency to make it very weak as a trade-off, but the problem is that the player's decision making would simply be:

1. I don't have anything better so i will spam this.

OR

2. I have something better so i will never use this.

No. 2 usually happens when you reach higher levels, which will happen eventually.

You don't need to breath weapon every round to remind yourself that you are a Dragonborn.

[Kane0]

You don't need to breath weapon every round to remind yourself that you are a Dragonborn.

It's one of the rare cases I'd encourage adding Darkvision, and/or some other ribbon like being more easily able to determine the correct value of treasure.

[Eldariel]

I generally dont like spammable abilities, especially those that deal damage. There is the tendency to make it very weak as a trade-off, but the problem is that the player's decision making would simply be:

1. I don't have anything better so i will spam this.

OR

2. I have something better so i will never use this.

No. 2 usually happens when you reach higher levels, which will happen eventually.

You don't need to breath weapon every round to remind yourself that you are a Dragonborn.

Hence recharge. Make it strong but not at will.

[Greywander]

I generally dont like spammable abilities, especially those that deal damage. There is the tendency to make it very weak as a trade-off, but the problem is that the player's decision making would simply be:

1. I don't have anything better so i will spam this.

OR

2. I have something better so i will never use this.

No. 2 usually happens when you reach higher levels, which will happen eventually.

You don't need to breath weapon every round to remind yourself that you are a Dragonborn.
There's a simple way to handle this. Regular attacks are single target, and this is an AoE. The breakpoint for cantrips like Thunderclap or Word of Radiance seems to be catching three or more enemies in the blast. For only one or two targets, it's not really worth it. Just set the damage to an appropriate value and it will be better than attacking some times but not others.