Clerical Conundrum

[LibraryOgre]

Why does a life cleric get Heavy Armor as a bonus? Wouldn't Medicine make a lot more sense?

[InvisibleBison]

Life cleric is supposed to be a healing specialist, so perhaps the thought was they'd be delivering touch-range heals to melee combatants and thus needed a way to get high AC.

[Gignere]

Life cleric is supposed to be a healing specialist, so perhaps the thought was they'd be delivering touch-range heals to melee combatants and thus needed a way to get high AC.

Probably more like an army medic. Army medics do wear battle armor.

[Kane0]

For that matter, why do Nature clerics get heavy armor instead of, I don't know, proficiency in the Nature skill?

Honestly i think thats mostly just a way for 'druids' to get access to heavy/metal armor.

[Dork_Forge]

Honestly i think thats mostly just a way for 'druids' to get access to heavy/metal armor.

I think it's to add a layer between them to help distinguish them, I don't think gaining Prof would override a Druids metal armor restriction with how its written.

In hindsight, they just shouldn't have given the druid medium armor and shields, it's a bit weird they get them. Probably some past edition baggage?

[Kane0]

I think it's to add a layer between them to help distinguish them, I don't think gaining Prof would override a Druids metal armor restriction with how its written.


It wouldnt, my airquotes were primarily because ive lost track of how many times a nature cleric has been confused with an actual druid by both players and characters at my table, theyre basically two sides of the same coin as far as theyre concerned

[RogueJK]

Life Cleric is the "default stereotypical Cleric" in 5E.

And the stereotypical Cleric in D&D over the years has been heavily armored.

Hence the stereotypical Cleric subclass gets the stereotypical Cleric armor.

The fact that many of the other types of Cleric don't get Heavy Armor in 5E is the aberration here... In prior editions, any Cleric could wear heavy armor. (Well, any standard Cleric; there was the occasional specialty priest who had rules against wearing certain types of armors, kinda similar to Druids.)

[animorte]

The fact that many of the other types of Cleric don't get Heavy Armor in 5E is the aberration here... In prior editions, any Cleric could wear heavy armor. (Well, any standard Cleric; there was the occasional specialty priest who had rules against wearing certain types of armors.)
This is true and I've always been fine with it, honestly.

However... I've always preferred the concept of a more mage-like healer. Focus on your buffs/control/ranged combat instead of hanging out on the front line, next to the Paladin...

This would require Cure Wounds to have, y'know, range.

[LibraryOgre]

This is true and I've always been fine with it, honestly.

However... I've always preferred the concept of a more mage-like healer. Focus on your buffs/control/ranged combat instead of hanging out on the front line, next to the Paladin...

This would require Cure Wounds to have, y'know, range.

Really, Healing Word in the hands of a Life Cleric is better on average than Cure Wounds in the hands of a normal cleric 87.5% of the time at a 16 Wisdom.

Life Cleric, Healing Word: 1d4+3 (wisdom) + 3 (life cleric): minimum 7, mean 8.5, max 10
Other Cleric, Cure Wounds: 1d8 +3 (wisdom): Minimum 4, mean 7.5, maximum 11.

Minimum is almost their mean, mean is a point and a half ahead, and max is only one point below. Throw in that it's a bonus action, not an action, and had range, and I can toss healing word and shoot with my crossbow in the same round.

Use a 3rd level slot?
Life Cleric, Healing Word: 3d4+3 (wisdom) + 5 (life cleric): minimum 11, mean 15.5, max 20
Other Cleric, Cure Wounds: 3d8 +3 (wisdom): Minimum 6, mean 16.5, maximum 27.

Cure wounds shows better there, but the minimum is way better, and the mean competitive. Max is way lower, sure, but you're still doing well, and it's still bonus v. action... if I can do 7 damage in that round (say, a cantrip that does 2d6+3 damage, or one that does 2d8+3 damage, like Word of Radiance or Sacred Flame do for a cleric at levle 5 with a 16 wisdom), then my mean total (healed and done) is 25 or 27, vs. a Cure wounds' maximum of 27

[Kurt Kurageous]

Life Cleric is the "default stereotypical Cleric" in 5E.

And the stereotypical Cleric in D&D over the years has been heavily armored.

Hence the stereotypical Cleric subclass gets the stereotypical Cleric armor.

About the single most unchanging thing in all of D&D.

1977. Meet St. Cuthbert equipped with chain+shield+mace. He's a LG combat healer and bringer of divine wrath.

2017 Meet Life Cleric. What changed? (Life cleric can wield weapons that draw blood.)

[Psyren]

Why does a life cleric get Heavy Armor as a bonus? Wouldn't Medicine make a lot more sense?

A lot of the cleric features don't make sense to me, which is likely why they are planning to decouple proficiencies from domain in OneD&D and overhaul the abilities. Why do Peace Clerics boost attacks? Why do Nature Clerics get Heavy Armor? Why do Tempest clerics get martial weapons? Shouldn't Forge Clerics get martial weapons too? It's just a mess.

[RogueJK]

Why do Peace Clerics boost attacks?

Peace through superior firepower.

[Kurt Kurageous]

Peace through superior firepower.

LOL! Keeping the peace since DRXXX.

[Psyren]

Peace through superior firepower.


LOL! Keeping the peace since DRXXX.

Well, it's not like there isn't precedent (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_Gandhi) :smallbiggrin:

[Thunderous Mojo]

Peace through superior firepower.

That is the Roman way. Caesar Augustus had built an Altar of Peace, in Rome, but the altar is more a monument to Pacification.

Roman violence, was a key ingredient for Pax Romana, according to the Romans themselves.

D&D Peace clerics are probably better thought of as pacifiers, and not practitioners of non-violence.

[RogueJK]

It's right there in the Peace domain flavor text... "stand up against those forces that try to prevent peace from flourishing"

[Zuras]

Why does a life cleric get Heavy Armor as a bonus? Wouldn't Medicine make a lot more sense?

In studying healing, the life cleric quickly learns that man is mortal, and wants to put as much armor between them and potential harm as possible. Learning medicine would only make sense in a system where the Medicine skill actually did something.

[Kurt Kurageous]

Why does a life cleric get Heavy Armor as a bonus? Wouldn't Medicine make a lot more sense?

I would caution anyone against these thoughts. Seeking sensibility in 5e might be a path to madness. And now it's a path to moot-ness.

I'm not sure the sensibility of anything in 5e was ever considered by those who created it. At best, it seems they were going for a hat tip to expectations from the past and striving for a vaguely defined concept of 'balance.'

[Xihirli]

Consider: Every planet we know of except Earth has World Peace.

[Psyren]

It's right there in the Peace domain flavor text... "stand up against those forces that try to prevent peace from flourishing"

You can stand up to someone without making it easier to commit direct violence against them though. It's a thematic oddity is all I'm saying.


I would caution anyone against these thoughts. Seeking sensibility in 5e might be a path to madness.

Indeed :smalltongue: