Want help making a Pathfinder Alchemist

[pabelfly]

So I have a player whom I want to make an Alchemist for in Pathfinder. I'm not overly familiar with Pathfinder or the Alchemist class as I'd like to be and I'm after some help and advice to help get started.

Some notes that will help dictate the build.


Level 10, 49K gold, no race specified.
He wants to throw bombs as his main attack option. While I believe Alchemist is likely the best option for this, if there are alternative archetypes from other classes that also do it well, I'd love to hear about them too
Minimizing book-keeping would be helpful. Permanent bonuses are preferred to temporary bonuses.
Are there any archetypes that trade off extracts? If there aren't, what would be a reasonable trade that could be made for them? Something like Fighter bonus feats or a something progression?

I'd also love some good suggestions for Pathfinder Items that I could use to best outfit the character.

[exelsisxax]

Alchemist is absolutely terrible for every component of this except bombs, for which it can't really constitute a 'main attack option'. Bombs are basically sneak attack damage that is much harder to use in a full attack, they will run out, and TONS of targets will be highly resistant or immune.

Alchemists have virtually no permanent bonuses. Their dedicated combat steroid is mutagen, a time-limited buff. extracts are more complicated than prepped spells because you lose out on action economy as alchemist is not a gish but they're almost exclusively buffs. additionally, if you try to prep all of them at the start of the day you WILL screw it up hard - you don't have fullcaster slots and flexibility to play around. there's exactly one archetype that replaces extracts - and it also replaces bombs.

So don't build an alchemist. straight up make an unchained rogue with bombs+throw anything but with much less sneak attack. far simpler, avoids needing to homebrew an entire class.

[Kurald Galain]

All right. Well, as you probably know from the Tiering discussions, Alchemists are a solid class all around, in addition to being a fan favorite.

You need the Fast Bombs discovery; a full attack routine with bombs will deal pretty good damage. If you run out, toss alchemist fire instead (which you can craft yourself).
Int-boosting cognatogen is a good boost for both bomb damage and knowledge skills. Mindchemist archetype has some of the best knowledge skills in the game.
I would stick with alchemy and just pick long-lasting buffs like Barkskin, and take the discovery to share them with your teammates.
Holy bombs is a good discovery, and some of the discoveries that add debuffs to bombs (e.g. nauseate) are very solid.
Wings is an excellent discovery and one of the few ways to get permanent flight without taking an action in combat. For a ranged attacker, flight is a solid defense option too.

I don't think anyone is better than alchemist at bomb throwing, except if you take a Draconic Sorcerer and refluff his fireballs into bombs. To be fair, a blaster sorc will outdamage an alchemist.

HTH.

[Firebug]

If you are looking to drop Extracts, then consider the Underground Chemist (https://aonprd.com/ArchetypeDisplay.aspx?FixedName=Rogue%20Undergroun d%20Chemist) archetype for Rogue. And I suggest the regular Rogue, not the 'updated' Unchained Rogue, because two of the regular Rogue Talents (that the Unchained Rogue doesn't get) is Bomber and Bombers Discovery. Bomber gives the regular rogue Int mod alchemist bombs per day(which uses your Sneak Attack Dice to determine how strong of a bomb), and Bombers Discovery gives them a discovery that relates to bombs. Sand Bomb is a really good one, as it gives an automatic no-save blind to the primary target for 1 round and save or blind for the splash.

However, the Rogue will have far fewer bombs per day compared to an actual Alchemist (who gets Int mod +level). But one thing the Underground Chemist can do that is a bit uncommon is that they can Quick Draw any alchemical item, and can sneak attack with Splash Weapons 1/round. I like to tag on the Rake (https://aonprd.com/ArchetypeDisplay.aspx?FixedName=Rogue%20Rake) archetype as well. It lets you sacrifice some Sneak Attack for a free Intimidate(and +5 bonus per additional die lost) for the shaken condition. If you have a way to attack with a weapon, or another party member, adding in Cruel (https://aonprd.com/MagicWeaponsDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Cruel) is also useful for Sickened. However, this character is really only attacking once per round so can't get it going by itself. Sickened + Shaken is -4 to attack/saves, so can really help the rest of the party.

I like going the Ranged Feint (https://aonprd.com/FeatDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Ranged%20Feint)(and Improved Feint to feint as a move action) method for getting Sneak Attack at range. You are already taking quick draw, so basically you draw and throw a dagger as a move action to feint, and then use your standard action to throw a bomb or acid flask targeting Flatfooted Touch AC (basically, AC 10).
Given prep time (or gold to spare every day), mixing up a half dozen Acid/Alkali Flasks with the Hybridization Funnel (https://aonprd.com/MagicWondrousDisplay.aspx?FinalName=Hybridization% 20Funnel) can extend the 'bigger bombs' per day. Note: Hybridization Funnel says they do damage as if struck by both, so you should get Int to each damage roll (and energy resistance to each). 2d6+Int x2 + Sneak Attack is a decent enough hit for when you are out of bombs.

Extending the damage potential of a humble acid flask, consider a level dip in Medium (https://aonprd.com/ClassDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Medium)(Champion spirit) for +1 to hit and +3 (for non-spell) damage (note, should affect both sides of Hybrid Funnel). This also buffs the random melee or bow attacks the character might make. Spirit Focus(Champion) for another +1/+1, and/or Spirit-bonded Armor enchant for another +1/+1. You can make up the 'loss' of a level of sneak attack by taking Accomplished Sneak Attacker (https://aonprd.com/FeatDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Accomplished%20Sneak%20A ttacker), which basically makes up for 2 level dips. So I recommend a second level dip into Spiritualist, specifically the Exciter (https://aonprd.com/ArchetypeDisplay.aspx?FixedName=Spiritualist%20Exc iter) Archetype and the Dedication Spirit. When the Phantom is harboured in the spiritualist's mind, the spiritualist gets Skill Focus in two skills based on the emotional focus (Dedication is Sense Motive and Diplomacy), and a +4 against Mind-affecting and can shunt a failed save vs Mind-affecting to the phantom instead 1/day. In addition, Dedication also gives the Iron Will feat, and the class gets +2 Fort/Will as well. A 1 level dip that is HUGE for will saves(+4 Will, and another +4 vs mind-affecting). Exciter gives +10 movement speed(which makes up for medium armor), and lets you turn off the phantom bonuses for a +4 Dex/Cha rage (or +4 Str/Con, or +2 Str/Con/Dex/Cha) for 4+Con rounds per day(like bloodrage).

[vasilidor]

When I played an Alchemist, I took the Infusion discovery. Made me a pretty good buff character, as long as people remembered to use what I handed out before a fight, or even during. It allows other people to use your extracts greatly enhancing the characters versatility. A large number of "self" targeting abilities can now be used on the party fighter this way. Mutagen is a temporary buff that can help with various fights depending on what you need to do.

Different discoveries can change what damage types your bomb has available. This somewhat bypasses the problem of targets being immune to them. If you throw them at enemies in melee with your front liners, I recommend the precise bomb discovery. This will keep you from hitting them. Dispelling Bomb and Force Bomb are good options for most challenges when they become available,

As far as static boosts go, the Alchemist does not have a lot of those. Book keeping is needed for tracking what extracts you have prepared just like a wizard.

[zlefin]

I'm not that up on this balance-wise;
there's an Arcane bomber archetype, though it doesn't really accomplish your stated goals.
https://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/archetypes/paizo---wizard-archetypes/arcane-bomber

For minimizing bookkeeping, one way would be to only select extracts that have durations long enough that they can essentially be up all day. Any hour/level could be counted with two uses, or maybe one use, depending on what you want. any 10 mins/level would use upa bunch of extract slots but could be worthwhile. Just assume that they're always drunk at a convenient time between battles so they're always up.

An alternative would be to give them the arcane bomber's ability and just say that they use that instead of extracts. It'd still involve bookkeeping but it'd just be using all the extract slots to buff the bombs as you cast them.

Or you could have them give up extracts and mutagen in exchange for double the number of bombs (so they don't run out) and extra feats that are either combat feats or bomb discoveries. That'd probably be fine, though I'm not entirely clear on the balance level.

[Akal Saris]

You might look into the "Grenadier" archetype, which trades some of the alchemist's poison abilities for more bomb-focused abilities.

[Starbuck_II]

So I have a player whom I want to make an Alchemist for in Pathfinder. I'm not overly familiar with Pathfinder or the Alchemist class as I'd like to be and I'm after some help and advice to help get started.

Some notes that will help dictate the build.


Level 10, 49K gold, no race specified.
He wants to throw bombs as his main attack option. While I believe Alchemist is likely the best option for this, if there are alternative archetypes from other classes that also do it well, I'd love to hear about them too
Minimizing book-keeping would be helpful. Permanent bonuses are preferred to temporary bonuses.
Are there any archetypes that trade off extracts? If there aren't, what would be a reasonable trade that could be made for them? Something like Fighter bonus feats or a something progression?

I'd also love some good suggestions for Pathfinder Items that I could use to best outfit the character.

Vigilante lets you attach bombs to arrows as a talent, but limited uses a day: 3 + Int mod. You get a extra use + discovery by taking talent again.
Pro:
Acts like fast bomb as you attach as an attack (so rapid shot, haste, BAB exta attacks, etc stack)

Cons:
Limited uses a day.

Sadly no extra Vigilante Talent feat or any feat to increase it.
Unclear if extra bomb feat applies.