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View Full Version : D&D 3.x Class Would you play/allow this prestige class? (Bendy and the dark revival inspired)



lolcat
2023-04-21, 08:40 AM
Greetinngs Playground!

After watching playthroughs of "Bendy and the dark revival" (trailer here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R365IYrPgoE), i got inspired and tried my hand at creating a prestige class for D&D 3.5 that captured the style and feeling of the game.
I also tried to take inspiration from existing classes like the Sandshaper, but wanted to give it a more creepy/otherworldly bent at higher levels.

In any case, since this is my first attempt at homebrewing an entire class, feedback and criticism would be much appreciated.

Thanks a bunch,

your friendly neighborhood lolcat
https://www.gameactuality.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/bendy-and-the-dark-revival-guide-soluce-head.jpg

The Ink Caster



Requirements:


Arcane or Divine spellcasting ability (must be able to cast 3rd-level spells)
Skill ranks in Craft (painting or calligraphy): 5
Knowledge (nature): 2 ranks
Profession (artist) 5 ranks
Feat: Spell Thematics (Ink)
Successful creation of an ink-based artwork or magical item worth at least 1000GP



Hit Dice: d4
BAB: progression as Sorc, Fort: Bad, Refl & Will: good
Class Skills: Concentration, Craft (painting or calligraphy), Decipher Script, Forgery, Knowledge (arcana), Knowledge (nature), Knowledge (the planes), Profession (artist), Spellcraft.
Skill Points per Level: 4 + Intelligence modifier.



Class Features:

Spellcasting: At each level except 1st and 9th, you gain new spells per day and an increase in caster level (and spells known, if applicable) as if you had also gained a level in an arcane or divine spellcasting class to which you belonged before adding the prestige class level. You do not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained. If you had more than one arcane spellcasting class before becoming an ink caster, you must decide to which class to add each level for the purpose of determining spells per day, caster level, and spells known.

Create Ink[Sp], Lvl 1: A first tentative connection to the Ink magic gives an Ink Caster access to the spell “Create Ink”. They can add it to their list of known spells or add it to their spell- or prayerbook for free (if they have one). This spell works identically to the spell “Create Water”, only that it creates one ounce of well-made artists-ink for every gallon “Create Water” would have created. The caster can choose the ink to be of any color of their choosing. The ink, once created, is non-poisonous and non-magical in nature. It can be used in many of the Ink Casters abilities, or to create regular artworks or magical items.


Magic of the Ink [Lvl 1]: As an Ink Caster, you gain knowledge of the deeper magic of the ink, which gives you access to additional spells (see the list below). If you were a caster who previously prepared spells (such as a wizard), you can prepare these spells like any other spell to which you have access. If you are a spontaneous caster (such as a sorcerer), these spells are available to you like any other spell you know. You cannot cast a spell of higher level than the maximum spell level you can cast. These spells become options for you when you gain access to the appropriate spell level.

At first level every second level thereafter, an Ink Caster can choose one of the spells on the following list. Further on, she is capable of losing a prepared spell, in addition to a number of ink-vials equal to the spell level, in order to cast it spontaneously without having prepared it beforehand.


O Level: Arcane Mark, Amanuensis, Stick
1st Level: Animate Ink (as Animate Water), Grease, Illusory Script, Silent Image, Color Spray
2nd Level: Blur, Ghoul Glyph, Minor Image, Mirror Image
3rd Level: Sepia Snake Sigil, Glyph of Warding, Major Image, Secret Page
4th Level: Hallucinatory Terrain, Shadow Conjuration, Solid Fog
5th Level: Symbol of Sleep, Mirage Arcana, Persistent Image, Shadow Evocation
6th Level: Programmed Image ,Veil, Symbol of Fear, Symbol of Persuasion
7th Level: Greater Shadow Conjuration, Project Image, Symbol of Stunning
8th Level: Greater Shadow Evocation, Symbol of Insanity
9th Level: Shades





Intent Made Manifest [Ex] Lvl 2: As you delve into the mysteries of ink magic, you learn to weave your art and magic into a more permanent form. You can create mundane, non-alchemical items out of ink, using their paintbrush or quill as a tool. You can create any solid object you can imagine, provided you have access to enough ink, and you can successfully make a caster level check. The DC of the check is determined by the size and complexity of the item:
(table identical to Sandshaper ability)

Vivid Imagination [Su] Lvl 4: An Ink Caster can channel stored spell energy into summoning spells that she hasn’t prepared ahead of time. She can lose a prepared spell, in addition to a number of ink-vials equal to the spell level, in order to cast any summon nature’s ally spell of the same level or lower.

The summoned creatures, known as “inkwell creatures”, have the visual appearance of an artwork of the chosen creature (in the casters chosen art-style), and have identical characteristics to the original creature, with the following exception:

The summoned creature does not possess any Supernatural, Spell-Like or Spellcasting abilities. The Ink Caster can summon an inkwell version of any creature that they have seen before or can make a Knowledge (nature) check with a DC equal to 10 + the creature's CR.

While in contact with an ink-covered surface, an inkwell creature has fast healing 5 and damage reduction 5

A vial of ink thrown on an inkwell creature has the same effect as a cure light wound spell, CLvl of the character having created the ink.



Subtle Art[Ex] Lvl 3: Drawing ink forth from within her, an ink caster can cloak herself in a near-perfect imitation of her surroundings, all but disappearing into the background. This ability grants a circumstance bonus to the ink casters Hide check equal to her Craft(painting or Calligraphy) modifier. An Ink Caster can use this ability up to one minute per class level per day, split up however she desires. Activating and dismissing this ability is a move action.



Art Moves[Sp] Lvl 5: At level 5, the Ink Caster can teleport from one surface of liquid ink to another. They can teleport as a move action to any pool within 10 ft. per caster level which they have seen before or personally created. The Ink Caster can teleport a number of times per day equal to their class level plus modifier of casting ability. One vial of ink can create a surface large enough to accommodate a medium-sized creature. For example, an Ink Caster who is already standing in a puddle of ink can throw a vial of ink through an open window 30 ft. away as a ranged attack (standard action), where it shatters on the floor, and then teleport to the inky surface they created as a move action.

At level 7, her connection to the ink has grown to such a point that she no longer needs to touch an inky surface to teleport to another. In addition, her range increases to that or a “Teleport” spell.



Inkwell Transformation[Sp] Lvl 6: The Ink Caster gains the ability to transform her own body into a pool of living ink, for one minute plus 1 minute per Ink Caster level per day. This ability otherwise works identical to the spell “Sandform”.



Inkwell Dimension [Ex] Lvl 8: Deciphering the deeper secrets of the Ink Magic and its origins, the Ink Caster gains the ability to create a small demi plane by drawing power from the mysterious source of ink magic. Drawing its features through use of her Craft(painting or calligraphy) skills, the demi plane has a radius of 10 ft. per Ink Caster Level.
Any drawn elements within that plane are considered mundane versions and have the same hardness and hit points as their regular counterparts. No exotic materials such as adamantium can be drawn to create the inkwell dimension.
While they are dry to the touch, any drawn item or surface in the Inkwell Dimension is considered liquid ink concerning other Ink Caster abilities.
Within the Inkwell Dimension no extra ink is necessary to spontaneously cast spells from the “Magic of the Ink” ability.

Creating this refuge is costly and takes one vial of ink per 5-ft. cube of created volume to initially make, to change or to repair. The Ink Caster can make slight changes to the visual traits of the demi plane (I.e. if all creatures and objects in it are monochrome or a appear a certain artistic style, form and source of lighting etc.) but cannot change the laws that govern physics or magic as they exist on the prime material plane.

The Ink Caster can attempt to extend her domain beyond the size it could naturally take by making a caster-lvl check of 10+5 for each 5-ft radius beyond what it could normally have. If this check fails, her Inkwell Dimension collapses back into a 5 ft.-radius core around the ink caster. All ink-based features and creations outside this core are lost, as are all non-magical items in these areas. Magical Items and non-ink-based creatures make a Reflex Save (DC 10 + Distance from Core/10) or are also irretrievably lost as the demiplane collapses.



Living Art [Sp] Lvl 10: Learning the deepest secrets of the Ink Magic, the Ink Caster gains the ability to bring their drawings and sketches to true, sentient life. This ability can be applied to any painting or sketch of a physical being she made, but otherwise works as the spell “Awaken”. As with “Awaken”, the Ink Caster has no special ability to command or control her creations, even though she senses if they are destroyed and can, as a move action and at any distance within the same plane, retrieve the life-force she spent on creating the being. This kills the awakened creature permanently and returns ½ of the spent XP to the Ink Caster. The Ink Caster can use this ability once per casting ability modifier per day (withdrawing the life force can be done at will).




Edit: Here is the latest version (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1pa4_YrRFOtvLLyRssg7L0tIujfGp3NNm9WO5dZWeqdI/edit?usp=sharing) of the Ink Caster and two more prestige classes, the Inkwell Guardian and the Inkwell Cultist, plus some spells, items and monsters:

Beni-Kujaku
2023-04-21, 09:25 AM
Would definitely play this, would probably not allow it without change in very low-op games. The 1st-level ability to learn so many of the best and most versatile spells completely breaks spontaneous casters. 30 spells (excluding cantrips) is almost as many as the sorcerer gains naturally. Sand Shaper gives a similar amount, but most of them are weak, or useable only in a desert, and is already a good to great option for sorcerers. Having all the Shadow X, Glyph of Warding, and a lot of illusions, on top of effectively all Summon Nature's Ally (though without SLAs, so a lot weaker) seems a bit too strong to my tastes, even losing a caster level at level one. Without Shadow Conjuration, or if at least you need to be level X+1 in the class to gain access to the spells of level X in the list (to prevent people simply dipping Ink Caster to double or more their spells known), seems like a good and flavorful class.


Also, should probably be in the Homebrew part of the forum.

lolcat
2023-04-21, 02:12 PM
Would definitely play this, would probably not allow it without change in very low-op games. The 1st-level ability to learn so many of the best and most versatile spells completely breaks spontaneous casters. 30 spells (excluding cantrips) is almost as many as the sorcerer gains naturally. Sand Shaper gives a similar amount, but most of them are weak, or useable only in a desert, and is already a good to great option for sorcerers. Having all the Shadow X, Glyph of Warding, and a lot of illusions, on top of effectively all Summon Nature's Ally (though without SLAs, so a lot weaker) seems a bit too strong to my tastes, even losing a caster level at level one. Without Shadow Conjuration, or if at least you need to be level X+1 in the class to gain access to the spells of level X in the list (to prevent people simply dipping Ink Caster to double or more their spells known), seems like a good and flavorful class.


Also, should probably be in the Homebrew part of the forum.

Thank you, you're most likely right :)
What do you think of this alternate spell selection?

O Level:

Arcane Mark
Amanuensis
Stick


1st Level:

Bigby’s Tripping Hand
Grease
Silent Image


2nd Level:

Blur
Ghoul Glyph
Minor Image


3rd Level:

Sepia Snake Sigil
Major Image
Bigby’s Interposing Hand



4th Level:

Hallucinatory Terrain
Otiluke’s Resilient Sphere
Evards Black Tentacles


5th Level:

Symbol of Sleep
Mirage Arcana
Persistent Image


6th Level:

Wall of Gears
Veil
Symbol of Fear


7th Level:

Bigby’s Grasping Hand
Project Image
Prismatic Eye


8th Level:

Prismatic Wall
Symbol of Insanity


9th Level:

Prismatic Sphere

Miss Disaster
2023-04-21, 08:22 PM
I like this PrC ... a lot. Very cool. Mechanically, all your requirements and class abilities range from good to phenomenal. Except for one class ability - Magic of the Ink. Which probably could use selection tweaks and power/utility level analysis. You've nailed an ink-themed casters preferences for spells that are heavy on rune/glyph/sigil/symbol theme. Although you should consider adding "tattoo" spells to that theme, especially since your PrC requirements already lay a skill emphasis foundation for such an addition. That said, the spell Create Magic Tattoo from the Spell Compendium should be a definite add.

Also, if you need more thematic spells in these fields, consider looking into Pathfinder 1e's offerings. As the vast majority of PF1e's spells are backwards compatible into 3.5 with little or no need for mechanics tweaking. Also, both 3.5 and PF1e have a metric tonne of ink-themed spells from a wide number of high-quality, well-balanced 3PP books. Many available on the internet for free wikis, d20PFSRD, etc. Spell like this could easily swap into your additional bonus spell list in place of your current spells that probably only are added because they can be visualized as being ink-themed when combined with your Spell Thematics feat (like Solid Fog, etc).

Please don't take this as me being overly critical or preachy. I really love this PrC. Lots of cool, immersive imagery and a good offering of both quality crunch and fluff!

lolcat
2023-04-22, 03:24 AM
I like this PrC ... a lot. Very cool. Mechanically, all your requirements and class abilities range from good to phenomenal. Except for one class ability - Magic of the Ink. Which probably could use selection tweaks and power/utility level analysis. You've nailed an ink-themed casters preferences for spells that are heavy on rune/glyph/sigil/symbol theme. Although you should consider adding "tattoo" spells to that theme, especially since your PrC requirements already lay a skill emphasis foundation for such an addition. That said, the spell Create Magic Tattoo from the Spell Compendium should be a definite add.

Also, if you need more thematic spells in these fields, consider looking into Pathfinder 1e's offerings. As the vast majority of PF1e's spells are backwards compatible into 3.5 with little or no need for mechanics tweaking. Also, both 3.5 and PF1e have a metric tonne of ink-themed spells from a wide number of high-quality, well-balanced 3PP books. Many available on the internet for free wikis, d20PFSRD, etc. Spell like this could easily swap into your additional bonus spell list in place of your current spells that probably only are added because they can be visualized as being ink-themed when combined with your Spell Thematics feat (like Solid Fog, etc).

Please don't take this as me being overly critical or preachy. I really love this PrC. Lots of cool, immersive imagery and a good offering of both quality crunch and fluff!

No i really appreciate it, thank you for the input! I would definitely love to build on the idea later on, with ink-themed spells and maybe even ink-themed grafts and items. For now i'm mostly concerned with balancing it. What do you think about the initial spell selection vs. the second one in my later post?
Also, thanks for the pointers towards the spells, will def. take a look :)

Alabenson
2023-04-22, 12:50 PM
As a DM, I'd say I wouldn't have any issue with this class for the most part. The only part of the class that would make me slightly leery is the capstone, which I suspect could be abused by combining it with though bottles or other ways to mitigate the XP cost, along with minionmancy/Diplomancy shenanigans. At the very least, I'd apply some limitations to what the player could create with Living Art so they don't try and create an army of gods or some nonsense.

lolcat
2023-04-23, 01:07 PM
Thanks everybody for the feedback up to now!

I have adapted the Spell-List to the following. I was thinking of adding the Create Magical Tattoo spell, but then thought that no other abilities of the class actually mesh well with a buffing/support role, so left it out for now. Please let me know if you think the spell selection is well balanced or what/why you would alter :)

O Level:

Arcane Mark
Amanuensis
Stick

1st Level:

Bigby’s Tripping Hand
Grease
Silent Image

2nd Level:

Web
Ghoul Glyph
Minor Image

3rd Level:

Bigby’s Interposing Hand
Major Image
Sepia Snake Sigil

4th Level:

Evards Black Tentacles
Hallucinatory Terrain
Otiluke’s Resilient Sphere

5th Level:

Mirage Arcana
Symbol of Sleep
Blackwater Tentacle

6th Level:

Symbol of Fear
Veil
Wall of Thorns

7th Level:

Bigby’s Grasping Hand
Project Image
Prismatic Eye

8th Level:

Prismatic Wall
Symbol of Insanity

9th Level:

Prismatic Sphere



I added a tidbit to the Inkwell Dimension ability so that items created from ink last indefinitely in it as if worn by the Ink Caster.
Any item created with the Intent Made Manifest ability continues to exist as if on the Ink Casters body while remaining in the Inkwell Dimension.


And i clarified that the Living Art capstone ability only works on drawings of animals and trees, as the original "Awaken" spell it is patterned after.
Learning the deepest secrets of the Ink Magic, the Ink Caster gains the ability to bring their drawings and sketches of nature from merely being captured in ink to true, sentient life. This ability can be applied to any painting or sketch of an animal or tree she made, if it is at least of diminutive size and created with at least a DC 20 Craft (painting or calligraphy) skill check.

I thought of giving Inkwell Creatures the ability to move through inky surfaces as the Ink Caster herself does, but i suspect that would be way too OP (essentially giving every Summon a limited version of Dimension Door), but maybe i'm wrong. What do you think?

Please let me know what you think of the changes, and what else you might want to edit :)

A big Thank You for every input so far, it was really helpful :)

noob
2023-04-24, 07:11 AM
I thought of giving Inkwell Creatures the ability to move through inky surfaces as the Ink Caster herself does, but i suspect that would be way too OP (essentially giving every Summon a limited version of Dimension Door), but maybe i'm wrong. What do you think?

It would not be op: with the earliest entry in that class you would be level 7 by the time you can summon inkwell creatures that can use that ability so you already could have created lantern archons two levels earlier (since create lantern archon is a level 3 spell) which grants the utility of greater teleport as long as you are below 25 pounds.

lolcat
2023-04-24, 01:38 PM
So my tinkering with this got... a tiny bit out of hand one could say :smallbiggrin: It's not just the Ink Caster now, but along with it the Inkwell Guardian (fighter prestige class) and the Inkwell Cultist (warlock prestige class), as well as an actually fleshed out Inkwell Creature template.... so yeah, if anybody wants to take the time to take a glimpse at it and let me know how to improve or add to it, i may or may not ritually sacrifice to you instead of to the dark and terrible gods of the far realms (a.k.a. back of the fridge) next time :)

Here's the link, btw: The Voices told me to! Also, Ink is pretty! (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1pa4_YrRFOtvLLyRssg7L0tIujfGp3NNm9WO5dZWeqdI/edit?usp=sharing) (apologies for any bad formatting btw, Google Docs are not something i use all that often)

Thanks a bunch!

noob
2023-04-24, 02:01 PM
So my tinkering with this got... a tiny bit out of hand one could say :smallbiggrin: It's not just the Ink Caster now, but along with it the Inkwell Guardian (fighter prestige class) and the Inkwell Cultist (warlock prestige class), as well as an actually fleshed out Inkwell Creature template.... so yeah, if anybody wants to take the time to take a glimpse at it and let me know how to improve or add to it, i may or may not ritually sacrifice to you instead of to the dark and terrible gods of the far realms (a.k.a. back of the fridge) next time :)

Here's the link, btw: The Voices told me to! Also, Ink is pretty! (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1pa4_YrRFOtvLLyRssg7L0tIujfGp3NNm9WO5dZWeqdI/edit?usp=sharing) (apologies for any bad formatting btw, Google Docs are not something i use all that often)

Thanks a bunch!

Set it to public, right now it asks for authorization.
Or even better copy paste the entire content of the doc in your first post.

lolcat
2023-04-24, 02:18 PM
Set it to public, right now it asks for authorization.
Or even better copy paste the entire content of the doc in your first post.

That should do it.... hopefully. Can you access it now?

Concerning the first post,i'm gonna try, but the forum doesnt really play nice with the table formatting... but i will try :)

lolcat
2023-05-03, 05:31 PM
So the idea didn't really leave my mind until i got it all out, soooo.... here it is. (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1HhnqWa2FVmEjIP08dF6wPxETYV_Skv6u/view?usp=sharing)

Prestige Classes, Spells, Magic Items and Monsters.

If you have the time, feedback is much appreciated. It you try out any parts of it, let me know how it goes :smallsmile:

NichG
2023-05-03, 09:13 PM
Honestly, Subtle Art is the main thing in here that immediately raises warning bells for me, because things that let you scale a (relevant) skill check at twice the rate skill checks normally scale by are nearly unheard of. Item Familiar is the closest other thing I can think of, and it's quite potent (though it also does so many other things too...). Plus you have a free X stat to Y in there as well (with your Hide now getting boosted by both your Dex and Int). And since Hide is one of those skills that functions mostly if not entirely via opposed checks, a character who goes this route can basically guarantee being beyond the abilities of other characters to Spot them without something that just bypasses Hide entirely. Certainly spells/abilities making skill checks irrelevant or automatic isn't a unique thing, but its not a design feature of 3.5e that I'd want to double down on and ask for even more of... I'd probably either make it that the character can replace Hide with their Craft check rather than add them, or do something like a +1 bonus per 2 skill ranks invested in the Craft skill but ignoring stat mod or buffs to the Craft skill, which would at least make it on par with Item Familiar skill rank stacking.

I agree that the capstone also bears careful looking at. It's described to be 'as Awaken', but is left ambiguous as to how the base stats of the thing being Awakened are determined. If its only the stuff from Summon Nature's Ally emulation that's one thing, but if its basically working like Ice Assassin where the character could draw a picture of a particular person to clone them, that's a much bigger deal (including trickery like having them be polymorphed into an animal shape so they fit the animal or tree criteria, then ...). Maybe just something to say that the creation is always a generic instance of the creature type being illustrated, and never a specific creature with memories, extra HD or class levels, etc?

lolcat
2023-05-04, 05:59 AM
Honestly, Subtle Art is the main thing in here that immediately raises warning bells for me, because things that let you scale a (relevant) skill check at twice the rate skill checks normally scale by are nearly unheard of. Item Familiar is the closest other thing I can think of, and it's quite potent (though it also does so many other things too...). Plus you have a free X stat to Y in there as well (with your Hide now getting boosted by both your Dex and Int). And since Hide is one of those skills that functions mostly if not entirely via opposed checks, a character who goes this route can basically guarantee being beyond the abilities of other characters to Spot them without something that just bypasses Hide entirely. Certainly spells/abilities making skill checks irrelevant or automatic isn't a unique thing, but its not a design feature of 3.5e that I'd want to double down on and ask for even more of... I'd probably either make it that the character can replace Hide with their Craft check rather than add them, or do something like a +1 bonus per 2 skill ranks invested in the Craft skill but ignoring stat mod or buffs to the Craft skill, which would at least make it on par with Item Familiar skill rank stacking.

I agree that the capstone also bears careful looking at. It's described to be 'as Awaken', but is left ambiguous as to how the base stats of the thing being Awakened are determined. If its only the stuff from Summon Nature's Ally emulation that's one thing, but if its basically working like Ice Assassin where the character could draw a picture of a particular person to clone them, that's a much bigger deal (including trickery like having them be polymorphed into an animal shape so they fit the animal or tree criteria, then ...). Maybe just something to say that the creation is always a generic instance of the creature type being illustrated, and never a specific creature with memories, extra HD or class levels, etc?

Those a great points. Maybe, Subtle Art is really better off by replacing Hide with the Craft Skill, and maybe give a + ClassLevel bonus to it?
Concerning the capstone you're absolutely right, the phrase of the generic instance of the creature is great!

H_H_F_F
2023-05-05, 10:54 AM
Note that the capstone of Inkwell guardian having no /day limitations really plays into the hands of anyone immune to Con damage, anyone that mitigates ability damage (strongheart vest), or anyone binding Naberius.

Tzardok
2023-05-05, 11:04 AM
Two of those three problems can be solved by replacing Con damage with Con burn. I really don't get why ability burn is never used after the XPH introduced it

lolcat
2023-05-05, 12:18 PM
Two of those three problems can be solved by replacing Con damage with Con burn. I really don't get why ability burn is never used after the XPH introduced it

Good points, will definitely use that & make actually having to sacrifice the con more clear. Any thoughts on the Cultist prestige class?

H_H_F_F
2023-05-05, 02:01 PM
Good points, will definitely use that & make actually having to sacrifice the con more clear. Any thoughts on the Cultist prestige class?

I'm not great with warlock stuff, so I can't comment on the class as a whole, but I think Zac's passive black death is sort of weirdly worded. First, it's described as spell like, but it isn't really and doesn't make sense as such. Wouldn't it be SU?

Second, "succeed in slaying" is kind of weird. If the inkwell creature reduced the killer to -9 and then the killer died later that round from bleeding, did the inkwell creature slay it? Even if clarified, it creates a huge tactical hassle for the party. I'd consider changing it.

Third, the inkwell creatures don't have a duration. What if the killer teleports away? Do they just keep chasing them to the ends of the earth? What if the killer teleports away, and then someone casts true resurrection on the character? What happens to the inkwell beings then?

To your credit, that kind of weird mess is very much in line with WoTC prc design.

lolcat
2023-05-06, 01:51 PM
I'm not great with warlock stuff, so I can't comment on the class as a whole, but I think Zac's passive black death is sort of weirdly worded. First, it's described as spell like, but it isn't really and doesn't make sense as such. Wouldn't it be SU?

Second, "succeed in slaying" is kind of weird. If the inkwell creature reduced the killer to -9 and then the killer died later that round from bleeding, did the inkwell creature slay it? Even if clarified, it creates a huge tactical hassle for the party. I'd consider changing it.

Third, the inkwell creatures don't have a duration. What if the killer teleports away? Do they just keep chasing them to the ends of the earth? What if the killer teleports away, and then someone casts true resurrection on the character? What happens to the inkwell beings then?

To your credit, that kind of weird mess is very much in line with WoTC prc design.



Hmmm, you're right, at the very least it would need clarification. But i wonder, what would you change it into or how would you alter it?

H_H_F_F
2023-05-07, 04:08 AM
Hmmm, you're right, at the very least it would need clarification. But i wonder, what would you change it into or how would you alter it?

Not sure...

First, clarifications: make it SU. Make it clear whether the player or the DM chooses the inkwell creatures, or simply set them to one type of creature. Clarify that it only happens if someone kills the cultist, not in any other circumstance. Use the same definition of slaying that you'll later use for the inkwell creatures getting the killer back, whatever that may be.

As for the main issues: maybe I'd just go with saying "instead of dying, the cultist explodes..." so you can't revive them while the creatures are active. Give them a duration, and add "the cultist truly dies only when the duration is over, or when all the inkwell beings have been slain".

Finally, make it so that "if the killer is slain (whatever that is) by one of the inkwell creatures, they retreat and cocoon. If they manage to survive, they reform into the cultist."

It's better than resurrection, obviously (you don't lose a level) but it's far less messy, IMO.

Herbert_W
2023-05-07, 07:24 AM
Overall, this is a great prestige class. I can't say much about how well-balanced it is - but in terms of thematics, it's great. Most of this class' abilities are useful with forethought, preparation, and creativity which IMO is exactly what you'd expect from a writing/drawing/art themed spellcaster.

There is one potential exploit that I'd like to point out:



Inkwell Dimension . . . The Ink Caster can attempt to extend her domain beyond the size it could naturally take . . . Magical Items and non-ink-based creatures make a Reflex Save (DC 10 + Distance from Core/10) or are also irretrievably lost as the demiplane collapses.



irretrievably lost


Some ambitious player is going to want to use this to lose things on purpose and permanently delete the tarrasque, any and all one-ring-style quest-to-destroy artifacts of doom, etc. That's really cheesy IMO, and while the subset of plots that it can derail is small, it could derail those plots very badly.

I'd recommend having the lost items be transported to a random plane, without further elaboration on what "random" means - which de facto makes it mean "under the DM's control."

(Also, what happens to the creatures and magical items that aren't lost? Do they end up back in the 5-ft radius around the caster? Are we assuming that they all fit in that space?)

lolcat
2023-05-07, 10:38 AM
Not sure...

First, clarifications: make it SU. Make it clear whether the player or the DM chooses the inkwell creatures, or simply set them to one type of creature. Clarify that it only happens if someone kills the cultist, not in any other circumstance. Use the same definition of slaying that you'll later use for the inkwell creatures getting the killer back, whatever that may be.

As for the main issues: maybe I'd just go with saying "instead of dying, the cultist explodes..." so you can't revive them while the creatures are active. Give them a duration, and add "the cultist truly dies only when the duration is over, or when all the inkwell beings have been slain".

Finally, make it so that "if the killer is slain (whatever that is) by one of the inkwell creatures, they retreat and cocoon. If they manage to survive, they reform into the cultist."

It's better than resurrection, obviously (you don't lose a level) but it's far less messy, IMO.

What would you say to this reformulation?


If an enemy reduces an Inkwell Cultist below –10 Hit Points with an attack, instead of dying she explodes in a 20 ft. Radius burst of ink, covering all surfaces and creatures in it unless they succeed on a DC 10 + Charisma Mod. + Lvl/2 Reflex save (see Ink-Blast for effect).

In the round after her demise and at her previous initiative, 1d4 Inkwell Creatures from the Summon Monster V list emerge from the ink. The player of the Inkwell Cultist chooses which of the creatures from the Summon Monster V list appear. They dissolve back into ink after one round per total character level.

The inkwell creatures proceed to attack whoever reduced the Inkwell Cultist below –10 HP with mindless ferocity. (If the creature is not within line of sight of the inkwell creatures, they proceed to attack anyone that is not an Inkwell Cultist, Inkwell Guardian, Ink Caster or other Inkwell Creature. They have no special ability to sense or track their prey other than what a regular creature of their type would have.)

The cultist truly dies only when the duration is over, or when all the inkwell creatures have been slain. Should one of these Inkwell Creatures manage to kill their prey, it will try to retreat from combat and find a safe place to cocoon itself in a sphere dripping black ink and red blood. If the sphere is left undisturbed for 1d4 hours, the Inkwell Cultist emerges from it as if the spell “Resurrection” had been cast on her remains and her killers soul is consumed in the process. If the sphere takes at least one point of damage, it collapses into a steaming puddle of ink and flesh without resurrecting the Inkwell Cultist. An Inkwell Cultist can use this ability once every fortnight.

lolcat
2023-05-07, 10:46 AM
Overall, this is a great prestige class. I can't say much about how well-balanced it is - but in terms of thematics, it's great. Most of this class' abilities are useful with forethought, preparation, and creativity which IMO is exactly what you'd expect from a writing/drawing/art themed spellcaster.

There is one potential exploit that I'd like to point out:




Some ambitious player is going to want to use this to lose things on purpose and permanently delete the tarrasque, any and all one-ring-style quest-to-destroy artifacts of doom, etc. That's really cheesy IMO, and while the subset of plots that it can derail is small, it could derail those plots very badly.

I'd recommend having the lost items be transported to a random plane, without further elaboration on what "random" means - which de facto makes it mean "under the DM's control."

(Also, what happens to the creatures and magical items that aren't lost? Do they end up back in the 5-ft radius around the caster? Are we assuming that they all fit in that space?)


Good point, i rephrased it as follows :)

The Ink Caster can attempt to extend her domain beyond the size it could naturally take by making a caster-lvl check of 10 + 2 for each 5-ft radius beyond what it could normally have. If this check fails, her Inkwell Dimension collapses back into a 5 ft.-radius core around the ink caster. All ink-based features and creations outside this core are lost. All unattended items are ejected into a random plane and location (DM discretion), whereas all creatures make a Reflex Save (DC 10 + Distance from Core/10) to reach safety near the Ink Caster before the collapse. Should there not be enough space within the core for all creatures seeking safety, those nearest to the Ink Caster take precedence. Those who fail their save or for whom there is not enough remaining space near the Ink Caster are also ejected onto a random plane as the Inkwell Dimension collapses.

lolcat
2023-05-07, 10:57 AM
I added a google doc to the OP with all the alterations, including a large section on custom spells, ink-based items and monsters. In case you want to read all of it, here it is (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1pa4_YrRFOtvLLyRssg7L0tIujfGp3NNm9WO5dZWeqdI/edit?usp=sharing).

H_H_F_F
2023-05-08, 03:28 AM
What would you say to this reformulation?


If an enemy reduces an Inkwell Cultist below –10 Hit Points with an attack, instead of dying she explodes in a 20 ft. Radius burst of ink, covering all surfaces and creatures in it unless they succeed on a DC 10 + Charisma Mod. + Lvl/2 Reflex save (see Ink-Blast for effect).

In the round after her demise and at her previous initiative, 1d4 Inkwell Creatures from the Summon Monster V list emerge from the ink. The player of the Inkwell Cultist chooses which of the creatures from the Summon Monster V list appear. They dissolve back into ink after one round per total character level.

The inkwell creatures proceed to attack whoever reduced the Inkwell Cultist below –10 HP with mindless ferocity. (If the creature is not within line of sight of the inkwell creatures, they proceed to attack anyone that is not an Inkwell Cultist, Inkwell Guardian, Ink Caster or other Inkwell Creature. They have no special ability to sense or track their prey other than what a regular creature of their type would have.)

The cultist truly dies only when the duration is over, or when all the inkwell creatures have been slain. Should one of these Inkwell Creatures manage to kill their prey, it will try to retreat from combat and find a safe place to cocoon itself in a sphere dripping black ink and red blood. If the sphere is left undisturbed for 1d4 hours, the Inkwell Cultist emerges from it as if the spell “Resurrection” had been cast on her remains and her killers soul is consumed in the process. If the sphere takes at least one point of damage, it collapses into a steaming puddle of ink and flesh without resurrecting the Inkwell Cultist. An Inkwell Cultist can use this ability once every fortnight.

Seems far better, yeah.