Help pricing movement increase...

[aglondier]

We have finally got some downtime coming up and want to get some item creation going.

How would you price the following additions to a pair of boots?

• a +10 foot increase to base movement speed
• a x2 increase to current movement speed

If you know of an item that does this, please do mention it...

[pabelfly]

We have finally got some downtime coming up and want to get some item creation going.

How would you price the following additions to a pair of boots?

• a +10 foot increase to base movement speed
• a x2 increase to current movement speed

If you know of an item that does this, please do mention it...

Is the character in light, medium or heavy armor?

Boots of Skating (MIC) gives you a conditional +10-ft enhancement bonus to speed, depending on the slope of the ground you're on for 5K, and Boots of Unending Journey does it for 7K gold if you're some flavour of Neutral. And you can enchant armor with +5-ft Enhancement bonus to speed for a flat 5K.

[Crake]

Is the character in light, medium or heavy armor?

Boots of Skating (MIC) gives you a conditional +10-ft enhancement bonus to speed, depending on the slope of the ground you're on for 5K, and Boots of Unending Journey does it for 7K gold if you're some flavour of Neutral. And you can enchant armor with +5-ft Enhancement bonus to speed for a flat 5K.

Boots of striding and springing are the OG for this, 5.5k for a +10ft move speed, and +5 bonus to jump. Considering its based off longstrider, that the +5 jump bonus is priced at 2.5k as per the guidelines, and multiplying secondary abilities by 1.5, it seems like the +10ft movement speed is literally just a continuous longstrider, CL1, spell level 1, x2000gp x1.5 for a secondary ability, or just a flat 2000gp if its standalone

For double, it would probably be much more expensive, being priced as a haste item.

[InvisibleBison]

• a +10 foot increase to base movement speed

The boots of striding and springing (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#bootsofStridingandSpringing) give a +10 foot enhancement bonus to speed and +5 to jump for 5500 gp. The price guidelines suggest that just the speed increase, essentially a continuous longstrider item, would cost only 2000 gp, and reverse-engineering the BoSS does show they were priced using that amount, so I'd say it's a reasonable price.



• a x2 increase to current movement speed

This is trickier, given that it's not a constant value. There is an item that doubles your speed, the spear of rapid wrath from Ghostwalk. However, it's a 3.0 item based on expeditious retreat, which in the 3.5 update was changed from doubling your speed to giving a +30 bonus. I think it would be reasonable to make the same change to the spear as part of the adjusting of 3.0 content that the DM is supposed to do, which would mean it can't serve as an example of how to price doubling move speed. If I had to put a price on it, I'd do so assuming it's being used by someone who values speed, and thus has some significant bonuses to speed already, then apply a bonus-squared-times-a-constant rule, as per normal for bonuses - maybe 50,000 gp (5 * 5 * 2000)?

[Crake]

This is trickier, given that it's not a constant value. There is an item that doubles your speed, the spear of rapid wrath from Ghostwalk. However, it's a 3.0 item based on expeditious retreat, which in the 3.5 update was changed from doubling your speed to giving a +30 bonus. I think it would be reasonable to make the same change to the spear as part of the adjusting of 3.0 content that the DM is supposed to do, which would mean it can't serve as an example of how to price doubling move speed. If I had to put a price on it, I'd do so assuming it's being used by someone who values speed, and thus has some significant bonuses to speed already, then apply a bonus-squared-times-a-constant rule, as per normal for bonuses - maybe 100,000 gp (5 * 5 * 2000)?

Ngl, i legit forgot expeditious retreat existed

Also, 5x5x2000 is 50k, not 100k

[aglondier]

Boots of striding and springing are the OG for this, 5.5k for a +10ft move speed, and +5 bonus to jump. Considering its based off longstrider, that the +5 jump bonus is priced at 2.5k as per the guidelines, and multiplying secondary abilities by 1.5, it seems like the +10ft movement speed is literally just a continuous longstrider, CL1, spell level 1, x2000gp x1.5 for a secondary ability, or just a flat 2000gp if its standalone

For double, it would probably be much more expensive, being priced as a haste item.

Ah, yes. Because Longstrider has a duration measured in hours, the multiplier is x1, whereas Expeditious Retreat has a duration measured in minutes so it's multiplier is x2.
Hmmm...2000gp for +10' move or 4000gp for +30' move...

[Crake]

Ah, yes. Because Longstrider has a duration measured in hours, the multiplier is x1, whereas Expeditious Retreat has a duration measured in minutes so it's multiplier is x2.
Hmmm...2000gp for +10' move or 4000gp for +30' move...

Hey, i mean, the forumla is clearly used in the calculation for boots of striding and springing, don't get upset with me.

[aglondier]

Hey, i mean, the forumla is clearly used in the calculation for boots of striding and springing, don't get upset with me.

???

Agreeing... acknowledging your accuracy...

[Crake]

???

Agreeing... acknowledging your accuracy...

oh, sorry, the way it was written made it appear to me like you were apprehensive of the answer, my bad!

[InvisibleBison]

Also, 5x5x2000 is 50k, not 100k

Oops! Thanks for the correction.

[Crichton]

This is trickier, given that it's not a constant value. There is an item that doubles your speed, the spear of rapid wrath from Ghostwalk. However, it's a 3.0 item based on expeditious retreat, which in the 3.5 update was changed from doubling your speed to giving a +30 bonus. I think it would be reasonable to make the same change to the spear as part of the adjusting of 3.0 content that the DM is supposed to do, which would mean it can't serve as an example of how to price doubling move speed. If I had to put a price on it, I'd do so assuming it's being used by someone who values speed, and thus has some significant bonuses to speed already, then apply a bonus-squared-times-a-constant rule, as per normal for bonuses - maybe 50,000 gp (5 * 5 * 2000)?


Rapid Wrath is also priced at 11702gp, so regardless of if you're trying to use it to price a 2x item or a +30 item(I strongly disagree that we should use a change in an item's spell prerequisite to change the item's effect, even if only when considering reverse engineering, let alone the actual item), the effect is still valued differently from a continuous item of Expeditious Retreat (which would have been 2000gp in 3.0, since 3.0 didn't have the modifier based on the spell's duration)


But there was another 3.0 item that doubled your speed, and it was based on Haste. The Horned Helm from the Arms & Equipment Guide was price at 38000gp, and in addition to doubling speed, gave you a secondary attack from the horns, at a +2 bonus. It used Haste and Magic Fang as its prerequisite spells. Perhaps it could be used to reverse engineer a price to compare to the spell/formula based prices (which is the explicit instructions when pricing magic items, after all). Funnily enough, 3.0 Haste didn't actually increase your speed at all though (unless you used your extra action to move, I guess)


So far as I know, Rapid Wrath and Horned Helm are the only published items with a speed-doubling effect. (should be noted that Horned Helm got an 'update' in MIC, though it hardly resembles its former self. No speed bonus at all, just the secondary gore attack, and even that has no +anything bonus on it. It is much cheaper, though)

[Crake]

Rapid Wrath is also priced at 11702gp, so regardless of if you're trying to use it to price a 2x item or a +30 item(I strongly disagree that we should use a change in an item's spell prerequisite to change the item's effect, even if only when considering reverse engineering, let alone the actual item), the effect is still valued differently from a continuous item of Expeditious Retreat (which would have been 2000gp in 3.0, since 3.0 didn't have the modifier based on the spell's duration)


But there was another 3.0 item that doubled your speed, and it was based on Haste. The Horned Helm from the Arms & Equipment Guide was price at 38000gp, and in addition to doubling speed, gave you a secondary attack from the horns, at a +2 bonus. It used Haste and Magic Fang as its prerequisite spells. Perhaps it could be used to reverse engineer a price to compare to the spell/formula based prices (which is the explicit instructions when pricing magic items, after all). Funnily enough, 3.0 Haste didn't actually increase your speed at all though (unless you used your extra action to move, I guess)


So far as I know, Rapid Wrath and Horned Helm are the only published items with a speed-doubling effect. (should be noted that Horned Helm got an 'update' in MIC, though it hardly resembles its former self. No speed bonus at all, just the secondary gore attack, and even that has no +anything bonus on it. It is much cheaper, though)

Keep in mind that 3.5’s haste speed bonus is double speed, but also capped at +30

[DarkSoul]

I allow (as a DM) and have been allowed (in the game I'm playing in) boots of Expeditious Retreat for 10,000 gp. +30' land speed and thus a +4 circumstance bonus to jump per 10' over 30 your speed is when wearing them. They're always on and are considerably better than Striding and Springing boots, so 10-12k seems about right.

[Crake]

I allow (as a DM) and have been allowed (in the game I'm playing in) boots of Expeditious Retreat for 10,000 gp. +30' land speed and thus a +4 circumstance bonus to jump per 10' over 30 your speed is when wearing them. They're always on and are considerably better than Striding and Springing boots, so 10-12k seems about right.

well, i mean, keep in mind that boots of striding and springing ALSO grant the +4 circumstance bonus, so their total bonus is +9 to jump, assuming your base land speed was 30+ to begin with

[aglondier]

The casters of our group have put our heads together...

We are going to save a few gp and go with
Longstrider (druid spell level 1, caster level 1, continuous, hour/level duration). 1x1x2000x1= 2,000gp
Cheetah's Sprint (shaman spell level 1, caster level 1, command word, 1/day, 1 round duration). 1x1x1800x1/5= 360gp
As we have two effects, the cheaper one is multiplied by 1.5 (360x1.5= 540)
So the total base cost is 2000+540= 2,540gp. Thus the crafting cost is half that, 1,270gp. Crafting time is about 3 days. Since we will need to hire a neophyte druid to cast longstrider, add (caster level 1 x spell level 1 x 10gp x 3 days) 30gp to our cost.

The end result is a pair of boots that add 10 feet to our paladins base speed (bringing her back up to 30'), and allow her to, once a day, charge up to 10x her adjusted speed (single round charge of up to 300').

Edit because Command Word activation spells do not get the duration multiplier that Continuous spells get.

Thanks for suggestions and advice everyone.

[pabelfly]

Savnok's Tooth from Tome of Magic (p79) costs 2K gold and removes speed penalties from medium and heavy armor and medium and heavy loads. It's my preferred item when I've got a character with heavy armor and want to fix mobility.

[sreservoir]

Savnok's Tooth from Tome of Magic (p79) costs 2K gold and removes speed penalties from medium and heavy armor and medium and heavy loads. It's my preferred item when I've got a character with heavy armor and want to fix mobility.

Note that it's also a unique quasi-artifact with the side-effect of giving you a stacking -1 penalty to everything each time you remove any item that improves your AC, because that's Savnok's influence.

Knight Unburdened (FW 114) is a low-level spell with hours/level duration that lets you ignore the movement penalty for medium and heavy armors, though it's only on the artificer, blackguard, and paladin lists.

[Crake]

The casters of our group have put our heads together...

We are going to save a few gp and go with
Longstrider (druid spell level 1, caster level 1, continuous, hour/level duration). 1x1x2000x1= 2,000gp
Cheetah's Sprint (shaman spell level 1, caster level 1, command word, 1/day, 1 round duration). 1x1x1800x1/5x4= 1,440gp
As we have two effects, the cheaper one is multiplied by 1.5 (1440x1.5= 2160)
So the total base cost is 2000+2160= 4,160gp. Thus the crafting cost is half that, 2,080gp. Crafting time is about 5 days. Since we will need to hire a neophyte druid to cast longstrider, add (caster level 1 x spell level 1 x 10gp) 50gp to our cost.

The end result is a pair of boots that add 10 feet to our paladins base speed (bringing her back up to 30'), and allow her to, once a day, charge up to 10x her adjusted speed (single round charge of up to 300').

Thanks for suggestions and advice everyone.

Keep in mind that the druid needs to be there for the full 8 hours of crafting each day, and needs to cast longstrider every day, so its gonna be 250gp for the longstrider casts, plus whatever the going hourly/daily rate is for a level 1 druid x40 hours/5 days of work

[aglondier]

Keep in mind that the druid needs to be there for the full 8 hours of crafting each day, and needs to cast longstrider every day, so its gonna be 250gp for the longstrider casts, plus whatever the going hourly/daily rate is for a level 1 druid x40 hours/5 days of work

As per Pathfinder costs for spells cast it is 10gp x spell level x caster level. So 10gp per casting, not 50gp. We probably will have to compensate the druid circle for their time, but we will sort that in character.
Also, I have altered my previous post due to realising that the cost of a Command Word spell doesn't attract aspell duration multiplier to the cost. So much cheaper than continuous...and with lower cost comes less days to craft it. 3 days.

[Crake]

As per Pathfinder costs for spells cast it is 10gp x spell level x caster level. So 10gp per casting, not 50gp. We probably will have to compensate the druid circle for their time, but we will sort that in character.
Also, I have altered my previous post due to realising that the cost of a Command Word spell doesn't attract aspell duration multiplier to the cost. So much cheaper than continuous...and with lower cost comes less days to craft it. 3 days.

Oh, right, my bad, misread what you wrote!