3.5 Dungeon Delver conversion

[Melcar]

As on the tin...

Has anyone done or seen a conversion for the 3.5 prestige class Dungeon Delver?

My old DM wants to continue a campaign of old, and in that I had some levels of dungeon delver. I really likes the class and feel its carries with it some signiture abilities, which I would like to keep. So I'm looking for either an official or well made home-brew version of this class?

Any takers?

Thanks

[JackPhoenix]

It would be helpful if you explained what those abilities are, so people don't have to try to figure out what book it is from and look for it.

[Amnestic]

It would be helpful if you explained what those abilities are, so people don't have to try to figure out what book it is from and look for it.

Trap Sense (as Barbarian)
Darkvision 60ft
Class level to Survival in the underground
Reduce Person on self 3/day
Stonecunning (as Dwarf)
Augury 1/2/3 / day
Skill Mastery (as 3.5 Rogue)
Evasion (as Rogue)
Blindsense 30ft for 1 minute/class level, 1/2 per day
Passwall 1/day
Find the Path 2/day
Phase Door 1/day

3/4 BAB

I'm sure you could cludge some version of this out of a multiclass with a rogue focus, but if you wanted an exact copy it'd probably be a homebrew rogue subclass.

[T.G. Oskar]

The issue with 3.x to 5e conversions regarding PrCs is that they're supposed to allow concepts available to multiple base classes - something that was completely disregarded in 5e by going with the "subclass" route.

5e has a concept of "broad" and "narrow" for class design, where classes are meant to be broad enough to allow for multiple interpretations, but narrow enough to be distinctive. Dungeon Delver is intentionally narrow, since the whole purpose is to aid in dungeon/underground exploration; its features involve bypassing doors (Phase Door, Passwall), surviving within dungeons (Trap Sense, bonuses to Survival), aiding with exploration (Darkvision, Blindsense, bonuses to Survival) and surviving traps (Evasion, Trap Sense, Augury).

The Rogue already has most of these - while they lack Danger Sense per se, what it currently offers is advantage on Dex saves. Stonecunning and the bonuses to Survival can be summed up in Expertise (History and Survival). They already have Evasion, and one of their latter-level benefits is Blindsight (which is decisively better). The ability to survive traps exists with - ironically enough - the Dungeon Delver feat, which has an equivalent to Trap Sense but vastly improved.

An Arcane Trickster with Dungeon Delver feat should mimic most of the PrC's original flavor. (Then again, Arcane Tricksters are partly based on the PrC while stealing the Spellthief's main trick) A Thief should also do it, provided you get several scrolls of Augury, Find the Path and Passwall (no Phase Door, sadly, but Passwall already consumes that). Because of the feat, there's virtually no need to homebrew a subclass for it (and if there is one already, I'm not knowledgeable about it). It forces you to go Rogue, which can be an issue if the original character was a Ranger or Barbarian.

[Unoriginal]

Trap Sense (as Barbarian)
Darkvision 60ft
Class level to Survival in the underground
Reduce Person on self 3/day
Stonecunning (as Dwarf)
Augury 1/2/3 / day
Skill Mastery (as 3.5 Rogue)
Evasion (as Rogue)
Blindsense 30ft for 1 minute/class level, 1/2 per day
Passwall 1/day
Find the Path 2/day
Phase Door 1/day

3/4 BAB

I'm sure you could cludge some version of this out of a multiclass with a rogue focus, but if you wanted an exact copy it'd probably be a homebrew rogue subclass.

Maybe an Arcane Trickster with some levels of Artificier would work for this?

[JackPhoenix]

Let's see...
Trap Sense: Barbarian 2 for Danger Sense or Dungeon Delver feat have similar effect.
Darkvision 60': Gloom Stalker Ranger 3, or a racial choice. There are few other ways, but these are more accessible.
Class level to Survival in the underground: Not a thing due to how skill works in 5e, but can be covered by Expertise. Bunch of ways to get that... Rogue 1, feats or Deft Explorer from Ranger 1
Reduce Person on self 3/day: Enlarge/Reduce is available to Artificers and Wizards (and through them, to AT) and Bard.
Stonecunning: Expertise, again. It applies to History in 5e which... I'm not sure anyone uses for that purpose anyway.
Augury: AT can get it, and Ritual Caster does it too.
Skill Mastery: Reliable Talent, Rogue 11.
Evasion: Rogue or Monk 7, also Hunter Ranger 15.
Blindsense 30': Rogue 14, but only 10'. Blindsense isn't really a thing in 5e, and the game is pretty stingy with giving it to players.
Passwall: That's an issue. AT doesn't get it, as it's a 5th level spell. Armorer Artificer can get it at level 17, too late and it would preclude other multiclass, Bard could get it at level 10 through Magical Secrets
Find the Path: Level 6 spell. Again, too high level, but can be grabbed through Bard
Phase Door: No equivalent in 5e.

Arcane Trickster Rogue with Dungeon Delver will probably be the closest you can get, maybe Gloom Stalker Ranger dip for Darkvision. Bard could work for the spells, but it would be missing Reliable Talent and Evasion, and may be too much of a caster.

[OldTrees1]

What was the class of the previous character? If they were a Rogue it is easy. If they were not a Rogue, then knowing that might help.


As others have said, the simplest conversion is to make a variant of Arcane Trickster and then tailor the spell list to fit the Dungeon Delver spells. Arcane Trickster has a school based restriction on its spell list. This variation would have a thematic (Dungeon Delver) restriction on its spell list.

Dungeon Delver spells from 3.5 (add these to the arcane trickster list)
1st (3rd)
Reduce Person
2nd (7th)
Augury, Darkvision
3rd (13th)
Find the Path (adjusted from 6th)
4th (19th)
Dimension Door (replaces Phase Door as a better fit), Passwall (adjusted from 5th)

Evasion (Rogue 7)
Reliable Talent (Rogue 11 replaces Skill Mastery)
Blindsense (Rogue 14)

Survival Proficiency, Stonecunning, and Trapsense could replace the 3rd level features of Arcane Trickster. I suggest keeping but delaying the original 3rd level feature until 9th level (delvers would still appreciate mage hand legerdemain). Then replace the 13th and 17th level features. Maybe with earlier access to PhaseDimension Door and Passwall?

[Unoriginal]

Off the books right now, but can't the Artificier makes Googles of Night Vision?

I think it fits.

The Fighting Initiate feat let anyone have 10ft radius of blindsight, also.

[Mastikator]

Off the books right now, but can't the Artificier makes Googles of Night Vision?

I think it fits.

The Fighting Initiate feat let anyone have 10ft radius of blindsight, also.

Affirmative on both accounts.

Dungeon delver in 5e is a feat, it could be updated to be good rather than bad, so that any character that takes it would reasonably fit the mold. In 5e feats are expensive and character defining, much like prestige classes are in 3.5e