Core Spheres?

[SangoProduction]

Back when I was first recommended Spheres of Power, their wiki was (compared to current) very small and concise. In fact, it looked pretty much identical to http://spheresofpower.wikidot.com/spheres-of-power
OK. I guess I can just use that slightly more hidden version of the wiki to introduce people from now on, rather than the overwhelming mess of links that is the main wiki.
I don't think I need to embark on some silly project to take out only the core of the system, effectively hiding the less typical options, which would serve as a gateway to using the full system.

But since I'm already here, does anyone think such a thing is a worthwhile project?

[Seerow]

Back when I was first recommended Spheres of Power, their wiki was (compared to current) very small and concise. In fact, it looked pretty much identical to http://spheresofpower.wikidot.com/spheres-of-power
OK. I guess I can just use that slightly more hidden version of the wiki to introduce people from now on, rather than the overwhelming mess of links that is the main wiki.
I don't think I need to embark on some silly project to take out only the core of the system, effectively hiding the less typical options, which would serve as a gateway to using the full system.

But since I'm already here, does anyone think such a thing is a worthwhile project?

One thing I am not a fan of on the wiki is how much material from 3rd party campaign settings got mixed in as spheres content. Like all of the Skyborne airship rules, some of the weirder races, etc, had nothing to do with spheres but get put front and center at the same level of officialness that the Spheres based classes and archetypes get.

Spheres of Guile I feel like you can just discount entirely. Thus far I've tried a half dozen times and the best use I've found for it is just trading class skills for a trade tradition to effectively get 2-4 bonus traits and if you're lucky cherrypicking a single talent that's worth using. Which is pretty solid for giving up effectively nothing (and literally nothing if you're using Oaths and invest a single point into Skilled).

Speaking of Oaths is probably another thing that has nothing to do with Spheres itself, but is just this completely random extra subsystem that gets bundled in with Spheres on the wiki. Spheres Magic Items are at least half just weird renames of existing magic items (much like Psionics), which I really hate. Can't we just call it a wondrous item no matter what system crafts it?

Sorry this is probably reading more like useless babbling than an actual answer to your question.

[icefractal]

If I was introducing someone to Spheres, I might suggest:
1) Pick either SoP or SoM to start with. While you can combine both in one character, it's extra complexity and they work fine alone.
2) Use either an existing class with a Spheres archetype, or one of the "general" classes - Incanter / Conscript. Classes like Wraith are cool, but add their own mechanics to learn on top of the Spheres themselves.
3) Don't feel like you need to learn all the Spheres at once. Personally, I learned them as I used them for characters, and that worked fine.
4) Don't even worry about all the new feats. Check out the ones for the Spheres you're personally using, remember that Extra Talent exists, and you're good.
5) Ditto for the new gear. Remember that Implements exist and you're good.


Oaths is basically unrelated, I agree, but I also think it's one of the better "bang for the buck" options on the entire wiki. It's easy to use, many of the oaths are fun roleplaying, and it has a magic item replacement option that actually works and I'd use voluntarily.


Sadly I have to agree on SoG so far. It's got some talents that are nice additions to a character, but not enough to be the primary basis of one. I guess I was imagining "expand the scope of what skills can do", but it's more like "expand the details of what skills can do". Maybe it needs a specific type of campaign to shine.

[Nizaris]

To piggyback of icefractal, the three casting classes for a simplified Spheres I'd look at are Elementalist, Incanter, and Mageknight; Shifter if someone wants to focus on Alteration. For the martial characters, Conscript and maybe Commander, no archetypes for sphere classes if wanting very simple. For non-sphere classes just the basic "trade some features for SoP or SoM progression versions" as long as martial classes stay SoM and casting classes stay SoM (ie, Berserker Barbarian is fine, Painted Savage or Worldsoul Incarnate aren't). No Champions content.

Anything with a "[]" is out, no SoP feats except from the General list, but even then mostly just Extra Talent, Extra Spell Points, Cantrips, and Sphere Focus, or ones for the spheres you're using. SoP feats I feel can be largely ignored outside of Extra Combat Talent amd <uscular Reflexes.

I'd take out the Mana sphere, but that's just me thinking it can get finicky and a bit underwhelming without all the later additions. Bear is obviously not considered, neither are the two 3PP SoP or the SoM Pilot or Tech (1st party I know but complicates things).

Subsystems like Oaths and Aristeia are out and unless someone is planning to craft, stick to the regular magic item shop instead of spheres item crafting.

I'll add to the choirs that SoG can be dropped entirely.

[Logalmier]

The biggest problem with the Wiki right now is just... the layout. At some point they just stuffed too much in, and it's become a mess. Why are Spherecasters not next to Magic Spheres? Why are Operatives above Practitioners, all the way to the right of "Using Spheres of Guile"? I sort of see the logic they were going for, but - color coding notwithstanding - it's unclear which parts belong to which system. It looks bad and intimidating.

I don't think it's necessary to outright remove the less necessary clutter, but it would probably be worthwhile to sweep it under the rug (for example, there's no reason why the vestigial stump that is "Prestige Classes" needs to be grouped at the top with Practitioners and Spherecasters). Maybe present the content in two distinct sections - a "core" section at the top followed by a clearly divided "supplemental" section.

If the goal is to get people into Spheres, you probably shouldn't show them Guile.