Light/Darkness spells with Invisible Spell Feat/Ring of Darkhidden

[carrdrivesyou]

I am curious how the Invisible Spell feat from Cityscape would affect spells such as Light, No Light, Daylight, Darkness, and other light or darkness based effects.

Would the feat effectively cancel the spell's effect for a zero sum?

Would it create an area that appears normal, but affects the vision of anyone in the area the same way the spell does?

Would it create an area of "visual static" that gives people migraines?

Does the world explode?

What effect would this have on anyone in the area wearing a Ring of the Darkhidden?

[Chronos]

I am curious how the Invisible Spell feat from Cityscape would affect spells...
You could have cut off your question right there. For anything at all more complicated than a Fireball, Invisible Spell is a rules mess. In addition to the ones you cite, what happens if you use an invisible conjuration? Can you summon invisible creatures or objects? What if it's an Instantaneous conjuration that produces real, nonmagical matter... Can you get naturally-invisible iron from a Wall of Iron spell? If you use Invisible Spell on Polymorph, is the creature invisible, or do they still look like their true form while having the stats of their new form?

You need houserules to make any sense of it, and unfortunately the simplest houserule is "Invisible spell doesn't exist".

[sleepyphoenixx]

Invisible Spell does nothing because invisibility doesn't affect light.


The creature or object touched becomes invisible, vanishing from sight, even from darkvision. If the recipient is a creature carrying gear, that vanishes, too. If you cast the spell on someone else, neither you nor your allies can see the subject, unless you can normally see invisible things or you employ magic to do so.

Items dropped or put down by an invisible creature become visible; items picked up disappear if tucked into the clothing or pouches worn by the creature. Light, however, never becomes invisible, although a source of light can become so (thus, the effect is that of a light with no visible source). Any part of an item that the subject carries but that extends more than 10 feet from it becomes visible.

[Fero]

I once saw a very good explanation how how Invisible Spell should work. Unfortunately, I can't remember where it was. I will post if I find it. I love the feat, but it does require working with your DM to define how it applies to various spells.

Light is also super tricky under the rules. What is a light? Is it an object? An AoE? A game effect? Photons bouncing off of objects?

That said, I think that one viable analysis of how this would work would be to say: The spell/feat cancel each other out except to the extent the viewer can see invisibility, in which case the spell functions as normal to the target.

[Pinkie Pyro]

Invisible Spell does nothing because invisibility doesn't affect light.


You can modify any spell you cast so that it carries no visual manifestation.

Doesn't actually make the spell invisible as per the rules for invisibility, so that shouldn't really matter.


The answer is pretty simple, due to:


Those with detect magic, see invisibility, or true seeing spells or effects active at the time of the casting will see whatever visual manifestations typically accompany the spell.

Unless a character has detect magic, see invisibility, or true seeing active when the spell was cast, they would see no indication of the spell. If they do meet that criteria, then they would see the effects of the spell as normal.

You can actually use this on something like solid fog to make concealment that only stops creatures with those spells active from seeing.

As for stacking with ring of the darkhidden, In the case of a creature with one hiding in an area of invisible no light, against a creature with darkvision and detect magic, (or see invisible/true seeing if those are off after the spell takes effect, since they'd beat the ring) the creature would be invisible in the invisible darkness as viewed by the enhanced observer.