Wizard Prcs: Top 15 Most Powerful

[Fero]

For no real reason, here is a list of what I consider the 15 most powerful Wizard PRCs. By "powerful" I don't necessarily mean "best" but rather the classes that can accomplish the most impressive acts of magic. Please let me know if you think I should add something, remove something, and/or change a rank.


15. Recaster (RoE): One of my all time favorite PrCs. Losing a caster level stings but lots of free MM, the ability to learn spells from any list, and the ability to create sone of the biggest AoEs in the game makes up for the cost.

14. War Weaver (HoB): Essentially a bunch of free MM (reach, chain, quicken) for buff spells. Incredibly powerful stuff.

13. Deep Diviner (Und): Nodes can be incredibly powerful. I would probably put this in the top 5 but for the fact that other classes can mimic most of what it does through feats.

12. Initiate of the Sevenfold Veil (CA): Stupid good, immediate action wards and walls.

11. Mage of the Arcane Order (CA): Overcomes the greatest weakness of the Wizard class, DMs who are stingy with spells. What pushes this over the top for me is the realization that it gives you access to an entire guild of Wizards, all of whom have Cooperative Spell.

10. Anima Mage (ToM): Easy early entry with minimal cheese. Fantastic class abilities including one of very few ways to cast spells as an immediate action. Natural harmony between Wizard spellcasting and binding. Free access to crafting feats. Overall incredible.

9. Shadowcraft Mage (RoS): I don't use the more aggressive interpretations of how the "Shadow Illusion" ability works. Even then, this class is an absolute powerhouse with fantastic abilities at each level.

8. Spell Dancer (MoF): Potentially better at MM than an incantrix but much harder pre reqs.

7. Dread Archivist (HoH): Similar to the Tainted sorcerer, but worse in almost every way that matters, but still amazing.

6. Red Wizard (DMG): The weakest of the Circle Magic classes can still accomplish some of the greatest possible feats of magic.

5. Incantrix (PGtF): Fantastic grab bag of free MM.

4. Hathran (PGtF): Circle magic and can spontaneously cast their whole spellbook in their home territory.

3. Halruan Elder (ShSo): The best of the Circle Magic classes boats a wide array of abilities including very strong metamagic reduction.

2. Dweomerkeeper (CD): Bypassing spell gp/xp costs is absurdly good. The MM reductions are also groovy.

1. Tainted Sorcerer (UA): Absurd DCs and bonus spells, bypass spell gp costs. Easy MM. This is, to my mind, the ultimate powerhouse.

Honorable Mentions
The following don't make the list, mostly due to losing multiple caster levels,, but are nonetheless awesome and worth discussing.

A. Cerebramancer/Mind Mage (EPH/Mind's Eye): Psion/Wizard theurges are incredible.

B. Planeshifter (MotP): Lose several casting levels but gain a truly impressive ability to move large portions of one plane to another.

C. Yathrinshee (PGtF): Objectively bad in many respects but has: i) the only method I know outside Dragon that lets you combine theurge caster levels, lewlading to absurd caster levels; and ii) a very good zombie creation ability.

D. Spell Sovereign (Dragon): Loses several caster levels. In exchange. Get some truly unique abilities to turn. Your spells into creatures.

E. Void Disciple (CD): Has some of the most unique and useful abilities including one of the best divination abilities in game. Lose several caster levels though.

F. Runesmith (RoS): Potentially hard to enter but gets some cool abilities, including one that lets your allies cast some of your spells.

G. Vermin Lord (BovD): Before the Hive Mind nerf thja had one of the most powerful abilities in the game. Even with the nerf, the ability yo simultaneously have a large number of familiars is very good.

H. Fiendbinder (ToM): Can permanently call and bind powerful, but ultimately disloyal, minions.

I. Unbound Scroll (Dragonmarked): Lots of dirt cheap scrolls.

J. Malconvoker (CS): Seriously buffs summoning, one of the strongest playstyles. Also buffs binding, an even stronger playstyle.

I. Zhentarim Skymage (LoD): Get a potentially very powerful flying mount.

J. Bonded Summoner (Minature's Handbook): Loses a ton of caster levels but can share spells with a minion that has more HD than your actual level, leading to some potent combos.

K. Divine Oracle (CD): Adds a true domain, and a good one at that. Later gives immunity to surprise. Both abilities are very good.

L. Sacred Exorcist (CD): Giving a wizard Turn Undeas opens a number of strong options.

M. Shaper of Form (Dragon Compendium): Loses caster levels but has some powerful transmogrification powers.

[Chronos]

Even if your DM gives you access to all the spellbooks you want to copy from, Mage of the Arcane Order is still a huge power boost, since it lets you cast nearly any spell you want without needing to have prepared it.

[Maat Mons]

If your DM follow the “Text trumps table” rule, Rainbow Servant is a full-casting PrC. The domains aren’t much good to a Wizard, but you eventually gain full Cleric Spell Access.

Unseen Seer can be entered with Wizard 10 and adds new spells to your spell list. Unfortunately, they’re only allowed to be Divination spells, and the language “from any class list” seems to rule out picking Choose Destiny. Though if your DM does allow you to pick domain spells, Unseen Seer could be a useful dip after finishing one Incantatrix or Spelldancer.

[Zanos]

Dunno how these fit into your lists but I didn't see them mentioned:

Shadow Adept:
Grants 3 good feats at level 1 in exchange for a 1 feat entry tax. The feats are only good if there's a lot of caster on caster shenanigans in your game, but very strong. The rest of the class is kind of whatever, but full CL at least.

Escalation mage:
Trivial entry requirements. It works a little strangely in that you can add some free metamagic to your spells at the risk of a failure on a CL check, but Arcane Mastery lets you take 10 on those in combat and is a very good feat anyway. At sixth level you potentially have 7 free quickens a day.

[Anthrowhale]

I feel like Ultimate Magus should be there.

Abyssal Specialist Wizard [with Aligned Spellcaster[chaotic] and Spontaneous Divination ACFs] 5/Knight of the Weave 1/Ultimate Magus 10 can pickup Theurgic Specialist at 6 for a deeply escalated caster level which gets ever more extreme as Ultimate Magus advances. Patching on a full advancing class, you end up at level 20 with spell access of a wizard 19/KoTW 8, and a caster level of 23 for [lawful] spells, 31 for KotW spells, and 54 (!) for all other spells. That's not all though---KotW 8 provides access to 6th level spells, enabling Ultimate Magus to persist spells. (And if you play games with Tome Dragons to persist many spells).

I consider Hathran a bit more powerful than Halruaan Elder simply because you boost the caster level of Holy Word so easily. It can also be used to gateway into Initiate of Mystra on an Archivist. And, Universal Spirit Magic can allow you to spontaneously cast off potentially multiple class lists worth of scribed scrolls.

Spelldancer surpasses Incantatrix in my mind. The feat tax is a real issue but it there are several ways to effectively pay the tax and explode magically by level 9 or so. Of course you only take for 1 or maybe 2 levels.

The one other that comes to mind is Maho-Tsukai. It's close to Tainted Sorcerer, but different in a few interesting ways.

I'm not sure the Tainted Sorcerer is so impressive. Using the UA rules, it sounds like you can have a taint of a bit less than your twice your wisdom which is quite good on a wis-based caster. However, tainted metamagic is confined by the maximum spell level you can cast which is a significant drag. And, blood component only deals with gp while Dweomerkeeper's Supernatural Spell eliminates all components. Overall, you get lots of bonus spells and the save DCs are high, but other elements are 'meh'. I tend to believe that the ability to elevate caster level is more important. In fact, an elevated caster level can yield high spell save DCs and bonus spells via Owl's Insight.

[Fero]

Even if your DM gives you access to all the spellbooks you want to copy from, Mage of the Arcane Order is still a huge power boost, since it lets you cast nearly any spell you want without needing to have prepared it.

Agreed, it is an amazing prc. I love the art too.


If your DM follow the “Text trumps table” rule, Rainbow Servant is a full-casting PrC. The domains aren’t much good to a Wizard, but you eventually gain full Cleric Spell Access.

Unseen Seer can be entered with Wizard 10 and adds new spells to your spell list. Unfortunately, they’re only allowed to be Divination spells, and the language “from any class list” seems to rule out picking Choose Destiny. Though if your DM does allow you to pick domain spells, Unseen Seer could be a useful dip after finishing one Incantatrix or Spelldancer.

These are both good PrCs but I tend to see them put on spontanious caster frames typically.


Dunno how these fit into your lists but I didn't see them mentioned:

Shadow Adept:
Grants 3 good feats at level 1 in exchange for a 1 feat entry tax. The feats are only good if there's a lot of caster on caster shenanigans in your game, but very strong. The rest of the class is kind of whatever, but full CL at least.

Escalation mage:
Trivial entry requirements. It works a little strangely in that you can add some free metamagic to your spells at the risk of a failure on a CL check, but Arcane Mastery lets you take 10 on those in combat and is a very good feat anyway. At sixth level you potentially have 7 free quickens a day.

Shadow Adept is very good, but more in the good/practical than the good/powerful sense. I typically see it as part of Shadowcraft Mage builds. However, I would be curious to see how one works in isolation.

I have seen Escalation Mage but will have to look into it more.


I feel like Ultimate Magus should be there.

Abyssal Specialist Wizard [with Aligned Spellcaster[chaotic] and Spontaneous Divination ACFs] 5/Knight of the Weave 1/Ultimate Magus 10 can pickup Theurgic Specialist at 6 for a deeply escalated caster level which gets ever more extreme as Ultimate Magus advances. Patching on a full advancing class, you end up at level 20 with spell access of a wizard 19/KoTW 8, and a caster level of 23 for [lawful] spells, 31 for KotW spells, and 54 (!) for all other spells. That's not all though---KotW 8 provides access to 6th level spells, enabling Ultimate Magus to persist spells. (And if you play games with Tome Dragons to persist many spells).

I consider Hathran a bit more powerful than Halruaan Elder simply because you boost the caster level of Holy Word so easily. It can also be used to gateway into Initiate of Mystra on an Archivist. And, Universal Spirit Magic can allow you to spontaneously cast off potentially multiple class lists worth of scribed scrolls.

Spelldancer surpasses Incantatrix in my mind. The feat tax is a real issue but it there are several ways to effectively pay the tax and explode magically by level 9 or so. Of course you only take for 1 or maybe 2 levels.

The one other that comes to mind is Maho-Tsukai. It's close to Tainted Sorcerer, but different in a few interesting ways.

I'm not sure the Tainted Sorcerer is so impressive. Using the UA rules, it sounds like you can have a taint of a bit less than your twice your wisdom which is quite good on a wis-based caster. However, tainted metamagic is confined by the maximum spell level you can cast which is a significant drag. And, blood component only deals with gp while Dweomerkeeper's Supernatural Spell eliminates all components. Overall, you get lots of bonus spells and the save DCs are high, but other elements are 'meh'. I tend to believe that the ability to elevate caster level is more important. In fact, an elevated caster level can yield high spell save DCs and bonus spells via Owl's Insight.

It is funny that you mention UM as I am seriously considering something similar for my next build. I did not know about KotW and will have to look into it. Unfortunately, I may not be able to get spontanious divination as I want to save my 5th level feat for the Transmuter ACF that lets me change one spell into a Transmutation spell.

Hathraan/Halruan Elder is tough. Ultimately, I picked HE b/c it can craft magic items.

Spelldancer/Incantrix is also tough. Ultimately, I went with Incantrix b/c 1- more MM feats (due to bonuses and lower tax), 2-more versatility in how it applies MM; and 3- the advantage of the SD seems more theoretical than real as Incantrix gets a metric ton of uses/day.

Re Tainted Sorc, if I remember correctly, your spell DCs are significantly higher than if you cast at double Wis (which would already be amazing). The free GP on spells, especially with Extract Gift as you can get, in essence, unlimited free stat/ski items. The TS also enjoys a soft bonus against the DK, in that the DK works for a god of magic and is supposed to protect the weave, making it very east for the DM to, in game, stop abusive tactics. The MM is admitedly just gravy and not as good as the likes of incantrix. Still, obscene DCs (I seem to recall 40s, 50s, and even 60s are all doable by mid levels) and free stats/skills for everyone is hard to beat. Also, TS is very dippable.

[sleepyphoenixx]

I think you're seriously undervaluing War Weaver. The incredible spell slot efficiency and the action advantage granted by Quiescent Weaving blow everything on your list except Circle Magic and free metamagic out of the water.


Even if your DM gives you access to all the spellbooks you want to copy from, Mage of the Arcane Order is still a huge power boost, since it lets you cast nearly any spell you want without needing to have prepared it.
So can Uncanny Forethought, without spending 10 levels on it. Also keep in mind that by RAW spellpool access is PHB-only, with anything beyond that requiring DM approval.
Which makes it much less useful.


If your DM follow the “Text trumps table” rule, Rainbow Servant is a full-casting PrC. The domains aren’t much good to a Wizard, but you eventually gain full Cleric Spell Access.
The Good domain is a free +1 CL to all your spells if you use Mark of the Enlightened Soul, so it's hardly useless. And the off-list spells it grants you aren't terrible.
If you happen to be a theurge it also qualifies you for Aligned Theurgy.

The Air and Law domains are a little lame, but the former at least gives you Control Winds and you'll learn to cast Substitute Domain eventually anyway.
And while elemental turning doesn't work with most divine feats it does work for Divine Spell Power (though you'll need a dip in Sacred Exorcist to qualify for it).



Shadow Adept is very good, but more in the good/practical than the good/powerful sense. I typically see it as part of Shadowcraft Mage builds. However, I would be curious to see how one works in isolation.

Shadow Adepts only claim to fame is that it grants you the three Shadow Weave Magic feats for free at level 1. The feats are all good for a caster, but the rest of the class is only saved from being crap by having full casting progression.

Insidious Magic in particular is great on illusionists since it makes True Seeing require a CL check to see through your illusions, but pretty much every caster can benefit from their spells being difficult to detect and much more difficult to resist or dispel unless they're never fighting other spellcasters.

[Chronos]

Sure, the spellpool is PHB-only, but the significant majority of what makes wizards nutso powerful to begin with is in the PHB. That's an awfully big list of spells to have available on-demand.

[Anthrowhale]

It is funny that you mention UM as I am seriously considering something similar for my next build. I did not know about KotW and will have to look into it. Unfortunately, I may not be able to get spontanious divination as I want to save my 5th level feat for the Transmuter ACF that lets me change one spell into a Transmutation spell.

KotW and UM fit together extremely well since KotW caster level is greater than wizard caster level by definition and KotW provides 6th level spontaneous spells under UM.



Re Tainted Sorc, if I remember correctly, your spell DCs are significantly higher than if you cast at double Wis (which would already be amazing).

The difficulty is that UA taint damages Con & Wis. TS modifies this as:


A tainted sorcerer no longer applies her taint score as a penalty to her Constitution, and only applies one-half her taint score as a penalty to her Wisdom.

You don't want to reach 0 wisdom because that creates permanent unconsciousness. Furthermore, your spellcasting causes taint, so you need a 1-encounter buffer of wisdom. Perhaps (wis-5)*2 is a practical maximum? Luckily, wis-based casters tend to have access to restoration for easy taint management. As an example, wisdom 34 suggests you can handle taint 60 which implies save DCs are 10+25(taint)+spell level or 36-44. On the other hand a Druid/Hathran with Wis 34 can circle magic to caster level 40 then cast Owl's Insight for a +20 bonus to wisdom (reaching Wis 54), then circle magic a spell to heighten to 20 then cast for a DC of 10+22(wis)+20(spell level)=54.



The free GP on spells, especially with Extract Gift as you can get, in essence, unlimited free stat/ski items. The TS also enjoys a soft bonus against the DK, in that the DK works for a god of magic and is supposed to protect the weave, making it very east for the DM to, in game, stop abusive tactics. The MM is admitedly just gravy and not as good as the likes of incantrix. Still, obscene DCs (I seem to recall 40s, 50s, and even 60s are all doable by mid levels) and free stats/skills for everyone is hard to beat. Also, TS is very dippable.
The tricky thing here is: how do you want to manage your taint? Your Wisdom suffers as taint/2 so if you are relying on spells or magical items for a Wis bonus the TS is instantaneously drops unconscious with a Disjunction. On the other hand, you could play super risky by leveraging temporary magical bonuses like Owl's Insight and gamble that you can cleanse enough taint fast enough before the temporary bonuses pass. Personally, I'd avoid the Disjunction instalose, but others might gamble harder.

It's perhaps worth noting that DK also can us Extract Gift if you cast it with Uncanny Forethought, and it can also use Wish for stat boosters.

[Gruftzwerg]

I would love to see Spellguard of Silverymoon somehow on the list.
Can share some personal spells and thus one of the best options for a (persisted) buff focused build (see my Lion-O build).
Also has an Selective Spell ability based on creature types and subtypes.
Full spell progression and only 5 lvls.

Imho really a nice prc. The sole limitation is the fluff requirement to enter it (and that it is technically FR only..).


___

And since you mentioned Recaster, Wyrm Wizard should be at least mentioned as honorable mention.

[Kalkra]

In terms of ways to combine caster levels outside of Dragon Mag, Elemental Theurgy made it into Dragon Compendium. It's a bit more work to enable than Aligned Theurgy, but you can do it with Snowcasting and Energy Substitution.

Also, regarding Spelldancer prereqs, most of them are on the Mirror Move list, so if your DM is okay with qualifying for PrCs with items that makes it a lot easier. I doubt many DMs would allow that, though.

[Hawkwing1]

I would love to see Spellguard of Silverymoon somehow on the list.
Can share some personal spells and thus one of the best options for a (persisted) buff focused build (see my Lion-O build).
Also has an Selective Spell ability based on creature types and subtypes.
Full spell progression and only 5 lvls.

Imho really a nice prc. The sole limitation is the fluff requirement to enter it (and that it is technically FR only..).


___

And since you mentioned Recaster, Wyrm Wizard should be at least mentioned as honorable mention.

Interesting fact: Transcend Mortality counts for the purposes of sharing personal spells. Mix this with an initiator class and Jade Phoenix Mage for funnies.

Of course, this requires Wu Jen casting, and you specified Wizards, but it's still a really funny thing to do on a stealth build. Pop into someplace while you're invisible, place the spell on the bad-guy-of-the-day, then pop out, and a few rounds later, they die, and there's nothing they can do about it! Hilarious.

[RandomPeasant]

If your DM follow the “Text trumps table” rule, Rainbow Servant is a full-casting PrC. The domains aren’t much good to a Wizard, but you eventually gain full Cleric Spell Access.

I do not think Rainbow Servant is particularly compelling for Wizard. You sink ten levels into it, getting some domains you don't really care about, and then you get the ability to learn Cleric spells. But you don't actually learn any Cleric spells (unlike the Warmage), and Cleric spells are mostly worse than Wizard spells, so you have to get pretty far down your list of picks before you reach the point you really want to pick some up (particularly because you're likely to be bad at Persistomancy).


Unseen Seer can be entered with Wizard 10 and adds new spells to your spell list. Unfortunately, they’re only allowed to be Divination spells, and the language “from any class list” seems to rule out picking Choose Destiny. Though if your DM does allow you to pick domain spells, Unseen Seer could be a useful dip after finishing one Incantatrix or Spelldancer.

Probably worth pointing out Abjurant Champion as a similar option. It's great for finishing out a gish build, and you can get in with Wizard 10 (or more likely Wizard 6/PrC 4 or something) if you have a martial weapon proficiency somewhere.


2. Dweomerkeeper (CD): Bypassing spell gp/xp costs is absurdly good. The MM reductions are also groovy.

IMO overrated for Wizard entry. You're basically locked in to a Cleric dip (unlike Cleric, who can get in straight), which is a non-trivial cost, especially when it takes a while to get to the good payoffs for Supernatural Spell.


Sure, the spellpool is PHB-only, but the significant majority of what makes wizards nutso powerful to begin with is in the PHB. That's an awfully big list of spells to have available on-demand.

The problem is that the PHB isn't really where the silver bullet spells are, which is what's best to get out of a spontaneous casting plan. I still think it's good, but it's much better if you sneak your way in from Sorcerer or something and it's giving you breath.

[Fero]

I'm not sure the Tainted Sorcerer is so impressive. Using the UA rules, it sounds like you can have a taint of a bit less than your twice your wisdom which is quite good on a wis-based caster. However, tainted metamagic is confined by the maximum spell level you can cast which is a significant drag. And, blood component only deals with gp while Dweomerkeeper's Supernatural Spell eliminates all components. Overall, you get lots of bonus spells and the save DCs are high, but other elements are 'meh'. I tend to believe that the ability to elevate caster level is more important. In fact, an elevated caster level can yield high spell save DCs and bonus spells via Owl's Insight.

The TS gets 2 taint for every Wisdom. You get bonus spells as of your casting stat were Taint+10 and spell DCs at Taint+10+Spell Level. For example, a character with 30 Wisdom can go down to 10 Wisdom for 40 Taint, and thereby get bonus spells as if his/her primary casting stat were 50 and has spell DCs as if his/her casting stat were 90.

Normally, I, like you, favor CL over DC increases. However, spells that have DCs of 50+ by low-mid levels are hard to ignore.

I played a TS several years ago and found managing taint to be fairly easy. The saves to avoid taint are fairly low and taint is not that difficult to reduce. I think the trick was simply to not get too greedy.

Also, you get all of these advantages from the first level in the class. This is balanced out by the mechanic that forces you to save to prevent taking more levels. However, those saves are not too bad so long as you manage.your taint. Alternatively, you can just take TS as a capstone. I can totally see a 10th level Red Wizard taking TS to pair his absurd CL with absurd Spell DCs.

As a final note, as someone else mentioned in another post, undead do not suffer the negative effects of taint. As such, my understanding is, that an undead TS can have unlimited spells/day and DCs.

[Anthrowhale]

...spell DCs at Taint+10+Spell Level.
Ah, I missed the straight Taint add. That will produce a hefty DC.


As a final note, as someone else mentioned in another post, undead do not suffer the negative effects of taint.
The UA Taint section also says:

... tainted characters are “evil,” considered a threat to common people and, in sufficient numbers, to entire nations. ... An evil monster has a taint score equal to one-half its Charisma score, with evil undead getting a +1 modifier ...

So while there is no downside, the taint score is also locked to a modest value.

[Zanos]

So while there is no downside, the taint score is also locked to a modest value.
There is by no means any sort of consensus on this. The text makes no statement of this explicitly, and generally just because something "has" something doesn't mean that can't be modified.

[Fero]

There is by no means any sort of consensus on this. The text makes no statement of this explicitly, and generally just because something "has" something doesn't mean that can't be modified.

Also, the Tainted Spellcasting feature explicitly increases taint (specific overrides general). As such, a TS can choose to fail the fort saves to increase her taint score as high as wanted. Also, although a TS is evil, and likely performs monstrous acts, she probably isn't an evil monster for game rule purposes.

[sleepyphoenixx]

I do not think Rainbow Servant is particularly compelling for Wizard. You sink ten levels into it, getting some domains you don't really care about, and then you get the ability to learn Cleric spells. But you don't actually learn any Cleric spells (unlike the Warmage), and Cleric spells are mostly worse than Wizard spells, so you have to get pretty far down your list of picks before you reach the point you really want to pick some up (particularly because you're likely to be bad at Persistomancy).
There's no shortage of cleric spells worth learning. Consumptive Field, Triadspell, Divine Agility and so on. And copying spells isn't that expensive, especially if Archivists exist in your campaign world to copy from.
The domains can be traded in for the respective devotion feats if you prefer those. It's also the only way a wizard can qualify for Initiate of Mystra without losing casting progression, if the ability to cast in AMF is relevant to your campaign.

As for being bad at persistomancy many good cleric buffs already come with hour/level durations. On top of that RS costs no feats and you still have (at least) 5 levels free, so you can pick from pretty much any (or even multiple) of them. Incantatrix? Only takes 3 levels for Metamagic Effect. Spelldancer? 1 level. Your cleric spells even qualify for DMM if you get turning from Sacred Exorcist, though that's probably only worth the feat investment for a Warmage or other full-list-access caster.

[RandomPeasant]

There's no shortage of cleric spells worth learning. Consumptive Field, Triadspell, Divine Agility and so on. And copying spells isn't that expensive, especially if Archivists exist in your campaign world to copy from.

There's no shortage of Wizard spells worth learning either, and it's not that expensive, but you have to learn a lot of spells to make ten levels worth of investment pay off. On the other hand, if you go in to Hathran, you can get circle magic and the acorn spontaneity trick for five levels.


On top of that RS costs no feats and you still have (at least) 5 levels free, so you can pick from pretty much any (or even multiple) of them. Incantatrix? Only takes 3 levels for Metamagic Effect. Spelldancer? 1 level. Your cleric spells even qualify for DMM if you get turning from Sacred Exorcist, though that's probably only worth the feat investment for a Warmage or other full-list-access caster.

By the time you have finished Rainbow Servant and gotten Metamagic Effect from Incantatrix, you are an 18th level character. A trick you can do for the first time at that point is not a trick you're good at.

[Fero]

My problem with the RS is the table versus text. If I am going to do something crazy, I want to be able to show my DM it works both RaW and RaI (and hopefully RaF). I find it hard to believe that the writers/editors of RS missed a glaring error on the table. I find it much easier to believe that they missed a copy/paste error in the text.

Setting that issue aside, RS may be worthy of hitting the top 15. The capstone yakes forever to reach Law and Good are nice. Maybe it is better than Recaster?

[Anthrowhale]

There is by no means any sort of consensus on this. The text makes no statement of this explicitly, and generally just because something "has" something doesn't mean that can't be modified.


Also, the Tainted Spellcasting feature explicitly increases taint (specific overrides general). As such, a TS can choose to fail the fort saves to increase her taint score as high as wanted. Also, although a TS is evil, and likely performs monstrous acts, she probably isn't an evil monster for game rule purposes.

Yeah, I can see how it could be looked at otherwise. My expectation is that most DMs will find some way to quash infinite DCs in practice though.

Incidentally, it looks like you can early entry TS via Lesser Aasimar Spellcaster 1/Paragnostic Initiate 1/Tainted Sorcerer 1.

[sleepyphoenixx]

My problem with the RS is the table versus text. If I am going to do something crazy, I want to be able to show my DM it works both RaW and RaI (and hopefully RaF). I find it hard to believe that the writers/editors of RS missed a glaring error on the table. I find it much easier to believe that they missed a copy/paste error in the text.

Setting that issue aside, RS may be worthy of hitting the top 15. The capstone yakes forever to reach Law and Good are nice. Maybe it is better than Recaster?

It doesn't really matter what you believe RaI to be, RAW is "text trumps table", and the text says full casting progression.



There's no shortage of Wizard spells worth learning either, and it's not that expensive, but you have to learn a lot of spells to make ten levels worth of investment pay off. On the other hand, if you go in to Hathran, you can get circle magic and the acorn spontaneity trick for five levels.
If you want to take advantage of Circle Magic you'll be investing a whole lot more than just copying some scrolls. Let's not pretend circle members fall out of the sky for free.


By the time you have finished Rainbow Servant and gotten Metamagic Effect from Incantatrix, you are an 18th level character. A trick you can do for the first time at that point is not a trick you're good at.
You could take Incantatrix first and be a "normal" persistomancy wizard until ECL 18 instead, which is far more useful at lower levels. Or you could take a level of Spelldancer instead and only delay RS by 1 level. Cherrypicking the least optimal example can make any build look bad.

With early entry you can also enter RS at ECL 2 and get cleric spell access at ECL 11.

[Chronos]

It might not matter what you believe RaI to be, but it does matter what your DM believes it to be.

The "text trumps table" rule is meant to cover situations where there isn't enough room in the table for the full description, so it just gives a name for the feature or a brief summary. It isn't meant to cover situations where there's a clear editing mistake in one of the two. In cases where there's an editing mistake, the correct interpretation is to ignore the one that has the mistake and use the non-mistaken one. And it's clear, for Rainbow Servant, that the mistake is in the text, not the table.

[Fero]

It might not matter what you believe RaI to be, but it does matter what your DM believes it to be.

The "text trumps table" rule is meant to cover situations where there isn't enough room in the table for the full description, so it just gives a name for the feature or a brief summary. It isn't meant to cover situations where there's a clear editing mistake in one of the two. In cases where there's an editing mistake, the correct interpretation is to ignore the one that has the mistake and use the non-mistaken one. And it's clear, for Rainbow Servant, that the mistake is in the text, not the table.

Well said. That said, I do believe it matters what players consider RaI to be. Being part of a D&D playgroup is, in essence, a form of social contract. That means all players should act in good-faith when building characters, even optimized ones. As such, if I want to do something that works RaW, but very much seems to violate RaW, I owe it to the DM to bring the issue up and let them adjudicate. Failure to do so in a glaring case like this can lead to the DM and other players not trusting my builds and questioning everything I do in this, and future, games.
Maybe the DM will rule in favor of RaW . . . but probably not, especially when I admit it looks like an editing error.