Chaotic Good Paladin Oath?

[Hiro Quester]

I’m fixing to play a Paladin/sorcerer in a friend’s game. In terms of roleplaying, I’m finding most of the oaths kinds meh, though.

In the story of the world, a great Calamity has just happened, and many cities and civilizations are in ruins. And magic has just started to happen. There is a lot of chaos, and many attempts to impose order in ways that limit people’s newfound freedoms and take advantage of the desperation of refugees, and so on.

Plus people are starting to have incontrovertible evidence that the gods are real. But there are still questions about the gods’ intentions and motivations. Do they deserve our worship? Do they even care about mortals? Do they have goals and intentions that morals could or should help or oppose? Are the gods benevolent, indifferent, or exploitive?

My character is a musician-warrior, who was (maybe still is) devoted to a trickster god. Paladin 2/divine soul sorcerer 4. He used to work as a musician, clown, bear-wrestler and roustabout in a traveling circus (a tolerant, diverse, nonconformist, outsiders’ artistic community, that flouted many laws and traditions and fiercely protected one another in this). Post calamity, he has been helping to gather refugees and shepherd them to a safe community. But the community is being threatened by a military presence trying to reimpose the old society’s heirarchy and oligarchy.

My character is bristling against this order being imposed from the outside.

I wish there was an official oath that felt more chaotic good (oath of freedom, or something like that).

I’m not really into roleplaying the oath of conquest or oath of the Crown. Way too colonialist or too authoritarian. Oath of Devotion might be okay. But it’s very lawful.

So I’m looking for a way to reinterpret one of the oaths in a chaotic good way. Perhaps like Devotion, but less lawful. More ensuring that power is earned and flows from the will of the people, in the interests of the people, rather than imposed on the people against their wishes, and for the benefit of those elitists and oligarchs.

Perhaps if there’s a reasonably balanced homebrew or UA oath of freedom, that swore to oppose exploitation, oppression, authoritarianism, and promote artistic expression, personal choices, diversity, freedom of thought and speech and religion, etc? Or a way to reinterpret one of the standard oaths in these directions?

Does anyone know of something that might be suitable?

[MonochromeTiger]

I’m fixing to play a Paladin/sorcerer in a friend’s game. In terms of roleplaying, I’m finding most of the oaths kinds meh, though.

In the story of the world, a great Calamity has just happened, and many cities and civilizations are in ruins. And magic has just started to happen. There is a lot of chaos, and many attempts to impose order in ways that limit people’s newfound freedoms and take advantage of the desperation of refugees, and so on.

Plus people are starting to have incontrovertible evidence that the gods are real. But there are still questions about the gods’ intentions and motivations. Do they deserve our worship? Do they even care about mortals? Do they have goals and intentions that morals could or should help or oppose? Are the gods benevolent, indifferent, or exploitive?

My character is a musician-warrior, who was (maybe still is) devoted to a trickster god. Paladin 2/divine soul sorcerer 4. He used to work as a musician, clown, bear-wrestler and roustabout in a traveling circus (a tolerant, diverse, nonconformist, outsiders’ artistic community, that flouted many laws and traditions and fiercely protected one another in this). Post calamity, he has been helping to gather refugees and shepherd them to a safe community. But the community is being threatened by a military presence trying to reimpose the old society’s heirarchy and oligarchy.

My character is bristling against this order being imposed from the outside.

I wish there was an official oath that felt more chaotic good (oath of freedom, or something like that).

I’m not really into roleplaying the oath of conquest or oath of the Crown. Way too colonialist or too authoritarian. Oath of Devotion might be okay. But it’s very lawful.

So I’m looking for a way to reinterpret one of the oaths in a chaotic good way. Perhaps like Devotion, but less lawful. More ensuring that power is earned and flows from the will of the people, in the interests of the people, rather than imposed on the people against their wishes, and for the benefit of those elitists and oligarchs.

Perhaps if there’s a reasonably balanced homebrew or UA oath of freedom, that swore to oppose exploitation, oppression, authoritarianism, and promote artistic expression, personal choices, diversity, freedom of thought and speech and religion, etc? Or a way to reinterpret one of the standard oaths in these directions?

Does anyone know of something that might be suitable?

Oath of Redemption could probably be reworked to a more Chaotic Good outlook. Issue is it also makes it very hard for you to do any sort of violent opposition to a corrupt or oppressive force since that it discourages fighting unless you aren't really given another choice and "they treat people terribly" isn't quite on the same level as "they are actively holding a knife to this person's throat unless I duel them to the death."

Oath of Ancients is pretty easy to rework into Chaotic Good too, actually easier in some aspects since the tenants of the oath boil down to "try to give people hope, save lives and fight evil, be a good person, have courage." Paraphrased of course, the actual text involves more flowery language and mentions of art and beauty and light and so on.

Only thing that really screams "Lawful" in either of them is swearing the oath in the first place and that's just because some people will argue anything with "Chaotic" in its alignment can't keep its word.

[Unoriginal]

Oath of Redemption could probably be reworked to a more Chaotic Good outlook. Issue is it also makes it very hard for you to do any sort of violent opposition to a corrupt or oppressive force since that it discourages fighting unless you aren't really given another choice and "they treat people terribly" isn't quite on the same level as "they are actively holding a knife to this person's throat unless I duel them to the death."

Oath of Redemption asks you to use proportionate response and give people a chance, that doesn't mean you can't do violent opposition to forces refusing to stop.

You give them a chance to do the right thing, and if they don't, you stop them with might and steel if necessary.

Agreed that it can fit a chaotic good Paladin, though



Oath of Ancients is pretty easy to rework into Chaotic Good too, actually easier in some aspects since the tenants of the oath boil down to "try to give people hope, save lives and fight evil, be a good person, have courage." Paraphrased of course, the actual text involves more flowery language and mentions of art and beauty and light and so on.

Agreed. There is also the Oath of Glory, which is basically swearing to be cool and awesome.



Only thing that really screams "Lawful" in either of them is swearing the oath in the first place and that's just because some people will argue anything with "Chaotic" in its alignment can't keep its word.

Yeah, never agreed with that. For 5e, at least, 'cause each edition has its own vision for alignment.

IMO a Paladin's Oath is an affirmation of self. You look at the universe and state "this is who I am" hard enough the universe gives you powers to reinforce it.

Nos it's true that this kind of contract magic attracts lawful types, logically, but that doesn't make it a requirement.

[Dualight]

I have to echo Ancients. Their thing, as i understand it from the description in the PHB is that they aim to be the life of the party, and to kindle and protect hope.
I can see how the druidic aspects of their powers can be ill-fitting, but tenets of the Oath fit what your character has already been doing (providing hope and fighting against those that would cause despair, even if that is not how you frame it in your post).

[kazaryu]

IMO a Paladin's Oath is an affirmation of self. You look at the universe and state "this is who I am" hard enough the universe gives you powers to reinforce it.

Nos it's true that this kind of contract magic attracts lawful types, logically, but that doesn't make it a requirement.




Only thing that really screams "Lawful" in either of them is swearing the oath in the first place and that's just because some people will argue anything with "Chaotic" in its alignment can't keep its word.

this is why in my games I emphasize that the power paladins get doesn't come from the oath. in fact not all paladins ever verbally or mentally swore an oath. the power comes from as unoriginal put it, affirming themselves and their beliefs hard enough that they gain power. (i actually have a cosmic reason for this that relates to like True Names and Alignments).

But yeah, its not even really contract magic IMO.

[Hiro Quester]

I admit, I had not looked closely at the oath of the ancients. That probably is what I’m looking for, in terms of flavor.

I just wish the channel divinity for oath of the ancients was just slightly more interesting, than using your action to restrain another for a round or two.

Plus we already have a Druid in the party. Restraining people with plants and chatting to the forest creatures is kind of his thing.

I might be able to reflavor the Oath of Vengence along the lines of this oath, though.

Embodying the light of freedom, creativity, beauty, and life, while being willing to sacrifice one’s own “righteousness” and “purity” (lawfulness, honesty, mercy) to be a champion of freedom and justice. Taking retribution against those who are cruel, exploitive, oppressive, dominating, and abuse their power. Sometimes telling a good entertaining parable or story, or a parody or singing a mocking song that humbles those who abuse their power, even if that means not always strictly telling the truth.

That seems a possibility worth discussing with my DM.

[RogueJK]

Oath of Glory would work well for that character concept, and there's nothing inherently "lawful" about that one.

[Unoriginal]

Oath of Glory would work well for that character concept, and there's nothing inherently "lawful" about that one.

The Oath, in case OP doesn't have access to the relevant book(s):



The tenets of the Oath of Glory drive a paladin to attempt heroics that might one day shine in legend.

Actions over Words. Strive to be known by glorious deeds, not words.

Challenges Are but Tests. Face hardships with courage, and encourage your allies to face them with you.

Hone the Body. Like raw stone, your body must be worked so its potential can be realized.

Discipline the Soul. You must marshal the discipline to overcome failings within yourself that threaten to dim the glory of you and your friends.

[JellyPooga]

I'm also going to upvote Oath of Ancients; from your description of your characters ideals, Ancients is where it's at. If you don't want to step on the thematic toes of the Druid in your party, you can easily reflavour your SFX from vines and such into something more trickery based (or something else entirely).

Ensnaring Strike and Natures Wrath could be tied shoelaces or spectral ropes. Speaking to animals is very much in the wheelhouse of many tricksters. Misty Step doesn't have to be anything nature/fey related, being just slipping through dimensional cracks to "fool" reality. So on and so forth. Any spells you don't like thematically or can't reflavour don't have to be used, or you can justify them the same way as any spell on the Paladin list; none of the Smite line of spells really scream trickster or protector, but nothing is forcing you to use them unless you want to. Magic is.

[sithlordnergal]

Yeah, I say go Ancients too. The Oath fits your character's personality, and you won't actually step on the Druid's toes as much as you might think. Its also the spellcasting subclass for the Paladin, with a lot of handy and powerful spells.

Heh, its kind of a shame you went Divine Soul already. I did an Ancients/Wild Magic multiclass once, and not only was it fun, but it was surprisingly effective. Especially when you hit yourself fireball.

[KorvinStarmast]

I admit, I had not looked closely at the oath of the ancients. That was gonna be my suggestion. So that's a third vote "for" it seems.

[Hiro Quester]

Thanks everyone. This was ver helpful.

I’m combining the Oath of the Ancients with the oath of vengence, abiding by the explicit tenets of both, by swearing vengence against those who stifle freedom, abuse their power, impose external “order” onto self-organizing communities, etc. while mechanically taking the oath of vengence.

Biographically, my character’s family and friends were executed by remnants of the old hierarchical society that had developed into an authoritarian sect, because they were symbols of nonconformist freedom and resistance to imposed hierarchical authority. He has sworn to oppose such abuses of power.

So he’s swearing to kindle the light, shelter the light, be the light, while also swearing to be a champion of freedom, and to punish those why try to stifle the light, abuse their power, impose “order” in ways that limit creativity, freedom, diversity.

So he’s a vengence paladin mechanically, but flavored as an Oath of the Ancients, in terms of freedom and creativity without the Druidic flavor.

[Hiro Quester]

Heh, it’s kind of a shame you went Divine Soul already. I did an Ancients/Wild Magic multiclass once, and not only was it fun, but it was surprisingly effective. Especially when you hit yourself fireball.

Agreed. I’m working with the DM to incorporate Wild Magic too. Magic is very new and poorly understood. And my PC is creative and playful, and a little foolhardy and impulsive. So sometimes he might also vary the magical forms too far and set off wild magic (perhaps gaining advantage). We both think this will be fun.

[Crushgrip]

Thanks everyone. This was ver helpful.

I’m combining the Oath of the Ancients with the oath of vengence, abiding by the explicit tenets of both, by swearing vengence against those who stifle freedom, abuse their power, impose external “order” onto self-organizing communities, etc. while mechanically taking the oath of vengence.

Biographically, my character’s family and friends were executed by remnants of the old hierarchical society that had developed into an authoritarian sect, because they were symbols of nonconformist freedom and resistance to imposed hierarchical authority. He has sworn to oppose such abuses of power.

So he’s swearing to kindle the light, shelter the light, be the light, while also swearing to be a champion of freedom, and to punish those why try to stifle the light, abuse their power, impose “order” in ways that limit creativity, freedom, diversity.

So he’s a vengence paladin mechanically, but flavored as an Oath of the Ancients, in terms of freedom and creativity without the Druidic flavor.

I love all the comments and suggestions. I ran into a similar issue a while ago when making my Dwarven Sorcadin. I wanted him to be NG and found the Dwarven God Vergadain to be a good fit. My DM and I came up with a "new" Oath called the Oath of the Khazad. It is essentially an Oath of Devotion Pally with the tenet's re-written and some other flavor changes. Take a look and hopefully it will give you some idea's:

https://i.imgur.com/thkZkYJh.jpg

[Witty Username]

Oath of glory from Tasha's/Theros is a pretty open one for alignments and it does to hero paladin pretty smoothly.

[Hiro Quester]

My DM and I came up with a "new" Oath called the Oath of the Khazad.


That's awesome. I love the dwarfiest dwarf flavor. Kudos to Khazad!

[Psyren]

Conquest: LE/LN
Devotion: LG
Glory: All
Redemption: Any G
Ancients: Any Non-E
Crown: Any L
Watchers: Any Non-C
Vengeance: All
Oathbreaker: Any E
Open Sea: Any C