arkieNork
2023-10-17, 12:19 PM
I am a relatively DM, never had to dig into Druids or any pet classes, one of my PCs is getting this feat by story fiat. Specifically its a level 12 PC gaining a Dire Wolf.
Circumstances:
Players have previously done a significant service for a branch of a powerful druid cult (they have hunted down and destroyed a CR 12 arachnid monster that was about to release a brood of unnatural demonic spiders on the region). They have also recently killed almost a dozen different abominations, unnatural monsters and demons with whom the druid cult in this area is in perpetual war.
So they have access to half a dozen Ranger npcs who are Helpful (would be willing to advise, help them train the animal, lend castings of Speak with Animal)
Players are also in good standing in their little community which is ruled by a Lich disguised as the town's blacksmith and money-lender. They have accumulated a credit of just over 10k for anything non-magical and are in process of convincing him to craft magical items for them in return for certain services.
The 'loyal dire wolf' is the only reward for a very deadly cr 12 encounter (they had to go deep into their inventory, used up scrolls of haste, store of healing potions, invisibility potions). I DMed the wolf's addition as just giving the PC that healed it an extra 'Wild Cohort' feat.
My first question here is to confirm how the HD increases to be calculated based on level. (https://www.realmshelps.net/charbuild/feat/Wild_Cohort) for level 12 PC - I am treating them as a level 9 druid for this.
Gets to take Dire Wolf at level 7. HD adjustment -6, so the wolf will be taking the stats from line "3rd-5th Character Level"?
Ideas being discussed in order that the players want to apply them:
1) One player dug this up https://archive.ph/NEf3n#selection-433.0-433.40
Now pc with the wolf is asking if they can pay an extra fee of 10k experience to let this spell work on the wolf, bypassing "as a class ability." clause. (arguing that as a 'good' aligned character, he is very much worried that he has saved this rather dangerous beast, which is now attached to him, getting familiar around humans etc... If he should happen to die, the wolf might go off and hurt some innocents and so he is morally obligated to try and make the wolf 'good' in hopes that it won't look at any nearby kids as lunch anymore. PC in question is 2 levels ahead of the party and is proposing to funnel his experience into the wolf for a while, to let the others catch up a bit)
So they want to first make it Celestial and good aligned, than Awaken it. Totally not because it would make the wolf more powerful, of course. 'Just playing into alignment.'
they also rose the option of tacking on another 10k price to get past the clause 'If the target creature is your familiar' so the template would be based off the PC's level rather than wolf's HD.
Question for DMs: Not sure if 10k experience is sufficient cost to stretch the rules that way on either clause. On the other hand we currently only have 3 pcs in the group, they are aiming to make it essentially a weak 4th
2) Making a trip to a hidden druid grove and asking the head druid there to cast Awaken on the Dire Wolf.
I am immediately stuck here because we are playing a blend of 3.5 and PF1
Researching what 3.5 has to say about this I see this
https://www.realmshelps.net/charbuild/classes/animalcompanion.shtml#alternate
"an animal awakened by a druid remains her companion as long as she treats it with respect, as discussed above. The animal continues to count against the druid's Hit Dice limit for animal companions. For a time, the awakened animal can even exceed the druid's level. (For example, an awakened dire bear suddenly has 14 HD, but it remains with a 12th-level druid). Until the druid once again exceeds the animal in Hit Dice, however, she cannot gain new animal companions.
As a general rule, an awakened animal continues to assist the druid, at least as long as she continues to include it among her companions. When she elects to leave that animal behind (by befriending a new one), it soon departs. The animal remains friendly with the druid and may assist her from time to time, but it no longer accompanies her on adventures."
So gist of that is - they can awaken it and keep it as a cohort. ( https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/a/awaken/ )
PF1 however has this to say " An awakened animal can’t serve as an animal companion, familiar, or special mount."
so... technically that does not exclude an 'animal cohort'
Than pf1 clarifies further "Most pointedly, awakened animals can no longer serve as companions, and the character must follow the rules for Leadership if he wishes to take the animal as an official cohort. "
Question 2: Should I let them do this or have the druid tell them that this will most likely break the bond the wolf has formed with the PC? Or perhaps it would be better to transform the 'Wild Cohort' feat into a Leadership feat on the spot?
Question 3: am I correct in understanding that if this wolf is awakened, it should no longer get the benefits of Wild Cohort stat
3) If it takes 1 year and 2 month for a base animal to be trained up to get Warbeast template, than how long would it take for a Celestial Awakened Dire Wolf to get it?
My gut response here: Nope - if its awaken, let it level up normally.
That said, are there any templates for military training of an NPC to compare with?
Circumstances:
Players have previously done a significant service for a branch of a powerful druid cult (they have hunted down and destroyed a CR 12 arachnid monster that was about to release a brood of unnatural demonic spiders on the region). They have also recently killed almost a dozen different abominations, unnatural monsters and demons with whom the druid cult in this area is in perpetual war.
So they have access to half a dozen Ranger npcs who are Helpful (would be willing to advise, help them train the animal, lend castings of Speak with Animal)
Players are also in good standing in their little community which is ruled by a Lich disguised as the town's blacksmith and money-lender. They have accumulated a credit of just over 10k for anything non-magical and are in process of convincing him to craft magical items for them in return for certain services.
The 'loyal dire wolf' is the only reward for a very deadly cr 12 encounter (they had to go deep into their inventory, used up scrolls of haste, store of healing potions, invisibility potions). I DMed the wolf's addition as just giving the PC that healed it an extra 'Wild Cohort' feat.
My first question here is to confirm how the HD increases to be calculated based on level. (https://www.realmshelps.net/charbuild/feat/Wild_Cohort) for level 12 PC - I am treating them as a level 9 druid for this.
Gets to take Dire Wolf at level 7. HD adjustment -6, so the wolf will be taking the stats from line "3rd-5th Character Level"?
Ideas being discussed in order that the players want to apply them:
1) One player dug this up https://archive.ph/NEf3n#selection-433.0-433.40
Now pc with the wolf is asking if they can pay an extra fee of 10k experience to let this spell work on the wolf, bypassing "as a class ability." clause. (arguing that as a 'good' aligned character, he is very much worried that he has saved this rather dangerous beast, which is now attached to him, getting familiar around humans etc... If he should happen to die, the wolf might go off and hurt some innocents and so he is morally obligated to try and make the wolf 'good' in hopes that it won't look at any nearby kids as lunch anymore. PC in question is 2 levels ahead of the party and is proposing to funnel his experience into the wolf for a while, to let the others catch up a bit)
So they want to first make it Celestial and good aligned, than Awaken it. Totally not because it would make the wolf more powerful, of course. 'Just playing into alignment.'
they also rose the option of tacking on another 10k price to get past the clause 'If the target creature is your familiar' so the template would be based off the PC's level rather than wolf's HD.
Question for DMs: Not sure if 10k experience is sufficient cost to stretch the rules that way on either clause. On the other hand we currently only have 3 pcs in the group, they are aiming to make it essentially a weak 4th
2) Making a trip to a hidden druid grove and asking the head druid there to cast Awaken on the Dire Wolf.
I am immediately stuck here because we are playing a blend of 3.5 and PF1
Researching what 3.5 has to say about this I see this
https://www.realmshelps.net/charbuild/classes/animalcompanion.shtml#alternate
"an animal awakened by a druid remains her companion as long as she treats it with respect, as discussed above. The animal continues to count against the druid's Hit Dice limit for animal companions. For a time, the awakened animal can even exceed the druid's level. (For example, an awakened dire bear suddenly has 14 HD, but it remains with a 12th-level druid). Until the druid once again exceeds the animal in Hit Dice, however, she cannot gain new animal companions.
As a general rule, an awakened animal continues to assist the druid, at least as long as she continues to include it among her companions. When she elects to leave that animal behind (by befriending a new one), it soon departs. The animal remains friendly with the druid and may assist her from time to time, but it no longer accompanies her on adventures."
So gist of that is - they can awaken it and keep it as a cohort. ( https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/a/awaken/ )
PF1 however has this to say " An awakened animal can’t serve as an animal companion, familiar, or special mount."
so... technically that does not exclude an 'animal cohort'
Than pf1 clarifies further "Most pointedly, awakened animals can no longer serve as companions, and the character must follow the rules for Leadership if he wishes to take the animal as an official cohort. "
Question 2: Should I let them do this or have the druid tell them that this will most likely break the bond the wolf has formed with the PC? Or perhaps it would be better to transform the 'Wild Cohort' feat into a Leadership feat on the spot?
Question 3: am I correct in understanding that if this wolf is awakened, it should no longer get the benefits of Wild Cohort stat
3) If it takes 1 year and 2 month for a base animal to be trained up to get Warbeast template, than how long would it take for a Celestial Awakened Dire Wolf to get it?
My gut response here: Nope - if its awaken, let it level up normally.
That said, are there any templates for military training of an NPC to compare with?