How would you keep vikings from fighting?

[WhiteDrag0n]

Here is the setup:

An adult black dragon wants to destroy kingdom A. Unable to do it himself, he has allied himself with opposing army B and tasked with keeping a kingdom C out of the war.

Kingdom C is basicaly Vikings, but without the boats. The king is old and somewhat ineffective. He has a couple of heirs vying for the throne. I was planning on doing a Beowulf situation, where the king is being beset by the dragon and needs the players (Beowulf) to solve the situation.

However, I feel like the dragon would be smarter than to just fly around killing, though perhaps egotistical enough to just become the monster.

So if you wanted to make sure a bunch of war loving vikings stayed out of a war. how would you do it?

[InvisibleBison]

If you want to keep some war-loving people from fighting a war, the obvious solution is to give them another war, or at least the prospect of an imminent war. You say the king has two heirs vying for the throne - an obvious source of conflict. If I were the dragon, I'd be secretly funding both would-be heirs, so that they can both start recruiting armies in preparation for the inevitable civil war between them, which may or may not wait for the king to actually die before kicking off. And if the dragon doesn't want to or can't spare that much wealth, having the king killed would probably also get a civil war going, especially if it could be done in a way that made each of the heirs able to blame the other one for the killing.

[Amnestic]

Old and ineffective king? Multiple heirs vying for the throne?

If I wanted the vikings kept out of the war I'd simply off the king. The succession crisis it triggered would have them fighting each other instead of whatever war you care about. Bonus points if you plant blame that points to two, separate, opposed heirs so that neither looks totally innocent.

[Unoriginal]

Here is the setup:

An adult black dragon wants to destroy kingdom A. Unable to do it himself, he has allied himself with opposing army B and tasked with keeping a kingdom C out of the war.

Kingdom C is basicaly Vikings, but without the boats. The king is old and somewhat ineffective. He has a couple of heirs vying for the throne. I was planning on doing a Beowulf situation, where the king is being beset by the dragon and needs the players (Beowulf) to solve the situation.

However, I feel like the dragon would be smarter than to just fly around killing, though perhaps egotistical enough to just become the monster.

So if you wanted to make sure a bunch of war loving vikings stayed out of a war. how would you do it?

Is there a reason why Kingdom C needs to be kept out of the war, rather than be used to help destroy Kingdom A?

[LibraryOgre]

Old and ineffective king? Multiple heirs vying for the throne?

If I wanted the vikings kept out of the war I'd simply off the king. The succession crisis it triggered would have them fighting each other instead of whatever war you care about. Bonus points if you plant blame that points to two, separate, opposed heirs so that neither looks totally innocent.

This would be a good option, but I'd note that burning farms or crops could go either way... does it make them stay home to get enough food, or do they go raiding to take food from others?

[GloatingSwine]

So if you wanted to make sure a bunch of war loving vikings stayed out of a war. how would you do it?

The traditional way is to pay them a sufficiently large amount of gold to go away (until next year, repeat business is good business, after all).

(If they're not raiding the borders pretty much persistently they're not vikings, you were only a viking whilst you were going viking. Whether you can be a viking without a boat is a stickier proposition.)

[Sigreid]

Frame them and the kingdom for each other and let them spend their strength on a pointless fight before you strike.

[Sorinth]

Is there a particular reason the vikings would actually help Kingdom A, or is it more if Kingdom B's army is away they will take advantage and raid Kingdom B? Also are the players supposed to care about the war between Kingdom's A & B?

The smart tactic would be to cause a civil war with the vikings or otherwise put the focus somewhere else. The dragon's ego could certainly make it want that focus to be on itself rather then being behind the scenes manipulating stuff. But rather then the black dragon announcing itself, if it creates a new lair in the viking kingdom and thereby starts creating a regional effects and maybe taking out some small villages and leaving no witnesses that could distract the kingdom enough. The players might initially be sent to investigate these regional changes (A McGuffin could be amplifying these effects so that they happen quickly or have more range) with it eventually leading to the discovery and showdown with the black dragon. Throw in some misdirection where there are supports of each prince blaming the other prince for the events and you've got yourself a decent basis for the adventure.

[Clistenes]

The main reason Vikings raided other lands wasn't the desire to fight, but rather their desire for gold, land and slaves. As somebody said before, bribing them should work fine.

HOWEVER, I can't see an evil dragon choosing to spend his treasure that way as opposed to, you know, simply attacking them and taking THEIR gold to enlarge its hoard...

A smart dragon with access to the right magic or allies could manufacture a threat to keep their troops at home, like, for example, undead or lycanthropes who attack farms and villages while the fighting men are away... not at enough of a large scale to force a mass migration, but just enough to keep the warriors at home.

Another, obvious way would be to spark a civil war. If the king is weak and the heirs hate each other, he could arrange the assassination of the king and encourage the princes to fight each other, or he could give an ambitious noble the means to try a coup.

Or he could try all a of these simultaneously.

[GloatingSwine]

Another, obvious way would be to spark a civil war. If the king is weak and the heirs hate each other, he could arrange the assassination of the king and encourage the princes to fight each other, or he could give an ambitious noble the means to try a coup.


Arrange the assassination of the king (or even an attempt at such) in such a way that it seems publicly obvious that one of the two contenders did it.

That's a provocation that couldn't possibly be ignored.

[KorvinStarmast]

So if you wanted to make sure a bunch of war loving vikings stayed out of a war. how would you do it? Provide ale and whores (in the true Kurtzian spirit of things) at critical times to divert their attention.

Or do as Amnestic suggested. Fighting over who gets to be king seems to be a well worn Viking hobby.

[JellyPooga]

To stop a raiding nation from raiding, you'd need to make them focus inward. Interestingly, this could be done on a two-pronged "assault":

1) The most obvious is to have the king slowly poisoned to accelerate his death, whilst playing the heirs off against one another to generate strife, mistrust and eventually civil unrest/war.

2) It may be better with a more cunning flavour of dragon than Black for what I'm about to suggest; Green or Blue might be more suited. Either way, influencing the society away from a raiding/martial culture and into a more peacful or insular one could have the desired effect. This could be done in a number of ways;

a) Influencing a mercantile or trade guild to take greater interest or get a foothold in the nation. This will encourage the wealthy elite to invest in crafts and infrastructure over soldiers and weapons. This could be an attractive option for wealthy, but physically lesser nobles...such as the ailing King. It also gives you an easy "front" for a dragon cult.

b) Introducing a valuable resource inherent to the nation, such that staying home to exploit it becomes more valuable than going out raiding; at least in the short term. This may seem all but impossible, but introducing a technology that utilises a natural resource common to the area can do just that. e.g. introducing blackpowder weaponry to a nation rich in sulphur and coal deposits could drastically change their short and long term prospects. Alternatively, dividing society can turn members of it into a resource; why go out raiding for slaves and gold when you have slaves and gold ripe for the picking from those that don't deserve it at home? Encouraging a raiding nation to see a sector of its population as 2nd class citizens shouldn't be too hard to do.

So to use all of this, here's how I'd play it:

1) Have agents begin to poison the king slowly, weakening his grip on the throne which he presumably holds as much by strength of arm as anything else, as well as encouraging the heirs/contenders for the throne to become more active.

2) Have agents placed in the camps of all the heirs, with particular influence on the weakest ones (and by "weakest" I mean physically, politically and militarily).

3) Create a cult of the dragon within a craft or mercantile guild; specifically one that has potential to grow to prominence, but importantly is not one directly connected to military matters (so that it might appeal more to a non-military minded pawn). Throw influence, money, political maneuvering, etc. to have this guild become prominent enough to be noticed by the king and/or his heirs, further increasing your own influence.

4) If possible, induct the political elite into your Dragon Cult through the guild, putting them in separate cells to divide their interests if neccessary.

5) Influence the weakest heir to support/invest in the Cult/Guild. This is your horse in the race for the throne; a weak leader makes a weak nation and the stronger, more aggressive heirs will be forced to focus their strength inward to combat the "inexplicible" rise of this upstart.

At this point, your mission is basically accomplished; internal politics should be of higher precedence than a war between two external states and you've created a power vacuum by weakening the king, equalised the strength of the heirs so that no one contender can easily take power for themselves and you've started sliding society toward a less militaristic economy through the influence of your guild/cult.

The fun doesn't stop here though...

6) You assassinate the strongest heir for the throne and pin it on a likely candidate, perhaps even the King himself, allowing your horse (the weakest heir) to seize assets (including armies), agents and political capital.

7) Now you kill the King and ascend your puppet to the throne, preferably over at least one other candidate that has stronger claim. Sending the next in line away on some kind of mission abroad, especially if they have a large army that they take with them, is a great way to achieve this (perhaps engineering a scenario in partnership with your allies in Kingdom B to make this happen?).

The turmoil of a deceased monarch, with a weak heir grabbing at the throne whilst a beloved "true heir" is away with their army, should have the whole kingdom well and truly tizwozzed. It gets better...

8) Switch your favour from the New King to the returning True Heir. Make TH the returning hero and sabotage everything NK touches. By the time the True Heir takes the throne, half the kingdom will be in unrecoverable ruins, the commonfolk should basically hate the nobility, the nobility should be at one anothers throats, the economy will basically be in the hands of your guild/cult and corruption, infighting and treachery should be the word of the day.

Ripe pickings.

Where the PCs enter the story is up to you; any time after (5) is going to give you fertile soil for whatever plot you're planting your campaign in. A Beowulf/Grendel monster mash would fit nicely in as the assassination of either the strong heir (6) or the king (7), but could also work as part of undermining the New King (8) if you also involve the True Heir in defeating the monster, either alongside the PCs or as the quest-giver.

Obviously, the earlier in the timeline you place the PCs, the more influence they can have over these events, but flipside, the later in the timeline you place them, the more obvious the corruption and influence of the dragon cult will be. Pick your poison on how grimdark you want your setting to be.

[NB my apologies for any typos; posting from phone]

[LudicSavant]

Anyone else see the title and think "This is the central question of Vinland Saga, isn't it?"

[NecessaryWeevil]

Some great ideas here already, but I'll just add two thoughts:

1) If you spark a civil war, you need to ensure it lasts a good long while. A quick resolution would put a younger, presumably more able and ambitious king on the throne, which is not helpful when you're hoping for isolation.

2) Occupy the young hotheads with something equally exciting to warfare. Since it's a fantasy setting, what about paying a bunch of bards to play up invented (or true!) rumours of fabulous treasure for them to go questing for? As I read the Grail myths, they seem to portray a bunch of knights who were kept busy questing instead of causing (more) political trouble.

[Demonslayer666]

Here is the setup:

An adult black dragon wants to destroy kingdom A. Unable to do it himself, he has allied himself with opposing army B and tasked with keeping a kingdom C out of the war.

Kingdom C is basicaly Vikings, but without the boats. The king is old and somewhat ineffective. He has a couple of heirs vying for the throne. I was planning on doing a Beowulf situation, where the king is being beset by the dragon and needs the players (Beowulf) to solve the situation.

However, I feel like the dragon would be smarter than to just fly around killing, though perhaps egotistical enough to just become the monster.

So if you wanted to make sure a bunch of war loving vikings stayed out of a war. how would you do it?

You universally have three options. Persuade them, intimidate them, or deceive them.

Give them a bribe of some kind. Money, power, information, land, promise favors (protection), magic items, soldiers, arranged marriages, food and trade goods, etc.

Threaten to destroy them. Say they will be destroyed if they get involved because everyone would rally together against them.

Lie to them about an ancient curse, or a lich king that will rise if they get involved.