What are your favourite ECL 2 or higher races and templates?

[pabelfly]

So, what are everyone's favourite playable races and templates that are ECL 2 or higher?

[Zarvistic]

Shadovig from Dragon 299, just for how much stats and abilities it gets for +1 LA. I wish I will get a chance to play it some day.

[lylsyly]

Half Celestial. I use that **"* on everything.

[Prime32]

Two obscure Eberron templates:

Quorbred (aka "Failed Vessel") is an LA +2/CR +1 template from Secrets of Sarlona which gives a bunch of antimagical/antipsionic abilities, on top of Int +4, Wis -2, Cha -4... and lets you use Int in place of Wis or Cha when calculating your abilities' save DCs.

Dust-stuffed is an LA +5/CR +1 template from Explorer's Handbook which turns a creature into a Lawful Evil living construct with DR 15/bludgeoning, (Su) haste a few times per day, and no auras of any kind.

[Maat Mons]

Lolthtouched Lesser Drow
Mineral Warrior Earth Dwarf
Primordial Half-Giant

[bekeleven]

Petal is like a pixie with a less enormous build penalty. I'll build one every chance I get.

(It technically has cohort LA but I've never had a DM disqualify it for that reason.)

[Troacctid]

Half-fey. I especially like the feytouched/half-fey transition class that lets you get the full benefits of the template for only +1 LA instead of +2.

[Fero]

Ethergaunts are pretty cool.

[Golbarg]

As a DM, I've always been partial to Phrenic and Shadow creature (both +2 LA), to give a bit of oomph to an encounter. I've been partial to them as a player as well when offered free LA.

[Metastachydium]

Man, there are so many! I love Poison Dusk LizardfolkMM3 (LA +1), VolodnisUE (be a PLANTY and then some for LA +2!), the Winged templateSS (it's in fact crazy awesome broken for LA +2, but I'm not going to complain), DiopsidsDComp (LA +1 and totally underrated).

JaebrinsMM5 and FeytouchedFF are also interesting at LA +1. I'd like to play a Skum or a Woodling something-somethingalso MM3 one day. And EnekosSoS, 3.5's big green playable Ogre people likewise have a permanent residence in the affecting regions of my circulatory system. Als, Gloamings and SlythsUnd. I'm also also pretty sure there's even more but I'll stop myself here.


Ethergaunts are pretty cool.

Well, they do come online after ECL 2. (Anybody wanna talk about the spellcasting Nerra, in the meantime?)


As a DM, I've always been partial to Phrenic and Shadow creature (both +2 LA), to give a bit of oomph to an encounter. I've been partial to them as a player as well when offered free LA.

I think I prefer DarkToM to Shadow. Lower LA. Lovely perks. I've been trying to put that and ChameleonUnd on a SkulkFF/RoD for a while now. It would make a fun combo in a demented kind of way.

[Golbarg]

I think I prefer DarkToM to Shadow. Lower LA. Lovely perks. I've been trying to put that and ChameleonUnd on a SkulkFF/RoD for a while now. It would make a fun combo in a demented kind of way.[/QUOTE]

OP asked for +2 races and templates, but yeah, I've used Dark creature extensively as well. Often, minions with the Dark template and the boss with Shadow

[Metastachydium]

OP asked for +2 races and templates, but yeah, I've used Dark creature extensively as well. Often, minions with the Dark template and the boss with Shadow

LA +2 means ECL 3 or more. Neat idea with using those two in tandem, though.

[Beni-Kujaku]

In the Monster Manual 1, I like the Blink Dog (cohort LA... bah, I can be a cohort if I want!), unlimited Dimension Door is such a fun ability to have. The satyr for Siren and for at-will charms and compulsions. Ghosts are also fun. And obviously the Efreet and noble Djinn who got LA+9 and +10 in Dragon #293. I love how they were even more lenient than the LA thread and just said "3 XP-free wishes per day? Meh, should be balanced at ECL 19 and 20.".

Outside of it, the Steel and Tome Dragons is what playing a true dragon should be : spellcasting and SR from the get-go, but at a lower level than even a wyrmling silver. Agreed on the Petal being interesting. I like the Sharn and Hatchling Phaerimm because there is so much going on with them, for their lore implication, and because it is relaxing to not have to worry about anything. No spellbook, no spell preparation, no material component, no XP cost, just magic-slinging and Chaotic Evil tendencies. Unbodied is great for all the questions you have to ask about its "real" shape and how it can use items. Gravetouched Ghoul for being a fixed and balanced Undead template that still allows for multiple strategies, including mundane access to paralysis.

[pabelfly]

OP asked for +2 races and templates, but yeah, I've used Dark creature extensively as well. Often, minions with the Dark template and the boss with Shadow

Someone has already mentioned that ECL 2 is actually LA +1, but I'm not necessarily requiring races with a level adjustment either, racial hit dice are fine too. I'm just interested in seeing what racial options people like that are beyond the usual ECL 1 options.

[Metastachydium]

Ghosts are also fun.

I've been in a 6th level game once where one of the PCs was a 1st level Ghost Bard. When I thought she's not going to get any more freaking awesome, she just had to go and possess a retooled Remorhaz and be a melee brute for the rest of the thing. I loved that game.


the Sharn and Hatchling Phaerimm
Unbodied is great

Well, damn. You really had to just rifle off half the things that are just plain wrong with this game, didn't you?


Gravetouched Ghoul for being a fixed and balanced Undead template that still allows for multiple strategies, including mundane access to paralysis.

Not that much into Undead overall, but I think I'm on the record somewhere on these boards stating that I would be fine with that being the go to "be Undead, it's cheap" option in 3.5.


Someone has already mentioned that ECL 2 is actually LA +1, but I'm not necessarily requiring races with a level adjustment either, racial hit dice are fine too. I'm just interested in seeing what racial options people like that are beyond the usual ECL 1 options.

That reminds me: Anthropomorphic freakin' Animals.

[pabelfly]

That reminds me: Anthropomorphic freakin' Animals.

There are plenty of good anthropromorphic animals, I didn't bother to mention them since I would think most people here know them. But the best are probably Leopard and Tiger (good stat bonuses and Pounce), Baleen Whale (good stats and large size for 3 RHD and no LA), Giant Octopus and Giant Squid (lots of attacks), and the Bat (best WIS bonus for an ECL 1 race).

[Vizzerdrix]

Obah Blessed from a Dungeon magazine (I forget the number at the moment) is a favorite of mine. I dream of using it on a warforged with 4 to 6 broad bladed short swords.

[Beni-Kujaku]

I've been in a 6th level game once where one of the PCs was a 1st level Ghost Bard. When I thought she's not going to get any more freaking awesome, she just had to go and possess a retooled Remorhaz and be a melee brute for the rest of the thing. I loved that game.
I really had to restrain myself from saying Remorhaz was my favorite playable race overall. I just love the concept of it so much, and there is so much to do with it as a PC. But it only had an LA in Dragon #293, and even then LA+6 is just above what I would ever consider playable.


Well, damn. You really had to just rifle off half the things that are just plain wrong with this game, didn't you?
What's wrong with this game is that there aren't more noncasting high ECL creatures with interesting abilities. It's not my fault they undervalued casting and overvalued racial hit dice to the point that the most playable creatures as written with more than ECL 3 are low RHD creatures with obscene full casting. And anthropomorphic animals. But I don't like anthropomorphic animals. Either they're completely useless, or they're anthrobat (yay, even more druid favoritism!) or anthrowhale (this one's okay I guess if not a little bit overpowered, I just don't like how much Furaffinity I get on my screen when I try to look it up), with no rhyme or reason. Kinda like the game in general I guess....


Not that much into Undead overall, but I think I'm on the record somewhere on these boards stating that I would be fine with that being the go to "be Undead, it's cheap" option in 3.5.
Yeah, it was in my negative LA thread. You'll find it at page 16.

[liquidformat]

I had a lot of fun playing an ambush drake, they end up being a nice mix of things.

Centaur is also a lot of fun to play.

[ApologyFestival]

Quorbred (aka "Failed Vessel") is an LA +2/CR +1 template from Secrets of Sarlona which gives a bunch of antimagical/antipsionic abilities, on top of Int +4, Wis -2, Cha -4... and lets you use Int in place of Wis or Cha when calculating your abilities' save DCs.
That's such a cool find! I can't think of any other first-party ways to universally change your key ability score for determining save DCs -- and it even comes with a terrifying rider effect on all of your melee attacks. I'd like to make a skill monkey with save DC abilities with this.

It's a shame that it's so tied up in Eberron and Quori lore, and that it has such a huge impact on your character's story, since some DMs do insist on sticking to the lore and RP requirements. Also a shame that it's got an arbitrary "can't be psionic" ability.

[Metastachydium]

I really had to restrain myself from saying Remorhaz was my favorite playable race overall. I just love the concept of it so much, and there is so much to do with it as a PC. But it only had an LA in Dragon #293, and even then LA+6 is just above what I would ever consider playable.

On the flip side, it spares you the pain of watching things drop awesome loot your centipede can never use, I suppose?


But I don't like anthropomorphic animals. Either they're completely useless, or they're anthrobat (yay, even more druid favoritism!) or anthrowhale (this one's okay I guess if not a little bit overpowered, I just don't like how much Furaffinity I get on my screen when I try to look it up), with no rhyme or reason. Kinda like the game in general I guess....

I like the Eagle and the Hawk too (obviously) and once had a very fun time building and PLAYING a Crocodile Beguiler/Duskblade/Savant/I Don't Even Know What Else gestalt. Constrictors also makie fun discount Yuan-Ti lookalikes, and I'll never find how bad Huge Viper is not funny.


Yeah, it was in my negative LA thread. You'll find it at page 16.

Hah! I rarely find my dubious claims so easily confirmed!

[PoeticallyPsyco]

Savage Species gets a lot of flak (most of it even deserved), but Insectile Creature is awesome, even if it should be Arachnoid Creature in most cases (since most base creatures will have 2 legs in addition to their now 6 arms). Anthropomorphic Animals already got mentioned, but specifically there are a few that let you play a high-Dex large character, which is very hard to find otherwise, and Wolverine and Badger give you Rage (albeit a highly restrictive one).

I also get a little salty every time I remember how badly Half-Ogre got nerfed between Savage Species and Races of Destiny. Yes, it was too good at +1 LA. No, doubling the LA without any compensation was not the correct fix to that.

Oh, and Symbiotic Creature is utterly broken using the LA as RAW. Still an awesome template that lets you do character concepts that simply aren't possible otherwise (not without completely refluffing something, at least). The CR calculation is also downright reasonable compared to the LA, making it possible to use it without cheese for Villainous Competition, which I appreciate greatly.

[Gnaeus]

Marrulurk (sandstorm) ECL 4. Pretty comparable to a straight rogue, probably not above T4, but gets a lot of cool stuff and you get to be sneaky Anubis. It does have a touch of distinction of being playable (if rogues are playable) non full casting and over ECL3

[Tzardok]

I once played in a one shot an anthropomorphic condor crussader. He was a deus vult-ure.

[Metastachydium]

I once played in a one shot an anthropomorphic condor crussader. He was a deus vult-ure.

If this wouldn't involve a BIRDY and Latin, I'd be screaming now.

[Doctor Despair]

Dragonborn (LA0) Telthor (LA2) on any applicable race. Free incorporeality!

[Leon]

Feral Gargun, never got the chance to play one tho and the Winged Template was good aswell ~ that I did play with a few times in a variety of ways. Used the Feral template a lot, mostly on Orcs.