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Yora
2023-12-28, 03:30 PM
*quitely slips back in after 10 years as if nothing happened*

Preparing some stat blocks for dragons, I noticed that the Deep Dragon in Drow of the Underdark has the Change Shape ability to assume a humanoid form, while the metallic dragons from the Monster Manual use Alternate Form.

Taking the first real look at the two abilities in probably ever, I am now wondering why they even are two separate abilities that are mostly doing exactly the same thing.

The only clear difference I can see is that Alternate Form gives you the Str, Dex, and Con scores of your new form, while Change Shape lets you keep yours. Is that really the whole difference?

The only other difference in the description that I am able to see are these parts:

Alternate Form:
—The creature retains the special qualities of its original form. It does not gain any special qualities of its new form.
—The creature retains the spell-like abilities and supernatural attacks of its old form (except for breath weapons and gaze attacks). It does not gain the spell-like abilities or supernatural attacks of its new form.

Change Shape:
—The creature retains all other special attacks and qualities of its original form, except for breath weapons and gaze attacks.

Since both ability descriptions tell you what stats change, can't we shorten these three points to just this?

—The creature loses any breath weapons and gaze attacks

So am I right? Are the Str, Dex, and Con scores really the only difference between the two abilities?

Duke of Urrel
2023-12-30, 06:16 PM
*quitely slips back in after 10 years as if nothing happened*

Preparing some stat blocks for dragons, I noticed that the Deep Dragon in Drow of the Underdark has the Change Shape ability to assume a humanoid form, while the metallic dragons from the Monster Manual use Alternate Form.

Taking the first real look at the two abilities in probably ever, I am now wondering why they even are two separate abilities that are mostly doing exactly the same thing.

The only clear difference I can see is that Alternate Form gives you the Str, Dex, and Con scores of your new form, while Change Shape lets you keep yours. Is that really the whole difference?

The only other difference in the description that I am able to see are these parts:

Alternate Form:
—The creature retains the special qualities of its original form. It does not gain any special qualities of its new form.
—The creature retains the spell-like abilities and supernatural attacks of its old form (except for breath weapons and gaze attacks). It does not gain the spell-like abilities or supernatural attacks of its new form.

Change Shape:
—The creature retains all other special attacks and qualities of its original form, except for breath weapons and gaze attacks.

Since both ability descriptions tell you what stats change, can't we shorten these three points to just this?

—The creature loses any breath weapons and gaze attacks

So am I right? Are the Str, Dex, and Con scores really the only difference between the two abilities?


There are, by my count, four differences between the Alternate Form ability and the Change Shape ability. One difference is the one that you mentioned: that the Alternate Form ability changes your physical ability scores, whereas the Change Shape ability does not.

The other three differences are these.


The Alternate Form ability has this sentence: "If the new form has the Aquatic subtype, the creature gains that subtype as well." (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#alternateForm) The Change Shape ability does not.


The Alternate Form ability replaces the natural armor of your primary form with the natural armor of your target form (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#alternateForm). The Change Shape ability does not allow you to gain the natural armor of your target form. (Presumably, it allows you to keep the natural armor of your primary form.)


The Change Shape ability allows you to gain all the extraordinary abilities of your target form, including extraordinary special qualities as well as extraordinary special attacks. In contrast, the Alternate Form ability allows you to gain only the extraordinary attacks of your target form.


The final difference that I have mentioned here does not appear in the description of the Change Shape ability in the SRD (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#changeShape), but it does appear on page 306 of the MONSTER MANUAL v. 3.5. The text on this page is as follows.


The creature gains the natural weapons, movement modes, and extraordinary abilities and attacks of its assumed form.

I have added the boldface text for emphasis.