Hexblade progression assistance

[Tiptup357]

I am in a campaign that is running to level 13. My character is a Yuan Ti , my rolled stats with racial bonuses are 8-14-14-14-14-18 and I started lvl 1 as a draconic sorc (for RP and extra cantrips/spells) but now am going Hexblade from 2 - 13. My current spread is:

lvl1 : draconic sorc

*cantrips: message, green flame blade, mind sliver, minor illusion

*1st: absorb elements, shield

lvl2 : hexblade

*cantrips: mage hand, eldritch blast


*1st: hex, amor of agathys( or wrathful smite)

I’d love to end up using a great sword too, so I think taking GWM is a necessity.
My question is, what recommendations for feats, when to take ASIs, later spells , etc would you recommend ?

[RogueJK]

Keep in mind that, in order to use a 2H weapon with CHA, it has to be your Pact Weapon via Blade Pact. So you'll need to stick to 1H weapons until Hexblade 3.

So with your stated plan to end up as Draconic Sorcerer 1/Hexblade 12, I'd go Blade Pact at Hexblade 3 to start using a Greatsword, then Great Weapon Master at 4, then Thirsting Blade Invocation at Hexblade 5 for Extra Attack. (Use Green Flame Blade at Sorcerer 1/Warlock 4, to boost your single attack until Extra Attack comes online.) Then I'd probably go with two CHA half-feats at 8 and 12, like Fey Touched and Telekinetic, to end up with 20 CHA by Level 13. Or perhaps +2 CHA and Lucky.

Starting at Hexblade 3, you can leverage the Darkness+Devil's Sight combination for most of the PC's career, to generate Advantage to offset GWM's -5 attack penalty. (You'll just eventually start running into some enemies with things like True Sight/Tremorsense/Blindsight/etc. that will render that tactic less effective.)

Don't bother with Wrathful Smite, as its damage doesn't scale with your Pact slots, and it requires Concentration. Taking the Eldritch Smite invocation at Warlock 5 is a better option if you want to be able to turn spell slots into added melee damage.

[Theodoxus]

To piggyback on RogueJK's point, I'd go longsword for Warlock levels 1 and 2, using the versatile property to 'act' like a greatsword. Then just conjure a greatsword with your Pact and never look back (unless you find a magical greatsword - THEN never look back ;)

[Tiptup357]

Then I'd probably go with two CHA half-feats at 8 and 12, like Fey Touched and Telekinetic, to end up with 20 CHA by Level 13. Or perhaps +2 CHA and Lucky.

Ah so getting to 20 CHA asap isn’t top priority?



Starting at Hexblade 3, you can leverage the Darkness+Devil's Sight combination for most of the PC's career, to generate Advantage to offset GWM's -5 attack penalty.

I was actually looking to avoid this combo to not make problems for my party members, does that mean I should forgo GWM ? I am looking to use shadow of moil though

[Hairfish]

The "Darknessing your party members" problem goes away (and keeps enemies from doing it) if anyone in the party can cast Continual Flame with a 3rd-level spell slot. Cast it on some items they can tweak as a free action, like cloak pins.

Might also consider going up to level 4 as sorc after level 5 as warlock. ASI/feat, sorc points (with warlock slots-to-points conversions immediately prior to short rests), and metamagic.

And if you're going the GWM route, think about swapping the sword for a polearm and PAM. Small per-hit damage loss in exchange for getting a reliable source of reaction attacks.

[Unoriginal]

I’d love to end up using a great sword too, so I think taking GWM is a necessity.

GWM is far, far from a necessity. Especially with your build.



My question is, what recommendations for feats, when to take ASIs, later spells , etc would you recommend ?

I would recommand you max you CHA with your first available ASI.

I agree that Pact of the Blade will likely be your best option. I would take the invocation to have an extra attack and the Eldritch Smite invocation.

You don't want any Sorcerer levels past the first, right?

[Tiptup357]

GWM is far, far from a necessity. Especially with your build.

I would recommand you max you CHA with your first available ASI.

I agree that Pact of the Blade will likely be your best option. I would take the invocation to have an extra attack and the Eldritch Smite invocation.

Duly noted for all 3 points, thank you!


You don't want any Sorcerer levels past the first, right?

Correct, I was even on the fence taking 1 level but I’m leaning on it as a crutch for more cantrips/spell slots and the con save

[solidork]

I personally think Eldritch Smite is bad and you're better off actually casting something with your limited slots almost every time.

[RogueJK]

Ah so getting to 20 CHA asap isn’t top priority?


The typical PC doesn't have a 20 in their primary stat until about Level 12 anyway. Nearly all will start with a 16-17, and bump it to 18 by Level 4 or 8, and 20 by 8 or 12.

So by starting with an 18 CHA, you're already well ahead of the stat curve. You don't necessarily need to beeline for 20 CHA at Level 4 or 8.



I was actually looking to avoid this combo to not make problems for my party members, does that mean I should forgo GWM ? I am looking to use shadow of moil though

In my experience, Darkness is less problematic in play than on paper, especially if your party likes to work together tactically. You won't be using it 100% of the time, such as when fighting a lone enemy or fighting in really close quarters, but it's still useful a good chunk of the time. And since you can cast it on an item you're wearing (like a pendant), allowing the ball of Darkness to move with you while also letting you cover/uncover it to turn it off/on, you have some control over its effects so you can limit the interference.

Shadow of Moil has the same potential party interference with its 10' radius darkness, but without the ability to turn it on/off.

GWM is likely still worth it even without that frequent Advantage from cheesing Darkness+Devil's Sight. You'll just have to work with your team to find other ways to generate Advantage and/or to have other buffs available to counteract the attack penalty (like having your Cleric/Paladin cast Bless). And even when you can't afford the attack penalty, the added Bonus Action attacks are still available.

But GWM is by no means required. As noted above, PAM with a Polearm is potentially a solid alternative to GWM at 4. Inspiring Leader is another great option to take in lieu of GWM at 4, and would still allow you to use a Greatsword. Or you could use a Maul (same 2d6 damage as a Greatsword) and take the Crusher feat for 15 CON at 4, then take a +1 CON half feat like Skill Expert for 16 CON at 8 and +2 CHA for 20 CHA at 12. (Or vice versa.)


you're better off actually casting something with your limited slots almost every time.

Normally, I'd agree. But Eldritch Smite is better than taking some of the "Smite" spells like the OP was considering, if you want to be able to convert spell slots into damage. It's not something you're going to be using every fight, but having it on hand for use on Critical Hits is a solid strategy, letting you get the most bang for the buck from the spell slot.

It's also situationally useful for its no-save Prone effect, allowing you to knock flying creatures out of the sky (and avoid Legendary Resistances).

But as to whether it's worth spending an Invocation for the ability to occasionally add some big crit damage and Prone someone, that's up to you.

[Tiptup357]

Alright wow you’ve given me a lot to think about, thank you! That’s at least narrowed down the feats to consider , but already a lot of cool ones

One thing I’m more confident in is probably holding off eldritch smite until I have 3 evocations , and then test it out for a level. I’m not particularly attached to smiting

[RogueJK]

You can't take Eldritch Smite until Hexblade 5 anyway, at which point you'll have your 3rd invocation. But Thirsting Blade definitely takes priority at Warlock 5, unless you want to swap out one of your two earlier Invocations and take both Thirsting and Smite at Warlock 5.

Personally, I'd likely go with:

Devil's Sight and something else utilitarian like Mask of Many Faces/Eldritch Sight/Beguiling Influence/etc. at Hexblade 2.

Then Thirsting Blade at 5.

Then maybe Eldritch Smite at 7, though there are other potentially good options here too, including Trickster's Escape, Maddening Hex, Relentless Hex, Repelling Blast, etc.

Then one of the above additional options from 2 or 7 at 9.

And finally Lifedrinker at 12.


But Thirsting Blade and Lifedrinker are the only must-haves here.

[Tiptup357]

Personally, I'd likely go with:

………….

But Thirsting Blade and Lifedrinker are the only must-haves here.

I’m definitely going to be following the path laid out here, thank you! And the feat advice has been just as helpful , really appreciate it

[Tiptup357]

But GWM is by no means required. As noted above, PAM with a Polearm is potentially a solid alternative to GWM at 4. Inspiring Leader is another great option to take in lieu of GWM at 4, and would still allow you to use a Greatsword. Or you could use a Maul (same 2d6 damage as a Greatsword) and take the Crusher feat for 15 CON at 4, then take a +1 CON half feat like Skill Expert for 16 CON at 8 and +2 CHA for 20 CHA at 12. (Or vice versa.)

Looking at the warlock exceptions Eldritch Adept gives as a feat, what are your thoughts on taking that one?

[RogueJK]

I don't think it's worth an entire ASI/feat just for your Warlock to have one more invocation, when you'll already have 2 by Character Level 3, 3 by Level 6, 4 by Level 8, 5 by Level 11, and 6 by Level 12.

You'll get a lot more bang for your buck out of another feat or an ASI.

Eldritch Adept is best used for certain non-Warlocks. An Illusionist Wizard taking it to grab Misty Visions' at-will Silent Image is the obvious one. Or an Abjuration Wizard who wants at-will Mage Armor from Armor of Shadows to freely refill their Arcane Ward. Or an Infiltration/Intrigue-focused Bard taking Mask of Many Faces for at-will instant disguises.

[Tiptup357]

I don't think it's worth an entire ASI/feat just for your Warlock to have one more invocation, when you'll already have 2 by Character Level 3, 3 by Level 6, 4 by Level 8, 5 by Level 11, and 6 by Level 12.

You'll get a lot more bang for your buck out of another feat or an ASI.

Eldritch Adept is best used for certain non-Warlocks. An Illusionist Wizard taking it to grab Misty Visions' at-will Silent Image is the obvious one. Or an Abjuration Wizard who wants at-will Mage Armor from Armor of Shadows to freely refill their Arcane Ward. Or an Infiltration/Intrigue-focused Bard taking Mask of Many Faces for at-will instant disguises.

okay thank you! saved me from dropping the ball, i gotta think harder/bigger picture on these. maybe I even need to consider other feats i dismissed before

[Tiptup357]

DM has given the green light for the UA invocation Curse Bringer, go with it or just skip?

[RogueJK]

I'm not familiar with that, but based on a quick reading, seems like it could be a decent Invocation pick.

It's basically Eldritch Smite - though limited to only using a Greatsword - plus adds the ability to switch your Hexblade's Curse to more than one target per use but only if you're the one that downs the target to 0 HP. As discussed above with Eldritch Smite, you'd be best served using it primarily for the latter ability, and then reserving the added quasi-smite damage primarily for Crits, or for when you desperately need to keep an enemy from moving.

It might be a good pick at Hexblade 7 or 9, or you could trade out one of your two Level 2 Invocations for it at Level 3+ if you really want it earlier.

[Tiptup357]

I'm not familiar with that, but based on a quick reading, seems like it could be a decent Invocation pick.

Okay cool thanks for all this advice, you have been insanely helpful to me and I really appreciate it