2024 Rulebooks slated for SRD 5.2 and Creative Commons

[Oramac]

DDB Twitter Link: https://x.com/DnDBeyond/status/1787528251520307409

Article link: https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/1717-2024-core-rulebooks-to-expand-the-srd?utm_campaign=DDB&utm_source=TWITTER&utm_medium=social&utm_content=13358104522

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Gotta say, I'm surprised by this, but also happy for it. I did not expect this. It's a very good move for WOTC though, IMO.

[Theodoxus]

LOL - they won't release the SRD until all the books are out, so you know how the new monsters have been updated... but, we have to play the game from September through February without the updated monsters...

It's like, hopefully they're not so massively different that the 2014 Monsters are cakewalk, or insta-death (given the updates we have been privy to, I suspect the former over the latter), and yet, if they're not so different, why the new book and super secrecy?

I guess I'll just spend 5 months staring at the new hotness waiting for the new monsters... weird philosophy on 'fun' WotC has.

[Psyren]

I'm not sure why it's surprising - Kyle Brink promised he would do exactly this during his YouTube apology tour last year. (Well, either this or a "bridge" document/update guide, but I'm glad they just went with a full-on new SRD anyway.) And of course, the current one is also under CC now so they couldn't delete/overwrite it even if they wanted to.

The part that did slightly irk me is that we won't get it until after the new MM in 2025. I was hopeful that the MM's delay was largely down to the sheer amount of art/typesetting a bestiary needs and that we would have at least a bunch of naked statblocks to throw at our shiny new PCs, but clearly they have a bunch of redesign work left to do on the monsters themselves. This likely means that we won't see the new Basic anytime soon either, possibly not until even after the new SRD itself.


LOL - they won't release the SRD until all the books are out, so you know how the new monsters have been updated... but, we have to play the game from September through February without the updated monsters...

It's like, hopefully they're not so massively different that the 2014 Monsters are cakewalk, or insta-death (given the updates we have been privy to, I suspect the former over the latter), and yet, if they're not so different, why the new book and super secrecy?

I guess I'll just spend 5 months staring at the new hotness waiting for the new monsters... weird philosophy on 'fun' WotC has.

I mean, there's always MPMM and Bigby's etc for new monster design while we wait for core. And they promised some monsters in the PHB as well, for Moon Druid if nothing else.

[Theodoxus]

I mean, there's always MPMM and Bigby's etc for new monster design while we wait for core. And they promised some monsters in the PHB as well, for Moon Druid if nothing else.

Bodegas and Beasts for 5 months, woot!

[Psyren]

Eh, I'm not seeing what's so bad about using the older monsters for a while anyway. Half of y'all have been complaining about the newer statblocks for months, if anything you should be relishing the last hurrah of the old ones being extended :smalltongue:

[Unoriginal]

and yet, if they're not so different, why the new book and super secrecy?

Because they've put themselves in a situation where:

1) they won't sell a lot to their customers unless the books are different enough to justify spending $60+ on each new book.

2) they presented this rule change as "don't worry, it won't be too different and the core books you already paid for won't be obsolete" so as to not upset the customers who already bought the old core books.

Meaning they will do what they can to keep the rather transparent illusion that 2) isn't a lie.

[Zevox]

Cool, that makes things easy on me. Now I can poach whatever few good ideas the final product has that the playtest didn't without needing to buy the new books.

[Psyren]

Cool, that makes things easy on me. Now I can poach whatever few good ideas the final product has that the playtest didn't without needing to buy the new books.

And that approach is totally fine - again, there's nothing new or revelatory about this announcement save perhaps the timeline. They promised 100% free 2024 rules updates via SRD over a year ago. (The SRD won't contain every subclass, spell, feat, and item of course.)


Because they've put themselves in a situation where:

1) they won't sell a lot to their customers unless the books are different enough to justify spending $60+ on each new book.

2) they presented this rule change as "don't worry, it won't be too different and the core books you already paid for won't be obsolete" so as to not upset the customers who already bought the old core books.

Meaning they will do what they can to keep the rather transparent illusion that 2) isn't a lie.

#2 isn't a "lie," something can be not that different mechanically AND worth the price of a new book - due to reasons like convenience, access, art/aesthetics, a simple desire to support the team etc.

[Oramac]

The part that did slightly irk me is that we won't get it until after the new MM in 2025.

snip

The cynic in me wants to say the delay is not typesetting or art, but the fact that if the SRD5.2 releases with the 5.5 PHB, then all the 3PP's can immediately start using it to write their own stuff. Delaying the SRD means WOTC effectively has a pseudo-monopoly on 5.5e for at least the first several months.

Which, for the record, I'm ok with. It is their product, after all.

[KorvinStarmast]

Which, for the record, I'm ok with. It is their product, after all. Works for me. Folks complaining that they don't get free stuff until five months later strikes me as a little odd.

[Theodoxus]

Works for me. Folks complaining that they don't get free stuff until five months later strikes me as a little odd.

I don't know if that was directed at me or not - but my complaint isn't free stuff or not, it's the ridiculous notion that either the 2014 et al monsters are good enough to use 2024 classes with - so why should I buy the 2025 MM when it comes out - OR they're not good enough, so I have to wait 5 months before I play 'the game as it's meant to be' which more than likely, means not buying the books until all three are available. And if enough of us do that, WotC will be under the impression (and if not WotC, certainly all the fiscal hawks that come out of woodwork) that slumping books sales obviously means the product is poop. Will 5 months be short enough for them to ride the inevitable boom of sales? Maybe. If they don't (somehow) manage to listen to the nayhawks.

Either way, for me, the 2024 50 year celebration won't start until 2025. YMMV.

[Psyren]

Actually, looking into it I was wrong - Basic was released well before the SRD 10 years ago. That makes me feel a lot better!


it's the ridiculous notion that either the 2014 et al monsters are good enough to use 2024 classes with - so why should I buy the 2025 MM when it comes out -

This is such weird logic to me. "This burger is decent and pretty filling, why would I ever think about buying a steak months from now?"



OR they're not good enough, so I have to wait 5 months before I play 'the game as it's meant to be' which more than likely, means not buying the books until all three are available.

If by "as it's meant to be" you mean "with modern monsters" - there are, again, plenty of books that contain those. MM being last was definitely the right decision, and it's the same decision they made at 5e's launch.

[KorvinStarmast]

I don't know if that was directed at me or not - but my complaint isn't free stuff or not, it's the ridiculous notion that either the 2014 et al monsters are good enough to use 2024 classes with - so why should I buy the 2025 MM when it comes out - OR they're not good enough, so I have to wait 5 months before I play 'the game as it's meant to be' which more than likely, means not buying the books until all three are available. Then why is the SRD in the conversation? It's a liposuctioned version of the three Core rule books.


And if enough of us do that, WotC will be under the impression (and if not WotC, certainly all the fiscal hawks that come out of woodwork) that slumping books sales obviously means the product is poop. Will 5 months be short enough for them to ride the inevitable boom of sales? Maybe. If they don't (somehow) manage to listen to the nayhawks. I cannot answer for a wide variety of dumbdonkey decisions WotC has made.

Either way, for me, the 2024 50 year celebration won't start until 2025. YMMV. For me it is an example of how WotC has been mailing it in since before Tasha's. They could have started the "UA alleged playtest" sooner, and they could have scheduled the book releases to ensure that by the end of 2024 all three were released, as they did in 2014.

But they boned it.
(Yes, Roy will nag me for using boned as a verb).

[Snowbluff]

Eh, I'm not seeing what's so bad about using the older monsters for a while anyway.

And you're absolutely right. I've seen plenty of baseless complaints about backwards compatibility for 5.5 for months now. Nothing about the older monsters really keeps you from running them against the new material. The bounded accuracy is the same as far as I can tell. Baselines characters are a little stronger, but at the same time the damage output ceiling is probably a little lower.

[Psyren]

For me it is an example of how WotC has been mailing it in since before Tasha's. They could have started the "UA alleged playtest" sooner, and they could have scheduled the book releases to ensure that by the end of 2024 all three were released, as they did in 2014.

In fairness, they had more time to plan 5e, because 4e was already hated anyway. It's not like people were clamoring for more of that while their heads were down working on the next thing.

Also... for all intents and purposes Tasha's WAS the start of the 5.5e playtest.


And you're absolutely right. I've seen plenty of baseless complaints about backwards compatibility for 5.5 for months now. Nothing about the older monsters really keeps you from running them against the new material. The bounded accuracy is the same as far as I can tell. Baselines characters are a little stronger, but at the same time the damage output ceiling is probably a little lower.

Exactly - and I doubt the new lower-level monsters will be powered up anyway. If challenging the players is really an issue after these QOL improvements, throw in an extra goblin/zombie/etc, or two, or three.

[Devils_Advocate]

This is such weird logic to me. "This burger is decent and pretty filling, why would I ever think about buying a steak months from now?"
I remember once seeing D&D described as being like a burger that you can eat as often as you want, forever; in stark contrast to an ordinary burger which can only be eaten once. Obviously that's amazingly fantastic, but just as obviously it's going to pretty severely limit the number of return customers. It's difficult to monetize for precisely the reason that it's such a good deal. The good news is that, even if the corporate overlords pull the plug as a result, it won't destroy books already printed. The Enteral Burgers cannot be unmade!

[Theodoxus]

The good news is that, even if the corporate overlords pull the plug as a result, it won't destroy books already printed. The Enteral Burgers cannot be unmade!

Hmm... spend $200 on 3 physical books that can't be unmade by corporate overlords, but have all the drawbacks of not being electronic; or spend $200 on 3 virtual books that can be unmade by corporate overlords, but are electronic with plug n play capability directly ported into said COs for-profit game engine and VTT...

Decisions decisions...

[Devils_Advocate]

Ah, right. To go with traditional durability, or to succumb to the high-tech allure of the new virtual reality cyberburger, that is the question.

One factor to consider is that, should some landlubbin' company cease to provide access to the digital goods ye have purchased, thar likely be alternate means to acquire that booty, yar.

Anyway, of course if you have been eating the same burger for years, there's an obvious reason buy a steak: You want to try something new! It's just that actual food isn't reusable like that, and that feels like the bigger reason to buy more food. So... kind of a flawed analogy. :P