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slexlollar89
2007-12-24, 05:12 PM
I recently saw the healer class from the Miniatures Handbook, and I liked it a lot. Having said this I have a few questions.

Does anyone know where else the class is (besides Miniatures)?
Has anyone ever played one/enjoyed it, ad is it considered weak or powerful?
Do the exalted feats (specifically various vows and definately nonlethal substitution) work well with the class or violate the healer's vow?

Thanks in advance for the comments... my next character could be a selfless wandering healer if these things work... with the ocasional nonlethal lightning bolt... he he.

bugsysservant
2007-12-24, 05:27 PM
1. I'm pretty sure it doesn't appear anywhere else, though I could be wrong.
2. Its considered very weak. Generally you can make an easy build for healing with RSoP based off cleric which is substantially better than a healer. The only time I've ever seen a healer in play for any duration (besides non-serious one shots) would be for NPCs.
3. I can't think that it would, though again, I'm not all that familiar with this class.

Really, if you want to play a healer, this class is not the way to do it. Take cleric and go into the Radiant Servant of Pelor (RSoP, Complete Divine).

Edited for stupid typos.

Chronicled
2007-12-24, 05:33 PM
RSoP is actually Radiant Servant of Pelor. It's a top-notch healing class that doesn't suck.

The Healer does suck. I believe that it's only in the Minatures Handbook.

The Exalted feats would probably work fine with it.

Tengu
2007-12-24, 05:37 PM
I'm not very familiar with this class, so I'm going to ask...

Does it suck because it can't do anything apart from healing, or does it suck because even at its chosen field, healing, it's crappy?

JackMage666
2007-12-24, 05:47 PM
Clerics are better for healers, as they can wear armor and get a better selection of spells. The only one up the Healer gets is Cha bonus to healing spells... Yeah, it's considered very weak.

But, it's full of taste flavor, and makes wonderful NPCs (I've used them as DMPCs for a small group who lacked a healer. Worked wonderfully).

slexlollar89
2007-12-24, 06:17 PM
I really don't want to play a cleric if I can help it, and Pelor doesn't exist... ala no RSoP... alas...

Bsides, the character I wanted to play was going to be an atheist.

I was thinking healer (My DM has decided to expand their spell list with SpComp. and give them advanced learning like a warmage, WHOOHOO!)

Tengu
2007-12-24, 06:28 PM
Clerics are better for healers, as they can wear armor and get a better selection of spells. The only one up the Healer gets is Cha bonus to healing spells... Yeah, it's considered very weak.

But, it's full of taste flavor, and makes wonderful NPCs (I've used them as DMPCs for a small group who lacked a healer. Worked wonderfully).

So they're like clerics stripped from all non-healing ability? I wouldn't call that pathetically weak, some people play and enjoy playing clerics as white mage healbots anyway, and this class would be good for them - it is slightly better at healing, after all, getting that charisma bonus.

Chronicled
2007-12-24, 06:31 PM
Radiant Servant of Pelor would work fine with an aethiest. You will be healing better than a Healer towards the middle/end of it.

You might also find the Cloistered Cleric (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#clericVariantCloistere dCleric) to be an interesting alternative. They, like the Healer, don't do much of the ClericZilla melee thing.

slexlollar89
2007-12-24, 07:08 PM
Yeah... the cloistered cleric deal could work... no god just "worship" healing or protection... but the RSoP requires you worship Pelor to get in...

I'm really looking forsome kind of major healing class that is not supposd to be combative, and has decent skills/abilities (sort of rogue-ish), but I have thusfar not seen anything with the exception of a rogue/healer or warlock/healer.

HA! having reviewd the cliostered cleric, I realize they can take the bardic knack ability rather than their bardic knowledge ability...wonderful...

Trouvere
2007-12-24, 07:25 PM
The thing to notice about the Healer is that right up to 19th level, they get more spells/day than a Cleric. At 20th, they get no extra spells/day! Of course, these spells are drawn from a greatly inferior spell-list. The way to fix that is to multiclass into PrCs that grant spells you do want to cast.

As a thought experiment taking this to an extreme... for the first 5 levels, straight Healer. Then enter Divine Oracle, to get the Oracle domain. With a domain, you now qualify for Sovereign Speaker. Take 4 levels of this, picking up another domain at each level. If one of these is the Good domain, you qualify for Sacred Exorcist at 10th level (you've lost a caster level in SS, sadly). This fits thematically as a fantasy psychiatrist :smallwink: and grants you Turn Undead, opening up the possibility of divine metamagic. Another level of Sovereign Speaker for a 6th domain, but no more than that, as you don't want to lose another caster level. So go into Contemplative for 6 levels for another two, and some appropriate class features - immunity to all poisons and diseases for two (why doesn't the healer get the latter when even a Paladin 3 does?). There's probably now room for another PrC granting yet another domain, or you could take the second level of Divine Oracle, for pseudo-evasion. And just to thumb your nose at the world, take a 6th level of Healer itself at 20th (at least it gives +1 BAB, improves all saves). 8 domains - potentially 72 spells added to your list, plus the domain abilities, of course. The Domain spontaneity feat might add some extra versatility. You have a caster level of 19, and you have nearly the same number of spells as a 20th level cleric - with the bonus domain slot from Sovereign Speaker, you're up one 3rd and one 6th level spell, but down one 9th. You have a few class abilities, which is more than Mr Blank Straight Cleric can say.

Now, maybe this isn't really a Healer anymore, but it does use the Healer's spell progression table, and there's not really anything outrageous about an oracular, exorcizing, contemplative healer devoted to the Sovereign Host.

Chronicled
2007-12-24, 07:29 PM
Yeah... the cloistered cleric deal could work... no god just "worship" healing or protection... but the RSoP requires you worship Pelor to get in...

I'm really looking forsome kind of major healing class that is not supposd to be combative, and has decent skills/abilities (sort of rogue-ish), but I have thusfar not seen anything with the exception of a rogue/healer or warlock/healer.

HA! having reviewd the cliostered cleric, I realize they can take the bardic knack ability rather than their bardic knowledge ability...wonderful...

RSoP had something about how it could work for any "sun god" or healing/light oriented idea. It'd be a shoddy DM who didn't let you get into the class because you weren't praising Pelor.

The Cloistered Cleric has 6+Int skills per level, is not supposed to be combative (low BAB), and can be a top-notch healer with the Healing domain. You also get the Knowledge domain for free, which is quite nice.

Incidentally, if you go this route and don't take RSoP, then you should ask about using the Player's Handbook 2 spontaneous domain cleric variant that allows you to spontaneously cast from a domain instead of a cure spell for that level. The Healing Domain offers better spontaneous heals. AND you could combine it with the Spontaneous Healer feat from Complete Divine for SO MUCH spontaneous healing options.

On a side note, the feat Augment(ed) Healing from Complete Divine sounds like it'd be right up your alley.

slexlollar89
2007-12-24, 08:09 PM
Yeah, my DM isn't shoddy he he, I wish he was so I could get away with more, but the only healing god in this setting is a N god of necromancy life and death... soooo, yeah.

I think you've swayed me Chronicled, and as a side note you avatar is very cool...

Now I can finally make my "Paladin" of Life! With Domains! WOOHOO!!

Trouvere, where are all these PrCs!? that's rather crazy and dificult to explain IC...

Chronicled
2007-12-24, 08:26 PM
Thanks! Ava has more of her great avatars up for grabs in the Avatar Adoption Center (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=26936); if you're looking for one, she's one of the top artists on these boards.

Most (if not all) of the PrCs Trouvere mentioned are in Complete Divine.

Trouvere
2007-12-25, 07:35 AM
Yes, they're in Complete Divine, except for Sovereign Speaker, which is in Faiths of Eberron, so won't be of much use outside that setting. Sovereign Speaker is a crazy PrC (9 levels! Grants a new domain at every level), but I've not seen anyone say it's broken, unlike one other PrC from the same book (the notorious Planar Shepherd).

Yami
2007-12-25, 07:53 AM
I myself have been talked into beleiving that a well built paladin with the spirit of healing variant rather than a mount was the best way to handle a healer. (Healing exact HP amounts makes me happy.)

But casterwise, I think you've already been given some solid advice.

Zweanslord
2007-12-25, 08:37 AM
I play a Healer in a game currently. I have done so earlier in a game as well, a high level Healer with Vow of Poverty. Why? Just because I liked the flavour around it. You really are a Healer. Not a cleric worshipping somebody who has the potential to buff something, to call upon heavenly fury. No, you are a Healer and nothing more, nothing less. While the class is generally considered weak, that should not stop you from playing it if you like playing as a Healer!

Chronicled
2007-12-25, 12:19 PM
I play a Healer in a game currently. I have done so earlier in a game as well, a high level Healer with Vow of Poverty. Why? Just because I liked the flavour around it. You really are a Healer. Not a cleric worshipping somebody who has the potential to buff something, to call upon heavenly fury. No, you are a Healer and nothing more, nothing less. While the class is generally considered weak, that should not stop you from playing it if you like playing as a Healer!

You're right, of course. Rereading my posts, I seem to be pushing the other options rather forcefully, when all I meant for the OP to have a good look at what options he had.

slexlollar89
2007-12-25, 08:18 PM
I didn't see your ideas as being forceful, and I think if I jut use restraint wih my spell selection, a cliostered cleric with bardic knack and a longsword could be a great self proclaimed pally... He's gonna be a smash to play...and the other players are gonna wonder when his lay on hands will run out... heh heh.