ECL 18 build- critique please

[Cuddly]

The idea is to survive as long as possible, so here's (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheets/view.php?id=36068) a character I'm currently making.

It has 72 AC (64 touch), and saves in the 40s (50s vs. spells and sp).

Hp was average for level, stats were rolled.

I think I have pretty good staying power, but lack offensive abilities, or really anything useful to contribute to the party. I'm a monk, essentially.

So, what should I go with to get more attack ability?

Here's the arcane duelist:
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20030224a

And the Gloura:
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20031003e

[Rachel Lorelei]

Get a Cleric level for the Pride domain--it lets you reroll if you roll a natural 1 on a saving throw (but you keep the reroll, even if it's another 1).

Slippers of Battledancing from the DMG-2 will let you use CHA instead of STR for attack and damage if you've moved... 10', I think it was? Combine with the Shadow Blade feat from Swordsage (see below) to get +DEX & CHA to damage and CHA to attack. Your single hits will contribute more than they do now.

Use Swordsage 2 instead of Monk 2 for CHA to AC in light armor (+1 Soulfire mithral shirt, +5 with a friendly Magic Vestment, will give you more AC than your full DEX and protect you from negative levels, death effects, and ability drain). You can get a Ring of Evasion if you really want Evasion.

Alternatively, try gettting rid of the Monk 2 and set your levels to Hexblade 4 (Dark Companion substitution feature)/Paladin of Tyranny variant 3/Cleric 1. You get Turn Undead (which you can use to power Divine Shield if you want to spend the action--not having Monk/Swordsage lets you use a shield), and between Hexblade's Dark Companion and the PoT's aura, you'll be imposing -4 on saving throws and -2 AB/AC to enemies you're in melee with, which your party members can take advantage of.

[SadisticFishing]

Two things: You can't be a Hexblade/Paladin, and Paladin's Divine Grace never stacks with any other charisma bonus to saves. Get the Blackguard's instead.

[tyckspoon]

Two things: You can't be a Hexblade/Paladin, and Paladin's Divine Grace never stacks with any other charisma bonus to saves. Get the Blackguard's instead.

Ok, I get the alignment problems with being an LE paladin- I assume there's either an unmentioned variant or some houseruling going on there already- but where do you get this thing about Divine Grace not stacking with anything else?

[AmberVael]

Two things: You can't be a Hexblade/Paladin, and Paladin's Divine Grace never stacks with any other charisma bonus to saves. Get the Blackguard's instead.

1) An alignment variant paladin is clearly being used, due to his listed class features. The Lawful Evil paladin, AKA paladin of Tyranny, can be found here. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#paladinofTyrannyClassF eatures)

2)
Divine Grace (Su)

At 2nd level, a paladin gains a bonus equal to her Charisma bonus (if any) on all saving throws.
No modifier type is specified, as such, it stacks. Note that it does not say your Charisma bonus is added, but a number equal to your Charisma bonus.

[Armads]

Evil Blessing in Exemplars of Evil lets you add Cha to saves. It doubles it if you deal 1 hit point damage to yourself, though.

[Nebo_]

Two levels of swordsage would give you Wis to AC - RAW, it doesn't work with Ascetic Mage, but you might be able to convince your DM that it works the same as monk AC. Swordsage levels can also get you a shadow hand stance, which you can use to qualify for Shadow Blade to get Dex to damage. Weapon finesse would really help, too.

[Rachel Lorelei]

Two levels of swordsage would give you Wis to AC - RAW, it doesn't work with Ascetic Mage, but you might be able to convince your DM that it works the same as monk AC. Swordsage levels can also get you a shadow hand stance, which you can use to qualify for Shadow Blade to get Dex to damage. Weapon finesse would really help, too.

Swordsage does work with Ascetic Mage, which simply requires a WIS bonus to AC. You need Imp. Unarmed Strike, but the Unarmed Swordsage variant provides that.

[SadisticFishing]

I have no idea where I read that, upon double checking, it turns out I was wrong. Sorry :P Might have been an odd house rule I read somewhere, which makes sense, kind of.

I knew about Paladin of Tyranny, but I figured that was worth mentioning Black Guard, which is way cooler imho. Better spell progression and all that (Rhino's Rush makes you capable of doing a lot of damage).

[Rachel Lorelei]

I have no idea where I read that, upon double checking, it turns out I was wrong. Sorry :P Might have been an odd house rule I read somewhere, which makes sense, kind of.

I knew about Paladin of Tyranny, but I figured that was worth mentioning Black Guard, which is way cooler imho. Better spell progression and all that (Rhino's Rush makes you capable of doing a lot of damage).

He's taking two to three levels, so spell progression doesn't really matter, and taking Blackguard would require wasting feats on prerequisites.

[Person_Man]

Gloura7/Monk2/Hex3/Pal2/ArcDuel2/LA2

I'm not a fan of the Gloura (http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20031003e). The racial hit dice are just way too high.

Instead of Monk, you can just buy a Monk's belt.

Instead of Paladin of Slaughter/Tyranny, you can use Blackguard. Same effect, but its core. Some DMs care about that.

Arcane Duelist (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20030224a) is 3.0 material. Some DMs care about that.

If you need offensive power, take one more level of Arcane Duelist. Dexterous Attack + two handed Power Attack is a very broken combo. Frightful Presence (Draconomicon, Races of the Dragon) would help. There are also a ton of divine/domain feats in the various books that are fueled by Turn/Rebuke Undead. Divine Might (http://www.systemreferencedocuments.org/35/sovelior_sage/divineFeats.html) comes to mind, and I'm sure there are half a dozen good options in Complete Champion as well.

[Cuddly]

I dunno, the a Gloura is essentially a bard that gives +10 dex and +6 cha, along with 10 DR. The only real problem is the 1/2 BAB. I don't want to use Blackguard because of the sunder & cleave prereqs- two feats I'm fairly certain I will never get to use.

[Ne0]

How did you get a +31 Deflection vonus to AC? Deflection bonuses don't stack, so I'm a little confused...

Also, as others have noted, you might want to exchange the monk levels for something more...offensive. I'm a defender of the monk class, but 2 levels isn't worth the dip.

[Fenix_of_Doom]

I'm curious why everyone is talking about wis to AC when this character has a wis of 10 giving him +0 to AC:smallconfused: .

[Armads]

I'm curious why everyone is talking about wis to AC when this character has a wis of 10 giving him +0 to AC:smallconfused: .

There's a feat that lets monks use Cha to AC instead of Wis to AC.

[Natural20]

So how does it win?

[Yami]

By surviving. Perhaps his DM has set up an arena battle in which the party is bambarded by all sorts of viciousness and they win if they manage to go 40 rounds or so.

[Bag_of_Holding]

I'm not sure but I don't think the character can do anything else other than 'surviving'. So, optimised in terms of defensive traits, but hardly playable due to the serious lack of combat capability. Well, have fun playing the untouchable character :smallwink:

[Cuddly]

How did you get a +31 Deflection vonus to AC? Deflection bonuses don't stack, so I'm a little confused...

Also, as others have noted, you might want to exchange the monk levels for something more...offensive. I'm a defender of the monk class, but 2 levels isn't worth the dip.

I only have a +5 deflection bonus (ring). However, monk gives me 13 AC that applies against everything all the time, except when immobilized. That's essentially deflection bonus. Gloura gives an unnamed bonus that functions as deflection. Arcane duelist gives a bonus that functions as dex (flat footed denies 13 to my AC). The reason I stuck it 26 of it in deflection and 13 in misc? Misc AC doesn't count towards my flat footed AC on that sheet, while deflection does.


I'm not sure but I don't think the character can do anything else other than 'surviving'. So, optimised in terms of defensive traits, but hardly playable due to the serious lack of combat capability. Well, have fun playing the untouchable character :smallwink:

I know. Thus this post. I'm honestly thinking of trying to draw aggro by flying around with my junk out, urinating on things.