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Fixer
2007-12-31, 07:35 AM
The guy who is planning a campaign has asked us if we would mind that we have our D&D characters get swooshed over into a Star Wars d20 campaign. Afte some grumbling from a few players, it was agreed we would go ahead and try it out.

The role-playing aspects aside, mechanically we have some questions as to how things will work and are wondering what he board has to say:
Lightsabers vs. Adamantium. I believe lightsabers ignore hardness/damage resistance of objects but does the same apply to enchanted objects? Can an adamantine longsword block a lightsaber?
Magic, and how does it work in a place where Force users have to spend vitality to use their powers?
Psionics = Force?

Hunter Noventa
2007-12-31, 08:30 AM
Well, the Knights of the Old Republic video game did introduce a material that was immune to lightsabers, so one could say adamantium is just the D+D world name for that.

As for magic and psionics, they're all very different animals, and can't really be equated with one another.

Fixer
2007-12-31, 08:34 AM
Well, the GM deems me his rules monkey (as the guy who knows the majority of the rules and can often be called upon to make impartial judgements) and asked me to try to find out how to do what he wants to do. These three questions came up and I was wondering if any Star Wars d20 GMs out there could provide some insight on how to let this happen.

See, I don't know the Star Wars d20 rules yet. I have to get the books and read them through and see how this might happen. Luckily I have a few months.

nerulean
2007-12-31, 08:39 AM
If you guys are used to using D&D, then I'd consider moving the SW stuff over to D&D rules. Use the rules for psionics for the force, for example, as you semi-suggested. If nothing else, this will keep your jedi roughly balanced with your wizards.

One thing you will need to decide on is which set of combat rules you're using. Whatever you do, don't use one set for some people and one set for everyone else. The sections you're looking at are mostly to do with armour and hitpoints. The class defence system in UA is, I think, balanced off the SW d20 rules, so you can probably introduce that, but I'd seriously consider getting rid of the WP/VP distinction. Provided you take a cleric with you, you'll be doing healing the D&D way, so it makes sense to do damage the D&D way, even if hitpoints are one of the worst abstractions in the system. Decide how you're going to do critical hits, too. The two ways really don't synch up too well, so you might want to house rule in some kind of injury system, where critical hits leave you with penalties that have to be removed separately to healing hitpoints.

A.Sondergaard
2007-12-31, 08:45 AM
By "swooshed into Star Wars," do you just mean porting the characters as is into whichever system, or are you supposed to convert them to what's most appropriate?

To answer some of yours questions...
1. Adamantine, by default, isn't necessarily treated as magical unless it has an a magical enhancement bonus. Off hand, I don't remember in either of the SWd20 games if Lightsabers ignored both DR and Hardness, or just DR. It'd be something I'd have to look up, though I only have the Saga book. It's been since April that I played Revised. If you want a material that counters lightsabers, you want cortosis, something Star Wars already has. Shuts down lightsabers it comes into contact with

2. It really shouldn't...a 10th level wizard is going to clean the floor with an equal level Force user focused on Force powers. Same'd go for psionics. The Force powers are strong in the context of SWd20, but don't really match the potency of spells. Sure, a Force User could refresh VP all day, but for an average encounter, spells are going to be a lot more lethal, despite being limited. For example, there aren't really any "save-or-die" Force powers.

Fixer
2007-12-31, 08:45 AM
The one thing that we will be using in the D&D campaign that is FROM the SW campaign is the WP/VP shift. The GM was very serious about that. I need to learn more about the defense point/armor value stuff as my warblade will be having adamantine plate around the time he converts to this new world.

We have no cleric. Ok, we have a Favored Soul but she's less about healing and more about beating the crap out of people she can't out-talk.

So far, the characters I know about:
Dwarven Warblade
Human Favored Soul
Human Sorcerer
Elan Psion

Probably one more but I don't know what he's playing.

nerulean
2007-12-31, 08:50 AM
Jedi are going to start to look fairly feeble fairly quickly, up against that lot.

Fixer
2007-12-31, 09:29 AM
Besturn (Warblade): "So, you are one of those fancy kick-ass Jedi I have heard so much about?"
Obi-Wan: "I am a Jedi, yes."
Besturn: "I ain't from around here but I always try to test my mettle against the best opponents I can find. Would you be willing to spar a bit?"
Obi-Wan: "I would prefer not."
Besturn: "Well, I thought I'd give you a choice first." *quick draw greataxe* *swing* *smack, smack, smack*
Obi-Wan: *crumples to the ground*
Besturn: "I'm not sure what the gods were thinking sending us to this place. Even their mightiest crumple quickly. I wonder if I can cleave one of those big flying chariots they tool around in?"

Altair_the_Vexed
2007-12-31, 09:45 AM
I've played both, and looked at blending them together. The power levels aren't easily comparable.

The most important issues to convert:
Armour & defence: Each SW class gets a defence bonus per level. Armour acts as DR. This means unarmoured SW characters are hit less often than D&D ones. You need to decide which rule to go with: SW armour = AC and no Defence bonus per level, or D&D armour = DR and grant a Defence bonus to each D&D class per level.
Vitality & Wound Points: SW heroic classes get Vitality Points (VP). Everyone else only gets their CON score as a number of Wound Points (WP). Heroes also get WP. This means even the most elite mooks are taken down in a single hit (lose any WP and you are disabled and need to make a Fort save to stay conscious). Critical hits go straight to WP. You need to decide whether to upgrade all the mooks to D&D standards (making Stormtroopers suddenly the terrifying elite they were always claimed to be, rather than the blaster-fodder of the movies) or convert the D&D characters to SW standards.

The Unearthed Arcana variants cover these, thank goodness!


Lightsabres may ignore hardness, but they shouldn't get to ignore magical hardness. Treat them as Brilliant Energy weapons, and they won't function the way we see in the films.
Unit conversion: In D&D we take 5 foot steps, in SW they're 2 metre steps. Use this (incorrect) conversion, and you can keep the same battle grid.


In my experience - assuming your D&D magic and items all function in the SW universe - your D&D characters will own the galaxy.

Jedi? These guys are the toughest character class in the game, and by D&D standards, they're dreadfully weak. They have to spend HP to use their powers. Those powers are nothing compared to equivalent level spells.

The only thing against you is that common weapons are nastier than in D&D, and that fast transport is easier.

Fixer
2007-12-31, 09:56 AM
I've played both, and looked at blending them together. The power levels aren't easily comparable.

The most important issues to convert:
Lightsabres may ignore hardness, but they shouldn't get to ignore magical hardness. Treat them as Brilliant Energy weapons, and they won't function the way we see in the films.
Unit conversion: In D&D we take 5 foot steps, in SW they're 2 metre steps. Use this (incorrect) conversion, and you can keep the same battle grid.


In my experience - assuming your D&D magic and items all function in the SW universe - your D&D characters will own the galaxy.

Jedi? These guys are the toughest character class in the game, and by D&D standards, they're dreadfully weak. They have to spend HP to use their powers. Those powers are nothing compared to equivalent level spells.

The only thing against you is that common weapons are nastier than in D&D, and that fast transport is easier.
I brought up the changes listed in UA in an email I sent to him about 20 minutes ago. I expect those changes to occur in the game.

I see the problem of magic in the Star Wars game being the imbalancing factor. I believe having the spellcasters having to spend vitality points to cast their spells to be a fair compromise, but gain a special 'pool' of spell points to cast their spells from, taking real vitality points only once those in the pool are spent. Any of my warblade's abilities would also require an expendature of vitality points to power his maneuvers, and he would get a maneuver reservoir of points to spend from first.

Magic Items? I think those should be severely nerfed. In order to use a magic item, you will have to spend vitality points (equal to the items caster level) to activate it for a number of rounds equal to half the character level. For continuous use items, they should only add half their benefit to the character (so +4 armor would normally only grant a +2 bonus unless the character spent vitality to power it up).

Opinions?

Fuzzy_Juan
2007-12-31, 03:29 PM
As for the origional questions...

Lightsabers ignore the hardness or DC of any non-magical material. magical weapons would be the equivalent of Sith Swords. That is, weapons imbued with the force through Sith alchemy to channel the user's force power. As such it is capable of clashing with a lightsaber and not getting destroyed instantly. It gets it's hardness against lightsabers. I would use the sith sword mechanic for magical weapons.

Magic and the Force...this is the biggest problem. The powers behind the cosmology are fundamentally different. Now...Depending on what you want, you can convert the spell levels into some type of HP drain that cannot be healed except through normal rest or something...It could be explained that something about the Dragons/gods/whatever's connection with their homeworld allowed magic to be easily channeled...elsewhere in the galaxy 'magicians' have learned to tap into their own life force and use it for magical means. Because of the horrible price it can exert on one's system, noone has dared to research more powerful 'spells', or those who have have been shut up or hunted down. (possible sith hook? jedi oppressing magic for people's own good?) MIxing it with Vancian magic from 3.0 and 3.5 could be saying that on the DnD world one could prepare spells using the ambient magic on the world and storing it in their minds/bodies and unleashing it later...now that they are away from such a planet they must find a new way to prepare spells, or just cast them using their life force. I might say that in places that are strong in the force, light or dark, that a spellcaster could possibly once again prepare the needed spells. Any prepared spells could be cast as normal, but once those were out, you would have to rely on your life force.

Psionics don't equal the force...I would have to say one should make it like I described magic above or don't use them at all....otherwise, make jedi psychic warriors with lightsabers and leave magic alone. Jedi consilars would be psions who still get lightsaber proficiency, just not as much extra damage.

--------------------------------------------------------

The force is cool and all, but the kind of magic found in DnD is epic by comparison. Do note though that people in the 'future' have found ways to do alot of what mages do...fly, strong blast and single shot effects, illusions (badly though), long range connunication, protective shirlds, 'golems', regeneration, accelerated healing, scanners (detection magic), rapid transit (not quite a teleport but last I checked spelljammer one can't teleport between star systems either).

A SIngle wizard could be as powerful as an entire army of rebel troopers, but that same wizard might have their hands full against a squad of AT-STs, AT-ATs and their associated ground personell. And that is assuming that the orbiting battle ship doesn't just start bombarding the planet surface to destroy the local 'god' figure.

You might also want to consider the effects on spells that rely on alternate planes or summons/teleports. Do they work out in space? Do they work on other planets, what truely is the range of these spells? What is space? Have you found a way into the astral plane? Do the planets of Star Wars share the same astral plane, or something beyond, what about the inner planes? Have you left the known cosmology of DnD and are now cut off from any spell that relies on such a connection? (summon monster, elementals, certian divinations, etherial jaunt, dimension door, teleport, gate, plane shift, planar ally...and so on). These must be defined in terms of the new universe. If you are just deep in the astral plane then the outer planes and everything else still matters and the etherial plane still overlays with each planet/plane/whatever...plane shift can then allow for transportation between planets as it does between planes (which could be 'problematic' if a simple plane shift can send them home if the intention is for them to stay and play and not be able to leave)

Just some things to think about.

Altair_the_Vexed
2007-12-31, 05:37 PM
I brought up the changes listed in UA in an email I sent to him about 20 minutes ago. I expect those changes to occur in the game.

I see the problem of magic in the Star Wars game being the imbalancing factor. I believe having the spellcasters having to spend vitality points to cast their spells to be a fair compromise, but gain a special 'pool' of spell points to cast their spells from, taking real vitality points only once those in the pool are spent. Any of my warblade's abilities would also require an expendature of vitality points to power his maneuvers, and he would get a maneuver reservoir of points to spend from first.

Magic Items? I think those should be severely nerfed. In order to use a magic item, you will have to spend vitality points (equal to the items caster level) to activate it for a number of rounds equal to half the character level. For continuous use items, they should only add half their benefit to the character (so +4 armor would normally only grant a +2 bonus unless the character spent vitality to power it up).

Opinions?

Mucking about with VP for spells could get messy - how much extra do you give the casters? - how much do the spells cost? You could go through a fair bit of playtesting before you get it right.
Similarly, the magic items that D&D heroes have aren't that impressive in SW that they need nerfing too hard. Force Adepts, Jedi and even mundane characters get plenty of bonuses to their skill checks and attacks from various sources.

I think the simplest option for both the players and the GM is to let your D&D characters carry on casting their spells / using their SLAs / Supernatural Abilities / etc as normal, and to adjust the SW CRs to fit. Coupled with - as Fuzzy_Juan said - the mundane replacements for magical effects that are common in the SW galaxy, it should even out if you bump up the challenges a little.

Now SW d20 doesn't use CRs like D&D does - it uses Challenge Codes, from A to I. These are roughly equivalent to D&D ratings 1/2 to 22 (see the table on 256 of the SW Revised Core Rules).
To reflect the general awesomeness of D&D characters, you could make an SW Challenge Code conversion that reduces the XP granted by SW threats and allows for simple comparison of SW threats to D&D.

Call CC "B" to "I" CR "2" to "16" (missing out every odd CR number). Bump those numbers down a bit - the ones below 5 stay as they are: above 5, reduce them by 1 each: above 10, reduce them by 2 each: above 15, reduce by three.
I propose that you retain CC A = 1/2 CR.
You end up with
A = 1/2
B = 2
C = 4
D = 5
E = 7
F = 9
G = 10
H = 12
I = 14

Or something like that. I think this is a more realistic reflection of the challenge presented to D&D characters by SW threats.

Ker
2007-12-31, 06:07 PM
Even though D&D casters might be incredibly powerful against Jedi, they might be hard pressed to go up against transports with multi-megaton point defense weaponry, and heavy guns of 200 gigatons.

I suggest Stardestroyer.net (http://www.stardestroyer.net/Empire/) and the Star Wars technical commentaries (http://theforce.net/swtc/index.html) for more info about SW tech.

Fuzzy_Juan
2007-12-31, 07:43 PM
Oh, at full power a mage can do plenty against even a starship...it all depends on them getting on or inside the thing. Otherwise a simple teleport, or even a rope trick is all one needs to be safe.

I mean...greater invisibility, overland flight, ironbody (to go into space/high altitude if necessary), and a teleport to get you within range...

Then it is just a matter of what spells might effect such a large construct. Desintegrate on the engines, symbol of insanity on the bridge and engine room, cloudkill into the air system, PAO vital systems, delayed blast fireball in the weapon's hold, charm person some crew and force them to use the self destruct...

I am sure other wizard players will be able to think up more ways a wizard could dismantle a fleet fairly quickly. Ony Yoda in the clone wars cartoon displayed that kind of outrageous power.

Altair_the_Vexed
2007-12-31, 08:14 PM
Even though D&D casters might be incredibly powerful against Jedi, they might be hard pressed to go up against transports with multi-megaton point defense weaponry, and heavy guns of 200 gigatons.

I suggest Stardestroyer.net (http://www.stardestroyer.net/Empire/) and the Star Wars technical commentaries (http://theforce.net/swtc/index.html) for more info about SW tech.

"Don't be too proud of this technological terror you've constructed. The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of a 20th Level Wizard."
:smallbiggrin:

Seriously though, against a colossal star ship, a high level character only has to worry about the same things they do in D&D when confronted with a bad guy's citadel: get inside, destroy key units. After all, what is a Star Destroyer but a big flying mega-dungeon?

So an Imperial Star Destroyer has DR 60 and 700 HP shields (also with DR 60)? We'll just have to get aboard. Can't teleport through shields? Seems reasonable... Then we need to scam the crew that our stolen shuttle is legitimate.

As long as the players RP their culture shock well enough - and these will be characters who've travelled the Astral and Elemental Planes, no doubt - there's little reason why they won't be able to significantly contribute to the SW universe.

In fact, I'm looking forward to hearing what happens in Fixer's game!

Ker
2007-12-31, 09:19 PM
Must...suppress...urge...to...assert...Empire's... supremacy!

It failed.

Ships can open compartments to vacuum, are there any spells that can protect against that?

Also, can teleport function through neutronium-impregnated armor? And is it effected by the warping of space? IIRC, jamming systems in SW can do that.

What if the shields on the infiltrated starship are dropped and it's fired upon by another ship? Can any spells resist teratons of firepower?

What about ray shielding? And gases such as Fex-M3d and Cyanogen?

Edit: What about self destructing the ship the caster is on? ImpStar reactors are at least as powerful as a star.

Edit again: What about Stormtroopers armed with disruptor rifles and T-21 repeaters? Or E-webs? Sonic weapons? Spray Sticks? Charrics?

Edit yet again: As a last resort, the planet the caster's on could just be BDZed.

Fuzzy_Juan
2007-12-31, 10:02 PM
I believe that passwall would be sufficient to bypass the armor, as would etherial jaunt. Ironbody gives the caster the ability to survive a vaccum if necessary as a construct does not require air and can withstand immense pressure or lack thereof. I don't believe that the cold of space would be a problem either but there are spells that could offset that too.

an interdictor creates an artificial gravity well that activates the failsafe on FTL drives to prevent them from crashing into planets and stars...One is unsure how or if such an artificial gravity well would interfere with teleport if at all since teleport takes place within a gravity well without problem normally (on a planet).

If the ship they are on gets hit, they are just as vulnerable as anyone else onboard barring magical defenses. Since shots hitting a ship don't always blow up people in the ships interior (away from the hull), one can be fairly safe there, or at least able to teleport out. One does not know if a wall of force or a Prismatic wall/screen will hold against the firepower of a starship. The energy is non-magical so as far as anyone can tell it will never penetrate such fields, but one can never be 100% sure with cross game system events.

Ray shielding is kinda like a forcewall...the DM would have to define how it interacts with magic. Poison gasses can be defeated by polymorph or ironbody, or certian class features (immunity to poison?)

Self destruct...unless caught by total suprise, a wizard would just leave...provided that they were capable of leaving quickly.

Soldiers armed with whatever? Invisibility is one way, but sleep, deep sleep, symbol of insanity, mass charm person, glitterdust, illusions, wall spells...all of these can get rid of simple troops...summon monster is also a good way of doing things.

Yes...a planet can just be blown apart...one would think hough that they could see or perhaps sense the impending doom and do something about it. Leave, transport to the death star, whatever...

Ker
2007-12-31, 10:38 PM
Doesn't a caster have to know about the location to teleport to it? COMPNOR could prevent the information from ever reaching the casters location, with a little luck. Plus, would the wizard know how to use a computer?

I wasn't referring to interdictors when I was talking about jamming btw.

What about tractor and repulsor beams focused on the same target, ripping it apart?

Plus, the industrial capacity of the Empire is huge. The DSII was 2/3 complete in 6 months. And the material for it's construction was transported solely by a relatively small private company. The Empire has over 20,000 ISDs alone in it's fleet, it could simply catch the wizard in a massive fleet, tractor him in random directions to keep him from concentrating on his spells, and kill him that way.

Stormtrooper helmets have thermal imaging. Invisibility only masks the target from sight, it doesn't mask it's heat signature. Wall spells would also be largely ineffective, as Stormtroopers carry a thermal detonator.

What about laser mines? Or ray shields coming down directly on top of the caster, shredding him?

Hecore
2007-12-31, 11:07 PM
Well, Telekinetic Sphere would prevent all types of tractor beams. The wizard could Polymorph into a cold-blooded creature to avoid heat detection. There's plenty of ways a caster could find a ships location - for example, all the wizard has to do is research is one of its crew members and then cast Demand.

Altair_the_Vexed
2008-01-01, 06:55 AM
All these arguments back and forth about the power of SW tech and D&D magic really just bring us to one conclusion:

Those D&D characters had better learn to exploit SW tech quickly, and vice versa.

Sure, it'll be hard to deal with the might of an interstellar empire - the same as it'd be difficult in D&D.
Yes, the giant space craft of the SW galaxy are scary items. There are lots of ways that you could TPK your D&D characters without a fair fight. But that isn't going to be fun for the OP and his GM. Neither would "magic wins" be much fun after the first session.

Individual character power levels are lower in SW. The equipment doesn't entirely make up for that until you get to warship scale - and this is just a bunch magic flying castles to D&D characters: dangerous, yes, but nothing out of the ordinary for high fantasy heroes.

Back on topic, I thought of another thing that the GM will need to consider before starting:
What effect does magic have on the Force and technology?

Consider: - is the Force magic for the purposes of detection / dispelling? - are illusions visible to droids or holographic cameras? - does Nondetection make you invisible to security cameras? - in regards to Resist Energy, what energy type are blasters and lightsabres?


It's probably best if the GM provides a definitive list of spells' functions with regards to technology (similar to the list in Stormwrack for spells vs ships). Game balance is more important than consistent logic for such a list (one can always invent rationale after the fact).
For example - think how much a techie civilisation relies on mundane means of scrying (cameras, droids, etc) rather than organic people watching out. If Nondetection did make you invisible to cameras (and maybe by logical extension, droids), then you'd be able to sneak right past the hordes of the Clone War Separatists and take out General Grievous while his droids wondered what the heck he was fighting.
Similarly - Think about how Invisibility might work - no matter what the light source, it makes you unseen. In 1st Ed, 2nd Ed and Original D&D, the "see-in-the-dark" ability that certain races got was called "infravision", and was described as a kind of thermal imaging. Guess what? Invisibility worked against it. Should it work this way for 3.x vs SW d20?

Fixer
2008-01-02, 07:54 AM
Ok, for you Star Wars people, is this a decent 'challenger' for a D&D character? I made it up yesterday to test against the warblade.

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Darth Cannon Fodder
Human Jedi Guardian 9 (Dark Side Template)
Str: 20, Dex: 14, Con: 16, Int: 10, Wis: 14, Cha:11

Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Lightsaber)
Force-Sensitive
Weapon Group Proficiency (Blaster Pistols)
Weapon Group Proficiency (Simple Weapons)

Force Feats: Alter, Control, Sense
Jedi Bonus Feats: Attuned, Mettle
Jedi Knight Feat: Force Mastery
Level Feats: Heroic Surge, Malevolent, Rage, Power Attack
Force Points: 9
Dark Side Points: 9
Defense Bonus: +9
Vitality Points: 77
Wounds: 16
BAB: +9/+4
Saves (F/R/W): +6/+6/+4
Skills:
Battlemind (Move Action, 10 ranks, +15 to check, +4 to hit, 6 vitality)
Enhance Ability (Attack Action, 10 ranks, +15 to check, +6 to an ability score, 3 vitality)
Fear (Attack Action, 9 ranks, +14 to check, -8 penalty to attack/skill rolls, 2 vitality)
Force Defense (Full-Round Action, 10 ranks, +15 to check, +8 to Defense, 3 vitality)
Force Grip (Attack Action, 4 ranks, +10 to check, 3d6 physical damage [Will 20 for half], 4 vitality)
Force Lightning (Attack Action, 6 ranks, +10 to check, 3d8 damage [Ref 25 for half], 6 vitality)
Move Object (Move Action, 12 ranks, +12 to check [objects < 5kg = 1 vitality/objects <50kg, 2 vitality/objects <500kg = 4 vitality])
Tumble (11 ranks, +13 to check)

Class Abilities: Deflect (Extend Defense +2, Extend Attack -4), Improved Lightsaber Damage (3d8), Block

Equipment:
24,000 Mastercraft +3 Lightsaber
6,000 Mastercraft +3 Heavy Blaster Pistol
350 Aquata Breather
1,000 Field Kit
3,300 Baktoid Combat Automata B2 Series (Pg 373)

34,650
-----------------------------------------------------------------
If this guy isn't totally stupid, what would be a good strategy. Assuming both parties start 50 feet (10 squares) from one another.


Besturn, the warblade, would be as follows:
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Dwarf Warblade 9
Str: 20, Dex: 14, Con: 16, Int: 16, Wis: 10, Cha: 9

Feats: Adaptive Style, Stone Power, Power Attack, Shards of Granite
Force Points: 1
Defense Bonus: +9
Armor Bonus: +6
Natural Armor Bonus: +1
Damage Reduction: 7/-
BAB: +9/+4
Vitality: 95
Wounds: 16
Saves (F/R/W): +6/+6/+3
Skills:
Concentration 12 (+15)
Tumble 12 (+14)
Balance 5 (+7)
Climb 12 (
Swim 12 (
Jump 12 (
Heal 4.5 (+4)
Use Magic Device 5 (+4)

Maneuvers: (4 readied, italicized for readied at beginning of combat)
Steel Wind (Iron Heart 1st) - Strike Standard Action
You may make one melee attack each against two different opponents.
Leading the Attack (White Raven 1st) - Strike Standard Action
Make a standard melee attack. If your attack succeeds, all your allies get a +4 morale bonus to attacks for 1 round against the creature you attacked.
Emerald Razor (Diamond Mind 2nd) - Strike Standard Action
Make a standard melee attack as a touch attack. Damage is dealt normally.
Action Before Thought (Diamond Mind 2nd) - Counter Immediate Action
Use a Concentration check instead of a Reflex saving throw. A roll of 1 is not an automatic failure.
Insightful Strike (Diamond Mind 3rd) - Strike Standard Action
Make a standard melee attack. Do not roll damage normally and instead of weapon damage, roll a Concentration check. The damage dealt by the attack is the result of the check.
Mountain Hammer (Stone Dragon 2nd) - Strike Standard Action
Make a standard melee attack. This attack deals an additional 2d6 damage and automatically overcomes damage resistance and hardness.
Overwhelming Mountain Strike (Stone Dragon 4th) - Strike Standard Action
Make a standard melee attack. This attack deals an additional 2d6 damage. If the target you hit is standing on the ground, your attack also causes the target to lose its ability to take a move action for 1 round. It can otherwise act normally.
A successful Fortitude save (DC 14 + Str bonus) by the target prevents the loss of the move action but not the additional damage.
Iron Heart Surge (Iron Heart 3rd) Standard Action
When you use this maneuver, select one spell, effect, or condition currently affecting you with a duration of 1 or more rounds. That effect ends immediately. In addition, you gain a +2 morale bonus to attacks until the end of your next turn.
Iron Heart Focus (Iron Heart 5th) - Counter Immediate Action
You may reroll a saving throw you have just made and must accept the second result.

Stances (italicized is normally active):
Stance of Clarity (Diamond Mind 1st)
Gain a +2 to AC against a single opponent. Take a -2 to AC against all other opponents.
Leading the Charge (White Raven 1st)
All allies within 60 feet of you (and are aware of you) receive a bonus to damage rolls equal to your initiator level on their charge attacks.


Equipment:
17,750 Finned & Spiked Adamantine Full Plate Armor +1
5,020 Adamantine Greataxe +1
2,500 Ring of Sustenance
5,500 Boots of Striding and Springing
2,000 Amulet of Natural Armor +1
2,200 Ring of Feather Falling
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My question with Besturn is about the armor bonus. Do armor bonuses stack with Defense Bonuses in Star Wars? Not sure how that works so I wanted a clarification before I begin the simulation.

Altair_the_Vexed
2008-01-02, 01:29 PM
Armour bonuses and defence bonuses don't stack. Sorry.

Firstly, I've never looked at the Warblade class, so I know nothing about your D&D character, sorry.

Secondly, Darth Fodder there isn't a bad build. With Dark Jedi and Sith types one can afford to be as nasty and one-dimensional as the rules allow for your combat monsters: that's the Sith way.

Round 1: Darth activates his lightsabre and Enhances Constitution (+3 VP per level is never a bad thing), and directs the B2 to attack as a free action. Besturn does something.
Round 2: Darth 2m steps back (assuming Besturn engaged in melee), activates Battle Mind and uses Force Grip on Besturn. B2 droid continues attacking.
Round 3: Darth rages and goes for full round action melee.

It looks quite nasty to me. Lots of bonuses to attack (hitting the dwarf on average with his lower BAB), nice big damage on each attack (averaging 14.5 per hit). Really depends on what your Warblade can do in response. Having a droid to shoot away at your opponent always helps, too.

I suspect he won't last very long though. The warblade's abilities don't cost VP...

Fixer
2008-01-02, 01:34 PM
Yeah, I will do the simulated battle between them in this thread. I figure the only FAIR way to do a simulation between them is to have the following rules in place:
Both sides roll the exact same results on their dice when they are needed.
Both sides are completely ignorant of the other's abilities and are really just trying to beat the heck out of the other one as quickly as possible.

So, I'll generate some dice rolls and prepare a mock combat between these two later.

Fixer
2008-01-02, 03:47 PM
Ok, here's the rolls:
{table]Dice|1|2|3|4|5|6|7|8|9|10|11|12|13|14|15|16|17|18| 19|20|21|22|23|24|25|26|27|28|29|30
1d4|2|3|1|2|2|1|4|2|4|1|3|3|3|1|4|4|1|2|1|1|4|3|2| 4|1|4|2|2|2|4
1d6|6|6|2|5|1|5|5|5|1|6|1|5|4|3|4|4|6|1|5|1|4|3|6| 4|3|1|2|5|5|2
1d8|2|2|8|2|6|8|1|5|6|1|8|7|3|5|4|7|2|6|7|3|7|6|5| 4|2|6|6|1|8|7
1d10|5|7|2|1|9|5|10|1|4|8|3|9|1|6|8|3|9|7|7|3|10|9 |2|3|1|5|5|10|2|4
1d12|10|1|12|10|6|1|12|5|7|4|12|8|3|1|12|9|3|4|2|4 |5|7|12|8|11|9|5|11|7|12
2d6|9|2|3|8|4|8|10|7|4|9|7|8|10|5|5|10|3|9|5|8|5|8 |8|7|9|8|5|6|2|10
3d6|4|15|10|13|9|9|11|11|14|10|7|18|10|16|9|15|13| 8|7|13|9|10|10|11|7|9|10|9|8|11
4d6|13|11|13|19|9|12|15|13|17|19|17|8|14|16|16|14| 11|15|19|15|15|13|15|12|12|23|7|9|14|12
3d8|9|18|15|19|8|11|20|20|19|12|12|17|9|16|21|12|1 3|18|13|18|15|16|10|12|6|11|22|13|14|12
1d20 (batch 1)|3|20|15|1|2|10|5|1|1|4|17|5|2|12|2|18|4|9|2|11| 9|15|15|19|17|1|10|19|7|15
1d20 (batch 2)|13|6|11|18|8|16|12|10|13|7|3|5|20|20|1|14|12|6| 18|20|20|9|3|11|1|1|1|10|3|5[/table]

To begin, Warblade Besturn will get batch 1, Darth Fodder will get batch 2, and they will alternate. I had planned their strategies before I rolled these dice.

No surprise, opponents are 60 feet (12 quares) from each other.

{table]Round|Initiative Winner|Initiative Loser
Round 1|Darth Fodder Initiative 15 (d20-2,1){table]Action|Vitality
Use Fear skill (25 result points, -8 to attempts but Besturn decides to take the Dark Side Point instead) using Force Mastery|71
Use Force Defense (25 result points, +8 to defense for 1 minute)|68
Heroic Surge for Enhance Ability (25 result points, +6 to Constitution for 1 minute)|89
Orders Droid to attack (5 result points (d20-1,1), misses)[/table]|Besturn Initiative 5 (d20-1,1){table]Action|Vitality
Enters Stance of Clarity|95
Charge Darth Fodder using Stone Power for 5 and Power Attack for 5 (17 result points (d20-2,1), which misses)|95 (10 temp)[/table]

Round 2|Besturn Initiative 22 (d20-1,2){table]Action|Vitality
Insightful Strike on Darth Fodder (20 (d20-2,2) result points misses|95[/table]|Darth Fodder Initiative 8 (d20-2,2){table]Action|Vitality
Heroic Surge for Enhance Ability (Strength) skill (25 result points, +6 to Str)|86
Use Battlemind (25 result points, +4 to hit for 1 minute)|80
Use Force Grip (20 result points, 2 damage to Besturn who passes save (d20-1,3))|76
Orders Droid to move to flank then fire (provoking AOO using Stone Power for 5, (d20-2,3) 20 result points, 15 damage to droid, Fodder elects to have droid fail Fort save and fall 'unconscious')|0 (5 wounds) [/table]

Round 3|Darth Fodder Initiative 13 (d20-2,3){table]Action|Vitality
Heroic Surge for Force Lightning skill (20 result points, 4 damage to Besturn (3d8,1), who passes his save with Action before Thought (33 result points (d20-2,4)))|43
Force Rage (+4 to Strength, etc for 8 rounds)|61
Power Attacks for 9 in Full Attack on Besturn with Lightsaber (27 result points (d20-1,3), 40 vitality damage (3d8,2); 30 result points (d20-2,4), 37 vitality damage (3d8,3))|61[/table]|Besturn Initiative 3 (d20-1,4){table]Action|Vitality
Full-Round Action to change maneuvers|12[/table]

Round 4|Besturn Initiative 20 (d20-2,4){table]Action|Vitality
Mountain Hammer against Darth Fodder using Stone Power 5 (11 result points (d20-1,5) misses|12+10[/table]|Darth Fodder Initiative 3 (d20-1,4){table]Action|Vitality
Power Attacks for 9 in Full Attack on Besturn with Lightsaber (20 result points (d20-2,5), misses; 30 result points (d20-1,5), 41 damage (3d8,4) (22 vitality, 7 armor, 19 wounds) and we have a dead Besturn|61[/table]

[/table]

Besturn has just gotten his butt HANDED TO HIM by this Dark Jedi. There is no way I am going to say that Jedi cannot handle their own against a D&D character. Because of that Boost Defense ability, Besturn never even had a chance to hit Darth Fodder except on a nat 20. That was only after Besturn accepted a Dark Side Point not to have an additional -8 to everything.

No, Jedi are not pansies compared to D&D Warblades. Maybe I can make a Wizard @ 9th and try again but this little contest was on the side of the Jedi.