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Clementx
2008-01-05, 08:19 PM
In an effort to make a little variety and making CRs not dependent on the presence of special materials, I was looking for a conversion between DR/silver or DR/cold iron and other forms of protection, most likely Fast Healing.

So how much FH worth in comparison to DR 5/whatever? At first glance, 3 or 4 seems enough to eek out another hit or two in a fight, which is less than what lacking the proper material would create. Perhaps another point of natural armor added into to reduce the overall damage as well? I'd rather not reCR every creature with DR/silver and cold iron, so a guideline would be nice.

Thoughts?

Reinboom
2008-01-05, 08:28 PM
It really depends on the creature.
A creature with a high AC, or a way to avoid hits in general, would get a lot more benefit for Fast Healing than a creature with low AC.
You need to look at more than just their DR/ value in this, you need to look at movement capabilities (burrowing and flight specifically), AC, Spell Resistance, defensive abilities, etc.

It also depends on the group. If there are a lot of melee characters, DR is more powerful than Fast Healing. On the other hand, a group of blasters will cream a monster whos defense was relied upon by damage reduction, since spells and energy isn't effected by DR... while Fast Healing will still heal those wounds.

In short, they are different, and without knowing the group and each monster, I doubt a strict conversion could be made.

Kizara
2008-01-05, 08:31 PM
While the special materials and creatures resiliance to them add an interesting aspect to the game, I can see where you are comming from in wanting to streamline your world/game a bit.

It really is a hard call, but you are on the right track. AC doesn't scale as directly, as ability to hit only indirectly effects ability to deal damage.

However, fast healing does scale quite well. Two options:

1) Slightly tougher monsters. Give them 3/4 of the DR in fast healing, and the rest in DR X/-. If they would be hit every round anyways, this works about about equal; since DR 5/material against 5 seperate hits is far better then DR 1/- and Fast Healing 4 for protection. However, if the monster is hard to hit or has hit-and-run or other ways to stall the heros so it can 'heal up' it can take more advantage of the fast healing.

2) Regeneration. Easiest way would be to make DR 5/cold iron into regeneration 7/cold iron. Bump up the DR by about 1/3 of the base, and give it as regen. That way if they DO have the material its a major boon, but the monster is still defeatable without it.

I suggest with this form of 'regen' that you actually have the thing 'die' at -10, or it will be even more undefeatable then the DR X/material one.


3) Don't change it. Monsters are just tougher. Give the PCs slightly more treasure and perhaps a bit more XP (but a bit more treasure should do fine).

Kristoss
2008-01-05, 08:34 PM
Too hard to say, The value of DR varies greatly between the opponents a creature faces. Against a group of adventurers whose members all have a tendency to full attack with mellee and arrows DR is a very significant factor. However against a group that only does spell or elemental attacks DR is worth nothing.
I would substitute FH in according to the opponents your expecting the creature to face. Against a group with one warrior who likes to full attack 2 to 3 points of FH per DR. Against a group with one full attack warrior and an archer 3 to 4 points. Do you see the sorta patten here.

There is no real hard and fast rule for DR to FH conversion.

ZeroNumerous
2008-01-05, 09:15 PM
If a monster at a low CR(5-9) has a burrow speed or flight speed, then Fast Healing is valuable. It can burrow or fly away and heal up.

As levels go up, DR 5/Material gets less and less useful. At low levels, it's significant, but at higher levels -5 to damage isn't even something your PCs will miss.

Fast Healing, however, remains viable throughout all 20 levels. It's felt the worst at low levels, but a high level creature with burrow can just as easily annoy PCs with it's fast healing ability.

FinalJustice
2008-01-05, 11:03 PM
For a dual wielder, every single bit of DR is absurdly annoying. The damage of a guy that makes 5 attacks a round and has the luck of hitting 'em all will be short of 25 points, which is hardly ignorable.