PDA

View Full Version : Questions from a DM



kiwee
2008-01-11, 09:23 AM
one of my players was wondering about multiclassing a ranger and a druid. if the player takes 4 lvls in ranger, and 1 in druid, does he get 2 animal companions?

also if the player abadons ranger and ends up with a rng4/drd12 will the characters effective druid level still be half his character level, even though he is level 12 in druid?

If the first is true, does that mean that the player might have a lvl2 and a lvl12 wolf (lvl2 from ranger, lvl12 from druid)?

If the first isnt true, does the level of the animal companion race up to the character level after taking 1 level in druid?

gah, this is confusing...:smallsigh:

Lochar
2008-01-11, 09:25 AM
Easiest answer?

Combine them. 12 levels of druid, plus the effective level of 2 from ranger. He has an effective level of 14 for any animal companion abilities. And he only gets one animal companion.

kiwee
2008-01-11, 09:33 AM
heh, why didnt I think of that...

oh, another question.
How would you go about playing a pack of wolfs?

you see a PC druid and PC ranger both have wolf companions. and it so happens that one is male and one is female. and we figured it would be cool for them to have pups, and start a pack :D

so the main question is, what would the stats be for the pups? and how would the PC control the pack, being that the PC with the Male wolf is likely to take the position as the alpha male of the pack.

I was thinking handle animal checks, but rolling 5 or 6 checks for each animal would take ages.

Lochar
2008-01-11, 09:39 AM
Take the base physical stats for the wolves (Or the average if they have different stats). Subtract 6-8 from each. You have your puppies. Give them a half d8 for hit dice.

Puppies require a handle animal check to teach. Since the PC is the alpha of the parents, give them a bonus to their handle animal check.

Then assign a DC.

Rearing a wild animal is DC 15+ HD of animal. Use the standard animal HD of a wolf for this purpose, which is 2, so 17.

Then add 2 for each extra animal in the 'pack'

If there are five total puppies, make the DC 17 + 8, or 23. They have to make this check once a day until they are no longer puppies, say two months, then they're considered reared and juviniles in the pack. Give them standard HD and half the subtraction you took from their base stats. No more handle animal checks required.

At six months, they're fully grown, give them their normal stats now.

NerfTW
2008-01-11, 09:40 AM
I'd go one removed. The alpha wolf is the pack leader, and the character who has that wolf as a companion simply gives commands to the wolf, who relays it to the pack. The pack as a whole simply regards the characters as friends, but not the leaders.

It might simplify the amount of dice rolls.

Keld Denar
2008-01-11, 09:45 AM
Its in the PHB about stacking animal companion classes. The above poster was spot on about combining effective levels and only getting a single animal companion.

As far as a pack goes, while the concept is cool, mechanically it is both weak and time consuming. Assuming you don't advance all the wolves in the pack (like an Animal Companion does) the wolves will quickly lag behind in effectiveness, and are extremely vulnerable to mid level AoE spells. I'm pretty sure your PCs inteligent friends won't want their progeny slaughtered wholesale by errant fireballs.

Also, mechanically, controlling that many animals in combat will bog down horribly. Never mind adding in situational factors like Bard Song and rolling a dozen trip attempts. Zookeeper type character (I'm lookin at you Dread Necro) tend to be less fun for the other players at the table. Best to stick with the one good companion, advance it and equip it, and not take the hastle of the rest.

They can still exist RP wise, and indeed can prove valuable adventure hooks for you as the DM (101 Dalmations style) but I'd highly recommend against them being stated out and carted around with the PCs.

kiwee
2008-01-11, 09:53 AM
thanks for the help guys, I think that is all...

Person_Man
2008-01-11, 09:54 AM
one of my players was wondering about multiclassing a ranger and a druid. if the player takes 4 lvls in ranger, and 1 in druid, does he get 2 animal companions?

He gets one animal companion. If he wants more then one animal companion, he can take levels of Beast Master or Beast Heart Adept.


also if the player abadons ranger and ends up with a rng4/drd12 will the characters effective druid level still be half his character level, even though he is level 12 in druid?

No, mutli-classing doesn't change any of your class abilities. So its determined by adding his Druid levels + 1/2 his Ranger levels. So a Ranger 4/Druid 12 would effectively be a 14th level Druid for determining animal companion bonuses.

Adumbration
2008-01-11, 09:54 AM
Although - depending on circumstances - you might get away with them being Dire Wolves. It would make a twisted kind of sense, you know, with the animal companions being way better than ordinary animals. You would have to let them go to the wilds eventually, as well, once they start to get one-shotted by enemies.

SoD
2008-01-11, 10:01 AM
I'd personally, for the pups, use the dog stats in the MM, instead of the wolf. After a certain amount of time, increase them to wolves.

kiwee
2008-01-11, 11:14 AM
@SoD: Good idea, that will probably be easier than editing the wolf stats.

mostlyharmful
2008-01-11, 12:00 PM
I'd go one removed. The alpha wolf is the pack leader, and the character who has that wolf as a companion simply gives commands to the wolf, who relays it to the pack. The pack as a whole simply regards the characters as friends, but not the leaders.

It might simplify the amount of dice rolls.

These would be the pack alpha male and female that rolled over and yipped at the slightest encouragement from the PCs? the same ones that take food straight from the PCs? That just doesn't work in my head.

The whole cubs thing is a bit tricky from a RP perspective unless you let the ACs take time off, establish a territory, make a den and then raise them in a stable setting. No more running around the countryside unless you want the pups to die. Or if you leave your class feature at home to knit little booties or whatever:smallconfused:

KIDS
2008-01-11, 04:41 PM
My recommendation is to take Wild Cohort feat on both sides and Beastmaster PrC on both sides and then RP the breeding with proper and clear rules backup for a wolf pack. It's a very awesome idea :)

If you mean to piggyback new wolves onto existing animal companion class feature, I recommend against it. Either they're going to be with no bonus and will die from first aoe (it's animal cruelty to lead them around!!!), or they will all get bonuses and be vastly overpowered. Better to provide a rules background first.

KillianHawkeye
2008-01-11, 05:36 PM
Take the base physical stats for the wolves (Or the average if they have different stats). Subtract 6-8 from each. You have your puppies. Give them a half d8 for hit dice.

Puppies require a handle animal check to teach. Since the PC is the alpha of the parents, give them a bonus to their handle animal check.

Then assign a DC.

Rearing a wild animal is DC 15+ HD of animal. Use the standard animal HD of a wolf for this purpose, which is 2, so 17.

Then add 2 for each extra animal in the 'pack'

If there are five total puppies, make the DC 17 + 8, or 23. They have to make this check once a day until they are no longer puppies, say two months, then they're considered reared and juviniles in the pack. Give them standard HD and half the subtraction you took from their base stats. No more handle animal checks required.

At six months, they're fully grown, give them their normal stats now.

I agree with doing the Handle Animal checks like this. But if you want to really stat out these wolf cubs, I would simply reduce the size category and HD on a normal wolf to get what you want.

Normal wolves are 2 HD Medium animals. The juvenile wolf (2 to 6 months old) would be Small and have only 1 HD. The stat adjustments are -4 Str +2 Dex -2 Con. Their bite attack goes down to a d4, and don't forget to add in the typical size bonuses for being small. The young wolf (less than 2 months old) would then be Tiny and have 1/2 HD. The stat adjustments are an additional -4 Str and +2 Dex, and their bite attacks go down to d3.

Just in case you didn't wanna do the math yourself, here:

Young Wolf
Tiny Animal
Hit Dice: 1/2 d8+1 (3 hp)
Initiative: +4
Speed: 30 ft. (6 squares)
Armor Class: 18 (+4 Dex, +2 Size, +2 Natural), touch 16, flat-footed 12
Base Attack/Grapple: +0/-11
Attacks: Bite -3 melee (1d3-3)
Space/Reach: 2.5 ft./0 ft.
Special Attacks: Trip (-3 modifier)
Special Qualities: Low-light vision, scent
Saves: Fort +3, Ref +6, Will +1
Abilities: Str 5, Dex 19, Con 13, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 6
Skills: Hide +12, Listen +3, Move Silently +4, Spot +3, Survival +1 (+5 when tracking by scent)
Feats: Track

Juvenile Wolf
Small Animal
Hit Dice: 1d8+1 (5 hp)
Initiative: +3
Speed: 40 ft. (8 squares)
Armor Class: 16 (+3 Dex, +1 Size, +2 Natural), touch 14, flat-footed 12
Base Attack/Grapple: +0/-5
Attacks: Bite +0 melee (1d4-1)
Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: Trip (-1 modifier)
Special Qualities: Low-light vision, scent
Saves: Fort +3, Ref +5, Will +1
Abilities: Str 9, Dex 17, Con 13, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 6
Skills: Hide +7, Listen +3, Move Silently +3, Spot +3, Survival +1 (+5 when tracking by scent)
Feats: Track, Weapon Focus (bite)