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MammonAzrael
2008-01-12, 02:56 AM
I'm looking to make an Assassin in a Core-only game. I've yet to play a sneaky or skill-monkey character, so any advice would be appreciated. The game starts at level 10.

As I said, Core-ONLY. This includes items and whatnot.

Stats (with no lv adjustments): 10, 10, 11, 12, 16, 17

Right now I'm looking at Rouge 5/Assassin 5.
Using WBL, so 49,000 GP for items.
Armor wise, I'm thinking the Shadow and Silent Moves enhancements.
Are the Assassin's Dagger or Sword of Subtlety worth getting?
Are there any Wands I should be looking at?
What am I not thinking of? Thanks for the suggestions!

icthius
2008-01-12, 03:06 AM
Honestly, a straight rogue works better for an assassin roleplay wise than the assassin class. It's also better for the mechanics too.

SoD
2008-01-12, 03:11 AM
I personally think that rogue 5/assassin 5 should work fine, as for items...well, if you can, get some potions of poison, if there's someone you're trying to kill, feed 'em the potion in their sleep, and wait a minute. Check for a pulse. If they're still alive...well, they're asleep. A sneak attack (because they're denied their dex bonus) coupled with a death attack (they don't recognise you as an enemy...because they're asleep) coupled with a coup de grace (I think asleep counts as helpless) should finish 'em off.

Metal Head
2008-01-12, 09:19 AM
I know that people around here play the monk, but flavor-wise it would be pretty cool. Think, and assassin that kills using no weapons, meaning that you don't attract attention to yourself because you can go around as a regular commoner. It goes well with the "discreet assassin" concept. But if you don't want to do monk, then just go with rogue. If you can also try going into shadowdancer.

CASTLEMIKE
2008-01-12, 07:40 PM
I'm looking to make an Assassin in a Core-only game. I've yet to play a sneaky or skill-monkey character, so any advice would be appreciated. The game starts at level 10.

As I said, Core-ONLY. This includes items and whatnot.

Stats (with no lv adjustments): 10, 10, 11, 12, 16, 17

Right now I'm looking at Rouge 5/Assassin 5.
Using WBL, so 49,000 GP for items.
Armor wise, I'm thinking the Shadow and Silent Moves enhancements.
Are the Assassin's Dagger or Sword of Subtlety worth getting?
Are there any Wands I should be looking at?
What am I not thinking of? Thanks for the suggestions!


Based on point buy rules I'd consider changing that 17 to a 16 (3 points for ability scores dropping it to a 16) and making that 12 a 14 and the 11 a 12 if possible in your game.

It depends on how you define core IMO: Is the Sword of Subtlety core? Not limiting yourself to the PHB and DMG but utilizing the SRD I'd consider taking a +2 LA template like Phrenic and with LA buy down you should be able to play it with the template already bought down at level 10 using the LA buydown rules. The same thing goes for a SRD Major bloodline already paid for and bought down.

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/bloodlines.htm#bloodlineStrengthAndSource


Playing a variant Psychic Rogue and a standard or variant Psychic Assassin could be interesting and the use of psionics by a PC is not normally affected by wearing armor:

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20040723b

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20040723d

Bag of Tricks for combat when you are not assassinating targets.

Elven boots for the +5 to moving silently or Boots of Striding and Spring possibly with both enchantments depending on how your game handles the multiple enchantments for market cost.

Elven Cloak for the +5 to hiding and depending on how your campaign handles the cost mechanics for dual or more enchantment magic items consider adding +1 or +2 Cloak of Resistance enchantments.

Hat of Disguise (Assassinating, Cons or Infiltration in Disguise for witnesses).

+2 Amulet of Health grants your PC +10 hit points at level 10 for 4,000 gp

Wand of Cure light wounds. Probably a few potions of alter self and invisibility.

Depending on how strictly your game interprets the rules you may want a race with low light or dark vision.

Flawless
2008-01-12, 11:01 PM
Rouge 5/ Assassin 5 works well. For wands, I'd recomment a wand of greater invisibility. Good defensive spell and you can sneak attack freely. It's a bit expensive but woth every single copperpiece. Two Weapon fighting is a good option as well. Double attacks = double sneak attacks. Get something that allows you to fly. Some potions or another wand, if you have the money left.

Person_Man
2008-01-13, 02:24 PM
Here's an odd build that you may wish to consider:

Human Rogue 1/Paladin 10 with high Int and Cha

Seriously.

After you turn 12th level, roleplay some sort of Evil fall. Turn into a Blackguard, and trade in 10 Paladin levels for Blackguard levels. You are now a Rogue 1/Fallen Paladin 1/Blackguard 10. This gives you 4th level spells, Sneak Attack, a Fiendish Servant to Flank with, and all the cool Blackguard abilities. For your next level, head back into Rogue.

You now have the nifty Skills that you want, but plenty of power to back it up. You have fewer Skill points, but that really shouldn't be a problem if you're smart about your choices. All you really need is Search, Spot, Listen, Tumble, Bluff, Sense Motive, and Use Magic Device. Most other Skills can be approximated or gotten around using Wands or creative roleplaying.

The only serious benefit that you're missing by not taking Assassin is Death Attack, which is a trap. The Save DC will never be very high, Undead/Constructs/etc are immune, and most enemies have a high Fort Save.

Kojiro Kakita
2008-01-13, 03:22 PM
If you have access to the Tome of Battle Book, create a swordsage who specializes in Shadow Hand and Diamond Mind. Pretty assasin like if you ask me.

CASTLEMIKE
2008-01-13, 09:52 PM
Rogue -3 for skill points, evasion and sneak attack, Bard or Barbarian -1, F- 1, Cl- 1 for turning, domain abilities to taste and some minor spellcasting, Wiz - 1 (or Sorcerer) for a Raven familar messenger and great spy that can speak or some other animal to personal taste, Assassin - 3.

(Bard abilities or +10 Movement, Rage 1/Day), +4D6 Sneak Attack, Trap sense, Fighter open bonus feat, some minor spellcasting as a Cleric - 1, Sorc or Wizard - 1 and Assassin - 3 without needing to worry about most UMDs with items. Evasion, Uncanny Dodge, Death Attack and Poison Use. +7 BAB with averaging.

SilentNight
2008-01-13, 10:03 PM
I know that people around here play the monk, but flavor-wise it would be pretty cool. Think, and assassin that kills using no weapons, meaning that you don't attract attention to yourself because you can go around as a regular commoner. It goes well with the "discreet assassin" concept. But if you don't want to do monk, then just go with rogue. If you can also try going into shadowdancer.

But then once you're finishe with asn you can't go back to monk. It is some pretty awesome fluffy-crunch though. However you could just buy a monk's belt(actually that is a must have for any unarmoured build, +4 AC on average due to the wis bonus, much more for clerics, and let's you do 1d8 damage with your bare hands. Pretty cool for spellcasters.

Rog 5/Asn 5 is a pretty solid choice. I would stay away from the sword of subtlety due to its price but the assasin's dagger is not a bad choice. If you want to spring for it a ring of invisibility is very nice as it allows you to death attack your victims easily aslwell as re-sneak attacking and possibly re-death attacking them after the first round. I'd go with a halfling or an elf for race.

SilentNight
2008-01-13, 10:04 PM
I know that people around here play the monk, but flavor-wise it would be pretty cool. Think, and assassin that kills using no weapons, meaning that you don't attract attention to yourself because you can go around as a regular commoner. It goes well with the "discreet assassin" concept. But if you don't want to do monk, then just go with rogue. If you can also try going into shadowdancer.

But then once you're finishe with asn you can't go back to monk. It is some pretty awesome fluffy-crunch though. However you could just buy a monk's belt(actually that is a must have for any unarmoured build, +4 AC on average due to the wis bonus, much more for clerics, and let's you do 1d8 damage with your bare hands. Pretty cool for spellcasters.

Rog 5/Asn 5 is a pretty solid choice. I would stay away from the sword of subtlety due to its price but the assasin's dagger is not a bad choice. If you want to spring for it a ring of invisibility is very nice as it allows you to death attack your victims easily aslwell as re-sneak attacking and possibly re-death attacking them after the first round. I'd go with a halfling or an elf for race.

F.L.
2008-01-13, 10:09 PM
Poisons are usually too expensive for what they do. Avoid spending money on them.

SilentNight
2008-01-13, 10:11 PM
I know that people around here play the monk, but flavor-wise it would be pretty cool. Think, and assassin that kills using no weapons, meaning that you don't attract attention to yourself because you can go around as a regular commoner. It goes well with the "discreet assassin" concept. But if you don't want to do monk, then just go with rogue. If you can also try going into shadowdancer.

But then once you're finishe with asn you can't go back to monk. It is some pretty awesome fluffy-crunch though. However you could just buy a monk's belt(actually that is a must have for any unarmoured build, +4 AC on average due to the wis bonus, much more for clerics, and let's you do 1d8 damage with your bare hands. Pretty cool for spellcasters.

Rog 5/Asn 5 is a pretty solid choice. I would stay away from the sword of subtlety due to its price but the assasin's dagger is not a bad choice. If you want to spring for it a ring of invisibility is very nice as it allows you to death attack your victims easily aslwell as re-sneak attacking and possibly re-death attacking them after the first round. I'd go with a halfling or an elf for race.

Tormsskull
2008-01-14, 08:20 AM
So seeing as I actually read the first post and realise that this is for a CORE only game (Core = PHB, MM, DMG), I'll say that assassins can be a tricky business. With the requirements of the class forcing your character to be evil, and chaining your character to an organization, it may not be worth it.

Rogue 10 can work very well for an assassin-type character, as Death Attack isn't all that great based on the way its mechanic's work. Besides the standard course of taking 2-weapon fighting, weapon finesse, a light armor with a high +max dex bonus, and then boosting your dex up the wazoo, I don't have any specific suggestions.

Good luck

Metal Head
2008-01-14, 10:04 AM
But then once you're finishe with asn you can't go back to monk. It is some pretty awesome fluffy-crunch though.

But if you go into shadowdancer after assassin then you have one badass killer. As if an assassin that can go virtually unsuspected thanks to his lack of weapons wasn't cool enough, now that assassin can jump from shadow to shadow, make illusions out of shadows, and more cool stuff. It would be as badass as this (http://youtube.com/watch?v=fZ0myfZlR1g) (except without the swords)

CASTLEMIKE
2008-01-14, 10:12 AM
Consider taking a single level as a variant Diviner for bumping up your Death Attack saving throw with Intelligence modifier since this is a skill monkey:

Prescience (Ex)
Gifted with extraordinary insight and perceptive abilities, a diviner using this variant can add an insight bonus equal to her Intelligence modifier to any attack roll, saving throw, skill check, or level check she makes. The diviner can use this ability once per day, plus one additional time per day for every five class levels attained. Using this ability is a free action that can be taken out of turn if needed, but the character must choose to use this ability before the die roll is made.

A diviner using this variant does not gain additional spells per day for being a specialist wizard.

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/specialistWizardVariants.htm#divinerVariants

Person_Man
2008-01-14, 10:22 AM
Also, if you do go Assassin, consider Craft (Poison making). Many DMs will allow down time for the character between adventures, during which they make things. It will save you a lot of cash. Otherwise, using poison is just way too expensive.

Crow
2008-01-27, 12:04 AM
Rogue4/Fighter1/Assassin5 is pretty good. You have to suck it up and drop skill points cross-class to get your Hide and Move Silently to 8, so you'll need 14 INT (or 12 if human). This makes up for the point of BAB you lose, gives you an extra feat, and you don't really lose anything substantial in return.

Also, a Headband of Intellect is a much better way to boost your death attack DC than the Assassin's Dagger.