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Ebaine Vulkarn
2008-01-13, 09:09 AM
Hey y'all.
Obviously I'm new to the forums, but have been lurking around for quite some time.
I'll make the assumption that, since we are all the kind of geeks that we undoubtedly are, most people here know what I'm talking about when I mention an "Ur-Quan".
To those unfamiliar with the term, Ur-Quan are an alien race and main antagonists of the cult-status sci-fi adventure game of the early 90's- Star Control.

What really piqued my interest was how similar they were modeled (physique aside) to the Gith, with regards to history and philosophy.
Is it a coincidence, or were they fashioned after the Gith?

Aquillion
2008-01-13, 05:43 PM
A quick google search reveals that nobody has even commented on the similarity before, so I doubt they're actually related. It's probably just a coincidence.

Also, the Githzerai aren't like the green Kzer-Za at all; only the Githyanki really fit. Although the Talking Pets do look a bit like a mind flayer toad...

Also also, this whole thread is spoilers for Star Control 2...

horseboy
2008-01-13, 06:41 PM
A quick google search reveals that nobody has even commented on the similarity before, so I doubt they're actually related. It's probably just a coincidence.

Also, the Githzerai aren't like the green Kzer-Za at all; only the Githyanki really fit. Although the Talking Pets do look a bit like a mind flayer toad...

Also also, this whole thread is spoilers for Star Control 2...
You don't get spoilers for free ware.

Yeah, I could totally see them as Kohr-ah.

shadow_archmagi
2008-01-13, 06:51 PM
No idea what a Gith is, but you win for mentioning that game.

Talya
2008-01-13, 07:37 PM
Don't make us *frumple.* We are not *happy campers.* Our *fingers* will *dance* with you *silly cows.*

Jormund
2008-01-13, 07:53 PM
Don't make us *frumple.* We are not *happy campers.* Our *fingers* will *dance* with you *silly cows.*
"Oh yeah, well last time I checked, what we left here didn't look like oversized fish and they talked proper english, too. Care to explain?"

Well, i mean that was one of the more interesting twists in that game, but I digress...

Did the githyanki use massive amounts of self-inflicted pain to break out of the mind control, too?

Kompera
2008-01-13, 10:06 PM
Oh, the memories...

Our great enemy, the unspeakable evil, which proves its evil intent by hiding beyond the range of even our most powerful sensors.

Rolaran
2008-01-14, 12:58 AM
The scary part is...

I have homebrewed both the Orz and the Kohr-Ah, and used them in a campaign.

Ironically, while attempting to send them back to their home plane, the party accidentally opened a gate to the Astral Plane.

Guess who found it.

So in my campaign, the Githyanki and the Kohr-Ah are now purging opposite sides of the planet, mirroring the old battle between the two kinds of Ur-Quan.

So yeah, I can see that resemblance there.

Ebaine Vulkarn
2008-01-14, 07:41 AM
For those unfamiliar with such a resemblance I will explain:

The Ur-Quan are a race of tentacled worms with mandibles, six pair of eyes and a nasty temper.

Thet were once part of a league which controlled this sector of space, known as The Sentient Milieu.

When the Milieu ran into a race of psionically endowed critters known as the Dnyarri, they were all soon subjugated, with the exception of the Taalo which were impervious to mind control.

To remove the Taalo threat, the Dnyarri sent the Ur Quan to eradicate them. Before they were taken over by the Dnyarri, the Ur Quan saw the Taalo as their closest friends.

The sadistic Dnyarri then proceeded to mess with the Ur Quan's biology, the end result being that they genetically spliced them to create two different races, one serving as warriors, the others- scientist. Along the years, one of the Ur Quan scientist named Kzer-Za (after whom all green Ur Quan are know named) devised a plan to rid the Ur Quan of the yoke of slavery.

The plan was successful, and the Dnyarri were defeated and, in turn, genetically transformed into mere pets.

Both races of the Ur Quan agreed that from that day on, they will let no one enslave them (here the similarities reach an apex), but while Kzer Za thought the best way to accomplish this goal was to enslave all other sentient races, Kohr-Ah, a black Ur Quan, proposed that the best way to carry out this agenda was to purge the universe of sentient life.

The disagreement resulted in a never-ending war between the two races.

The Gith were a race which are postulated to have descended from man.
They have been subjugated by the Illithid to slavery and genetically-tampered with. They revolted by using the Illithids weaknesses and haughtiness (much the same way as the Ur Quan did) once freed, Gith, the leader of the rebellion, and Zerthimon, a prominent figure in the rebellion and a leader unto his own right, agreed that they shall never let any race enslave them again, but disagreed about the how.
Gith was of a mind that all those who are capable of enslaving them must be brought to the sword or enslaved, while Zerthimon said that such a path will lead to their corruption, and said that they simply must never serve or answer to anyone.
A civil war broke between the two factions- the Githyanki, lead by Gith, and the Githzerai, followers of Zerthimon.
Since then, the Githyanki are ever attempting to destroy and conquer all resistance, while the Githzerai merely sit in insulation in Limbo and once ina while send war parties to fight the Illithid or the Githyanki.

pendell
2008-01-14, 08:01 AM
But do the Githyanki have a frungy team?

Respectfully,

Brian P.

This post was brought to you by ... Frungy! The sport of kings!

Bizboz
2009-10-12, 12:49 AM
Also note that old school D&D artist Erol Otus did much of the illustration for StarCon2.

Absolutely not a coincidence.

taltamir
2009-10-12, 01:02 AM
Well... wikipedia says that the gith were first mentioned in 1981 (I was sure they were newer than the ur quan, but I seem to have been wrong). That is actually before star control came out. But I don't think they are related.

For those who are interested, star control 2 was opened souced and has been cleaned up, graphically improved a little and ported to various platforms by this project:
http://sc2.sourceforge.net/

they even got people from the original audio team to create new music with modern tools (comprised of more than just beeps of a few tones)

theMycon
2009-10-12, 01:10 AM
Having never seen a picture of a Gith, I would only like to say that I did, once, call them "worse than Zebranky" purely by coincidence.

taltamir
2009-10-12, 01:14 AM
Having never seen a picture of a Gith, I would only like to say that I did, once, call them "worse than Zebranky" purely by coincidence.

gith look human... He is probably referencing their history and culture. As both were once enslaved by telepathic beings, whom they eventually overthrew.

Mikeavelli
2009-10-12, 01:47 AM
They're both inspired by the same source material.

Larry Niven's workinspired the Gith races (http://www.sevendead.com/charles-stross-interview/) according to their creator.

Similarly, The Dnyarri were very similar to Larry Niven's Thrintun, and he's an acknowledged influence in the creation of Star Control II (http://wiki.uqm.stack.nl/Influences_and_references#Larry_Niven_influences). The gith races are also cited as possible influences on the creation of the Ur-Quan and Kohr-ah.

The multicultural slave empire dominated by powerfully telepathic alien entities that fell due to a slave revolt came from Niven as far back as I can trace. Even then, it's just a Science fiction version of theh old "Empire overthrown by its own slaves" story that has been around since Spartacus, at the very least.

Essentially both creators were avid fans of the same source material, and created similar derivative works out of that inspiration.

I've wanted to run a campaign where the Gith were reflavored into Ur-Quan and Kohr-Ah for a while now, actually.

gdiddy
2009-10-12, 01:56 AM
I'm shocked how many people don't know about the Githesszszs-s. "Gith" is the name of their undying lich queen, who guides them on an endless crusade against their enemies (http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Emperor_of_Mankind).

Hasn't anyone played Planescape: Torment?

starwoof
2009-10-12, 04:21 AM
Wouldn't that actually be Vlaakith? Gith has been disappeared for a long, long time.:smallconfused:

kamikasei
2009-10-12, 04:27 AM
And the Lich-Queen of the Githyanki is an active entity who really does drive her race's actions, going so far as to consume the souls of the most powerful Githyanki to keep anyone from rising to challenge her. Not all that comparable to the Emperor on his Golden Throne.

bosssmiley
2009-10-12, 04:55 AM
Also note that old school D&D artist Erol Otus did much of the illustration for StarCon2.

*nerdgasms* :smallbiggrin:

One question: who are the D&D equivalent of the Spathi? :smallconfused:

The_Snark
2009-10-12, 04:59 AM
One question: who are the D&D equivalent of the Spathi? :smallconfused:

Kobolds. Small, cowardly, but ingenious; if you chase them, they will make your life a living hell.

... you know, while I'm happy to see Star Control-related posts, this is actually quite an old thread. Perhaps we ought to start a new one so that this one can rest in peace?

kamikasei
2009-10-12, 05:14 AM
... you know, while I'm happy to see Star Control-related posts, this is actually quite an old thread. Perhaps we ought to start a new one so that this one can rest in peace?

D'oh, missed that. Have flagged it to a mod so if one of you wants to start a new thread...

gdiddy
2009-10-12, 05:23 AM
And the Lich-Queen of the Githyanki is an active entity who really does drive her race's actions, going so far as to consume the souls of the most powerful Githyanki to keep anyone from rising to challenge her. Not all that comparable to the Emperor on his Golden Throne.

You're probably absolutely correct, but I at least knew about them. :smalltongue:

Eldan
2009-10-12, 05:55 AM
So, is Gith the Emperor and Vlaakith Horus, then? :smallbiggrin:

Okay, the situation is different. But still.

Roland St. Jude
2009-10-12, 09:09 AM
Sheriff of Moddingham:Please start a new thread rather than reviving year and half old ones. Thanks.