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bayushisan
2008-01-20, 03:06 PM
Hey all
We've got a bit of a disagreement in my gaming group so I thought I'd bring the question to you all. Would the heavy fortification enhancement stop a swordsage's abilities cold. Most of them are extraordinary abilities and some rely on hitting the foe in a vunerable spot. If something is immune to crits it seems to me that there are more than a few manuevers that would be useless against that creature.

What say the rest of you?

Person_Man
2008-01-20, 03:10 PM
Heavy Fortification protects you from Critical Hits and Precision Damage. That's it. A Swordsage can have many abilities that rely on neither.

kamikasei
2008-01-20, 03:12 PM
Abilities that only work against targets vulnerable to critical hits say so explicitly (or point to another ability which does, as with Assassin's Stance). See "Death in the Dark". Being Ex or Su has nothing to do with it. So no, this wouldn't work. Swordsages have lot of maneuvers that don't deal precision damage.

Dark Tira
2008-01-20, 03:14 PM
It would generally have no effect on most Swordsage abilities unless the ability was based on critical hits or precision-based damaged. So for example it would mess up Blood in the Water and Assassin's Stance but not Flashing Sun or Shadow Blade Technique.

NEO|Phyte
2008-01-20, 03:33 PM
It would generally have no effect on most Swordsage abilities unless the ability was based on critical hits or precision-based damaged. So for example it would mess up Blood in the Water and Assassin's Stance but not Flashing Sun or Shadow Blade Technique.
Actually, it wouldn't mess up Blood in the Water, there was a Custserv question regarding this, like the X Burst weapon abilities, it can still be triggered against crit-immune foes. Gimme a minute and I'll find the question (and answer) in question.
:edit: Found it (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=683775)! Its in the maneuvers - stances spoiler.

Q Blood in the Water: How does this interact with an opponent who cannot be critted, but you have a Flaming Burst weapon? Does that count as a crit?

A The ability doesn't specifically state that it doesn't work on creatures that are immune to critical hit damage, nor is the bonus from the maneuver treated as critical hit damage, so it looks like this maneuver would work on a creature that is immune to crits.

bayushisan
2008-01-20, 04:30 PM
Actually, it wouldn't mess up Blood in the Water, there was a Custserv question regarding this, like the X Burst weapon abilities, it can still be triggered against crit-immune foes. Gimme a minute and I'll find the question (and answer) in question.
:edit: Found it (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=683775)! Its in the maneuvers - stances spoiler.

From what I'm seeing it looks like a good number of manuevers are unaffected, however its looking depressingly like the majority of those from Diamond Mind, which are precision based, are affected. The strikes would be at any rate.

FinalJustice
2008-01-20, 05:37 PM
I really don't think so. If some ability is screwed by critical hit immunity, it is said specifically on the description. If it doesn't have that 'This doesn't work on creatures immune to critical hits/sneak attack', it works.

kamikasei
2008-01-20, 06:04 PM
Indeed, just because an ability describes itself as working because it hits precisely, does not make it precision damage in game terms. Think of it as being "through careful concentration, I strike just at the right point in his defenses to do the most damage" rather than "I catch him off guard and hit him in a particularly vulnerable area". It's the difference between finding a chink in the armor and putting a dagger in an organ rather than in muscle.