Baldur's Gate - question answered, proceed. [Archive]

ufo

2008-01-27, 06:27 AM

Might as well use this thread instead of making a new one:

Later today, when I can be bothered, I will order the Baldur's Gate 2 Double Pack, which should contain both SoA and ToB. I've heard much about this game and I can't wait to try it out. I know there's been some problems with making it run on XP, but I found a forum yesterday with all the fixes In the World!!!, so I should be able to make it work.

I prefer to roleplay, and not think too much about the crunch, but I have a little question, so here goes: Does rings/amulets/etc. count as armor? I was thinking of taking a Wizard Slayer Fighter Kit, because it has nifty bonuses, but the lack of magical amulets/rings/etc. will be a big minus.

EDIT: Oh yeah, another question: When I have installed both SoA and ToB, how do I use the content of the two games? Does it work like with Neverwinter Nights, that the original game sort of "gets upgraded" so that I can choose between the two campaigns from the game itself?

Reinboom

2008-01-27, 06:39 AM

Even though you roleplay... ignore Charisma unless you require it. This is AD&D, remember this. Charisma is more a dump stat. Even the sorcerer uses Intelligence here.

Really, not having access to rings or amulets will only hurt you slightly for those really nifty ones... and a bit more later on if you try doing silly things. It'll be the random magic items that will hurt you worse. Oh, and weapons and armor means those slots, not things that act as them, iirc.
The Wizard slayer has other issues, however. If it's your first time through the game, the game is rather difficult as is, and, I would recommend against it, as it is a bit gimping.

Although you have a party, if your main character dies... game over. So, gimping your party? great. Gimping your main character is a bit iffy.

2008-01-27, 06:47 AM

EDIT: Oh yeah, another question: When I have installed both SoA and ToB, how do I use the content of the two games?You'll have the option of either starting a game of SoA (which uses all the new mechanics introduced in the expansion) and progressing to ToB when you've completed that story, OR building a new character and jumping right into the ToB storyline and never playing SoA. You can't switch back and forth between the story areas

Mordokai

2008-01-27, 06:55 AM

I'd also advise against taking the wizard slayer for fist time player. Bonus aren't that great, and you can't use any magical items, others than armor and weapons, which can be quite a pain in the ass. If you want fighter, take berserker instead. Much better than WS. I'm playing with one at the moment and it's great fun, and quite easy.

As for the roleplaying, it's true what SweetRein said. However, I would advice droping CHA down to 3, since I find that totally unrealistic. Same with INT. Other than that, just boost STR, DEX and CON to 18 and you have a tank. The berserker mantioned above had the following scores: 16/10/17/10/18/15. She was not optimised, but she was much more fun to play with, at least in my eyes. And I didn't even dual-class her into cleric.

ufo

2008-01-27, 06:56 AM

Aw, bugger, I can't remember where that forum was with all the XP fixes/tips.

Anyways, thanks for the info guys/gals. Om, that's what I meant. I blame lacking English vocabulary :smalltongue:

2008-01-27, 07:33 AM

Your English was grand ufo, I just couldn't remember just how NWN worked :smallsmile:

Serpentine

2008-01-27, 07:37 AM

And who is this beleted you talk about? I can't seem to remember any such opponent in game.

Depending on which route you took.. you.. shouldn't really need to fight that NPC. :smalleek:
I also recommend making battles autopause. Makes things so much easier to handle.It's still in the city at the start. Considering the conversation goes something like this:
"I think you might be evil. Lets test it. What's your favourite colour?"
"Red"
"Like blood and fear!"
"I mean blue"
"Like bruises!"
"Green?"
"Rot and decay!"
"Pink, then!"
"Barbie!"
etc, I could never figure out a way to avoid it, unless you're meant to do something else first... And yeah, I know that trick. Quite handy.

For the 5th disk issue...
Do you use multiple drives? Make absolutely sure you install all the disks from the same drive. This problem happens most often when you use multiple cd drives.This could very well be it, though it didn't have any trouble with the ones before. Also it did specifically ask for the "fifth disc". I'll try starting it again and sticking with the one drive, anyway. Thanks.

ufo, two questions. First: What needs to be fixed? Second: Will you try to find that site again?

Reinboom

2008-01-27, 07:54 AM

@ufo (and possibly serp)

You'll want the fix pack on this site: http://www.gibberlings3.net/downloads/index.php
I also recommend the tweak pack. Especially if you are like me and want to do same sex romances. :smalltongue:

and... I highly recommend the uScript. AI is annoying otherwise.

@serp
Yes, I know. The 5th disc error is common. It happens when either the drive misses a portion of data, or, it was juggling discs too much. If what I recommended earlier doesn't fix it, then, you may want a disc cleaner. But it should fix it.

=edit insert=
I've also have yet to get an extreme issue with running the game on XP.

ufo

2008-01-27, 07:54 AM

ufo, two questions. First: What needs to be fixed? Second: Will you try to find that site again?

There's nothing that needs to be fixed since I don't have the game yet, but there seems to be quite a lot of problems with running it on WinXP; so I might as well be prepared. :smallbiggrin:

And yes, I am trying to find it again.

Driderman

2008-01-27, 08:03 AM

Ufo, it should be easy enough to run on XP. I bought the Baldurs Gate collection (yes, 4 discs all in all, for BG I + II and expansions!) from Gamestop a couple months ago. Baldurs Gate I will require you to get a patch from the official Bioware site. Can't remember which one, but there's only four to choose from so it shouldn't be too hard. If you don't patch it, it will complain that you don't have an english OS, even if you do.
As for BG II, it should run straight smooth from the start. Remember patching it though, that should alleviate a few issues.
You may want to download the Shadowkeeper, a modifying tool for the game... Although if this is your first playthrough I advise against it. When you gone through it a couple of times, the Shadowkeeper is a fun little thing to give your character über-stats or change your race so you play through it as an Ankheg, or something like that :)

Oh yeah, mods. You should definitely check out the mods. Throne Of Bhaal caught a lot of flack for being a railroad trip of combat encounters and not much else, but if you google BG II mods you should find all sorts of interesting mods for both BG II and TOB.

Have fun, good luck and if you want an easy character for your first playthrough, play a paladin

ufo

2008-01-27, 08:41 AM

I'm downloading the patches for SoA and ToB and the G3 tweak pack and fix pack and storing them in a folder for now. It should be max. a week until I get the game, but I might as well do it now and save myself the trouble later. :smallbiggrin:

Serpentine

2008-01-27, 08:49 AM

Reina, your advice resulted in the exact opposite of this:

http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2007/11/funny-pictures-bird-cat-cage.jpg

Thank you :biggrin:

Driderman

2008-01-27, 08:49 AM

You might want to check out the Virtue mod, which divides reputation into two categories, Virtue and Reputation, so you can be a popular evil person or despised good one.
One of my favourite mods, adds a bit more flavour to the game, very unintrusive and very well done.
You may also want to look for an Unfinished Business mod, as this one contains restoration and expansions upon features cut from the game.

ufo

2008-01-27, 09:10 AM

Another question (sorry for ruthlessly invading your thread Serp): When I have installed SoA, should I patch it before installing ToB, or should I patch it after installing ToB, or should I not patch SoA at all?

Reinboom

2008-01-27, 09:13 AM

Patch after ToB installation.

And *snickers towards Serp.*

Serpentine

2008-01-27, 09:17 AM

Don't worry ufo, go ahead. I'll want to know this stuff anyway.

Driderman

2008-01-27, 10:46 AM

:smallredface:

I actually thought UFO was the OP... Well, at least half my comments were really directed at you then, Serpentine....

Mordokai

2008-01-27, 10:48 AM

If you want to mod your game, go here (http://weidu.org/main.html), here (http://www.sorcerers.net/), here (http://www.pocketplane.net/mambo/) or here (http://www.spellholdstudios.net/). There are many good mods, and many in development, bound to amke a good game even better. Check the description. I advice against installing ANY mods if this is your first playthrought, the game is good enought without them. When you play as much times as I did, them mods come in play. But avoid mods like Tactics and Improved anvil, they make the game much too hard for someone who is not a veteran. Mods that add flavour, like Virtue, Banter pack and similar, they are he ones I like the most. And additional romances. Never can have enought of those :smallbiggrin:

@Serpentine: Galvarey isn't that hard. No, you can't avoid fighting him, no matter what you say. The key is, make the whole party attack one member of his party and take him down, then the next one and so far. This usually works. If you sill can't make it, lower the difficulty in options. If you wan't to avoid fight with him completely, drop Jaheira from party. You'll never have to fight Galvarey that way.

Highlight the text to see what it writes. I didn't want to spoiler anything, so I putted the text in white colour.

Serpentine

2008-01-27, 10:52 AM

Heheh... No Drider, my question was answered pretty quickly, and I think all yours were in response to ufo.

Mordokai, this was some years ago, so I might be better by now... Maybe. I only really tried a few times. Thanks, though, I'll try that - I don't really want to avoid it completely.

Pronounceable

2008-01-27, 11:03 AM

I also advise against mods on the first playthrough. You can go nuts with mods after you finish the game a couple or more times. Or not. I was a mod junkie before I reformed and stopped playing BG2 (which took me about 3 years). Mods DO improve the game, especially in the difficulty department. Which is good, because the game is too easy once you know all along what's gonna happen.

However, there's one mod that's practically essential once you started the game a few times: Dungeon Be Gone. The starting dungeon is one of the better ones in the game. However it inspires suicide after about 10th time you restart the game. This nifty little mod solves the problem by placing an NPC at the start who teleports you to the exit and gives you all items that can be found and all XP as well.

Dungeon Be Gone is vital for a BG2 player's sanity.

Driderman

2008-01-27, 05:42 PM

I'll have to concur with starting your first playthrough without mods. Save perhaps Virtue, since that's really how it ought to have been made in the first place... And if you play a Thief, an improved Thief Stronghold mod might be nice because the Thief Stronghold is BORING

Serpentine

2008-01-29, 11:53 PM

More BG2 issues :smallsigh:
I played it for a while... Then a message came up saying something along the lines of "Something or other Error, the thing with lots of letters and numbers is larger than the other thing with lots of letters that included something like "C" and "vid"" and the game dies.
My compooter's being mean lately :smallfrown:

Wraith

2008-01-30, 10:00 AM

Fear not, Serpentine - I get that message sometimes, and as far as I can tell it *IS* just the computer having a tantrum. The game itself is always uneffected, barring the fact that it exited without saving, so you can probably just live with it, if you get into the habit of using "Q" every few minutes.

Which, to be honest, you probably should be doing anyway. This game seems to have been made with Murphy in mind, and if anyone is going to walk into a Save or Die trap/spell and come out the other side in a wooden box, it's ALWAYS going to be the protagonist.... :smallamused:

Anyways... My name is Wraith, and I'm a compulsive BG2 Player.

I've had it since it came out, and I've tried playing through it every 6 months since only to get various parts of my various anatomies handed back to me by all sorts of horrific encounters. I've played Good, Neutral and Evil; Fighter, Mage and Rogue; Pure Class, Multi-Class, Dual Class and Kit, and at some point or another I've killed (and been killed by) just about every creature in the game.

Including Elminster and Volo. And Cespanar. Especially Cespanar.

Now that I seem to have found some like-minded fanatics, let me ask once and for all... WHO, do you think, has the best Romance in the game?

Everyone I speak to seems to prefer a different one, and that statement includes the fan-made Mods for Valygar, Solufein, Valen and even Imoen:smalleek: Personally I find Aerie to be a miserable whiner and too easy to 'complete', Anomen is a git and Jahiera isn't very useful in the party that I like to use. That leaves Viconia, which is fortunate because I think she is the most entertaining person to have in the party after Jan, and together they are hilarious company.

Care to differ?

Serpentine

2008-01-30, 10:18 AM

I... don't really know yet. What about female protagonist romances?

Another thing: I misunderstood the "frame rate" or something option, and set it up high. Now I can't un-set it, and it's all looking rather Benny Hill...

SilentNight

2008-01-30, 10:29 AM

To my knowledge the only female protagonist romance is with the gimpy cleric Anomen who I hated. Also in regards to the above mentioned boss just don't adventure with that member who started all this.

Veridian

2008-01-30, 01:09 PM

Jan, Ewdin, Viconia and Minsc are my favorites. None of the others seem to have much in the way of unique personality, and I like the infighting the bad guys get up to :smalltongue:

Blayze

2008-01-30, 01:57 PM

I was thinking of taking a Wizard Slayer Fighter Kit

Don't do it, unless you've installed the mod that improves them. Seriously, a vanilla Wizard Slayer is pants (And I love them!) unless you Dual-Class them into a Thief ("Use Any Item, you say? Do you mean any item, or *any* item? Show me the small print. All of it." "Sir, please get out."), and even then they're under-loved compared to the Kensai/Thief.

Even though you roleplay... ignore Charisma unless you require it.

Let's see if I can remember this correctly... In Athkatla alone, right from the off, you can obtain a Ring of Dump Stat (That is to say, a ring that improves your Charisma to 18), and you really don't have to look much further to get a pair of Gauntlets of Dexterity (18 Dex). Then there's a collection of Belts that set your Strength to some high number, and you can forge the mighty Crom Faeyr if you want to set it to 25.

One mod that I absolutely INSIST that every single player (Especially the item hoarders) downloads is the Ruad mod. Basically, you can upgrade a vast collection of items, often from quest items that you no longer need.

As for XP fixes, I must admit that I had some issues with the sound (Soundbites, mostly. Voice files played during dialogue seemed to work perfectly, though), until I fiddled around with the DirectX options (I believe I turned down the Acceleration, but don't quote me).

You may also want to look for an Unfinished Business mod

I had problems with one of the latest versions of that mod, as well as Check The Bodies. They didn't like the game at all. Things just... stopped working.

As for the romances? Bah. Aerie just whined and whined and whined non-stop. Jaheira's was so full of romance-breaking bugs that it was unnatural, and Viconia's seemed to be a minefield of wrong answers and arguments, and no matter where I walked something blew up in my face. Which, I suppose, made it the most like a real relationship.

Anomen never gets in my party anyway (He's a nonce), but the man's annoying as hell. Fan-made romances? I've tried the Imoen one, but I failed to get enough "Relationship points" to make her consider it as a possibility.

Another thing: I misunderstood the "frame rate" or something option, and set it up high. Now I can't un-set it, and it's all looking rather Benny Hill...

Do you mean this?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v107/Blayze/Config.jpg

If so, it's here.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v107/Blayze/StartMenu.jpg

Jan, Ewdin, Viconia and Minsc are my favorites.

After downloading a class-changing mod, I have to say that I like the prospect of Imoen as a Wild Mage, although I would prefer her as a Thief/Wizard Slayer (Yes, INTO a kit). That way, I can have my Berserker Minsc, Mr. ToB, Shapeshifter Jaheira (Well, not really. At least, not without ShadowKeeper) and Viconia (I've got to admit, there's something about that Concurrent Romances mod that appeals to me. Can't *imagine* what it might be...).

St.Sinner

2008-01-30, 02:16 PM

Haer'dalis was supposed to be the other female protagonist romance, but that was canned in order to meet the release schedule. Worry not. There are heaps of romance mods for female protagonists out there. Because, let's face it, the choice between Anomen or Anomen isn't the least bit enticing (to me, at least. To be fair, he does have a huge fan base.) Try the Edwin romance mod. For the male pc my favourite romances are Viconia and Nathaniel. Aerie, Jaheira, and Anomen are all pretty awful.

Minsc, Jan, and Yoshimo are great, and I love all the evil NPCs - Edwin, Korgan, Viconia, Sarevok. Trouble is, they will get into fights with your good guys, so watch out there.

I'd agree that you don't need any mods for the first playthrough beyond the official ToB patch and probably the G3 fixpack. For the second time round, mods like Ascension and Tactics add a whole lot more challenge and intensity to the game, and I'd highly recommend them (I think Tactics has been deprecated by another mod though). And if you're a fanatic go wild with the mega-mods :smallsmile:

Pronounceable

2008-01-30, 02:19 PM

PCs sometimes do that. It's nothing unless it happens DURING saving. Then the save is lost. If it's the quicksave, you can get screwed. That only happened once though.

Another thing: I misunderstood the "frame rate" or something option, and set it up high. Now I can't un-set it, and it's all looking rather Benny Hill...

Deleting the config file should solve the problem. But play it safe, and just move it.

Including Elminster and Volo. And Cespanar. Especially Cespanar.

You killed Cespanar? AND made him hostile? How?

WHO, do you think, has the best Romance in the game?

Korgan gets the golden emmy for outstanding romance. OK, it's not exactly a romance. Actually it isn't anything close to a romance, but it's GOOD. VERY good. (I'm, of course, talking about Korgan's crude attempts to hit on Mazzy and her rebuttals. What, you thought there was a Charname+Korgan Romance?)

For Charname, love life sucks. Big time. He gets to contend with a whiny, spineless kid with an extreme inferiority complex; an overbearing, self righteous, "all natural" widow; a manipulative, heartless, cold and ultimately insecure bitch.

If this is NOT the case, then she's better off turning lesbian. Because her one choice is not really a "choice". Anomen is a deranged prick with a flimsy grasp on reality who any woman shouldn't touch with a ten foot pole. He should also be castarated to eliminate the off chance that he can somehow reproduce.

Out of the choices, Jaheira is the best. She has the most developed (gameplaywise) relationship. That explains the bugs actually. Plus, she's an old acquaintance and trustworthy. I actually like her, and always keep her in the party.

Let's see if I can remember this correctly... In Athkatla alone, right from the off, you can obtain a Ring of Dump Stat (That is to say, a ring that improves your Charisma to 18), and you really don't have to look much further to get a pair of Gauntlets of Dexterity (18 Dex). Then there's a collection of Belts that set your Strength to some high number, and you can forge the mighty Crom Faeyr if you want to set it to 25.

But that's not very smart in the long term. Sacrificing a ring slot for cha is absurd considering the powerful rings that come later (esp if you'll cheese and get 2 rings of Gaxx later). MUCH better to get the ring on someone else and initiate dialog with him. And Charname's gauntlet slot has better choices than 18 Dex, which is frankly much better for Edwin or Korgan.

Not very powergamy, but I always loved Crom Faeyr on Viconia. Especially when romancing. Sweets for my sweetheart, or something like that...

St.Sinner

2008-01-30, 02:48 PM

You killed Cespanar? AND made him hostile? How?

It's pretty heartbreaking to kill Cespenar. He goes all "No... It hurts! It hurts!" So just turn off your speakers and let him live, ok? :smallsmile:

(I'm, of course, talking about Korgan's crude attempts to hit on Mazzy and her rebuttals. What, you thought there was a Charname+Korgan Romance?)

Well, there is that one conversation in ToB... :smallwink:

Not very powergamy, but I always loved Crom Faeyr on Viconia. Especially when romancing. Sweets for my sweetheart, or something like that...

Viconia has abysmal strength, so you have to equip her with a Str enhancing item anyway if you want her to be of any use. But I find that she becomes quite effective after you boost her strength.

I can't imagine why anyone would want to romance Jaheira. A widow of, oh, about two days, whose husband is barely cold on the slab. Who used to work and travel with Gorion... making her more of your father's contemporary than yours. Meh, I'll take the whiny winged elf, thanks. :smallsmile:

Veridian

2008-01-30, 03:03 PM

But that's not very smart in the long term. Sacrificing a ring slot for cha is absurd considering the powerful rings that come later (esp if you'll cheese and get 2 rings of Gaxx later). MUCH better to get the ring on someone else and initiate dialog with him. And Charname's gauntlet slot has better choices than 18 Dex, which is frankly much better for Edwin or Korgan.

Except, it doesn't really matter. You can just swap rings around while in town if it's a bother. Why on earth would you have anyone in your party wearing that ring in battle, when it does nothing for you?

As for gauntlets, that depends entirely on your class and build. Many of my fighter and cleric builds don't use dex at all, so 18 dex can be helpful. Better stuff turns up eventually, but right from the get-go you don't have many choices.

Pronounceable

2008-01-30, 03:07 PM

Because constantly reequipping people was a bore?

Cespenar was immune to everything and never turned hostile. He didn't even die to kill cheat. I wonder how Wraith got himself killed.

A fresh widow is odd, especially if it's an aunt figure. But that's the best we got. At least she didn't make me feel like molesting a child.

Khosan

2008-01-30, 03:28 PM

I would recommend never dumping Int below ten. There are illithids, and odds are you'll end up fighting at least one. If I remember correctly, they drain about 4 or 5 int per hit.

Blayze

2008-01-30, 04:18 PM

I believe that 11 is the minimum Int for the discerning Illithid-tanker. I think they drain five points per hit, which lets you survive two. Of course, I prefer never to actually get in range of the damn things. It's not always effective, but I'm a lover of the age-old tactic of spamming meat shields- Sorry, I mean *summons*.

Because constantly reequipping people was a bore?

I wouldn't say *constantly*. Then again, I never really played a Mage, so I didn't lose spell slots (And therefore effectiveness) every time I changed rings. It was more along the lines of "Ah, a Charisma check. Time to break out the secret weapon."

Hell, if you want completely legal cheese, then import your character into enough games that you can abuse the various means of permanently gaining stats over and over again, until you have 25 in every stat and all those benefits from the Trials at the end of SoA. I don't think you can get 100% resistance to everything, but in the end I imagine you can get pretty damn close.

Archonic Energy

2008-01-30, 05:44 PM

ARRRGGH!

ok so i've caved & installed BG2... are you happy now?!

Wraith

2008-01-30, 05:50 PM

You killed Cespanar? AND made him hostile? How?

That's a typo on my part. It should read "killed and/or killed by", not both :P

Cespenar was immune to everything and never turned hostile. He didn't even die to kill cheat. I wonder how Wraith got himself killed.

An amusingly long sequence events that ultimately ended with a certain Sorcerer running out of Energy Discs and, carefully obeying the Party AI Script that I had forgotten to turn off, drawing his Quarterstaff and charging headfirst through all 6 of the Skull Traps that I had set up to get the little bastard with when he tried to run away from the Red Dragon I had summoned on the other side of the room.

Next time, Gadget - next time....

Blayze

2008-01-30, 07:47 PM

Sounds more like a Wild Magic accident to me.

Heh. I remember fighting in the combat pit in the Copper Coronet, casting Magic Missile and ending up taking out half the inn by accident. I know that, at the very least, I opened with a "Roll twice more" result and then got a "Roll four more times" one and a bunch of other stuff, including "Fireball".

Needless to say, Minsc (And the rest of the tavern) weren't too happy with my little display.

Serpentine

2008-01-30, 10:58 PM

Do you mean this?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v107/Blayze/Config.jpg

If so, it's here.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v107/Blayze/StartMenu.jpg
That wasn't the bit I was looking for, but the second one did still show me how to change the settings out of game. The problem was that when I set it in-game, it'd just reset itself again. It looks like it's staying down, now. Thanks!

ARRRGGH!

ok so i've caved & installed BG2... are you happy now?!Delerious :smallbiggrin:

Trazoi

2008-01-31, 01:49 AM

I hope it's not considered bad form to tack a request onto this thread, but are there any mods in particular you recommend to someone who has already played through Baldurs Gate 2 a couple of times?

Admittedly I've only finished twice; once through the original game as a Kensai and once with the expansion pack added as a Sorcerer. I've had many runs where I stopped half-way though; I've got a current uncompleted game where I'm semi-soloing it through as a Cleric/Ranger (solo at the moment, I'll add Imoen to the team later as I feel she's too important to the story to leave out).

For those of you playing it through the first time, I'd probably recommend either the Kensai or maybe the Inquisitor. The Kensai with dual weapons can deal a ridiculous amount of damage, but is a bit vulnerable without armour. The Inquistor is a well balanced character with the very nice ability to dispel magic and makes a better wizard slayer than the Wizard Slayer and can wield one of the most powerful weapons in the game; the main downside is there's already an Inquisitor you can add to your party (Keldorn).

If you're playing it the second time and just want to be a spell casting powerhouse, I recommend the Sorcerer. You need to plan out all your spells in advance and the manual makes some mistakes about what they do, but if you pick wisely (hint: Project Image, Time Stop, Improved Alacrity) then you'll be nigh-on unstoppable about half way through the game. Makes the battles a bit one-sided, but it was fun to have my sorcerer waltz through ToB while the rest of the party hung out the back making small talk.

Pronounceable

2008-01-31, 06:04 AM

...
The single most important mod for you (or anyone) is Dungeon Be Gone, unless you want to play Improved Irenicus Dungeon mod. And if you want Imp Irenicus Dungeon, you're truly insane. IID contains, among other things, Rune Assasins who routinely gib the first PC they see. Plus the cleric buddy of Ilyich is high level enough to unleash a PLANETAR on you. And no, I didn't beat them.

Also, Ease of Use and/or Baldurdash Fixes has many nice things like infinite item stacking and infinite bag of holding.

After DBG, Unfinished Business. Restores much of stuff cut before the game's release.

The Banter Pack was at the development stage when I stopped playing, but it was quite promising.

Mod info contains spoilers for first time players. Don't look:

There's the Ascension. Melissan resurrects the Five at the Throne. And of course Irenicus before them. Hillarity ensues.

Each member of the Five has an Improved version. Those will put the fear of rng back into you.

Tactics mod adds many more tactical encounters throughout SoA. They aren't easy. There's also one for ToB.

There was a thief stronghold mod which I liked very much. Mainly because I played thief, but it was nifty.

There are additional NPCs like Valen, Solaufeun, Kelsey and others. I never took them, but still installed ones form Weimer for the additional encounters.

There are romance mods. But frankly things was getting ridiculous. Nalia, fine. Imoen, uh? EDWIN, wtf? I didn't, but you might want to check them out if you're interested.

There are also millions of kits out there. Unnecessary.

But I have repented. Consequently, I don't know what has been going on with modding community for the last years.

DeathQuaker

2008-01-31, 08:09 AM

Now that I seem to have found some like-minded fanatics, let me ask once and for all... WHO, do you think, has the best Romance in the game?

Personally, I like Viconia's the best. It seems to be the most thoughtfully written... she works through her brooding, and the main thing is if you treat her intelligently and respectfully (including *not* shacking up with her the first time you get the opportunity) you get some very cool conversations with her as your romance grows, far more captivating and stimulating than, "Oh my wings are gone," or "Oh my daddy hates me," or "Oh, the Harpers blah blah blah...". I also like that you can shift her alignment in TOB if you're good and have successfully romanced her throughout.

She's also not whiny, not your effective aunt who is supposed to be grieving over your effective uncle, and not Anomen.

The only party PC I ever killed, and with EXTREME glee, was Anomen. I tried putting up with him because I wanted another cleric and didn't want the reputation drop from Viconia, and then realized that she was way, way, way more worth it.

My favorite party member, no romance, is Imoen, hands down. I dream one day of being able to play her in a table top game (or PbP).

Archonic Energy

2008-01-31, 08:21 AM

My favorite party member, no romance, is Imoen, hands down. I dream one day of being able to play her in a table top game (or PbP).

her and Annah right? :smallwink:

"so i kicked him in the head till he was dead.... i can't believe i just said that"

Blayze

2008-01-31, 09:33 AM

are there any mods in particular you recommend to someone who has already played through Baldurs Gate 2 a couple of times?

*clears throat*

Ascension. Redemption. Dungeon Be Gone. Rogue Rebalancing/Song and Silence. As many Kit mods as you can get your hands on (Especially the Improved Wizard Slayer and Improved Shapeshifter ones). The Sorcerer's Place Collection. Improved Summons. Xyx's Beholder Stuff. Tactics. Ease of Use. Item Upgrade. Ruad. Twist Pack. Natural Selection. Improved Anarg. Masamune Sword Mini-Mini Quest.

Boards o' Magick Item Pack. Cloak of Mirroring fix. Improved Anvil. The Four. Teleport Spell (Yes, Teleport). Improved Volcano. IRC Weapons. The Magnificient (sp) Magic Store. Cloak of the Shield Change. Stuff of the Magi. Red Dragon Summoning (Do not adjust your monitor). Baldurdash FixPack. English Language Game Text Update. Sorcerer's Place Fixpack. Juggernaught Golem Fix. Triple-Class Mage HLA Fix. "Keep All BG1 Items on Imported Character". Free Alignment. Happy Group. Evil Dialogues Override. No Bottoms Patch. Grand Mastery Rules Fix Patch. Bonus and Collector's Edition CD Merchants.

Bhaalpowers Addition. Original Tougher Demogorgon. Improved Tougher Illasera/Gromnir/Yaga Shura/Balthazar/Abazigal. Battle of Helm's Deep. Solo With a Party. One Pixel Productions. Quest Pack. Freedom's Reign of Virtue. G3 Tweak Pack (I think it was that one I had problems with, though...). Expanded Thief Stronghold. Underrepresesnted Items Mod. Desecration of Souls. Virtue. Cloakwood Squares. Banter Pack. NPC Flirt Pack. Ashes of Embers. Oversight. RPG Dungeon. Improved Oasis. Revised Hell Trials. aVENGER's Realm Mods. Improved Battles. Ajoc's Mods. D0Tweak. Drow Innate Abilities. Azengaard. Exnem's Addon. BG2 Fixpack. BG2 Tweak Pack. Cal-Cluator. Deeper Shadows of Amn. Divine Remix. Druidic Sorcerer. IEP Extended Banters. Munchmod. Planar Sphere Mod.

And, of course, whatever mod it was that lets you change the classes and kits of your characters.

(I had some problems with Improved Firkraag. Namely, he wouldn't spawn at all)

I would recommend Check the Bodies and Unfinished Business, had later versions of both not given me lots of trouble.

You might want to check out Luizmods, at least for the improved AI. Haven't had the chance to check it out myself. Hell, you might want to install the Jedi/Sith kits. The same goes for "The Way of Heroes", too.

---
Or just get your hands on Baldur's Gate Trilogy or BG2TuTu.

Oh, and one more thing. Quite a few of these mods are incompatible, especially the rules-changing ones. Be careful when mixing mods, as you never quite know what the outcome will be.

Veridian

2008-01-31, 01:13 PM

Ever tried the Ascension mod, starting from ToB without running SoA?

That very first fight, all by your lonesome...and with fair, but not special gear. I tried that with a munchkined sorceror and it took me a dozen reloads to get right.

So yeah, definately get that one if you want some challenge. :smallbiggrin:

Woot Spitum

2008-01-31, 04:04 PM

Triaxx

2008-01-31, 04:14 PM

Veridian: Repeatedly. It's not that hard IMO. All you need to do is keep from getting blinded.

Ikialev

2008-01-31, 04:16 PM

When you join romanceable char, game sets romance on 1. After a couple of lovetalks, it becomes r2, but if you try to romance more characters at once, you have to choose. But for you, yes, you can wait for next romance.

Blayze: I could say this in three words. Big World Project. :3

Trazoi

2008-01-31, 07:31 PM

Out of curiosity, if one of the romance subplots gets triggered with a chacter you aren't interested in, and you accidentally give the right answer to continue that subplot, are you stuck with that particular subplot till the next conversation goes up, or will the other potential romantic subplots come up anyways?
From what I saw, typically you can go through the early stages of the romance subplots with as many characters as you're eligible (due to gender, species requirements) (when the internal setting for "Love Talk" is set to 1 for those characters). However you'll get some bickering between the rival love interests as that happens, which will eventually escalate up to an ultimatum where you must pick one over the other.

I've never had all three romancable female characters in my party at once; I suspect things would get rather chaotic.

As an aside, isn't it a bit weird that all of the standard romancable characters are healers; and out of the female ones, they're all elves or half-elves?

Wraith

2008-01-31, 07:54 PM

I wouldn't be at all surprised if this was deliberate on the grounds of making them attractive to the Player - you ALWAYS need a Healer after all, so in a sense Black isle and Co. probably thought that Players ought to have a Romance as part of the actual plot. It's certainly plausible, and I think it works quite well...

...When Bohdi kidnaps your Romance and forces you to kill them. I realise you didn't need much reason to kill Bodhi, but it certainly ends any kind of sympathy that you might have had for her Curse/s up to that point.

Has anyone else noticed, also, that each of the 3 Romances also seem to represent some kind of "Difficulty" scale in the game, above and beyond the actual setting?

Take Aerie for example - a Mage/Priest that eventually reaches Epic Level, can be given a Hammer that sets her Strength to 25, and is also liable to receive a +4 suite of chainmail that doesn't block her mage spells. As annoying and lacking in humour as she is, how could she POSSIBLY get any harder, with full spellcasting ability in both of the most broken basic classes in the 2nd Edition System?

Viconia, who can wear bigger armour, use the same hammer and is still a full-class Cleric, is always going to be useful by definition. Now compare Jaheira, who... isn't. Whatever you have to say about 3rd Edition Druids, a lot of it is a deserved improvement to my mind. :smalltongue:

Or maybe not. Maybe I just don't compliment my party well enough to accommodate yet another Dual/Multi Class Fighter.

Woot Spitum

2008-01-31, 08:28 PM

From what I saw, typically you can go through the early stages of the romance subplots with as many characters as you're eligible (due to gender, species requirements) (when the internal setting for "Love Talk" is set to 1 for those characters). However you'll get some bickering between the rival love interests as that happens, which will eventually escalate up to an ultimatum where you must pick one over the other.That's good to know. I would hate to inadvertantly get stuck in one of the subplots just because I keep accidentally picking the right answers.

I've never had all three romancable female characters in my party at once; I suspect things would get rather chaotic.Now I have to try this.:smallbiggrin: I already have Jaheira and Aerie in my party, now I just have to find Viconia.

As an aside, isn't it a bit weird that all of the standard romancable characters are healers; and out of the female ones, they're all elves or half-elves?I had wondered that myself. What is wrong with the human women like Nalia that prevents the main character from being interested in them?

On a related note, isn't it creepy the way Jaheira keeps bringing up her dead husband whenever she wants to talk to you at the beginning of her subplot?:smalleek:

Trazoi

2008-01-31, 08:46 PM

Now compare Jaheira, who... isn't. Whatever you have to say about 3rd Edition Druids, a lot of it is a deserved improvement to my mind. :smalltongue:

Or maybe not. Maybe I just don't compliment my party well enough to accommodate yet another Dual/Multi Class Fighter.
In defense of Jaheira, she does have a couple of saving graces. Firstly, as a druid rather than a cleric she can wield spears, of which there are some extremely nice ones in the game. Once she gets the best spear in the game... Ixil's Spike in Throne of Bhaal; the pinning action is extremely useful... she's an extremely good fighter. Not to mention that many of the druid spells are offensively oriented, which goes well with her fighter stats. While my parties generally overload on the fighters (I'm fond of Minsc and Mazzy, and Keldorn is a pretty powerful addition to the team), Jaheira still could hold her own.

Aerie's main weakness is she's not quite bright enough to cast the extremely useful 9th level mage spells, so she's not that good as a primary mage. Viconia's pretty solid as a pure cleric however. I'm not sure how useful Anomen is as I'm yet to find anyone who can keep in the party for more than an hour of playtime...

Wraith

2008-01-31, 09:24 PM

I find that, as a Dual-Classed Fighter (7) Cleric (X), "Anomen" pretty much amounts tp being merely a full-class Cleric, who has a few specs in Mace and Warhammer and (if I remember right) an extra attack per round that Pure Clerics miss. Or something in that vein.

The point is, while extremely useful early in the game because he has completed his 'training' and benefits from the Spells of Cleric and Hit Points/THACO of a Fighter, by the time you hit level 15 or so the bonus' are wiped out by the toughness of enemies and the sheer number of Mages that you meet.

Wow, +1 to hit you say? Against AC-5 and through Globe of Invulnerability/Mantle/Immunity to Magical Weapons? You're probably better off taking either another Mage and loading up on Debuff spells like Warding Whip and Ruby Ray, or taking Keldorn and letting Carsomyr do it's job.

Unless you're absolutely intent on getting Anomen to epic level and picking up the additional spells, of course, at which point things get interesting, though having said that until his personal Quest is completed and he gets a boost to his Wisdom (which can take WEEKS, in game time, or you can miss out on entirely if you leave for Spellhold too quickly) he's not even a very good Cleric.

I tend to favour the Imoen/Jan/Minsc/Viconia/Keldorn party, however, so feel free to disregard all that as the ramblings of yet another anti-Anomen player :smallsmile:

Pronounceable

2008-01-31, 09:58 PM

I've never had all three romancable female characters in my party at once; I suspect things would get rather chaotic.

It's funny, but not on the scale of Minsc or Jan banters. Especially Minsc+Jan banters.

Let me steer the thread a little more: What are your favorite banter sequences? Remember to spoiler it for first timers:

Korgan repeatedly hitting on Mazzy. Nothing ever beats that. It's a must see for everyone.

Another gem, which many people might not have seen. When dragon Firkraag tells you to go away, Keldorn doesn't like it. Edwin points out that discretion is the better part of valor. Then Mazzy explodes: "What do YOU know of valor?"

Jan tries to steal Boo...

-Minsc, that tattoo on your face. Does it have tribal significance or did some nursery's fingerpainting class assault you with the blue pastels?
-I do not like the tone of your voice, Dark Elf. The face I have is the face the ladies love! Boo loves Minsc's face, too! Don't you, Boo?

The whole gender changing sequence of Edwin. Especially when the loser in Coronet (you know, guy hitting on every female NPC) hits on him/her. Ends with Edwin blasting the **** out of the bugger and (unfortunately) turning everyone else hostile.

Korgan keeps insulting Aerie until she actually leaves the party (you could dump Korgan and keep Aerie, but why would you do that?).

Edwin's picking on Jaheira. Jaheira's answer: "Edwin, an oak staff can cave in a skull from only inches away. And none would mourn your passing..."

"One day, Tiax will point and click!"

"Elminister this, Elminister that, give ME two thousands years and a pointy hat, and I will kick his arse!"

"HI-YA! Heh, the tourists love that stuff..."

Mazzy's promoting Valygar to her squireship is also pretty nice. So is her joy upon meeting her childhood hero Keldorn. She's generally a nice gal.

And last, but not least: "So I kicked 'im in the head, till he was dead!" So soothing.

Maybe I should stop reading this thread before I install BG.

DeathQuaker

2008-01-31, 10:41 PM

her and Annah right? :smallwink:

Definitely Imoen and Annah are my favorite D&D CRPG characters. Annah would also be fun to play tabletop, though I more just out and out worship her, I think... :smallbiggrin:

They'd make a very... odd... team, come to think of it.

NPC Bob: You! With the weird, evil heritage!
Annah: *draws daggers* Yeh got a problem w' me, yeh pikin' -
Imoen: He's talkin' to me.
Annah: Eh? Yeh?
Imoen: You don't wanna know.

Anyway, Baldur's Gate 2...

Let me steer the thread a little more: What are your favorite banter sequences?

A few of my favorites, which don't get quoted much:

Mazzy and Aerie:

Aerie: Mazzy? Do you think you’ll ever become a true Paladin for Arvoreen?
Mazzy: I am a true sword for my God, Aerie. That is as close as I can expect to come. To hope for otherwise would be foolish and naive of me.
Aerie: Yes, but I was told of a time when halflings were rogues only ... that you would never find one that was a cleric or even a warrior such as yourself anywhere.
Mazzy: That’s true, if unfortunate. But that was a long time ago, Aerie ... things have changed since then.
Aerie: But maybe things could change again? Maybe your people could become paladins and rangers and even mages one day, without limitation. Wouldn’t that be exciting?
Mazzy: Yes, yes, and maybe my people will become skinny, wear shoes, and have big, long skulls. Really, Aerie, you needn’t keep your head in the clouds ALL the time.
Aerie: Well, it was just a thought.
Mazzy: And it wasn’t a bad one. But it’s not likely that the gods are going to revamp the halflings and come out with a ‘third edition’, as it were, now is it?
Aerie: Oh, you never know. The gods do strange things, sometimes.

Imoen and Aerie (ginormous spoilers within):

Aerie: I have a question for you, Imoen ... you have the taint of Bhaal within you? Does this mean that you will turn into the Slayer as well?
Imoen: I certainly hope not. I ... I have been thinking more and more lately about that, myself, though.
Aerie: It must be an awful feeling though. I can’t imagine how (CHARNAME) deals with it.
Imoen: Yeah ... (HE or SHE)’s been dealing with it longer, too. Sometimes, when it’s quiet, I can hear the taint in my heart whispering to me. It says awful things and I almost want to scream to shut them out.
Aerie: (gasp) You .. you haven’t done anything that it’s said, have you?
Imoen: Well, other than that time I got up in the middle of the night to snatch a bunch of cinnamon cookies, heck no.
Aerie: Oh, goo - What? Cinnamon cookies?
Imoen: Ha ha! Come on, Aerie! Lighten up, will ya? I’ll tell you what ... If I have any desires to murder you in the middle of the night, you’ll be the first to know, okay?
Aerie: That’s not very funny, Imoen. (CHARNAME) never makes fun of (HIS or HER) condition in that way.
(CHARNAME): Well, it’s been much easier since I discovered that all the Slayer really wants is a sandwich ...
Aerie: Oh, fine. Everybody seems determined to make fun of me. I’ll stand back here thank you.
OR
(CHARNAME): Aerie’s right, Imoen. It’s a very serious subject.
Imoen: Well, excuse me (LORD or LADY) Serious Pants. I’ll just trot on down to the end of the line, then, and wait for my head to explode. Sheesh.

Imoen and Haer'Dalis:

HaerDalis’: Ahh, Imoen, my wildflower. Have I ever told you you’ve a most natural grace and innocent beauty about you? T’is something any man would find most charming.
Imoen: Yeah, okay, whatever. I don’t know about my grace, HaerDalis’, but I’m not all that innocent. I can smell a cheesy come-on from a mile away.
HaerDalis’: ‘Twas not meant as such. I’ve no intention of offending you.
Imoen: Uh-huh.
HaerDalis’: T’is only that I see you in an unguarded moment, at times ... and I see the ache in your heart reflected in your eyes. It saddens this sparrow to know there is no-one to hold you close, Imoen.
Imoen: I ...
HaerDalis’: But no doubt I over-step my bounds by saying so. It has only ever been my hope that you might one day give me the chance to be the one that comforts you. It would be an honor, my wildflower.
Imoen: Whew. Gosh, you’re good.
HaerDalis’: Yes, I know. T’is an art form that has served this sparrow well, at times.
Imoen: Write a book. I’ll buy it.

Serpentine

2008-02-01, 06:11 AM

I tried to play BG again today. I freed Minsc, talked to Jahira, got some gear off the table and from the chest... and then it died on me. So I gave up and played Planescape:Torment, instead.
:smallfrown:

St.Sinner

2008-02-01, 06:26 AM

^ Aw, tough. But Planescape:Torment's an amazing game as well, so not so bad. What caused the crash though? Did you install any mods? Did you check your graphics settings?

Imoen and Haer'Dalis:

HaerDalis’: Ahh, Imoen, my wildflower. Have I ever told you you’ve a most natural grace and innocent beauty about you? T’is something any man would find most charming.
Imoen: Yeah, okay, whatever. I don’t know about my grace, HaerDalis’, but I’m not all that innocent. I can smell a cheesy come-on from a mile away.
HaerDalis’: ‘Twas not meant as such. I’ve no intention of offending you.
Imoen: Uh-huh.
HaerDalis’: T’is only that I see you in an unguarded moment, at times ... and I see the ache in your heart reflected in your eyes. It saddens this sparrow to know there is no-one to hold you close, Imoen.
Imoen: I ...
HaerDalis’: But no doubt I over-step my bounds by saying so. It has only ever been my hope that you might one day give me the chance to be the one that comforts you. It would be an honor, my wildflower.
Imoen: Whew. Gosh, you’re good.
HaerDalis’: Yes, I know. T’is an art form that has served this sparrow well, at times.
Imoen: Write a book. I’ll buy it.

Aww, the charmer. I often wish Bioware had scrapped the Anomen romance and gone with the Haer'dalis one instead. I guess the developers wanted to give charname the classic knight in shining armour type to fall in love with. Grrr.

There are romance mods. But frankly things was getting ridiculous. Nalia, fine. Imoen, uh? EDWIN, wtf?

I balked at the idea of an Edwin romance at first. But it turned out to be actually quite well-written in a light, humourous way. The whole thing is pretty hilarious and somewhat less trite than some of the other romances.

My favourite banters that come to mind are:
Anomen and Edwina (he wants to champion 'her' in a knights' tournament), Yoshimo and Edwina (Yoshi offers to alter Edwina's dress), Minsc and Jan (stealing Boo) and what Jan says at the end of ToB when the pc is offered the chance to be a god, about how he was a god for one month and had Helm knocking on his door at three in the morning.

About some of the mods that have been mentioned. Ease of Use has been deprecated, and can cause problems with other mods - install G3 Tweakpack instead, it contains everything in Ease of Use and more. Don't install Baldurdash, install the G3 Fixpack. Tactics has been deprecated by Big Picture. Big Picture and Ascension are both great for second time players, but Ascension's Improved Yaga-Shura unfailingly causes my game to crash. You can just opt not to install that one component though.

Serpentine

2008-02-01, 06:28 AM

Nope, nothing. Like I said, it comes up with a message saying that something is bigger than the Civvid thing or something.

DeathQuaker

2008-02-01, 06:58 AM

Serpentine - not that I would want to dissuade you from playing PS:T because of the awesomeness that it is, but regarding your continuing BG2 issues, have you tried looking here for help:

http://forums.bioware.com/forums/viewforum.html?forum=10

There's a good chance your issue's already come up and a solution posted there. If not, you can try posting your issue there. The people who check that board are either new players like you or die-hard BG2ers who've probably memorized all troubleshooting solutions in their sleep.

Serpentine

2008-02-01, 07:08 AM

I'm not that new... I played it years and years ago! I just... didn't make it very far :smallredface:
Thanks, I'll have a look at that.

Mordokai

2008-02-01, 07:40 AM

Perhaps a screenshot of this error would help? I have a friend that's quite Infinity engine guru, I'm sure something could be done about it.

Also, I heavily endorse Romanctic encounters mod. (http://www.gibberlings3.net/romanticencounters/) It makes romances oh so much more fun :smallbiggrin: I always install it if I play solo, which is not often. But if you do, then this is a must have.

DeathQuaker

2008-02-01, 08:00 AM

"New" being a relative term, then.:smallsmile:

St.Sinner

2008-02-01, 08:20 AM

Out of curiosity, how many times have you folks completed this game? I've only finished Baldur's Gate once, but over the years I think I've played through from the start of SoA to the end of ToB about fifteen times. A couple of months ago I reinstalled it again. Anyone here crazy like me?

Wraith

2008-02-01, 08:38 AM

I am exactly the same way, St.Sinner. I'm so impatient that I keep quitting just before I go save the Elves in order to try out a new Romance, or a new group of followers to see if there's some banter I missed...

As for banters, my absolute favourites of all time are between Edwin and Jaheira, Sarevok and Viconia and Sarevok, Minsc and Jan.

*The Party find Imoen in Spellhold, and lament on her condition.*
Edwin: "It is a weakness on her part. A superior mind could handle such a gift."
Jaheira: "And what would you have to do with that, Edwin? Perhaps if ego were all that was required."
Edwin: "(Sigh. It's aggravations like this that will eventually lead me to Fireball the entire party as they sleep. Yes indeed, everyone peaceful and quite adn then FOOM!!!)"

Viconia: "I miss the customs of my homeland, like the breaking in of new pleasure slaves. The largest and strongest were the hardest to break, but they were the most rewarding. Sarevok, I find your great size... intriguing."
Sarevok: "Were you to break me Viconia, you might find nothing but the chill emptiness of the grave within."
Viconia: "That does not repulse me as you might imagine. We drow are ever eager to broaden our... experience."
Sarevok: "I orchestrated a war to slaughter thousands. I have felt the cold embrace of death. I have witnessed the horrors of the abyss. But you, Viconia... you scare me."

Sarevok: "Ranger, turn your rodent's gaze another direction! I will not be scrutinised as though by some ridiculous divining rod!"
Minsc: "Boo has an uncanny judge of character, but you... you give him trouble."
Sarevok: "I'll give him more than that if this continues! I nearly conquered a nation! I will not be judged by a creature that stores nuts in its cheeks!"
Jan: "Hey! I resemble that remark."
Sarevok: "Trust me, gnome, you do not want to partake in my wrath this day."
Minsc: "Food storage aside, Boo controls himself far better than you do. Do you see him ranting about mere glances? Let's look."
Sarevok: "What?"
Minsc: "See? No rant. In fact, now he is snuffling about for a comfy place to sleep. Admirable restraint."
Sarevok: "I'm still in Hell, aren't I? This is insanity."
Minsc: Ah, finally a calming look comes across your face. Boo's handiwork, no doubt? Doesn't that feel better?
Sarevok: Let's... let's go kill something. Soon.

Genius :smallbiggrin:

SmartAlec

2008-02-01, 08:49 AM

Ah, BG2. The game that got me into this wacky hobby. Anyhow, if you're still having these problems, or any problems, try this.

From the BioWare FAQ - http://www.bioware.com/games/shadows_amn/support/faq/index.html?faqID=40#29

If you are having problems getting the game to install or the game is asking for a CD5 or a CD0, you may want to try some of the following suggestions.

When changing CDs during the installation, let the drive spin-up and then stop. Then click OK and see if the installer recognizes the disc change. Do this for all the CDs that are requested.

Try checking for a firmware/BIOS update for your CD or DVD drive. We have had several reports of sucessfull installs of the game once a firmware update was applied. You will have to check with your CD/DVD drive manufacturer for this kind of update.

If for whatever reason you are unable to do a Recommended or Full install, but you can do a Minimum install, please read How to "fake" a larger install from a Minimum.

If you have multiple CD/DVD drives, only install from one and do not try to use all of your drives. For some reason, this is confusing InstallShield.

If you cannot do any install without getting some sort of error or crash and you have about 5 Gig of free hard drive space, you can try to copy all 4 CDs to your hard drive, then run the install from there. Please note, you must copy all 4 CDs to the same directory for the install to run. If you get prompted for the next CD, then you have not copied the files over properly, or you have missed some.

Try turning off DMA for your CD/DVD drive. For some people, this has allowed them to install. You can find this checkbox by going to your Control Panel, then to System, then to the Device Manager tab. Find your CD/DVD drive and bring up its Properties, then go to the Settings tab.

Try turning off your CD/DVD read-ahead. For some people, this has allowed them to install. You can find this slider by going to your Control Panel, then to System, then to the Performance tab. Down in the Advanced Settings frame, press the File System... button and move the slider all the way to the left. You may need to restart for this setting to take effect.

And, about that 'faking a full install' thing...

Minimum to Recommended Install

1. Do a Minimum install.

2. Edit your "baldur.ini" file. Change the line "Install Type=1" to "Install Type=2"

3. Copy the following files from CD2 to your BG2 directory, where [cddrive] is the letter of your CD-ROM drive and [BG2] is the location of your BG2 install

[cddrive]\CD2\Data\CREAnim.bif ===> [BG2]\data\CREAnim.bif
[cddrive]\CD2\Data\CREAnim1.bif ===> [BG2]\data\CREAnim1.bif
[cddrive]\CD2\Data\GUIMosc.bif ===> [BG2]\data\GUIMosc.bif
[cddrive]\CD2\Data\MovHD0.bif ===> [BG2]\data\MovHD0.bif
[cddrive]\CD2\Data\NPCSoCD3.bif ===> [BG2]\data\NPCSoCD3.bif
[cddrive]\CD2\Data\NPCSound.bif ===> [BG2]\data\NPCSound.bif

4. Copy the following files from CD3 to your BG2 directory

[cddrive]\CD3\Data\CD3CreA2.bif ===> [BG2]\data\CD3CreA2.bif
[cddrive]\CD3\Data\CD3CreAn.bif ===> [BG2]\data\CD3CreAn.bif
[cddrive]\CD3\Data\CDCreAni.bif ===> [BG2]\data\CDCreAni.bif

5. Copy the following files from CD4 to your BG2 directory

[cddrive]\CD4\Data\CD4CreA2.bif ===> [BG2]\data\CD4CreA2.bif
[cddrive]\CD4\Data\CD4CreA3.bif ===> [BG2]\data\CD4CreA3.bif
[cddrive]\CD4\Data\CD4CreAn.bif ===> [BG2]\data\CD4CreAn.bif

You now have a Recommended install.

Minimum to Full Install

1. Do a Minimum install.

2. Edit your "baldur.ini" file. Change the line "Install Type=1" to "Install Type=3". Also, you will need to edit the [Alias] section. Make the following changes where [BG2] is the location of your BG2 install

[Alias]
HD0=[BG2]
CD1=[BG2]\CD1
CD2=[BG2]\CD2
CD3=[BG2]\CD3
CD4=[BG2]\CD4

3. Copy the following directories (and all their contents) from the BG2 CDs to your BG2 install folder, where [cddrive] is the letter of your CD-ROM drive and [BG2] is the location of your BG2 install

CD2
[cddrive]\CD2 ===> [BG2]\CD2

CD3
[cddrive]\CD3 ===> [BG2]\CD3

CD4
[cddrive]\CD4 ===> [BG2]\CD4

You now have a Full install.

Serpentine

2008-02-01, 08:54 AM

Perhaps a screenshot of this error would help? I have a friend that's quite Infinity engine guru, I'm sure something could be done about it.I'll either screenshot it or just write down the details. Tomorrow.

Blayze

2008-02-01, 09:20 AM

Out of curiosity, how many times have you folks completed this game?

I have completed SoA once, and ToB not even that. I reached the final battle, and then things went all screwy. I had Ascension installed, and for some reason, every single enemy was duplicated. It should come as no surprise that I got my arse handed to me.

And that Big World project appears to have fallen at the first hurdle. No matter. It looks like the concept of a Mega Install will have to wait until a later date.

St.Sinner

2008-02-02, 03:02 AM

You can just uninstall Ascension before the final battle. Or just don't install Ascension at all, you can still install Improved Illasera, Gromnir, Yaga-Shura et. al individually.

I have a mega-install now. I haven't heard that there's anything wrong with the Big World project. It's just in beta, but I don't think it's fallen. Just install everything manually and iron out a few kinks here and there and you'll be alright.

Cespenar

2008-02-02, 11:04 AM

Out of curiosity, how many times have you folks completed this game?

I've beaten SoA 3-4 times, and ToB one and a half times :smallsmile:. A small number for one of my favourite games, I guess.

Though I've played with full parties before, the most fun I had was with myself as a cavalier, Keldorn and Anomen, with the Improved x mods installed. This was after I've realized the power of mages, but it came out that Keldorn was somewhat broken as well. Instead of the earlier games where I carefully wore down enemy mages' defenses with various spells, Keldorn only threw a dispel magic of an abnormal level, followed by an improved whirlwind attack with his Carsomyr, which allowed few enemies to survive.

For my next game, I plan to get the weakest five characters. I'm thinking Haer'dalis, Mazzy, Cernd, Valygar and... Nalia perhaps? (I know this sentence is bound to draw some aggression, but whatever :smalltongue:)

Oh, and on the romance subject; in my first game, I found Jaheira to be the most sensible choice, but I'm sad that I've never tried Viconia. It's just that I didn't anticipate the designers to put an option to "convert" her, but it seems that I had underestimated the game.

Pyro

2008-02-02, 11:10 AM

I've probably beaten it twice, but started around 5 games. Man Baldur's Gate is so awesome....

Blayze

2008-02-02, 12:03 PM

For my next game, I plan to get the weakest five characters.

Do you mean the five characters who will have the worst time? If so, then I say pick all the characters who can't cast any spells. Them spellcasters do seem mighty powerful come ToB. So that'd be a party consisting of Korgan, Minsc (He may as well be a Berserker or a Barbarian), you-know-who/you-know-who, Haer'Dalis (He can do almost everything, but still...) and Mazzy, backed up by a Wizard Slayer or Beastmaster PC.

You can just uninstall Ascension before the final battle.

But... but... mega-mod is mega-mod! I'll keep an eye on Big World, too. The biggest problem with my mega-mod installs isn't the content mods, as they tend to work fine with each other. No, the problem is with the rules mods. It gets kinda hectic sometimes, and tends to break everything. Still, it's kinda fun. :)

Serpentine

2008-02-02, 12:09 PM

I got into the game again, intending to write down the message... and this time it just died, no message or anything :smallfrown:

SmartAlec

2008-02-02, 12:10 PM

The classic answer to most BG2 crashing problems is to disable 3d Acceleration in BGConfig.

Or:

If you have random crashes or reboots during BGII play, the solution most times is to go to http://www.cmedia.com.tw and get the newest drivers (version 632 or higher). Uninstall your old drivers and install these ones and the game should work correctly. This problem happens most often with Windows XP, but those with other OS versions may also want to look into it if they are having similar issues with this device.

Download the latest patch for BG2, it includes a fix for ATI video cards.

Blayze

2008-02-02, 12:32 PM

The classic answer to most BG2 crashing problems is to disable 3d Acceleration in BGConfig.

Ah, I think I forgot about that one. The other way that may help is by going via Start > Run (Windows key + R), and typing in "dxdiag". That opens up the DirectX Diagnostic Tool. Then click on the Display tab (Or the Sound one, if you have sound issues) and note the three buttons that should say "Disable" (In the Display tab) or the bar that is labelled "Hardware Sound Acceleration Level" (In the Sound one).

When I had sound issues, I moved the Hardware Sound Acceleration Level bar further to the left and tried again, which cured the sound problems.

If you don't want to mess around with your computer's DXDiag settings, please don't. It's done nothing bad to my computer, but I don't want to take any chances with a computer belonging to someone else. :P

ShinyRocks

2008-02-02, 05:37 PM

On my old PC, I had to completely disable the background sound of BG2. There was some horrendous conflict and the shouting voices you got in cities would cause me to crash to a BSOD.

Probably revealing too much for my first post, but I was always disappointed that I couldn't leave the PC out of things and engineer a romance between Anomen and Haer'dalis.

Nalia's facial and vocal resemblance to Drew Barrymore always freaked me out a bit.

I haven't played that game in years.

DeathQuaker

2008-02-02, 06:04 PM

Out of curiosity, how many times have you folks completed this game?

Twice, but given that I almost NEVER complete a second playthrough of any game no matter how much I love it, and especially given how long it takes to complete SOA+TOB (especially when one works full time and attempts to maintain some semblance of a social life), that's a pretty impressive thing.

Serpentine

2008-02-03, 09:41 AM

I disabled 3D Accelerator... and it came up with this:

An Assertion failed in InfScreenInventory.cpp at line number 9826:smallconfused:
One of those links had a list of assertion errors, so I'll go look that up.

edit: Typically, it's not on the list :smallsigh:

SmartAlec

2008-02-03, 12:14 PM

Hm. Maybe a complete uninstall, detelte directories, and re-install? I realise you may already have done this, but another one can't hurt.

Ikialev

2008-02-03, 12:21 PM

I disabled 3D Accelerator... and it came up with this:
:smallconfused:
One of those links had a list of assertion errors, so I'll go look that up.

edit: Typically, it's not on the list :smallsigh:

'Failed to draw an item on the history page. This is most likely bad data. Try clearing out your "cache", "temp", and "tempsave" directories. Failing that, try reinstalling.'

St.Sinner

2008-02-04, 02:47 AM

Hmm, now I remember that someone I know had to reinstall about five times to get it to work. It kept crashing at the beginning and sometimes even at the title screen. I think he used the 'faking a full install' trick and in the end it worked.

But... but... mega-mod is mega-mod! I'll keep an eye on Big World, too. The biggest problem with my mega-mod installs isn't the content mods, as they tend to work fine with each other. No, the problem is with the rules mods. It gets kinda hectic sometimes, and tends to break everything. Still, it's kinda fun. :)

True, but the mega-install ain't worth it if it stops you from finishing the game. I had to uninstall Improved Yaga-Shura although I didn't want to. Which rules mods are you trying to install?

For my next game, I plan to get the weakest five characters. I'm thinking Haer'dalis, Mazzy, Cernd, Valygar and... Nalia perhaps? (I know this sentence is bound to draw some aggression, but whatever :smalltongue:)

Cernd isn't actually a weak character. On the surface he appears weak, but let him shift into a werewolf and later greater werewolf, his stats leap into the astronomical - something like 21 Str, 20 Dex, 25 Con IIRC - and he regenerates at a frightening pace. He has good Wis and decent Cha. Don't bother shifting him back to human, keep him as a werewolf all the time and he makes a great fighter, the best fighter among all the healers in the game.

Probably revealing too much for my first post, but I was always disappointed that I couldn't leave the PC out of things and engineer a romance between Anomen and Haer'dalis.

Nalia's facial and vocal resemblance to Drew Barrymore always freaked me out a bit.

Haha, seriously? Well I always thought Haer'dalis and a male PC would be a very interesting prospect... but HD-Anomen? Gosh. One is lawful and the other is very chaotic. It would be a very explosive relationship!

Wow, y'know... I've never noticed the Nalia/Drew Barrymore thing until right now.

Trazoi

2008-02-04, 03:00 AM

For my next game, I plan to get the weakest five characters. I'm thinking Haer'dalis, Mazzy, Cernd, Valygar and... Nalia perhaps? (I know this sentence is bound to draw some aggression, but whatever :smalltongue:)
I knew you were expecting some disagreements :smallamused:. I've always thought Mazzy was a pretty darn useful character to have in the team. As a pure fighter she gets enough weapon proficiency points to max out dual wielding and the weapons of your choice, so the possibilities are near endless. Plus she starts off as a superb archer with her small bow skill (why are the small bows so much better than the large?)

Darn, this whole thread is making me keen to play Baldur's Gate II all over again, but I can't run it on my Mac until I get a copy of Windows on there.

St.Sinner

2008-02-04, 03:56 AM

Well I suppose you'd have to compare them fighter to fighter, caster to caster. Mazzy is generally a pretty good tank of course, but compared to the powerhouse fighters Korgan and Sarevok, and Keldorn wielding Carsomyr, she is significantly weaker. Cernd you would have to compare with the healers: Jaheira, Anomen, Viconia, and Aerie. And Nalia with Edwin, Jan, Imoen, and Aerie, and possibly Haer'dalis as well, since he doesn't fit in anywhere else.

For me the weak characters would be Mazzy and Valygar from the fighters, Jaheira and Aerie from the healers, and Nalia and Haer'dalis from the arcane casters. After playing this many times though, I really don't care who is strong and who is weak, I just pick 'em based on personalities that are likely to clash. Gotta love infighting. I do have a soft spot for Sarevok and usually end up taking him along.

ShinyRocks

2008-02-04, 06:22 AM

Haha, seriously? Well I always thought Haer'dalis and a male PC would be a very interesting prospect... but HD-Anomen? Gosh. One is lawful and the other is very chaotic. It would be a very explosive relationship!

That's why I thought it would be fun. Can they overcome their natural opposition to each other to be together etc. I'm just a sucker for angst.

Add me to the list of people who want to install and play BGII again. I'd forgotten that Mazzy and Jan even existed.

I think I completed with a Stalker PC, Edwin, Nalia, Anomen, HD and Korgan.

DeathQuaker

2008-02-04, 08:07 AM

For me the weak characters would be Mazzy and Valygar from the fighters

And they're not bad at all...

Jaheira and Aerie from the healers

Jaheira AS a healer is probably the weakest because of her slow druid class progression, but she can definitely be a solid character, and she's one of the better multiclass characters. Though I would say she is actually one of the weaker characters overall... just so many people use her they know how to overcome her shortcomings.

Aerie is... oh my god. First couple levels, meh. High level? Girl is a one-woman spell-slinging death machine. I'd never class her as a weak character... equip her with good stuff so she's hard to hit and stick her behind Minsc. If somehow her equipment/buffs are bypassed and she hasn't already killed the dragon/demogorgon for you, Minsc will berserk and handle the rest.

Nalia and Haer'dalis

Main problem with Nalia is she's just a poor man's Imoen. Worse stats and was dual-classed at too low a level. She has some sidequests that can make her interesting to hold onto for awhile. Definitely one to use if you want your "weak" party especially since she can still keep things interesting.

Haeri is a good gish.... not as good a tank as the other tanks, but he holds his own, and not as good a spellcaster as the others but again, holds is own. His main thing is he's very flexible... which means you can put him to good and different uses in different fights... I'd not use him as your only spellcaster unless you were specifically going for crazy-challenge, but as a second caster he's very good to have around. I used him along with Imoen as my arcanists in one party and they did very well together.

Veridian

2008-02-04, 08:26 AM

Blayze

2008-02-04, 09:09 AM

Which rules mods are you trying to install?

All of them. I kid, I kid. Most of them. I need to sit down and work out what changes what and what I need to drop (Then reinstall the game so I can start the modding process afresh).

I forgot the kit's name...dragon slayer or some such? The one with the attack bonuses against dragons and demons

Cavalier. The only Paladin kit I ever use. "Penalties? What penalties?"

Cespenar

2008-02-04, 10:45 AM

Cernd isn't actually a weak character. On the surface he appears weak, but let him shift into a werewolf and later greater werewolf, his stats leap into the astronomical - something like 21 Str, 20 Dex, 25 Con IIRC - and he regenerates at a frightening pace. He has good Wis and decent Cha. Don't bother shifting him back to human, keep him as a werewolf all the time and he makes a great fighter, the best fighter among all the healers in the game.

I agree, I've played with him before and pretty much enjoyed it, but I'll pick an Anomen over him everyday (in terms of power, not roleplaying; god I hate Anomen as a character).

I knew you were expecting some disagreements . I've always thought Mazzy was a pretty darn useful character to have in the team. As a pure fighter she gets enough weapon proficiency points to max out dual wielding and the weapons of your choice, so the possibilities are near endless. Plus she starts off as a superb archer with her small bow skill (why are the small bows so much better than the large?)

She may be okay, but bows and short swords just don't cut it against greatswords and such. And you got to think of the artifacts as well. The most powerful artifacts IIRC don't come in small sizes (unfortunately).

On Jaheira and Aerie, I think both are good to average characters, not top-tier like Edwin or Keldorn, but they have their uses. Jaheira is a good fighter and caster, though not excelling in both; but Aerie becomes a very good character, especially in late games, when she can cast the 9th levels of both sides.

I actually prefer Nalia over Imoen myself.

When all's said and done, both can do exactly the same things as one another, it doesn't matter that Nalia has less rogue levels, I still never found a trap she couldn't disarm after a few tries, nor a lock she couldn't pick after a few attempts. Plus I find Imoen to be incessantly whiny (even more than Aerie), and prefer a spoiled noble to that any day.

Power-wise, I agree, but I wouldn't think of not getting Imoen because of my respect for her for being a semi-protagonist. She's your damn sister for Bhaal's sake! :smalltongue:

Pronounceable

2008-02-04, 12:03 PM

Plus I find Imoen to be incessantly whiny (even more than Aerie), and prefer a spoiled noble to that any day.

Eh, wha? Imoen is a cheerful girl, except for the occasional bouts of Bhaalspawnism. She's not one bit whiny, whereas Aerie is the living incarnation of whine. Plus she's family, we don't badmouth the family...

Nalia is quite a naive (aka dumb) spoiled girl. Not that I don't like her, but she doesn't compare to Imoen personalitywise. However if she's summoned in ToB, she shows up as a very different, much smarter and mature girl. Which was quite astonishing. I liked her much better then.

In other news, as an older brother I always thought to have Imoen marry Haer'Dalis. Sure Haer'Dalis would NEVER actually marry, but they'd both be happy together (as long as it lasted). YAY! I matchmade!

Green Bean

2008-02-04, 03:55 PM

I seem to be having a bit of trouble in the Illithid City in SoA, particularly the doors that can only be opened by enslaved Mind Flayers, or CHARNAME's 'alter-ego'. The last blocked door before the Elder Brain opens just fine for the alter-ego, but it doesn't seem to work with the Mind Flayers I've Charmed. I'm trying to avoid the reputation hit, so I'm sort of stuck right now. Any advice?

ufo

2008-02-04, 05:05 PM

skyclad

2008-02-04, 05:17 PM

Just take the rep hit, it doesn't really matter. If you play a good party you are pretty much stuck on 20 anyway. Though if you play an evil one and don't want to drop so low that you get attacked by cowled wizards in the streets there's not much to do :p

EDIT: Does anyone know where to download the vendor who sells the robe of vecna and shield of balduran among other things?

Green Bean

2008-02-04, 06:30 PM

Sounds like a bug, I used a Mind Flayer to get through just fine. Reload?

It seems to have solved itself. I reloaded, but it didn't work, so I tried controlling another Flayer and getting it to open it. When I ordered it next to the door, the thing opened, but the charmed Flayer randomly turned hostile and attacked my party. Weird.

DeathQuaker

2008-02-04, 08:36 PM

I actually prefer Nalia over Imoen myself.

When all's said and done, both can do exactly the same things as one another, it doesn't matter that Nalia has less rogue levels, I still never found a trap she couldn't disarm after a few tries, nor a lock she couldn't pick after a few attempts. Plus I find Imoen to be incessantly whiny (even more than Aerie), and prefer a spoiled noble to that any day.

And when you're tossing high level spells around with her, it helps you forget that her stats are less optimal. Mages tend to do that. :smalltongue:

That's true of just about any character in the game (and Aerie still owns as high level spellcaster, though I'm sure Edwin comes close).

As for Imoen vs Nalia, my judgment above was based purely on power... Imoen has better stats and THAC0 than Nalia; stats and THAC0 are all-important in 2nd ed D&D; ergo, Imoen is more powerful. I did point out you can do okay w/ Nalia, and there are good story reasons to take her if nothing else.

As for Imoen being whiny, I'm not sure what you mean. I was going to paste her banters that I found at Sorcerer's Place, but realized that was too ridiculously long. Suffice to say most of those are humorous in nature, or self-reflective without being piteous.

Imoen occasionally makes "negative" comments... after all, the girl was

tortured, arrested, tortured some more, then had her soul ripped out of her. Given all she's been through, she's positively ebullient. What, do you expect her not to say anything or react at all?

And even then her comments are halfway sarcastic... "Just like old times... well, 'cept without the torture'n all."

I can see some folks not getting into spunky/perky, which she is. But whiny she definitely is not.

EDIT: Does anyone know where to download the vendor who sells the robe of vecna and shield of balduran among other things?

IIRC, it's not a download; you just unlock it with a cheat code in the console. I can't find the cheat at Sorcerer's, but if you Google it you should find it relatively easy, or try asking/checking at the Bioware forums.

St.Sinner

2008-02-05, 12:00 AM

EDIT: Does anyone know where to download the vendor who sells the robe of vecna and shield of balduran among other things?

Try here. (http://www.gamebanshee.com/baldursgateii/downloads.php)

It seems to have solved itself. I reloaded, but it didn't work, so I tried controlling another Flayer and getting it to open it. When I ordered it next to the door, the thing opened, but the charmed Flayer randomly turned hostile and attacked my party. Weird.

That's what is supposed to happen. After the flayer opens each door for you they immediately turn hostile and you have to dispatch them.

Veridian

2008-02-05, 12:19 AM

Why do I find her whiny?

I never got myself introduced to the dungeon begone mod. And Imoen is incredibly whiny in said dungeon. Not that I personally blame her, but it got on my nerves after so many runthroughs of that place. Thus, I refuse to take her along. Same with Jaheira, though my frustration stems from a glitch in her special sidequest (when she leaves you to wait in the docks, she wouldn't rejoin but keep saying she needed to wait at the docks, repeat ad nauseum). I was particularly annoyed as she was carrying a part of the Equialiser sword, so I had to kill her to get it back (Nalia can't pick pockets very well :smallwink: ).

Not that I planned to use it or anything, but a demigod in training's gotta have a pocket plane full of assorted shinies, right?

Now I think about it, I've yet to do an all-evil party...I think the only evil character I used was Viconia. And I'm convinced that the evil guys have the more entertaining lines, not including Minsc. Because that Minsc vs the Pirate King dialogue was just full of win.

St.Sinner

2008-02-05, 01:30 AM

Oh I also find Imoen to be quite irritating. (Whining about wanting to get out of a dungeon. Sister, what do you think I'm trying to do? If we could get out of Irenicus' dungeon we wouldn't be in this mess in the first place, girl.) Mind you, I also find Nalia annoying. Neither are half as bad as Aerie or Jaheira though. (Geez, what is it with the women in this game? Thankfully Viconia is great and Mazzy is pretty nice, if a little over-righteous.)

One of the main things about Imoen for me was
(plot spoilers inside)
The way she was reintroduced into the game. By that time Yoshimo was an excellent fighter who could backstab like no other, with snares that could drop anyone in their tracks, and he could also hold his own in face-to-face combat. Suddenly I have to trade down Yoshimo for Imoen, who was weak, can't melee, and had even lower spell levels than Aerie at that point even though Aerie was multiclass. This annoyed me so much I almost left Imoen right then and there in Spellhold. It was only for the storyline and the retrieve-soul-from-Bodhi plot that I ended up bringing her along, otherwise I would have just walked away.

I also really liked Yoshimo's character. Lighthearted but not frivolous, capable but not arrogant, clever but not egotistical. Having Imoen displace Yoshi like that really put me off her from the outset. Over time the resentment faded, but I still found her personality kinda irritating.

In my first playthrough I had Jaheira, Anomen, Aerie, and Imoen all in my party. Ye gods, WhingeFest '85. The second time round I got smarter and kicked them all out for Korgan, Viconia, Edwin, and Jan. Aaah... much better :smallsmile:

Aerie is... oh my god. First couple levels, meh. High level? Girl is a one-woman spell-slinging death machine. I'd never class her as a weak character... equip her with good stuff so she's hard to hit and stick her behind Minsc.

Aerie is weak in the context of a healer compared to the other healers. She has fewer spells, slower progression, low hp, can't wear armour, and is the only one of the healers who can't hold their own in melee combat. As an overall character I agree she is quite strong and a useful party member to have around. One of the hidden benefits with Aerie is that you can put the Robe of Vecna on her and speed up not only her mage spells, but her cleric spells as well. She does become a spellslinging machine then. The biggest drawback with Aerie is of course, need I say it, her personality :smallsigh:

skyclad

2008-02-05, 07:06 AM

Try here. (http://www.gamebanshee.com/baldursgateii/downloads.php)

Love ya! :smallsmile:

And yeah the best party is for sure Edwin, Korgan, Vicky, Jan and CHARNAME as whatever (Doing a Kensai/Wizard right now). 3 Wizard = CHAOS for everyone! :D

Mordokai

2008-02-05, 07:21 AM

Personaly, I never understood what with the wizards. Oh sure, they are insanely powerful, but I'm really not all that fond of them. So, just for the sake of it, I decided I'd sole the game. Not with mage, not with cleric, not with any kind of pure caster. I took my paladin, imported from BG1, made him cavalier and went under the way. And boy, had I ever had fun! This guy was one death machine. He started the game with the following stats: 19/19/19/11/15/19 and finished Tob with 21/19/20/12/16/21. That was before magic items. Give him Carsomry, Amulet of power, Bealt of fire giant strengh, Vhailors helm, Boots of speed, good armor and few magical rings and cloaks and he's night unstopable in melee. If he starts flinging spells as well... nothing stands in his way. The only problem was, he got insanely powerful too soon. By the time I got in elven city he was already level 40 :smalltongue: Not much to look from there.

As for Imoen, she is one of my favourite characters. But I guess that's up to everybody.

Triaxx

2008-02-05, 07:48 AM

Let's not forget that Aerie can wear the ever useful Sensate Amulet as well as the Amulet of Power.

Cubey

2008-02-05, 08:53 AM

Imoen didn't strike me as whiny as much as... not kinda there. Imagine you are Simon from Firefly, but your sister has less flipping out and awesome and more staring blankly into space, like if she was on something illegal. That's how playing BG 2 with Imoen feels like.

Baldur's Gate 2 has a lack of awesome female characters. Of course, there is Mazzy who is cool, and Nalia is okay if a little naive. The rest is, in my book, more or less awful. I described Imoen already. Aerie is a whiny weakling who needs to grow a spine. Viconia is a self-centered b*tch who does next to nothing to hide the fact she's evil, and then wonders why is it that people don't like her. Jaheira is an unbearable b*tch too, and a nature fanatic with a stick bigger than Miko's, to that.

So, we have 6 females, 1 of whom qualifies as awesome. That's 16.67%. Compare to guys' Minsc, Jan, Edwin, Haer'Dalis, Keldorn and Sarevok.

EDIT: Of course, the sexes' coolness ratios are balanced by Anomen, who wins the infamous award of Most Unbearable Party Member, Ever.

ufo

2008-02-05, 09:55 AM

I've reached chapter... six? The one after you exit the Underdark.

I decided to do the quests I hadn't bothered to do in Chapter 2/3, so I finished the Unseeing Eye quest and got Keldorn. Soon after I put him back together with his wife, and all was well and good. Except for one thing. Keldorn was carrying all my good swords, including the Equalizer, Flame of the North and more. Anyway to get them back from him?

DeathQuaker

2008-02-05, 11:22 AM

Why do I find her whiny?

I never got myself introduced to the dungeon begone mod. And Imoen is incredibly whiny in said dungeon. Not that I personally blame her, but it got on my nerves after so many runthroughs of that place. Thus, I refuse to take her along.

I see. I honestly don't remember the beginning very well... but I have to say I was willing to cut the girl some slack because she had been tortured constantly for weeks. That's not "whining," that's reasonable trauma, and she gets over it quickly.

If that's all you've experienced of the character, you don't really know her. If you ever play through again, I'd advise.... not that you have to take the advice of course.... trying to keep her around after Spellhold. You haven't seen her out-insult Korgan in a jibe contest (Kheldar and Neeshka of NWN2 fame have loads to learn from those two). You haven't seen her trade turnip stories with Jan or frighten Aerie with stories of her inner-Slayer forcing her to steal cinnamon cookies in the night, or ask Minsc for tips on how to raise hamsters. She really brings in some of the funniest dialogue in the game and makes the story richer all around... you just need to get past... you know, "the torture'n all."

And I'd rather than listen to 12 Imoens 24/7 than hear Anomen open his mouth once. HE is whiny. "Oooh, my daddy hates me, he's so meaaaaaan...."

Aerie is weak in the context of a healer compared to the other healers. She has fewer spells, slower progression, low hp, can't wear armour, and is the only one of the healers who can't hold their own in melee combat. As an overall character I agree she is quite strong and a useful party member to have around. One of the hidden benefits with Aerie is that you can put the Robe of Vecna on her and speed up not only her mage spells, but her cleric spells as well. She does become a spellslinging machine then. The biggest drawback with Aerie is of course, need I say it, her personality :smallsigh:

I see what you're saying about power as a healer... yes, I remember getting Anomen and then Viconia because she wasn't doing well enough as my sole party healer on one of my playthroughs.

As an aside, one thing I did with Aerie was get her one of the slings that has neverending ammunition and equipped her with that and a good shield, and while not uber in combat when not casting spells, she managed to hold the rear flank pretty well.

As for her personality, I've found that the key thing is if you want to play w/ her, don't play her romance (i.e. avoid playing a male human, half-elf, elf, or gnome -- or shut off the romance via the console) and bring along Minsc. He sort of adopts her and they have some cute interactions together, and she becomes a lot less frail and spleeny as the game progresses.

I've not played w/ her and Haer'dalis in the party together... don't know if their romance together makes her more or less tolerable.

Archonic Energy

2008-02-05, 11:42 AM

and is the only one of the healers who can't hold their own in melee combat.

Dual Weild: Croym Fayer + Runehammer...

"can't hold her own"
:sigh:

SmartAlec

2008-02-05, 12:09 PM

One thing to note about Aerie that I haven't seen mentioned is that she's able to put Clerical spells into Spell Sequencers and Contingencies.

That's fantastic.

St.Sinner

2008-02-05, 04:18 PM

^ You're right. I'd forgotten all about that.

I decided to do the quests I hadn't bothered to do in Chapter 2/3, so I finished the Unseeing Eye quest and got Keldorn. Soon after I put him back together with his wife, and all was well and good. Except for one thing. Keldorn was carrying all my good swords, including the Equalizer, Flame of the North and more. Anyway to get them back from him?

I actually don't remember much of Keldorn's quest at all. Doesn't he rejoin your party after his family drama is complete? I'm pretty sure in at least one of the paths you can ask him to join with you again, and then you can pick him up in about a day or so.

Dual Weild: Croym Fayer + Runehammer...

"can't hold her own"
:sigh:

It still holds true. She is weak in terms of hp, can't wear armour, and cannot put more than one proficiency slot in warhammers or any weapon. Put her one on one against Gromnir or Improved Illasera in a pure melee brawl and, Crom Faeyr or no Crom Faeyr, she won't last very long. And honestly such powerful weapons are wasted on her. Why give them to her when others can make much better use of them? It'd be pretty inefficient. Better to keep her right at the back and casting spells and staying well out of the combat.

I've not played w/ her and Haer'dalis in the party together... don't know if their romance together makes her more or less tolerable.

Neither more nor less I would say. But not being in a romance with the protagonist by default already makes her less irritating since, well, you don't have to listen to her so much. Maybe she's off at the side whining poor Haer'dalis' ears off but that's his business so just too bad for him. His loss is charname's gain :smallamused:

Imoen didn't strike me as whiny as much as... not kinda there. Imagine you are Simon from Firefly, but your sister has less flipping out and awesome and more staring blankly into space, like if she was on something illegal. That's how playing BG 2 with Imoen feels like.

Heheh, funny you should put it like that. I remember a friend watching me play BG2 once, and afterwards her comment on Imoen was "Has she been smoking something?" For me Imoen just reminds me of the annoying little sister I never had.

ufo

2008-02-05, 04:37 PM

I actually don't remember much of Keldorn's quest at all. Doesn't he rejoin your party after his family drama is complete? I'm pretty sure in at least one of the paths you can ask him to join with you again, and then you can pick him up in about a day or so.

I had the option, but I didn't think about it at the time, so I chose the romantic option that implied that he and his family would live happily ever after with no more Paladin-y. Meh. I'll find him and assassinate him.

EDIT: When I get out of Watcher's Keep. Most boring place ever(z).

St.Sinner

2008-02-05, 05:01 PM

You could also pickpocket him for the items if you have a good thief or bard, s'all good :smallsmile:

Blayze

2008-02-05, 06:38 PM

Or just use ShadowKeeper, find the "Out of party characters" option and transfer over what he's carrying.

Triaxx

2008-02-06, 06:37 AM

Who says she can't wear armor? Just play out all her mage spells as prebattle buffs, and apply them prior to the fighting. Slap on her armor and she can still use all her in battle spells, along with contingencies that activate regardless of armor. Plus she can stack Spirit Armor, Stoneskin, and Spiritual Armor.

Don't forget she has both Doom and Greater Malision.

Mordokai

2008-02-06, 06:44 AM

Well, she really can't wear armor, because her STR is too low for it. You have to slap some items on her before she can wear any good armor. But if you do that she can be pretty good, since she can still cast clerical spells, meaning all the buffs and healing is still avaliable to her.

I never do that with her since I don't think that's the way she was supposed to play, but the option is there. It's up to the player if he will use it.

Archonic Energy

2008-02-06, 07:13 AM

Put her one on one against Gromnir or Improved Illasera in a pure melee brawl and, Crom Faeyr or no Crom Faeyr, she won't last very long.

neither will most spell casters... because that's not what they are designed for! if you're going to equip your people to the best of their abilities then i can't think of a more optimal kit layout for Aerie.

Tenser's transformation
Mage Armour
Sheild
Protection from fear
Regeneration
Aid
Spell sequencer with 2x healing spells
Contingency with Heal, Blade Barrier, &... whatever
Dual weilding CF & RH...

need i really say more?

DeathQuaker

2008-02-06, 07:45 AM

I remember later in the game finding some rather nice suits of elven chain which don't hinder spellcasting. I put Aerie in it (she looks gorgeous in chain too, IIRC) and it suited her quite well (until I later found some ridiculous robe of uberness to replace it). If you really want an armored Aerie, that's your best bet.

Also, she can use shields without hindrance, so you can improve her AC that way and save some of your spells for other stuff. Buffs become only so good after all the enemy casters strip them off you first chance they get.

I still think Aerie with sling'n'shield is the best way to equip her. That way she can fight ranged when she isn't throwing spells--and some of those magic slings do some nice damage. I usually save Crom Feyr for a belt-of-strength wearing Viconia, to send her in the middle of all-caster fights, where the casters waste their spells on her while she beats them on the head.

Wraith

2008-02-06, 08:29 AM

I'm with you, DQ. If you can't take Aerie and get her AC down to about -6 WITHOUT spells and accessories, then you're not doing it right.

Bladesinger Chainmail +4, Drow Chainmail +5, Darkmetal Shield or the Fortress Shield, Bracers of AC 3, Helm of Balduran, Ring of Protection, Ring of Gaxx, Cloak of the Sewers, Bracers of Dexterity if you really want to make fun of things. Along with her natural DEX Bonus, I've probably gotten her down as far as -9 without spells.

Then we have Boots of Avoidance, Belt of Bluntness, Belt of Piercing and the Bonuses for having a Large Shield... another -4 or -5 against missiles or another damage type of your choice. And STILL casting all the spells she wants. :smalltongue:

Viconia, on the other hand... I think I've gotten her to hit about AC-15 without spells, though that was in ToB and I hadn't bothered collecting the pieces for the Big Metal Unit. Pick that Beast up, and you could be running around at -18 or even -20 on the right character.

Baldur's Gate, it seems, doesn't like paying attention to little guidelines such as "You can NEVER have an AC better than -10" as was part of the 2nd Edition Rules. :smallwink:

Blayze

2008-02-06, 09:20 AM

I usually save Crom Feyr for a belt-of-strength wearing Viconia

It's been ages since I last got Crom Faeyr, but doesn't it set the user's Strength to 25 anyway? Why would you need to give anybody a Belt of Strength if they were wielding it?

skyclad

2008-02-06, 03:13 PM

It's been ages since I last got Crom Faeyr, but doesn't it set the user's Strength to 25 anyway? Why would you need to give anybody a Belt of Strength if they were wielding it?

Yes it does so that seems like a waste. Not to mention the waste of having the crom faeyr on a character with only one attack per round.

Blayze

2008-02-06, 04:45 PM

Hmm. Crom Faeyr and Belm. I wonder how many Str 25 attacks per round you can squeeze out of the game?

Mordokai

2008-02-06, 05:09 PM

Yes it does so that seems like a waste. Not to mention the waste of having the crom faeyr on a character with only one attack per round.

Nohing that Improved haste won't fix. And Crom Faeyr is almost made for clerics, seeing it's a blunt weapon. I'm not sure how many attacks Anomen can produce, but like I said, if you cast Improved haste on Aerie she can stand pretty much toe to toe with him.

Hmm. Crom Faeyr and Belm. I wonder how many Str 25 attacks per round you can squeeze out of the game?

Pretty much irrelevant, seeing that by then you'll have GWW which sets number of attacks to ten/round.

Triaxx

2008-02-06, 05:29 PM

Which is why if Aerie is fighting, we give her the CF. Personally I prefer to give her the MoD+2, and the Fortress shield.

Minsc gets the CF and FoA+5.

Viccy should be lucky not to just get kicked in the head at the first opportunity. Or end up part of the Rock Garden like Sarevok. (Taken out back and turned to stone, where ever out back happens to be. I like the third challenge room myself.)

DeathQuaker

2008-02-06, 06:31 PM

It's been ages since I last got Crom Faeyr, but doesn't it set the user's Strength to 25 anyway? Why would you need to give anybody a Belt of Strength if they were wielding it?

Because it's been awhile since I played it and forgot Crom Feyr did that? I remember giving Viconia strength-enhancing items, but it must have been before I got Crom Feyr (I also liked giving her the Flail of Ages).

As for why use her (responding to others in the thread) -- exactly b/c of what I said before -- her spell resistance, esp. if enhanced with other items makes her very useful in rooms full of only casters. She shrugs off the spells they cast at her, and if she can't get past their own spell protections with her spells, she can beat them over the head with a large blunt instrument that does truckloads of damage.

Given I usually equip my meleers with the 8 zillion uber-magical swords in the game, I don't feel it's a waste handing Viconia one of the few items she can use.

Blayze

2008-02-06, 07:00 PM

Pretty much irrelevant, seeing that by then you'll have GWW which sets number of attacks to ten/round.

Granted, Greater Whirlwind is awesome, but it's an "x uses per day" ability, is it not? At least, I seem to remember it being one. In that case, then Belm is good for those times when you're NOT Whirlwinding.

She shrugs off the spells they cast at her

Belt of Inertial Barrier time, methinks? "Oh, a hostile spellcaster. What's that? You passed my Magic Resistance with a damage-dealing spell? Oh, what a pity." :P

Veridian

2008-02-06, 10:17 PM

Just a shame her con renders her about as physically tough as a kitten >_<

Trazoi

2008-02-06, 11:21 PM

Just a shame her con renders her about as physically tough as a kitten >_<
There's a belt for that too. :smallsmile:

I too usually give Crom Feyr to the cleric, because there's so many other awesome weapons for the fighters. Crom Feyr makes a nice secondary weapon to something like the Flail of Ages, which in my current playthrough is what my PC will end up wielding (she's a Cleric/Ranger).

Mordokai

2008-02-07, 07:18 AM

Granted, Greater Whirlwind is awesome, but it's an "x uses per day" ability, is it not? At least, I seem to remember it being one. In that case, then Belm is good for those times when you're NOT Whirlwinding.

Usually you should have it more than enought uses of GWW to last you for a day. If not, then there is Improved haste again. And Belm has another problem: it's only +2 weapon, which becomes much too weak later in game, seeing that you need a +3 or better weapon to hurt most of enemies. Personaly, I never understood all the hype around the Belm.

Veridian

2008-02-07, 07:31 AM

There's a belt for that too. :smallsmile:

I suppose, but I usually give it to someone with a sub-par con that I plan to allow to engage in combat :smallwink: (usually my main character as I tend to play spellcasters and ignore con a bit knowing I can get a permaboost for it)

I tend to use my clerics as offensive spellcasters rather than melee beatsticks. That's what I bring Minsc along for, after all.

Triaxx

2008-02-07, 07:34 AM

Belm's advantage was always the extra attack early in the game where it mattered, before you had access to time stop, and all those other lovely little tricks.

DeathQuaker

2008-02-07, 08:01 AM

Belt of Inertial Barrier time, methinks? "Oh, a hostile spellcaster. What's that? You passed my Magic Resistance with a damage-dealing spell? Oh, what a pity." :P

That would be good on Vic, or on someone else, especially if you're not using her. A reason to get to Trademeet early-ish, I guess.

I tend to use my clerics as offensive spellcasters rather than melee beatsticks. That's what I bring Minsc along for, after all.

You do understand when I was talking about that strategy with Viconia, it is in a very specific circumstance, and note that particularly it is versus spellcasters who are weak in melee (where comparatively she is a powerhouse, and she has abilities to shrug off spells that people like Minsc cannot)? I'm not -- and I don't think anyone is -- saying you should use her (or Aerie) as a primary melee-er in your party (unless you're wanting to challenge yourself that way).

And you don't have to use Vic at all, of course. Just saying that if you bring her along, this is a way in which she is useful.

It is good to give your clerics good equipment; they don't have a lot of offensive spells until they are higher level (plus you need to make sure you have certain curatives prepared at all times), and so there are times when equipping them as support melee (or ranged attackers) is a good idea, for when you run out of spells or are saving them for the bigger fight around the corner.

And the fact is, Baldur's Gate 2, for all the wonderful story it is, is also a Monty Haul game extraordinaire.... by the end... heck, even the middle of the game you have so much high-powered equipment you can keep your meatshields dressed to the nines (or +5s at least) and still be putting your rear-line ranged attackers and spellcasters in con and str boosting items and all kinds of crazy things, and giving them "handmedowns" like Crom Feyr because you've already found something better for your fighters....

Woot Spitum

2008-02-07, 10:45 PM

I have been having a problem lately. Every so often I'll get into an area and I will be unable to speak to an npc because they "appear busy and are unable to talk right now." No matter how long I wait, I can't talk to them without reloading the game. Is there a fix for this?

Pagz

2008-02-07, 11:11 PM

Usually you should have it more than enought uses of GWW to last you for a day. If not, then there is Improved haste again. And Belm has another problem: it's only +2 weapon, which becomes much too weak later in game, seeing that you need a +3 or better weapon to hurt most of enemies. Personaly, I never understood all the hype around the Belm.REAL MEN use the Scarlet Ninja-to :smallwink: (and by real men, I mean bards).

By Baldurs gate 2, I think I could solo the game with a Blade, is it just me or did they just seem wayyy too good. Beating that Red Dragon with a level 14 bard yay!

I have to say, Throne of Bhall had the most epic ending EVAR! I wish I could go back in time and experience it for the first time again... since I'd played through BG1 to ToB with the same character, I felt for the little guy :smallbiggrin:.

FELT PROUD.

Pronounceable

2008-02-08, 01:07 AM

I have to say, Throne of Bhall had the most epic ending EVAR!

The ending is actually a little lame what with random monsters and respawning boss (assuming you're talking about the entire battle and not just outro, which is just average). Ascension mod makes it so much better. Suggest you try it.

And original's ending with disintegrating Sarevok was orders of magnitude epicker than ToB.

(but no ending in gaming history can hold a candle to Torment...)

Prustan

2008-02-08, 03:03 AM

I have to say, Throne of Bhall had the most epic ending EVAR! I wish I could go back in time and experience it for the first time again... since I'd played through BG1 to ToB with the same character, I felt for the little guy :smallbiggrin:.

FELT PROUD.

I had a Paladin that I took through BG1, did the cheese for 25 all stats, and started her off in BG2 - middle of Spellhold I think. Then I took a long vacation, leaving my savegames (family computer) in the care of my younger brother. When I got back, no paladin :smallfurious: Since then, I've tried several times to beat the game, but never again got to Spellhold.
Is it just me, or does it seem really daft that female Paladins aren't tough enough to hang on to the deArnise Castle? Never quite understood that my female Cavalier, with the ability to benchpress trolls, wasn't considered tough enough to be a steward for the Castle.

Blayze

2008-02-08, 06:13 AM

Just get hold of the mod that gives you all of the strongholds (Had some problems with getting the Paladin stronghold with an earlier version). Just make sure you pick the Thief and Bard ones up later than the others, otherwise it'd cripple you. "Goddammit, I have to go back to Athkatla *again*?!

Either that or download one of the two (I think) Planar Sphere return mods. Or the seventh level Teleport spell.

I think I could solo the game with a Blade

I'm going to try it as a Jester. Actually, I think I'll go for a fun party next. Wizard Slayer, Swashbuckler, Wild Mage, Jester, Cavalier and some form of underpowered Druid.

St.Sinner

2008-02-08, 07:02 AM

Yes, the G3 Tweak Pack will allow you to have all the strongholds no matter what your class. I have to warn you though, having all the strongholds at once can get really annoying. Especially with idiotic ones like the ranger stronghold, where you can't even bloody refuse!

neither will most spell casters... because that's not what they are designed for! if you're going to equip your people to the best of their abilities then i can't think of a more optimal kit layout for Aerie.

I'm not saying Aerie is a bad character. As I've said before she is rather useful to have around. And clearly, with all the uber equipment in the game, anyone can be made into a perfectly serviceable, even a good, character. It's only a matter of whether it's the most efficient use of equipment, and the most efficient use of the character, which, where Aerie is concerned, many would say it's not. Her spell slots would be spent on much better things than buffing her so she can melee. So my point was only that she is physically weaker than the rest of the healers. Cernd, for example, would be able to go toe to toe with Gromnir with little to no buffs. So could Anomen, who can do up to five attacks per round thanks to his early fighter levels, no spells or buffs needed.

You do understand when I was talking about that strategy with Viconia, it is in a very specific circumstance, and note that particularly it is versus spellcasters who are weak in melee (where comparatively she is a powerhouse, and she has abilities to shrug off spells that people like Minsc cannot)?

Yes, that is a very good use for monks as well. At high level they are completely immune to anything those spellslingers lob at them so they'd just walk right through the Horrid Wilting and kung fu the poor guy.

I have to say, Throne of Bhall had the most epic ending EVAR! I wish I could go back in time and experience it for the first time again... since I'd played through BG1 to ToB with the same character, I felt for the little guy :smallbiggrin:.

FELT PROUD.

Hehe... judging by this, I guess when the time came you
ascended? :smallwink:

DeathQuaker

2008-02-08, 07:55 AM

Yes, that is a very good use for monks as well. At high level they are completely immune to anything those spellslingers lob at them so they'd just walk right through the Horrid Wilting and kung fu the poor guy.

Ooh, that sounds like fun. Geez, now this conversation is making me want to install the game again and try yet more character combinations (plus I have unfinished games as well). Argh! So much gaming, so little time....

riddles

2008-02-08, 08:02 AM

the cleric/ranger class was awesomely powerful - dual class in SoA only, better multiclass in ToB

a fighting type character, dual weilding the crom faeyr and the flail of ages with ironskin spells - horridly powerful.

i note that there is a lot of anti jaheira in this thread. in a similar way to the ranger/cleric, jaheira's power goes up leaps and bounds in ToB due to ironskin and other buffs. The reason she isn't so great in core SoA is the exp cap, which stops her getting a key level of druid (i think it's 15). EDIT: she was a right royal pain though. true neutral my butt, she was lawful good and revelled in it

same with aerie, actually. once the exp cap was raised by ToB, the multiclass character became increasingly more powerful than the dual and single class character (anomen, for example, is great in SoA but runs out of steam towards the end of ToB) because after a certain point, you weren't gaining much except for hps at level up, while the multiclass character continued to gain levels and class features in both their classes.

i support the notion that jan and minsc in the "boo stealing" dialogue actually made me fall off my chair. the evil characters got the best lines though - korgan, viconia and edwin were all great fun to play with and in SoA were some of the strongest characters.

Blayze

2008-02-08, 09:22 AM

Especially with idiotic ones like the ranger stronghold, where you can't even bloody refuse!

You can get rid of it by being a bad influence though, can't you? I seem to remember giving those kids alcohol and swords.

while the multiclass character continued to gain levels and class features in both their classes.

I still have to try out that mod that slants the Fighter/Mage/Thief HLA tables towards the Mage abilities. No level 10 spells my ginger, flatulent arse (Of course, that EXP cap fix that lets them reach 40/40/40 is needed here).

a fighting type character, dual weilding the crom faeyr and the flail of ages with ironskin spells - horridly powerful.

Don't forget buffs like, say, Bless. And especially when they can cast every Divine spell ever.

Green Bean

2008-02-08, 11:11 PM

Trazoi

2008-02-08, 11:48 PM

So, I finally beat both SoA and ToB, and since my first play through of any game tends to miss half the sidequests, I've started a new one aimed at getting as much of the non-essential stuff as I can. Which is why I'm wondering about how the inter-party dialogues come about. Are they unlocked based on story progress (i.e. if X and Y have 5 conversations, will I see them all simply by keeping them in the party the whole time?), or are they based on a timer (and is the timer based on real time or in-game hours?)?
From what I remember the conversations between party members depend on a wide range of factors. Some are based on timers, and some are based on location. It's a pretty complicated mess of rules; the best bet for interesting conversations is pick a party of four characters you'll like to see interact and stick with them, using the final slot for temporary characters and accessing side-quests.

Green Bean

2008-02-09, 01:41 AM

From what I remember the conversations between party members depend on a wide range of factors. Some are based on timers, and some are based on location. It's a pretty complicated mess of rules; the best bet for interesting conversations is pick a party of four characters you'll like to see interact and stick with them, using the final slot for temporary characters and accessing side-quests.

Darn. I was hoping for something easy. In my first ToB run, I was trying to do the whole [ToB Spoilers]'redeem Sarevok'[/ToB Spoilers] thing, but he didn't even talk to me once. I figured I was doing something wrong.

Trazoi

2008-02-09, 03:25 AM

Darn. I was hoping for something easy. In my first ToB run, I was trying to do the whole [ToB Spoilers]'blah blah blah spoilers blah blah blah'[/ToB Spoilers] thing, but he didn't even talk to me once. I figured I was doing something wrong.
I'm afraid I can't help you there. I've only played ToB once, and by the time I got there I already had a tight team of six that had been through a lot together. I wasn't going to kick someone out to let such an evil character join, not with Mazzy and Keldorn breathing down my neck!

St.Sinner

2008-02-09, 03:50 AM

You can get rid of it by being a bad influence though, can't you? I seem to remember giving those kids alcohol and swords.

Oh really? Heheh... I usually end up giving those kids bad stuff too (it's funny when they meet the "dragon") but I'd forgotten that you would lose your stronghold over it.

Ooh, that sounds like fun. Geez, now this conversation is making me want to install the game again and try yet more character combinations (plus I have unfinished games as well). Argh! So much gaming, so little time....

It is! If you want to play a monk, make sure you download the Oversight mod, which will give you high level abilities like the ones Balthazar has. I was always a bit disappointed that Bioware didn't create a monk NPC. But hey, there are always mods out there to remedy that.

Darn. I was hoping for something easy. In my first ToB run, I was trying to do the whole redeem Sarevok thing, but he didn't even talk to me once. I figured I was doing something wrong.

Did you ask him to swear an oath of loyalty at the beginning? The most important thing about redeeming Sarevok is not to ask him to swear the oath. Just trust him! :smallsmile:

Most of the banters in SoA and I think all of them in ToB are triggered by a timer (which is based off real-time I'm afraid, so you can't just rest to make them happen faster). There are mods out there with a 'banter accelerator' component which will make them happen faster. Sometimes it results in a barage of conversations at the beginning and none towards the end, but if you want to make sure you see all the banters this'll help you.

Cubey

2008-02-09, 04:56 AM

I managed to redeem Sarevok even with him swearing the oath. Unfortunately, it's been a while since I played the game, and I forgot most of the details. I'm sure about that one however.

Sir Enigma

2008-02-09, 07:08 AM

Is it just me, or does it seem really daft that female Paladins aren't tough enough to hang on to the deArnise Castle? Never quite understood that my female Cavalier, with the ability to benchpress trolls, wasn't considered tough enough to be a steward for the Castle.

It's nothing to do with being female, it's because you're a paladin. The castle is the fighter stronghold, so only a fighter character will be asked to hold it. The paladin stronghold is the Order of the Radiant Heart in the temple district.

Prustan

2008-02-10, 01:18 AM

It's nothing to do with being female, it's because you're a paladin. The castle is the fighter stronghold, so only a fighter character will be asked to hold it. The paladin stronghold is the Order of the Radiant Heart in the temple district.

Been a while since I played that far, but what I remember Nalia saying is that it was to do with her being a female - any male could have it, or a female Fighter. I'm sure I once played a male Monk who got to hang on to the castle...

Mordokai

2008-02-10, 03:18 AM

Any fighing soul, to be precise. Which means fighter and all his kits, barbarian and monk can have the de'Arnise stronghold.

Personaly, I find that weird because I don't see paladin any less of a fighter as a pure fighter. But I know that's because of game limitations. In real life, I'm guessing nobody would mind paladin for a head of a castle. Especially because paladins have charisma, while it's usually just the other way around with fighters, barbarians and monks.

Driderman

2008-02-10, 11:20 AM

I'm not sure about the banters, but LoveTalks happen once every real-time hour and I think NPC banters are based on the same premise.
To speed up LoveTalks you can up your framerate in the games config file. The default is 30, I usually set it to 45 or 60. Of course, this speeds up the entire game so you'll need to be able to cope with that too

Wraith

2008-02-10, 02:22 PM

The lovetalks are on a timer, though they are all different depending on 1) the person that you are romancing and 2) the stage you're at in the romance. Viconia, for example, is slow to start but has more and more frequent messages further towards the end of her storyline, whereas Aerie's whining lovetalks tend to be quite consistent throughout.

An alternative to altering your framerate, if you're not comfortable messing with your computer like me, is to use the CLUA Console. Any quick search in Google will give you the appropriate details on how to set your LoveTalk counter to "0" on a whim. This is, of course, "Cheating" in a literal sense as opposed to simply taking advantage of the available mechanics :smallsmile:

Both of these things are only true as far as SoA lasts. When you reach ToB, the LoveTalks instead coincide with important plot points, and will occur only when you do certain things or visit certain places. The only way to get them sooner is to hustle your ass through the plot faster, so no amount of tricks will work short of doing complicated things to the scripts with Shadow Keeper.

Just in case anyone was wondering. :smallsmile:

Anyhoo... I've just brawled my way through SoA as a Dual Class 7 Fighter/15 Druid. Man, that was hard work until I'd picked up 3 or even 4 Iron Skins, but one level into ToB and I jump up to casting Storm of Vengeance or Implosion 6 times instead of 3 before I rest. I take it back - 2nd Edition Druids aren't as bad as they are made out to be :smallbiggrin:

Anyone else found a class that has pleasantly surprised them lately? I've heard some crazy talk about playing as a Jester, but I have some serious doubts about how effective that'd be in a game dominated by Undead, Extra-Planars and High Level Mages after the 3rd Chapter.... :smallwink:

Blayze

2008-02-10, 03:44 PM

Alright, alright. Six Jesters. :P

Driderman

2008-02-10, 04:01 PM

Double-clicking the config file and adjusting Maximum Frame Rate from 30 to 60, then pressing save and exit hardly constitutes messing with your computer... But whatever floats your boat. Im still pretty sure the LoveTalks in SoA are once an hour, although there's definitely some random element involved as well

Wraith

2008-02-10, 06:06 PM

I once picked up my Tower, moved it 6 feet away to another table, turned it on, and it went *POP!* with a cloud of white smoke.

Heaven forbid I actually start trying to be clever with the thing, Driderman. :smallbiggrin:

DeathQuaker

2008-02-10, 08:30 PM

You could also just go to sorcerers.net and download the NPC Interactions and the Romance guide, which puts the interactions in (lengthy) Word documents.

You'll miss conversations your NPCs start with you, though (with the exception of the lovetalks, which is in the romance guide).

Generally, however, if you try to play as many sidequests as possible, you'll be playing for more than long enough to trigger most of the banters you'll want to see. And you don't necessarily want to speed up the banter rate, because the frequency of stuff happening like some goofy perky conversation happening right after or right before combat will increase as well.

Driderman

2008-02-10, 08:32 PM

:smalleek:

Well, I suppose some people just have 'The Curse'.
Like my girlfriend, she always has some sort of issue with hardware or software, the second I touch her computer it goes away...

On topic, I've reinstalled BG II yet again and as usual, it took me 5 tries to decide what character I wanted to play... Ended up with another evil party, as usual. Korgan is priceless, but I suppose I should try and fit him into another group.
I remember, my first playthrough, I hadn't really realised he was chaotic evil and him in a party with Aerie, Jaheira and Nalia. Now that was entertaining :smallbiggrin:

Prustan

2008-02-11, 06:14 AM

My latest attempt to play the full game is a Female Half-Elf Mage/Cleric, with current party members Minsc, Chloe (lesbian Kensai :smalleek: ), Yoshimo, Aerie, and Nalia. About to go clean out the castle.
Will pick up Kelsey sometime (not sure who I'll be replacing), and I have the Banter Pack, and multiple strongholds mods.

ShinyRocks

2008-02-11, 06:15 AM

All this talk of BGII made me want to reinstall it and play around. So I went to my great big collector's edition box.
I had my manual. I had my poster. I had my damn trading cards. But did I have my discs? I did not.
*cry*

Driderman

2008-02-11, 07:29 AM

I'm off the conviction that if you've already bought a game once, you're entitled to download it off the net if you've thrown the discs away.
Thats the only reason I'm still able to play Fallout 2, bought the game twice and lost the cd both times, now I have a cracked image file on my HD, won't be throwing that away!

You know, I actually have 2 versions of BG II. The 4 cd one and the dvd one which I bought from Gamestop recently.

Hmm, what mods do I have installed...?

Virtue
DungeonBeGone ( A given, otherwise I'd never actually get to play)
BG2 Tweaks
NPCKits
RomanticEncounters
NPCFlirt
Banterpack
Unfinished Business
Ascension

As I'm playing a fighter/mage right now, I was thinking of looking into some Expanded Stronghold quests before I get my Stronghold(s). Any suggestions for some good ones?

Blayze

2008-02-11, 07:56 AM

I can only remember expanded stronghold stuff being present for the Thief(Blucher made a general expansion), Bard (Something to do with extra plays that can be performed), Fighter (Do the two Nalia romance mods count? :P), Mage (No less than five or six mods for this, two of which add quick ways of getting back from other places, one adding a vendor after the normal quests are done, one about the Knights, at least one expanding it and adding a bunch of quests and the other giving you more stuff from your 'dealings' with Tolgerias) and Paladin (If you count Improved F and Super F as stronghold-related).

St.Sinner

2008-02-17, 10:07 PM

Mwaha! This thread seems to be luring a lot of people into reinstalling and playing BGII again. Brilliant!

So I was playing a little today and I just found a book called 'Fifty Ways to Kill Your Kangaxx' :smallbiggrin: I have no idea which mod dropped it in there, but it's the most hilarious thing ever.

My latest attempt to play the full game is a Female Half-Elf Mage/Cleric, with current party members Minsc, Chloe (lesbian Kensai :smalleek: ), Yoshimo, Aerie, and Nalia.

Hm, how is the Chloe mod? I was going to install Chloe to romance my female PC once, but then I read some descriptions and comments from other players and didn't really like her personality. I thought she might be a bit of a Mary Sue.

Prustan

2008-02-18, 02:45 AM

Hm, how is the Chloe mod? I was going to install Chloe to romance my female PC once, but then I read some descriptions and comments from other players and didn't really like her personality. I thought she might be a bit of a Mary Sue.

Not too bad actually. A lot of work was put into her, and her starting Dex of 25 didn't matter since I'd used Shadowkeeper to put everyone's Str, Dex, and most important other stat(s) up to 25 anyway. The author was correct in saying that Chloe was complicated, but I kind of like the challenge, plus the other banters are well done.

Tam_OConnor

2008-02-18, 06:25 PM

Got to disagree with you about Chloe, Prustan. I haven't tried romancing her, but her whole objective morality started to really irk me. Plus, she was fighting with Keldorn. Insane kill count, I'll admit, but that was in contrast to Minsc with the Chaos blade and a Clr/Rgr with a +2 flail. Her AC gets less and less attractive as time wears on. Chloe: 'Hey look, I have a -2 AC!' CHARNAME: 'Chloe, put some cloths on.' And her voicing is significantly louder than everyone's else; not a big issue, but annoying.

Oh course, I haven't uninstalled it yet, so it can't be that bad. Install it; no one says you have to take the half-god mercenary along with you.

A word on Mazzy and Valygar: if you install the Underrepresented Items mod, then give Mazzy the +5 Charged short sword of Wounding and Valygar Nine Paces (a +5 spear with a reach so long it may as well be a ranged weapon), they easily hold their own in pure melee. Keldorn's Dispels are still divine, but I think Mazzy's kill count may actually be higher.

Triaxx

2008-02-18, 08:02 PM

Personally I prefer Weimer's Item upgrade, so I can pump up Mazzy's normal short sword instead. Plus I get the Spear of the Unicorn, which is throwing and returning.

Blayze

2008-02-19, 08:58 AM

Don't forget the Ruad mod. There's a load of items you can upgrade, and many of them belong to the characters. I practically *need* a Bag of Holding right from the start these days...

St.Sinner

2008-02-20, 12:07 AM

Got to disagree with you about Chloe, Prustan. I haven't tried romancing her, but her whole objective morality started to really irk me. Plus, she was fighting with Keldorn. Insane kill count, I'll admit, but that was in contrast to Minsc with the Chaos blade and a Clr/Rgr with a +2 flail. Her AC gets less and less attractive as time wears on. Chloe: 'Hey look, I have a -2 AC!' CHARNAME: 'Chloe, put some cloths on.' And her voicing is significantly louder than everyone's else; not a big issue, but annoying.

Yeah I actually find the 25 Dex too cheesy and was rather put off by the demigod thing too. Sometimes you just want a regular human guy or gal, and there's a point where you think 'enough with the demigods, planeswalkers, celestial spawn, demon spawn, princes, heroes of a nation, and anyone else with a too cool for school backstory.' There is one star in this story, and it can get annoying when the supporting cast tries to steal the show.

I must say I'm not a big fan of too many item upgrade mods. As ridiculous as it sounds, there's such a thing as too much loot. It kinda takes the challenge out of it if every character has a +6 Weapon of Uber Pwnage in their hands.

Triaxx

2008-02-20, 08:50 AM

Blayze

2008-02-20, 08:53 AM

Well, Ruad's not really about creating uber-weapons out of every item available, so that everybody can have one. It's more about "You can sacrifice these specific weapons to create this stronger one" and "Would you like me to make those Rings of Protection +1 into an item that's more useful?"

Edit: Ruad's items are expensive, too. Some are, if I remember correctly, *really* *really* expensive.

Mordokai

2008-02-20, 01:42 PM

That's why I like Weimer's, because it's upgrades to items, rather than just adding more. The 'Stormlords Heels' for example are a combination of the Boots of Grounding, and Boots of Haste, netting the benefits of both, but requiring 10,000 gold, and a Rogue Stone.

I remember having that mod instaled and to me it was too powerful. I mean, Impaler(that spear you get in Sahuagin city) can become +4 throwing spear, which can deal insane amount of damage. For 10,000 gp and rogue stone or something similar.

In my opinion, Weimer's Item upgrade mod offers too powerful weapons for too little money.

Pagz

2008-02-20, 07:42 PM

I was thinking of starting a BG1 game over the interweb with three other friends, however this raises the question of class roles, such as "we need a fighter/mage/cleric/thief" for the party to function fairly well. However I was thinking "dudes, we can totally dual class!", but im not sure if this would work...

For my character, I wanted to play a bard, however I;m not sure if that will work. So I thought I should try and to this very strange dual class. If I start a fighter till level 3 or 5, then dual class into thief till a high enough level (most likely till BG2, if we get that far!), then dual class into mage.

However I am getting conflicting reports from the blag-o-blag. Some say you can dual class into any combination you want if its doable via multiclass, and some say you can only dual class once.

Which is right? I'd be nice to be able to dual class twice.

Triaxx

2008-02-20, 08:17 PM

Nope, you can only dual one time, but by using a fighter mage, or a bard, there's little you can't do. Bards can pick pocket, use scrolls of knock, and wield two handed swords and crossbows. Or longbows.

As long as someone is Cleric or Druid, you should be alright. Cleric is preferrable, since they can go sanctuary to set off the traps harmlessly.

skyclad

2008-02-21, 03:29 AM

Mage/Fighter (multiclass)
Thief/Fighter (ditto)
Cleric/Fighter (ditto)
+ whatever you want (cleric/mage/fighter?)

Should work well ^^

Wraith

2008-02-21, 08:13 AM

Skyclad is right to suggest multiclassing instead of Dual-classing. It's much simpler, easier and gives you the best of both worlds.

In all honestly, I would recommend that you don't dual-class at all in BG1. Compared to BG2 it's not a very big game, and it'd be very easy to Dual at, say level 6, but be unable to 'catchup' quick enough to refrain from being murdered by the level 5-7 monsters you're fighting while, technically, being only 2 or 3 yourself.

With forethought it can be avoided, but it's easy to get wrong. :smallsmile:

Dualling at anything less than 6 or 7, similarly, is generally a bad idea since your old class has nothing on it. A level 3 Wizard has.... what, 3-5 spells if you don't settle for an average Int?
Cleric, not much better, and Druid is a comparatively LONG haul to abandon after a few levels, when everyone else will probably be a level or 2 above you before you start over.

If you MUST dual, I'd recommend that you start out as a fighter and switch to your preferred class, rather than the other way around. At least that way you get some weapon specs and armour proficiencies which can carry over to your new class (3 *'s in short sword makes Backstabbing a lot more fun for example!) and you'll then continue to grow into something useful, rather than being stuck as a 3 Mage/X Fighter or something :smallsmile:

That unfortunately means you'd be starting out with 3 Fighters, competing for the same equipment and relying on NPC's to do the Healing/Nuking/Trapfinding until you're probably 2/3rds of the way through the game, which could prove dull or even frustrating. It's still, the voice of experience tells me, more likely to be successful than doing it the other way.

For example, I'm currently playing a 7 Fighter/24 Druid which I carried over. I didn't dual-class until Irenicus' Dungeon in BG2, since I knew that I would be 7/7 by the end of it thanks to Imoen's memorizing of scrolls and removing of traps, and I had Minsc, Jaheira and Yoshima to protect me from all those nasty Goblins, but even then it was a challenge.

Having said that.... 5 *'s in Spear, 5 in Two Handed Weapon, the Impaler Spear, Full Plate+2, True Seeing, Iron Skins and a few other shinies later, and just watch him go after those Dragons... :smallbiggrin:

Triaxx

2008-02-21, 08:58 AM

Blayze

2008-02-21, 09:26 AM

To be honest, it all really depends on the NPCs you plan on using in both games (If any). I mean, we can easily throw around suggested parties all day based on NPC combinations or if you're not going to use them or... Gah.

A little more information, please. :)

Wraith

2008-02-21, 09:51 AM

My personal feeling is that you'd be better off starting as a Druid, then in BG2 you can pick up the Shapeshifter class and instantly become the leet killing machine. Of course I'm currently working on a Mage that I'll turn into a Wild Mage when I import.

That is something I considered, but not only am I too lazy to go through BG1 the "hard" way (Druid require more brain power than Fighters, and at the time I just wasn't in the mood), but I'm too lazy to keep shapeshifting to human and back when I want to talk to an NPC. :smalltongue: The metal armour I can wear from Fighter and the additional Weapon Specialities seem to make up for it, by and large.

Besides, I really like casting spells a lot too, and shapeshifter's can't cast while 'shifted. To me it was a choice between a straight-forward Melee Whirlwind, or a Melee Whirlwind that can toss out Storm of Vengeance whenever he wanted! :smallbiggrin:

Triaxx

2008-02-21, 02:38 PM

What do I need with spells when I can turn into a Werewolf? Besides, I have an AI that can do the changing for me.

Guancyto

2008-02-22, 09:35 PM

I've heard some crazy talk about playing as a Jester, but I have some serious doubts about how effective that'd be in a game dominated by Undead, Extra-Planars and High Level Mages after the 3rd Chapter.... :smallwink:

Grab the nondetection cloak, go invisible and start the bardsong. Then sit back and watch the fun... :smallbiggrin:

Incidentally, I hated Chloe with a passion. Starting on the random paragraph infodump when I just wanted my Sword of Chaos, well into the complaining about being ordered around when given basic combat and movement commands and despite the claim that 'this mod isn't just about lesbians' she made lewd comments every time something vaguely feminine walked by. And the author busily justifying a Neutral alignment with an obscure Sci-Fi reference (even if Andromeda was neat early on) didn't win any points when the definition of a neutral person is "one who does What Seems To Be A Good Idea At The Time."

Then I checked her forums, figuring that anything vaguely compelling would be down the road and that 'hey, her portrait looks a lot like a clown. She can't be -that- bad, right?' only to find she was worse. Besides being the only member of Super Regional Kit-class X while coming from practically the other end of the planet, not acting even vaguely like one would, being directly favored of two big gods despite doing nothing (ever) to endear herself to either, threatening Renal on his own turf while he suddenly becomes an abject coward in front of all his people... and let's not get into being faster than the living incarnation of quickness.

I mean, this would be bad enough without being the dual scimitar-wielding daughter of a greater goddess. The Mary Sue label gets thrown around a lot with mod NPCs, but she's the first I've found to really deserve it. Of course she turns out a subpar fighter. :smallannoyed: Mechanics are rarely kind to the speshul.

And in a crowning moment of disappointment, I found out the clown thing was a resizing error. Sad face.

Avilan the Grey

2008-02-27, 02:25 AM

As for why use her (responding to others in the thread) -- exactly b/c of what I said before -- her spell resistance, esp. if enhanced with other items makes her very useful in rooms full of only casters. She shrugs off the spells they cast at her, and if she can't get past their own spell protections with her spells, she can beat them over the head with a large blunt instrument that does truckloads of damage.

Oh yes... Viconia... *sigh* :smalltongue:
She's always in my party, every single run. She's the only cleric that I can stand, and since I always rescued her in BGI I had an emotional attachment to her from the beginning anyway. Give her the Gauntlets of Ogre Power, some good blunt instrument and let her loose. Of course the addition of a Hasted Pit Fiend to the party when facing obstacles does help...
Aerie is so horrible in the beginning (Besides, it just feels... WRONG to have a romance with her, like dating a 13 year old) that I always dump her right after Nalia's Keep quest. Anomen is... *ARGH*. And although I sometimes use Jaheira, I use her more as a tank than a druid. Her insect swarm spells are wonderful against spellcasters, I give you that. To see them turn yellow and run when they realize they can't get a single spell off to defend themselves all covered in bees (or whatever they are, the bugs I mean)...