Most common flaws of "Oriental" settings?

[Cyclone231]

Okay, so I'm trying to work up a "Far East" locale for the campaign setting I'm working on. But I'd like to know what others find to be the most annoying things about these kinds of locations.

Please don't say things like "they exist" or "they are all chinajapan". I already know that.

[Human Paragon 3]

I think the most annoying thing about them is that they often become "regular dnd setting with an occasional different name." I think the key to doing these settings right is to actually put in the effort to keep the flavor consistant and not revert to the expected stereotypes of fantasy and the orient.

[Lord Tataraus]

Firstly, define the Orient. That is probably the #1 pet peeve I have about "Oriental" campaigns. The Orient in this day and age is a very loose definition. When I think of the Orient, I think the traditional meaning which is India and east. That includes India, Mongolia, China, Japan, Korea, Southeast Asia, etc.

If you want a "Japanese" setting, go for, but say that's what it is. Another shortcoming is basically the game becomes "too anime". Some people really like it, but a lot hate it. Its probably better to base the game in China than Japan since most of the culture is very similar, but players are less likely to go all "anime" with it. Another shortcoming is too much concentration on one area. Remember that Japan is a small area, the Orient includes the entire eastern section of the asian continent and China itself has over 1000 separate cultures in the real world. But still that is one section, there is still all of Southeast Asia and India to consider. So, even if you focus on one particular area, there should be a wide variety of definitively separate cultures. And lastly, research. I did a lot of research on the orient when I was setting up the game which created a much better experience because everything was taken from the real world mythologies of those areas.

[Cyclone231]

I think the most annoying thing about them is that they often become "regular dnd setting with an occasional different name." I think the key to doing these settings right is to actually put in the effort to keep the flavor consistant and not revert to the expected stereotypes of fantasy and the orient.Thanks, but, uh... how do I ask this question without seeming stupid...

What are the expected stereotypes of fantasy and the orient?

[Illiterate Scribe]

This is a good summary of the stereotypes, and what to avoid. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Wutai)

[CASTLEMIKE]

It's a game so we generally take the best commonly perceived flavor aspects of various oriental cultures each of which has different customs, traditions and history based on our own viewpoints and cultures.

The Oriental Adventures source book from either edition are nice if you don't want to reivent the wheel. Probably pick up a few ideas and save some time getting a used copy of the earlier Oriental Adventures or a pdf for under $5.

I like Tome of Battle classes being based on a oriental land in the campaign with the occassional wandering martial adept. I'd use Warblades or Swordsages instead of the OE Samauri though.

[Rutee]

Do you seek a realistic portrayal, or just the flavor? Because it can be hard to screw up the latter.

[raygungothic]

Irritating stereotype I: hideously inflexible honour code. While honour codes need to be considered to get the right atmosphere, they seem to have a horrible tendency to get exaggerated beyond all recognition and become a major crowbar to beat up player choice with. Like alignment griefing or paladin griefing, but harder to escape from if it does happen.

Irritating stereotype II: overexaggerated feudal system and obsession with loyalty to one's lord. Really another facet of I. Reduces player freedom, sometimes to an unbearable degree.

Not that these two can't be done well, they're just major potential pitfalls.

(Historical note: I have a suspicion both of these are rather like chivalry in the west - a form of it is historical, but was never an absolute, and the version most people think of is heavily conditioned by 19th century wishful thinking)

[AKA_Bait]

Firstly, define the Orient. That is probably the #1 pet peeve I have about "Oriental" campaigns. The Orient in this day and age is a very loose definition. When I think of the Orient, I think the traditional meaning which is India and east. That includes India, Mongolia, China, Japan, Korea, Southeast Asia, etc.

If you want a "Japanese" setting, go for, but say that's what it is. Another shortcoming is basically the game becomes "too anime". Some people really like it, but a lot hate it. Its probably better to base the game in China than Japan since most of the culture is very similar, but players are less likely to go all "anime" with it. Another shortcoming is too much concentration on one area. Remember that Japan is a small area, the Orient includes the entire eastern section of the asian continent and China itself has over 1000 separate cultures in the real world. But still that is one section, there is still all of Southeast Asia and India to consider. So, even if you focus on one particular area, there should be a wide variety of definitively separate cultures. And lastly, research. I did a lot of research on the orient when I was setting up the game which created a much better experience because everything was taken from the real world mythologies of those areas.

See, I was going to say all of that after reading the OP, but now I don't have to. Well done!

[Cyclone231]

Do you seek a realistic portrayal, or just the flavor? Because it can be hard to screw up the latter.

Flavor.

But I'm really looking for the sort of stuff where you play in an "Oriental" campaign and you're like... "Wait, what? How does that work?"

You know, like the emotional and mental retardation of elves in standard D&D: "They take decades to reach age of majority? What?"

But also the stuff that's just lame even assuming it makes sense.

EDIT: Also, thanks to others who've posted so far.

[Nerd-o-rama]

Mixing up China and Japan when you don't acknowledge that you're mixing up China and Japan (i.e. everything I've ever heard about Rokugan). It annoys history buffs, but I suppose it's justifiable in that it's a fictional setting.

Overall, you've got a lot of cultures to pick from when you say "Orient". Pick one, take them all and keep them separate cultural analogues, or take them all and put some thought and consideration when blending cultures.

[Rutee]

Flavor.

But I'm really looking for the sort of stuff where you play in an "Oriental" campaign and you're like... "Wait, what? How does that work?"

You know, like the emotional and mental retardation of elves in standard D&D: "They take decades to reach age of majority? What?"

But also the stuff that's just lame even assuming it makes sense.

EDIT: Also, thanks to others who've posted so far.
Ninjas. Unless you're deliberately going for the feel of wuxia mooks, or camp, please don't make them wear black pyjamas. On the offchance they wore pyjamas, they were dark red, IIRC, and they usually used disguise and whatnot to sneak around, through inconspicuousness. Hide in plain sight, as it were. And really, that makes at least as much sense.

..Now if you want faceless mooks or camp, more power to you, really. That's just plain old standardness XD

[Solo]

Thanks, but, uh... how do I ask this question without seeming stupid...

What are the expected stereotypes of fantasy and the orient?

Confucius say ohiyo nichan kamigawa kitsune tashido katana bosu kung fu okinawa karate crouching tiger ramen.

For great justice.

[Bierhoff]

If you can, I'd recommend watching a bit of Shogun. It's an old mini series about an Englishman in 1600 Japan. It does a good job of showing stereotypes as well as some one being utterly baffled by an alien culture ("they eat raw fish, the walls are made of paper!, and I have to take a bath more than once a year what sort of messed up place is this!") . It's also much more "realistic" than alot of current pop culture images of feudal Japan. Another good source would be Kurosawa movies (Rashamon, Seven Samaria, Hidden Fortress). My public library is wonderful and has these movies to borrow for free.

[The_Blue_Sorceress]

Irritating stereotype I: hideously inflexible honour code. While honour codes need to be considered to get the right atmosphere, they seem to have a horrible tendency to get exaggerated beyond all recognition and become a major crowbar to beat up player choice with. Like alignment griefing or paladin griefing, but harder to escape from if it does happen.

Irritating stereotype II: overexaggerated feudal system and obsession with loyalty to one's lord. Really another facet of I. Reduces player freedom, sometimes to an unbearable degree.

Not that these two can't be done well, they're just major potential pitfalls.

(Historical note: I have a suspicion both of these are rather like chivalry in the west - a form of it is historical, but was never an absolute, and the version most people think of is heavily conditioned by 19th century wishful thinking)


It depended on the individual samurai and his own ethical code. Things got pretty hairy right before the Meiji restoration because there were too many samurai and not enough jobs to go around, and their stipend, which was inherited from their father as I recall, wasn't just inherited by the first son, but split between all sons. What was originally a stipend sufficient to support a samurai and his household got broken apart so many times over the generations that it was all but negligible. Samurai who weren't able to get jobs serving government posts weren't legally allowed to make money in any other fashion, so many of the unemployed samurai illegally worked at other jobs to support themselves.

This is of course only true of Tokugawa Japan. Before the Tokugawa shogunate there was a great deal of social mobility, and this is actually the time period in which the Akira Kurosawa films Ran and Seven Samurai are set. The class system wasn't as rigid, there was really no central governmental authority, and things were pretty exciting. If you're aiming for an Oriental adventure and you want to borrow from Japan, I'd use this time period, since the warfare between lords and general chaos provides great adventuring opportunities. In contrast, the Tokugawa Shogunate was a time of almost unprecedented peace (almost because the Heian period was also very peaceful and a time of real artistic and cultural development.) Because of that, and because the laws were pretty strict, the Tokugawa era really isn't the best for promoting a spirit of adventure, unless you're taking your party away from the civilized lands proper and having them explore some strange new island that suddenly appeared in the ocean, or having them kill Godzilla, or something like that.

-Blue

[Rutee]

If you can, I'd recommend watching a bit of Shogun. It's an old mini series about an Englishman in 1600 Japan. It does a good job of showing stereotypes as well as some one being utterly baffled by an alien culture ("they eat raw fish, the walls are made of paper!, and I have to take a bath more than once a year what sort of messed up place is this!") . It's also much more "realistic" than alot of current pop culture images of feudal Japan. Another good source would be Kurosawa movies (Rashamon, Seven Samaria, Hidden Fortress). My public library is wonderful and has these movies to borrow for free.
One could also read Shogun, but yes.

[Mephibosheth]

I agree with most of what's been said already in this thread. Most of my major objections to "oriental" settings have already been mentioned. However, the thing that bothers me the most about settings based on the "orient" is that they borrow directly from the real world cultures on which they're based without any changes to fit the setting. The most flagrant example of this I can think of is Wizards of the Coast's Mahasarpa (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20011019a) campaign setting. The setting is based on India and South Asia, complete with four varnas (you guessed it, Brahmins, Kshatriyas, Vaishyas, and Shudras) and untouchables. They didn't even bother to change the names of the Indian varnas, let alone devise a new system. IMO, if you're going to go to the work of devising a new setting based on a real world culture, at least have the creativity to come up with new systems based on the real world, instead of simply using identical systems.

[Lord Tataraus]

I agree with most of what's been said already in this thread. Most of my major objections to "oriental" settings have already been mentioned. However, the thing that bothers me the most about settings based on the "orient" is that they borrow directly from the real world cultures on which they're based without any changes to fit the setting. The most flagrant example of this I can think of is Wizards of the Coast's Mahasarpa (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20011019a) campaign setting. The setting is based on India and South Asia, complete with four varnas (you guessed it, Brahmins, Kshatriyas, Vaishyas, and Shudras) and untouchables. They didn't even bother to change the names of the Indian varnas, let alone devise a new system. IMO, if you're going to go to the work of devising a new setting based on a real world culture, at least have the creativity to come up with new systems based on the real world, instead of simply using identical systems.

Unless you want to adventure in the real world, except all the gods and creatures are undeniably real. Of course, if you do that, make sure you tell people before hand!

[Mephibosheth]

True, but then just call your setting "India," rather than try to pawn it off as something new. I've actually been involved in a few games that take place in pseudo-historical settings, and they've been a lot of fun. However, dropping incredibly complex socio-religious phenomena like the varna system into a different setting doesn't really work. I guess I just wish designers would make the effort to tweak things to fit the campaign setting, even if that only means making up new names.

[Rutee]

I agree with most of what's been said already in this thread. Most of my major objections to "oriental" settings have already been mentioned. However, the thing that bothers me the most about settings based on the "orient" is that they borrow directly from the real world cultures on which they're based without any changes to fit the setting. The most flagrant example of this I can think of is Wizards of the Coast's Mahasarpa (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20011019a) campaign setting. The setting is based on India and South Asia, complete with four varnas (you guessed it, Brahmins, Kshatriyas, Vaishyas, and Shudras) and untouchables. They didn't even bother to change the names of the Indian varnas, let alone devise a new system. IMO, if you're going to go to the work of devising a new setting based on a real world culture, at least have the creativity to come up with new systems based on the real world, instead of simply using identical systems.

Hm... something about this seems so odd. I understand where the complaint's coming from, but.. something seems weird about saying you must have a new system for a different setting. Do you mean from the ground up, or alterations to things like spellcasting?

[AKA_Bait]

Hm... something about this seems so odd. I understand where the complaint's coming from, but.. something seems weird about saying you must have a new system for a different setting. Do you mean from the ground up, or alterations to things like spellcasting?

I think he means juggling things around a bit and renaming them.

For example, instead of having the 4 castes with the same names: Brahmins, Kshatriyas, Vaishyas, and Shudras they could have 5, with different names, a diffrent order in the social hierarchy and the new one would have a distinct defined function (how's about arcane magic for one?).

[Rutee]

Oh, so I misunderstood entirely? Well, it happens. That makes significantly more sense as a complaint, yeah.

[EvilElitest]

Even if you don't plan to pay an oriental setting, read shogun, it is an amazing book
from
EE

[AKA_Bait]

One could also read Shogun, but yes.


Even if you don't plan to pay an oriental setting, read shogun, it is an amazing book
from
EE

Wait... did all three of us just agree on something? Woah.

[EvilElitest]

Wait... did all three of us just agree on something? Woah.

I normally agree with you AKA bait, but shogun can unit Rutee and EE in terms of option. miracles do happen, Uwe Boll will make a good movie next Which is funny because i don't have any thing personal against rutee.

On topic, is jade empire or Legend of Five Rings good examples of oriental games in terms of Japanese/China style?
Personally i like Middle Eastern style games when it comes to Asia
From
EE

[TheThan]

I think he means juggling things around a bit and renaming them.

For example, instead of having the 4 castes with the same names: Brahmins, Kshatriyas, Vaishyas, and Shudras they could have 5, with different names, a diffrent order in the social hierarchy and the new one would have a distinct defined function (how's about arcane magic for one?).

Yeah, that’s probably the biggest one with regards to culture, people just seem to copy and paste. I understand that its easy to use what’s familiar and what’s real (heck it worked back then) but still, dnd is not about reality.

[Tengu]

I normally agree with you AKA bait, but shogun can unit Rutee and EE in terms of option. miracles do happen, Uwe Boll will make a good movie next Which is funny because i don't have any thing personal against rutee.

On topic, is jade empire or Legend of Five Rings good examples of oriental games in terms of Japanese/China style?
Personally i like Middle Eastern style games when it comes to Asia
From
EE

You are halfway correct. Uwe Boll will make a new movie, but it will not be a good one - instead, it will be a movie about Shogun. It will involve samurai flipping out and killing people.

I think that L5K does a good job at giving a Japanese (with some Chinese elements) flavour, though it's not very historically accurate - but then, it's not Japan. It's Rokugan. It is quite realistic, too - battles end in several blows at most, a sword master can be overpowered by a dozen of ordinary warriors, and there are no shockwaves and cutting through walls with a katana.

[EvilElitest]

You are halfway correct. Uwe Boll will make a new movie, but it will not be a good one - instead, it will be a movie about Shogun. It will involve samurai flipping out and killing people.

You have killed all joy i could ever have in my life. Ever. Unless uwe boll makes a remake of Yojimbo, that is the worst thing i could ever imagine


I think that L5K does a good job at giving a Japanese (with some Chinese elements) flavour, though it's not very historically accurate - but then, it's not Japan. It's Rokugan. It is quite realistic, too - battles end in several blows at most, a sword master can be overpowered by a dozen of ordinary warriors, and there are no shockwaves and cutting through walls with a katana.
heh, i've played it before, it is very fun
from
EE

[Tengu]

You have killed all joy i could ever have in my life. Ever. Unless uwe boll makes a remake of Yojimbo, that is the worst thing i could ever imagine


He will, and to add insult to injury, he will mix it with Usagi Yojimbo. And zombies. Hmm, maybe I should work as an idea guy for him - if anything, it will allow me to be close to him and easily be able to shoot him when he does a really, really horrible movie. I'm sure someone here knows a good attorney who will defend me?

[EvilElitest]

He will, and to add insult to injury, he will mix it with Usagi Yojimbo. And zombies. Hmm, maybe I should work as an idea guy for him - if anything, it will allow me to be close to him and easily be able to shoot him when he does a really, really horrible movie. I'm sure someone here knows any good attorneys who will defend me?

Destroying natural evils of teh world is not a crime
from
EE

[raygungothic]

Blue - That was more or less exactly what I meant: the historical reality is much more complicated and different attitudes dominate in different eras. You just know more about it than I do :-)

(That was more or less exactly my impression, I just wasn't quite sure and hadn't time to check at work - thanks for confirming that I've got the right impression!)

[Aquillion]

Mixing up China and Japan when you don't acknowledge that you're mixing up China and Japan (i.e. everything I've ever heard about Rokugan). It annoys history buffs, but I suppose it's justifiable in that it's a fictional setting.

Overall, you've got a lot of cultures to pick from when you say "Orient". Pick one, take them all and keep them separate cultural analogues, or take them all and put some thought and consideration when blending cultures.To be fair, the generic Western Knights-and-Dragons fantasy mixes up everything from France to Germany to all of Great Britain without a care in the world, usually throwing in a few things from all over the world for good measure. (Djinn? Fist-of-fury monks?)

It's just been done so much that nobody thinks about it anymore.

[Jack Zander]

I can see the beginning of a wonderful relationship between EE and Rutee here.

From arch enemies to lovers, all on these very forums.

[AKA_Bait]

I can see the beginning of a wonderful relationship between EE and Rutee here.

From arch enemies to lovers, all on these very forums.

That's... just... no.

[Solo]

I can see the beginning of a wonderful relationship between EE and Rutee here.

From arch enemies to lovers, all on these very forums.

Set in San Francisco.

[Tengu]

I can see the beginning of a wonderful relationship between EE and Rutee here.

From arch enemies to lovers, all on these very forums.

Cute.


http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h287/serpentine16/Avatarables/illithidthumb.gif

[Rutee]

Amusingly, that fits the laws of fanfiction.

[Tengu]

It does. Mind if I ask, how does it feel to be on the receiving end of shipping?

[Rutee]

This is actually par for the course for me. The GMs in my WoW guild love trying to match-make. Well, there's obviously some differences, but it's not that different.

[Lord Tataraus]

This is actually par for the course for me. The GMs in my WoW guild love trying to match-make. Well, there's obviously some differences, but it's not that different.

That sounds like it sucks. I hate it when people match make others. It really irritates me 'cause that's all they focus on and they usually have selfish reasons for. Of course, I'm more into chivalry, which is dying out.

Edit: ...so um....yeah...oriental stuff....

I think you first need to decide what overall style of game you want fluffwise: anime, real world analogy, pseudo-historical, or just slightly seasoned. Then you go from there.

[Tengu]

Y'know, they might just do it jokingly. Nothing bad in that.

[EvilElitest]

I can see the beginning of a wonderful relationship between EE and Rutee here.

From arch enemies to lovers, all on these very forums.

Set in San Francisco.

Cute.
Wow, i go away from this thread for an hour and look what comes about
Zander, you are a bad person, you are a very bad person
I would come up with some sort of denial statement, but knowing the laws of fanfiction, that does make perfect sense, i can't argue that:smallfrown:
And now i can imagine somebody writing a fanfiction as we speak, oh gods why (no offense Rutee)
Sadly, i am at total loss of what to say

Amusingly, that fits the laws of fanfiction.
At risk of agreeing with your, your pretty much right their

/silly, um, so rutee, what are you doing tonight:smallbiggrin:
from
EE

[horseboy]

He will, and to add insult to injury, he will mix it with Usagi Yojimbo
Well, they could make him invisible to everyone but a mild mannered man name Elwood P. Dodd. Or a projection of a probable possibility to a very disturbed teenager.

[Severus]

Getting the culture/flavor right.

It's so easy to fall back on cliches that it can be hard to make it different but not stereotyped.

I think starting with some good well-fleshed out NPCs and then building out the culture/plot to ensure that you're getting "real" character development, and not a samurai soap opera or a chinese kung fu movie.

To that end, I would probably NOT mix cultures, at least initially. You want your campaign to have a perspective. Mix in the others after you've built a strong base.

[Xuincherguixe]

Off topic, but frighteningly enough it does look like Uwe Boll's next movie might be good. It's based on postal. I saw some clips on youtube. It looks good.

Mind you, being stupid and immature is faithful to the game.

It will only be released in German.


I think he'll still ruin it somehow. Though I might not ever find out unless I learn German.

[Ominous]

Back to the original post, get a copy of Legend of the Five Rings Third Edition (http://www.l5r.com/products/rpg/). When my group feels like playing in a "realistic" (read, non-anime) feeling oriental setting, this is what we use. It's definitely focused on Japan and China, but there's a little of Mongolia thrown in as well. You can also find the L5R setting in Oriental Adventures for 3E D&D, but I don't feel it does L5R justice.


Confucius say ohiyo nichan kamigawa kitsune tashido katana bosu kung fu okinawa karate crouching tiger ramen.

For great justice.

It's spelled ohayo not ohiyo.

[Tengu]

You can also find the L5R setting in Oriental Adventures for 3E D&D, but I don't feel it does L5R justice.


It doesn't. It's just DND in a different setting. You can even play as non-humans! Blasphemous.

[Ascension]

To be fair, the generic Western Knights-and-Dragons fantasy mixes up everything from France to Germany to all of Great Britain without a care in the world, usually throwing in a few things from all over the world for good measure. (Djinn? Fist-of-fury monks?)

It's just been done so much that nobody thinks about it anymore.

At least with Djinn there's ALMOST a precedent, since all the fallout from the various crusades did achieve a bit of a cultural exchange between Europe and the Middle East... at least so far as looting and pillaging counts as a cultural exchange...

Where the analogy breaks down there is that in the main settings (to my knowledge, I've never played FR or Ebberon) there is no crusade-analog. The "Arabian" elements are assumed to be sprinkled in the great melting pot that is D&D, but without... say... the invasion of a Spain-esque nation by hordes of Djinn and goblin dervishes, only to have them turned back at the border of "France" by a heroic adventuring party led by the noble hammer-wielding paladin Charles Martel. If you're going to twist your history into a near-unrecognizable mish-mash, at least go all out with it!

Similarly, there's a bit of a precedent for mixing up European cultures as well, since their shared ties with the Catholic church ensured at least a bit of cultural conformity. Again, we run into a problem, though, because we have the effect without the cause. While we are told in a very general sense that most humans are Pelor worshippers, there is no "Pope of Pelor" wielding the sort of political power that the Medieval Popes wielded. If a regent turns away from the path of Pelor, he doesn't suffer the fallout of excommunication, he probably just finds another legitimate, culturally acceptable deity and continues ruling with little to no consequence.

I'd say the same problem applies to "Oriental" settings, but not just to them alone. Any and all settings which try to introduce the effects of a culture without introducing the accompanying cause are bound to fail when subjected to any kind of logical analysis.

I personally would say that the only core D&D setting that justifies its level of cultural intermingling is the Planescape setting, which simply handwaves away any accusations of ridiculousness by answering that Sigil, and to at least some extent the Outer Planes, is an interdimensional melting pot. You need that level of mixture before you can excuse even the core books (Prior to reading the PHB's entry for the class I was expecting "monk" to be a cloistered cleric-style non-physical divine caster, involving a vow of chastity and optional vows of poverty and silence.).

I could go on about how D&D fails at even being a proper representation of European fantasy due primarily to its prohibitively large pantheon of culturally acceptable gods, but I'm already far enough off topic as it is.

Back on topic-ish, I've been surprised by how well the whole Azurites-as-Japan-analogue thing has worked out in OOTS. I always think of the Crusades when I think paladin, so I never would have thought of mixing the class with a samurai flavor, but it has mostly worked out alright. I still don't think that Azure City's physical separation from the rest of the OOTS world is enough to justify its completely-dissimilar culture, but alas, it must be so in order to allow the party (and Team Evil) to get there as easily as they did.

[Solo]

It's spelled ohayo not ohiyo.

The misspelling merely serves to accentuate my point.

[Matthew]

I agree with most of what's been said already in this thread. Most of my major objections to "oriental" settings have already been mentioned. However, the thing that bothers me the most about settings based on the "orient" is that they borrow directly from the real world cultures on which they're based without any changes to fit the setting. The most flagrant example of this I can think of is Wizards of the Coast's Mahasarpa (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20011019a) campaign setting. The setting is based on India and South Asia, complete with four varnas (you guessed it, Brahmins, Kshatriyas, Vaishyas, and Shudras) and untouchables. They didn't even bother to change the names of the Indian varnas, let alone devise a new system. IMO, if you're going to go to the work of devising a new setting based on a real world culture, at least have the creativity to come up with new systems based on the real world, instead of simply using identical systems.

I would agree with this if it wasn't for the fact that D&D does the same for Graeco-Roman and Germanic Deities (amongst others). There are two basic approaches to creating Deities for D&D, one is to make up fantasy versions and the other is to import them from real world mythology. Both are widely used and sometimes they are mixed together, as with the Forgotten Realms, which uses several 'real world' Deity names in addition to its 'fantasy' Deities. Occidental or Oriental, it's incidental. :smallwink:

[Paragon Badger]

For the love of good, do not take a medieval setting and add ninjas with silly names! :smalltongue:

Everything you know about the west? Forget it. There are more differences than similiarities. Black is a color of mourning in the west, it's white in China. Purple is the color of royalty in the west, it's Yellow/Gold in China and Japan.

My specialty is only on those two countries, but I think the southeastern asian cultures have their own color symbolisms, too.

In fact, Vietnam has such a rich culture that I think that would make a pretty neat setting in of itself. China invaded it numerous times in the ancient era, so you'd have one big baddy right there. :-P

[Ozymandias]

The misspelling merely serves to accentuate my point.

Strictly speaking, the o should be macronic (ō).

(Genki desu-ka jutsu-do-dattebayo! Nyoro-n.)

[Aquillion]

Off topic, but frighteningly enough it does look like Uwe Boll's next movie might be good. It's based on postal. I saw some clips on youtube. It looks good.Dammit, for a moment I read that as "It's based on Portal".

[Starbuck_II]

Ninjas. Unless you're deliberately going for the feel of wuxia mooks, or camp, please don't make them wear black pyjamas. On the offchance they wore pyjamas, they were dark red, IIRC, and they usually used disguise and whatnot to sneak around, through inconspicuousness. Hide in plain sight, as it were. And really, that makes at least as much sense.

..Now if you want faceless mooks or camp, more power to you, really. That's just plain old standardness XD


Actually, it dark blue because it blends in better in the darkness.

Red was usually female ninja I think.

[Tengu]

Actually, it dark blue because it blends in better in the darkness.

Red was usually female ninja I think.

Do you really think that ninjas wore distinctive colors that helped others identify them easily?

RL ninjas were masters of disguise and blending into the crowd without attracting attention. They weren't wearing pajamas and balaclavas.

[Turbit]

Dammit, for a moment I read that as "It's based on Portal".

So your say there will been no cake? That the cake of a portal movie is a lie?

As to the topic at hand I'd like to second the use of L5R 3rd as being a better system for this style of setting.

[Tengu]

So your say there will been no cake? That the cake of a portal movie is a lie?


Have you seen any Uwe Boll movies? Trust me, it's better that way.

[EvilElitest]

Do you really think that ninjas wore distinctive colors that helped others identify them easily?

RL ninjas were masters of disguise and blending into the crowd without attracting attention. They weren't wearing pajamas and balaclavas.

Don't you know anything about ninjas? you might not even know the reverse law the way your talk:smallsmile:
from
EE

[Tengu]

Psst *confidential whisper* - I tell this to you cautiously, in case it destroys your view on the world, but the Conservation of Ninjutsu Law does not exist in real life! Neither does Naruto, though in this case it's probably a good thing.

[Cuddly]

The notion that you have to be "culturally accurate" to run a fun asian themed campaign is wrong. It's a fantasy game. Add whatever flavors you want; your homebrew doesn't have to be orcs=mongols, goblins=chinese, humans=japanese, koreans=hobgoblins, etc. Setting up such analogues can be helpful in creating distinct cultures within your game, but seeing as Japan never existed in the first place in your world, who cares if you confuse some Chinese culture with some Japanese? It's not like you're working on an honors thesis here. The pseudo medieval European flavored D&D is just as wrong as anything Asian flavored, but only goofy history buffs take much umbrage with it.

[EvilElitest]

Psst *confidential whisper* - I tell this to you cautiously, in case it destroys your view on the world, but the Conservation of Ninjutsu Law does not exist in real life! Neither does Naruto, though in this case it's probably a good thing.

1. Wait so i've been paying a single ninja for nothing
2. I am one of the keepers of the seal of great evil, should it be opened Naruto will be realized into the world
from
EE

[North]

Psst *confidential whisper* - I tell this to you cautiously, in case it destroys your view on the world, but the Conservation of Ninjutsu Law does not exist in real life! Neither does Naruto, though in this case it's probably a good thing.

Heresy! I totally Disagree! Look at how much better Chris Farley does after he leaves the dojo. Because there were less ninjas around him, so he did better.