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View Full Version : 1 DM, 1 PC - Helpful Advice?



Prometheus
2008-02-13, 07:43 PM
How well does it work to have one DM and one PC? I'm thinking about partipating in a campaign on the side for this purpose. If the other person DMs, which I think we will, it will be partially to help her learn some of the DMing mechanics better than her experience as a player and I want to make it run smoothly.

1) Besides handing the player challenges that are two CR lower than usual, are their any mechanical considerations to doing this? Should the PC be Gestalt so that they won't die to randomness and have a variety of abilities?

2) What about long term NPCs, DMPCs, or the players having multiple characters? Is it worth trying to replicate a larger sized party or does it just complicate things?

3) How about the style of the campaign? Is there any notable advantages to playing with a singular protagonist? How should the plot and action differ?

4) Share you stories!

13_CBS
2008-02-13, 07:46 PM
Well, Jason and Marcus of Foxtrot seem to pull this off often...:smallbiggrin:

Zincorium
2008-02-13, 07:50 PM
One of the main reasons 1 on 1 is hard is, in a campaign with more players, any one PC can hash out plans with another person or let someone else take on a responsibility.

Gestalt in a game with one player isn't a bad idea as long as it's used to give additional versatility rather than overpower a single strategy. If not going gestalt, classes like bard or ranger are fairly decent choices as they innately have a wide variety of options.

Gaiwecoor
2008-02-13, 07:57 PM
I can't say that I've actually been in this situation, but I've thought about it an awful lot :smallwink:

My suggestion: a Gestalt PC and a Gestalt DMPC (Long-term NPC? I really don't get the difference) that's two levels lower than the PC. This puts the "party" CR at Level+2, whereas a typical party of four non-gestalt characters is Level+4. Encounters should probably be run at a CR of 2 less than your level.


Gestalt in a game with one player isn't a bad idea as long as it's used to give additional versatility rather than overpower a single strategy.

Exactly. I'd recommend you and the NPC each take one type of spellcasting (divine / arcane) and divide up the stealth / meat shield responsibilities with your other class.

Tengu
2008-02-13, 08:00 PM
Such games are perfect for tailoring to the players' tastes, because you only have one player to worry about. And yes, the problem is that several minds can come out with a solution to a problem much more easily than a single one.

Chrismith
2008-02-13, 08:03 PM
How well does it work to have one DM and one PC? I'm thinking about partipating in a campaign on the side for this purpose. If the other person DMs, which I think we will, it will be partially to help her learn some of the DMing mechanics better than her experience as a player and I want to make it run smoothly.

1) Besides handing the player challenges that are two CR lower than usual...

Be careful with this. I've found that, in general, a single player is more geared for CRs three or four lower than their level. He or she can handle higher CRs if their character is geared toward that sort of encounter (undead vs. cleric, etc), but can get slaughtered if they run into something they're not prepared for. A party of four can usually find some way to damage a golem even without adamantine weapons; a single melee character would be screwed.

Something else you may want to consider is tying the player to an organization of some sort, such as a church or guild. That way they have access to some extra resources -- they can get a wizard to cast Remove Curse if they really need it, or have someone to bring them back to life if they get killed.

Zincorium
2008-02-13, 08:04 PM
(Long-term NPC? I really don't get the difference).

The difference, and this is fairly relevant to the original topic, is that a DMPC is played for the same reasons as a regular PC. A long term NPC would be played as an aid to the overall game.

It's all in the motivation, and that's why DMPCs get railed against while important NPCs are lauded.

Normally, PCs are both cooperative and competitive. But if the DMPC becomes competitive with the PC, the DMPC will always win due to the DM having control over all the rest of the world.



Regarding NPC choices, skill-heavy or arcane roles generally can be safely ignored if the Pc isn't interested. No one is making you put traps or arcane puzzles in the adventures, and having an NPC get past those is pointless.

A meatshield to the PC's squishy rogue or wizard is good, and a healer makes recovering after a fight far less arduous. If the Pc has healing and fighting down, you might not need a dedicated NPC at all.

Rutee
2008-02-13, 08:07 PM
The biggest advantage to this is that it's very much co-operative storytelling. There's only 2 of you; You may have final word on the scenery, but you both really need what amounts to equal storytelling power, in my opinion..

Dr Bwaa
2008-02-13, 08:09 PM
Such games are perfect for tailoring to the players' tastes, because you only have one player to worry about. And yes, the problem is that several minds can come out with a solution to a problem much more easily than a single one.

Exactly. I have been involved in a couple such campaigns on both sides of the arrangement, and it's a lot of fun for both especially if the DM caters to the kind of game the player wants to play (always true, but much harder with more people). the specifics depend entirely on what kind of game it is. Lots of political/murder mystery style intrigue? Dungeon crawling? Hash it out between player and DM and have fun. Again, it depends a lot on what you're doing, but rogues/bards do really well just for all the versatility.

valadil
2008-02-13, 08:10 PM
This is one of the cases where I'd recommend a DMPC, but only if the player wants it. One way to run the game would be to have two players, each with a character, and they take turns GMing. Each time a quest completes the next GM steps in. I'm in a 5 person game like this right now and it's a good time. Should work for two too.

Grug
2008-02-13, 08:16 PM
Mechanics aside, I can give some advice.

If you, Prometheus, are a player, be complient for your new DM. If he or she seems unsure or nervous, try to stick with the plot (visit a tavern, open a door). Meanwhile, if they seem active or anxious, it usually means they want some stimulation. Try to find something to do that's off the beaten path (do something fancy in combat, start an argument with a cleric). A Published adventure may be best unless he or she wants to improv.

If you are DMing, a single DMPC would be a good idea for reasons stated above. Besides power balance, it gives the player someone to talk with or point them in the right direction. If the personality of the player or character is strong, make the NPC meek and following. The players feel empowered when they impress someone. If the player or character has a weak personality, make the NPC a leader or exemplar. As time goes on their roles can be switched, which would be a major milestone. Also, if you're mature enough, a member of the opposite sex is often an interesting NPC to play and interact with.

Jack_Simth
2008-02-13, 08:29 PM
DMPC (Long-term NPC? I really don't get the difference)
The difference is generally a matter of attachment and/or rulings specifically because they're in favor of the DMPC.

As to things about a single PC campaign:
Advantages:
1) Class balance no longer matters, because there are no other players to overshadow.
If your Druid buffs up and wades into melee...
... there's no fighter to cry about being useless.
If your Druid uses Summon Nature's Ally I to spring traps, and Wildshapes into a rat to sneak past the guards...
... there's no Rogue who's missing out on his party role.
If your Druid has a spell list such that he's always got a spell that will fix the challenge....
... there's no Wizard to cry about being out-batmanned.
If your Druid loads up on blasty spells, Wildshapes into something that flys, and rains down Death From Above....
... there's no blaster-Sorcerer to worry about his role.
2) Most class disadvantages and party lacks can be swept under the rug when they're not needed.
Your 1 player doesn't have much healing capacity? Hey, the DM controls treasure drops. Suddenly almost everything has a Cure Serious Wound Potion or two (nominally for their own benefit).
No way to deal with traps or locks? DM controls the dungeon - *poof* - there aren't any that are impassible.

Downsides:
1) You're only playing with one friend.
2) No mistake insulation. Fail a save to Hold Person, and it's logically a CdG the next round. One fumbled roll on a climb check, and it's TPK.

Gaiwecoor
2008-02-13, 08:32 PM
The difference, and this is fairly relevant to the original topic, is that a DMPC is played for the same reasons as a regular PC. A long term NPC would be played as an aid to the overall game.
...
Normally, PCs are both cooperative and competitive. But if the DMPC becomes competitive with the PC, the DMPC will always win due to the DM having control over all the rest of the world.

Ah - thanks for clarifying. That's somewhat accounted for in my original recommendation: Make the DMPC two levels lower than the PC. Supposedly that'll make the PC considerably more powerful, and the DMPC should function in more of a supporting role. (No, the DMPC shouldn't gain XP on its own; just have it level when the PC levels.)

RTGoodman
2008-02-13, 08:33 PM
If both player and DM are okay with it, playing two PCs is a possibility. Maybe the characters are siblings or something like that. Just make sure they have complimentary abilities.

Either way, one bit of advice might be to shift away from a combat-heavy game to one that's more puzzle- or roleplay-centric. That way a lack of characters isn't as much of a problem. A Rogue or Beguiler, Gestalt or not, can handle a lot of non-combat encounters like that on his own, and may can hold his own in combat for short bits at a time.

Prometheus
2008-02-13, 08:38 PM
Wow, I'm glad I'm getting such a healthy response! Everyone has been very helpful.

Nice point about balancing CRs according to the type of character and monster.

A lot of people have been talking about using a DMPC or NPC as balance, which is fine if we decide on gestalt, but I've also been thinking on going with a theme. (Both assassins with different styles, both tomb raiders searching for treasure and history, both on a divine mission, both comrades in arms etc). I dunno which will work out better. EDIT: Two levels lower sounds like a good rule of thumb for DMPCs/NPCs.

Switching between Playing and DMing sounds like a lot of fun, especially since we are mostly ambivalent about whose who. It might be too short-sighted plotwise for a long-term campaign, but I think it will work nicely for us. I'll have to suggest the idea to her.

We like to improv, so no published adventures.

We are actually engaged, so there wouldn't be any maturity problems with a little bit of in-game flirting. But anything that goes more physical than that there doesn't seem a lot of point in rping

EDIT:Character balance hasn't really ever been an issue with our group

hawkboy772042
2008-02-13, 11:13 PM
I've only found it fun for heavy role-play adventures such as murder mysteries. Otherwise, it gets too boring being combat intensive.

Bellmaethorion
2008-02-14, 12:36 AM
over at the wizards boards, there's a thread that is chock full of information, it started out as someone describing their experiences with, and giving hints about, 1on1 DMíng

http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=471897
(Kandi and Pepper is the one on one DMing)

In the first post, there's links to most(if not all) posts by the original poster.

I'd give this thread a read either way, because there's just so much information in there, about all kinds of things.

Toliudar
2008-02-14, 12:37 AM
Combat:

Hordes of small monsters are generally not a lot of fun, because the lone PC (or lone PC plus cohort/NPC) either wipes them out with some area effect thing, or else is overwhelmed...and bored by all the rolling.

One key opponent, at or just below the PC's level, or 2-4 opponents a couple down, can be about perfect.

NPC's use of save-or-lose effects and spells (hold person, etc) should be kept to a minimum, or to situations where the PC's failure would help advance the plot in an interesting way.

Builds:

I'd strongly echo the "gestalt" recommendation, just to increase the PC's bag of tools to deal with situations. Intrigue and roleplay are great. Puzzles, many of which are solved by groups of PLAYERS working it out together, not so much. But then, I'm rarely a fan of puzzles in DnD anyway.