Not to go all "blast from the past", but why does Durkon get a pony?

[Quorothorn]

Referring to this (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0140.html) strip. Last time I checked, Dwarves are Medium-sized creatures, and so are Ponies; mounts must be at least one Size category larger than their riders. So Durkon ought to get a Horse like the Humans and V.

Am I forgetting something here, or are Dwarves Small-size, or Ponies Large-size, in OotS or somewhat?

[Mauve Shirt]

Dwarves are small and ponies are medium.

[averagejoe]

Dwarves are small and ponies are medium.

Incorrect, dwarves are medium.

To the OP, I don't know. It might just be a mistake on the part of the author. The dwarves in The Hobbit used ponies...

[The Extinguisher]

Maybe Rich just wanted a bit more realism.

[Qov]

Maybe it's a big pony. Maybe it's a small horse. Maybe it's 14 hands two inches exactly and depending on how you file its hooves it sneaks back and forth between the horse and pony categories.

[serpent615]

personally, I can't see a Dwarf as an actual medium person, I mean there only 4 feet tall, and a human is closer to 6 foot…I don’t see 2/3 the height being the same size

the only thing I can think of is that they are really broad and weigh about the same as a human...though I hardly think that should decide the size category

[theinsulabot]

personally, I can't see a Dwarf as an actual medium person, I mean there only 4 feet tall, and a human is closer to 6 foot…I don’t see 2/3 the height being the same size


for some reason some people still believe that the giant sees the rule book as more then a very loose set of guidelines to be followed ONLY when they tell him to do something he was planning to do anyway

[serpent615]

for some reason some people still believe that the giant sees the rule book as more then a very loose set of guidelines to be followed ONLY when they tell him to do something he was planning to do anyway

I was actually stating what I thought it should be...more along the lines of "Giant making more sense than the D&D book," but that's just the way I see this scenario. I just have a really hard time seeing a Dwarf as equal size:smallconfused: I probably would have said Pony instead of Horse myself if I wrote the comic...

ok, i'm done with my rant:smallbiggrin:

[Parvum]

Dwarves are only medium because Powerful Build wasn't invented yet. If dwarves were re-done, they'd be small with Powerful Build.

(Can you say dino raptor mount?)

[Raging_Pacifist]

Dwarves are only medium because Powerful Build wasn't invented yet. If dwarves were re-done, they'd be small with Powerful Build.

(Can you say dino raptor mount?)

Most awesome mount ever.

[serpent615]

Most awesome mount ever.

no, the coolest mount was for the Tri-Rider my group met one time...we literally rode on top of a triceratops, it had a platform attached to it that we could stand on, and we fought things while moving across a large field…but it was really crowded on that platform while trying to do combat:smalltongue:

[The Extinguisher]

That's why I'm stating out a Utahraptor mount.
Nevermind that it's also the coolest raptor, it's large size!

[Raging_Pacifist]

That's why I'm stating out a Utahraptor mount.
Nevermind that it's also the coolest raptor, it's large size!

Still, none of those match up to the goat of terror.....

[Souju]

Still, none of those match up to the goat of terror.....

or the chicken of malcontent

[Shhalahr Windrider]

personally, I can't see a Dwarf as an actual medium person, I mean there only 4 feet tall, and a human is closer to 6 foot…I don’t see 2/3 the height being the same size
Size categories do have a bit more range than that. The Medium size category starts at 4 ft. tall and ends at 8 ft. tall (Table 7-1, page 314, Monster Manual). Male dwarves average 4' 4" and females average 4' 0" (SRD:Alignment and Description:Height and Weight (http://www.systemreferencedocuments.org/35/sovelior_sage/description.html#height-and-weight)). That puts them on the very bottom end of Medium by height. Given that dwarves are generally considered to have a bit more bulk for their height, they would have far more in common with other Medium creatures, size-wise than they do with Small creatures.

Yes, beyond the general "A mount must be one size category larger" rule, the Player's Handbook's equipment chapter specifically notes regular horses as being the appropriate mount for a dwarf, with ponies being called out as only appropriate for gnomes and halflings.

[The Hop Goblin]

If you look at Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers (Movie), Gimly was riding a horse in a very awkward fashion. I think the basis for the pony decision and the overall "what feels right" is kind of based on that.

[Niknokitueu]

One reason for it's being a pony would be that dwarves have stumpy legs.

Ponies are used by people of smaller statue as their hips would be strained by the width of a larger mount. Not important for a quick 'ride around the yard', but very important after you have spent eight hours in the saddle.

Have Fun!
Niknokitueu

[Mauve Shirt]

Incorrect, dwarves are medium.

I meant in the OOTSverse. If the rule that mounts have to be a size category larger applies anyway.

[Quorothorn]

One reason for it's being a pony would be that dwarves have stumpy legs.

Ponies are used by people of smaller statue as their hips would be strained by the width of a larger mount. Not important for a quick 'ride around the yard', but very important after you have spent eight hours in the saddle.

Have Fun!
Niknokitueu

But dwarves are very broad, so width isn't necessarily a problem: what they'd really need is shortened stirrups.



Also, a Deinonychus (MM1) is actually a Large creature. So it can be a mount anyway. If you thought a large shark or dire wolf was an awesome Paladin mount...though I'm rather partial to a Rhino myself: Dwarven Cavalier charging down on you atop a Rhinocerous = climb an incredibly sturdy tree or die. ...I'd still pick a therapod of some kind, though.

Also, the same book stats a "Megaraptor", which by the description is pretty close to a Utahraptor (significantly taller, though).

[Roderick_BR]

I'm pretty sure the PHB1 mentions dwarves using poneys.

[Shhalahr Windrider]

I'm pretty sure the PHB1 mentions dwarves using poneys.

Nope.


Dungeons & Dragons Player's Handbook Core Rulebook 1 v.3.5[/i], p. 131-132"]Horse: The horse is the best all-around work animal and mount in common use. A horse (other than a pony) is suitable as a mount for a human, dwarf, elf, half-elf, or half-orc. A pony is smaller than a horse and is a suitable mount for a gnome or halfling. (See the Monster Manual for more information on horses and ponies.)
(Emphasis mine)

EDIT:
Also, a Deinonychus (MM1) is actually a Large creature.
A real Deinoychus is long enough to be "Large" by body length. But taking a look at the overall proportion (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Deinonychus-scale.png), it's height would make it more Medium.

As a biped, it should have been categorized as Medium, according to the footnote on the size table on page 314 of the Monster Manual.

In any case, as a DM I wouldn't consider it to be a suitable mount for Medium creatures.

[Quorothorn]

EDIT:
A real Deinoychus is long enough to be "Large" by body length. But taking a look at the overall proportion (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Deinonychus-scale.png), it's height would make it more Medium.

As a biped, it should have been categorized as Medium, according to the footnote on the size table on page 314 of the Monster Manual.

In any case, as a DM I wouldn't consider it to be a suitable mount for Medium creatures.

You're completely right there, Windrider: I'm just saying, by RAW a Human or Dwarf could use a Deinonychus as a mount. :smallwink: Obviously common sense dictates that no, it should only be a suitable mount for halflings and gnomes and other Small-size races.

[Eogan]

I was actually stating what I thought it should be...more along the lines of "Giant making more sense than the D&D book,"

Apparently, Lolcats make more sense than the D&D book. It's seriously a rule that a pony can't carry anyone taller than 4 feet?

Meh. I suppose if the guys who wrote the thing had half a clue about most of the stuff they make arbitrary rules about, we wouldn't be here, would we? :smallamused:

[Shhalahr Windrider]

You're completely right there, Windrider: I'm just saying, by RAW a Human or Dwarf could use a Deinonychus as a mount. :smallwink:
Well, if it were RAW Medium as I suggested it should be, then it wouldn't be RAW suitable. :smalltongue:

[Parvum]

Nope.

A real Deinoychus is long enough to be "Large" by body length. But taking a look at the overall proportion (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Deinonychus-scale.png), it's height would make it more Medium.

As a biped, it should have been categorized as Medium, according to the footnote on the size table on page 314 of the Monster Manual.

In any case, as a DM I wouldn't consider it to be a suitable mount for Medium creatures.

Problem there is that DnD uses 'movie logic'. Their raptor-like donosars would probably be closer to Speilberg monsters than the actual animals on which they were based.

[Oberon]

personally, I can't see a Dwarf as an actual medium person, I mean there only 4 feet tall, and a human is closer to 6 foot…I don’t see 2/3 the height being the same size


The average Human male is about 9 feet, yes, but some humans are only 5 feet tall. Some are shorter still. And these people are generally thinner than your average dwarf. I see no reason why a 4'11'' thin human female and 4' tall stocky dwarf should not be categorized in the same size

[Shhalahr Windrider]

Problem there is that DnD uses 'movie logic'.
With dinosaurs a bit more so than still-living creatures, unfortunately. :smallannoyed:

[Irbis]

The average Human male is about 9 feet, yes [...]

Excuse me? :smallconfused:

Either you mean halfling feet or something is wrong with this ridiculous imperial system.

[Rogue 7]

Orrr he typed a number wrong...

[serpent615]

The average Human male is about 9 feet, yes, but some humans are only 5 feet tall. Some are shorter still. And these people are generally thinner than your average dwarf. I see no reason why a 4'11'' thin human female and 4' tall stocky dwarf should not be categorized in the same size

when you put it that way, yes...but I still see dwarfs as the really short, stocky type...but ok, I guess that makes sense.

[slb]

Excuse me? :smallconfused:
Either you mean halfling feet or something is wrong with this ridiculous imperial system.

Speaking of that I wonder if there's a metric version of the SRD ? Although those ridiculous measurement units used in the US are probably well suited for a medieval fantasy setting :smallbiggrin:

On a side note, in Europe a horse can be called a Pony only if it's size is not higher than 148 cm at age 7.

[Shhalahr Windrider]

Speaking of that I wonder if there's a metric version of the SRD ?
Given that all measurements are in units of 5 ft, you can just divide them all by 5 and measure everything in "squares" or generic "units". From there you can easily decide things like, "Hey! I want my squares to equal approximately 2 meters/1.5 meters/1 meter!" depending on what kind of abstraction you want.

Heck, from all appearances 4e is doing away with the "divide by 5" part and will be measuring most things in generic squares as it is.

That's the great part about measuring stuff. Units are totally arbitrary.

[Quorothorn]

With dinosaurs a bit more so than still-living creatures, unfortunately. :smallannoyed:

Well, actually, the Velociraptors in Jurassic Park were pretty much the right size IIRC....for Deinonychuses. >_>

[pnewman]

Size is also a function of weight, not just size. Small creatures weigh less than 50 pounds, thus Dwarves are much too big to be small and should never be made small creatures with powerful builds.

[theinsulabot]

Well, actually, the Velociraptors in Jurassic Park were pretty much the right size IIRC....for Deinonychuses. >_>



the Jurassic park raptors out weighed Deinonychuses by a good 2 to 1. they were Utah raptors

[Lupy]

OOOOOOORRRR, maybe Durkon just likes ponies and a houserule says he can ride one? This is Oots after all.

[kpenguin]

EDIT:
A real Deinoychus is long enough to be "Large" by body length. But taking a look at the overall proportion (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Deinonychus-scale.png), it's height would make it more Medium.

As a biped, it should have been categorized as Medium, according to the footnote on the size table on page 314 of the Monster Manual.

In any case, as a DM I wouldn't consider it to be a suitable mount for Medium creatures.

I'd like to note that errata for the Monster Manual places the Deinonychus as a medium creature and the Megaraptor as a large-sized creature.

[Shhalahr Windrider]

I'd like to note that errata for the Monster Manual places the Deinonychus as a medium creature and the Megaraptor as a large-sized creature.
Ah. So it did. :smallbiggrin:

[Quorothorn]

I'd like to note that errata for the Monster Manual places the Deinonychus as a medium creature and the Megaraptor as a large-sized creature.

Yay for Errata, then.

[Voyager]

If you want to get technical, a properly sized pony is a perfectly suitable mount for a normal sized human, and in some riding conditions is actually a better mount than a hourse would be. The distinquishing characteristics between the pony and the hourse are proportion, not strength or loadbearing capacity. There's even a degree of height overlap between the two classifications.

Ponies are ponies because their legs are considerably shorter in relation to their torsoes, and their barrels larger than in the classic hourse. Many pony breeds are just as massive as medium horses (on the order of 800-1100lbs). Note that I am excluding things such as the Clydesdale and the Shire Horse, as they're just <beep>ing huge.

Harry Voyager

[Raging_Pacifist]

Not in DnD terms.

[Kalatash]

For some strange reason, I always thought that Utah raptors were larger than the JP raptors.

Also, I have a sudden urge to write up states for a dire Clydesdale.

[Raging_Pacifist]

For some strange reason, I always thought that Utah raptors were larger than the JP raptors.

Also, I have a sudden urge to write up states for a dire Clydesdale.

Dire clydesdale = Huge horse.[/pointing out redundancy]

[The gF]

Excuse me? :smallconfused:

Either you mean halfling feet or something is wrong with this ridiculous imperial system.

He was counting my manhood as a person. It really throws off the curve.

Anyway, as bad a pun as it sounds, I think by this point the topic is just beating a dead horse. Or pony, as the case may be. Apparently based on your race.

I WILL say that there are simple constraints of "It's easier for his tiny dwarf legs to reach the stirrups of a pony's saddle".

[Voyager]

Not in DnD terms.

Yes, well, not everything in DnD makes sense (http://www.criticalmiss.com/issue9/fallingguide1.html).



For some strange reason, I always thought that Utah raptors were larger than the JP raptors.

Also, I have a sudden urge to write up states for a dire Clydesdale.

I'm having visions of something the size of a not so small elephant that wants to know if you'd like to play polo, as the ball. They're supposedly descended from destriers, you know.