PDA

View Full Version : Death in DMG and new Characters



Iudex Fatarum
2008-02-19, 02:35 AM
So I am in a campaign where some funny things have happened recently. It is a low level party ranging from 3-5th level when i joined, so per DMG rules I started at 2nd level. This DM is having us keep track of XP very carefully and so I quickly made it to 4,900 XP because of some high level easy to kill opponents (I.E. no flying or other odd magic to make it harder than the CR).
Then the DM throws a Tendriculos at the party at night, of course the Tendriculos eats the entire party quickly except for my bard who runs as fast as he can, the party does manage to slash its way out of the Tendriculos' stomach but all but one of the party members is at 0 or less HP or paralyzed for minutes. We are now all screwed royally (Can you say TPK) The only person awake is our mage who of course has no spells because he hasn't slept yet. So my bard runs, the Tendriculos ignores all the players on the ground prone next to it and charges my bard and devours him. then runs off (ie DM doesn't want TPK and doesn't realize even a 5 member party at 4th level can't deal with a CR 6 monster at night unprepared). Now again according to the DMG I should draw up a level 2 character, again. The DM does this. even though at this point the party has leveled twice more so that I am now lower level than another party member's cohort. (yes the cohort is level 4.)

So i guess I have two questions, Does this make sense to follow the DMG?
and How strictly do people follow it with regards to making new characters when previous ones are killed with no chance of resurrecting them?

Oh btw if people would like DMG pages 41-42 are the rules I am citing.

leperkhaun
2008-02-19, 02:47 AM
in my group, typically a new character enters at the average party level. having a character lag a couple levels is useless and at low levels...means they dont have the HP or spells/skill/bab to do anything other than die.

Swooper
2008-02-19, 05:11 AM
Wow. I've never heard of a DM that follows RAW so strictly. I don't think there's any rule you can quote to counter your DM, just try to appeal to his fairness. As leperkhaun said, being lower level than the rest of the party just makes you the weakest link.

Yami
2008-02-19, 05:32 AM
I've had some bring a level 1 into a ecl 8 party due to such rules. It happens, and sadly, it becomes a reoccuring theme. Might I suggest cheesing out your character for survivals sake? That way you can gain EXP, hit the parties level, and then throw yourself blindly into the fray.

Expesially if the DM's going to pick on you by dropping your party, but chossing to slay you and spare them.

You know you want to! Taste the cheese!

Iudex Fatarum
2008-02-20, 05:26 PM
I have cheesed him out as much as I can, he is a fighter that has buffed himself over the top as far as I can, but then again he is a also allowing only core.

Iku Rex
2008-02-20, 05:57 PM
Wow. I've never heard of a DM that follows RAW so strictly.Here are a few quotes from the DMG:

"How you [the DM] handle each of these situations [new PCs] is up to you." -- DMG page 42.

"D&D works best when all the PCs are within a level or two of each other." -- DMG page 42.

"If a PC falls that far [four or more levels] behind the rest of the party, take action to restore a semblance of balance." -- DMG page 42.

In this case the DM is not "following the RAW". In fact, he's disregarding the advice in the DMG.

My suggestion to the TS if he wants to stay in the campaign and the DM won't budge, is to make a Barbarian/Fighter specializing in archery. Barbarian means greater speed, so you can run away from a threat. And as an archer with rapid shot you can contribute to the party without getting too close to danger.

Nerd-o-rama
2008-02-20, 07:52 PM
You may want to address the fact that your DM apparently hates you before you get concerned with drawing up a new character.

Also, I have only ever played with people who bring in new characters at either the average or lowest party level. Really, I can't see any good reason to start a new character at a lower level than that.

Prometheus
2008-02-20, 09:41 PM
Make sure you are receiving more experience points than the other players because of your lower level, and you will get closer to the other players, because you will be getting more experience but needing less to level. If there are five players, each other player gets 1/5 of what a party of their level would get, and you receive 1/5 of what a party of your level would get.

Also ask the DM if you are allowed to do a side quest to allow yourself to catch up. Whether or not the DM will allow this, whether or not it should occur during your regular session or another time, the basic premise is a short solo adventure in which your character gets all the experience and treasure in order to bring you up to speed. Than you have "earned it" and are meeting the other players.

Corolinth
2008-02-20, 09:57 PM
The "rule" for a new player is one level below the lowest party member (which is in place, essentially, so as not to screw over anybody by bringing in a new character at a higher level than somebody else).

The death "rule" is to emulate the penalty you'd receive if your character was raised from the dead.

Personally what I do is try to keep the party close to one another. If there's a death that's happening for a reason, I don't penalize the character for it. Especially if I'm burning fate chips, action points, plot points, drama points, void points, or whatever the system's "reroll dice" mechanic is (if it has one). Death due to stupidity is one thing. Death due to properly role-playing your character, or a bad run of the dice is something else entirely, and I don't really think I need to hurt players for it.

I do think you need to have a talk with your DM, though. There's no reason why you should've died while the rest of the party lived.

Galdor Miriel
2008-02-21, 11:31 AM
S
Then the DM throws a Tendriculos at the party at night, of course the Tendriculos eats the entire party quickly except for my bard who runs as fast as he can, the party does manage to slash its way out of the Tendriculos' stomach but all but one of the party members is at 0 or less HP or paralyzed for minutes. We are now all screwed royally (Can you say TPK) The only person awake is our mage who of course has no spells because he hasn't slept yet. So my bard runs, the Tendriculos ignores all the players on the ground prone next to it and charges my bard and devours him. then runs off (ie DM doesn't want TPK and doesn't realize even a 5 member party at 4th level can't deal with a CR 6 monster at night unprepared).

This is a clear case of poor judgement by the dm. His monster won the encounter and should have eaten all the prone party members, leaving your bard the only one left alive. The dm decided to fix things to let the party survive, but killed your guy. When he made the decision to spare the party but nail you he was picking on you, not being a good dm. The dm was well within his rights to think, 'oh my god, they will all die, how can I let them off' and could have done it in a good story way by having the monster chase you, but hampered by the injuries it received, you esape, and by leading the moster off so save the party and be a big hero. Which to my mind is what the game is all about.

So in my opinion there is no rule to cover this. The dm decided to make the monsters decisions in a way that spared some intentionally but killed you.

Make sure you bring it up with him in a nice way though as he was clearly unfair to kill you, and is compounding it by making you play a lame character now.

Galdor