Shipwrecked! Housing and Leadership Meeting

[smartaleq]

This is the Shipwrecked! thread for the meeting proposed by Hammerhardt occurring one evening during the second week.

This occurs:
after week 1
after diving quest
after discovering water
after discovering fire clearing
during week 2
before pig hunt

I will post a template for marking interest in proposals - this is not a substitute for RP, but should assist in accelerating the discussion

Player List (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3979749&postcount=62)

Current Location (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3975431&postcount=121) (at bottom of post)
Ovias "Keep Searching" (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3955735&postcount=62)
Epswitch "We Need Water" (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3957141&postcount=69) and "Building a Tent" (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3967429&postcount=88)
Maria "Cleared Hilltop" (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3987335&postcount=169)

[smartaleq]

Gil arrives at the appointed time for the meeting, and takes a seat on the sand near the fire. He idly knots his rope while listening to the others discuss.

Gil's Opinions UPDATED

Option - View - Reasons
Leadership
Himmerhardt - Weak Support - Old and wise?
Epswitch - Strong Oppose -
Ovias "Grey" - Weak Oppose - General Antagonism
Gil - Strong Oppose - Can't direct well
Maria - Weak support -
Mara - Strong Support - Level headed
Zalvulon - Oppose - Injured
Roostin - Support - Was sailor, would be new "captain"
Imbrallius - Strong Support - Good Speaker, Practical
All Others - No Opinion

For Housing Location
Stay on Beach - Oppose
Move to Clean Water Pond - Support
Move to Fire Clearing Hilltop - Strong Support - increases likelihood of meeting people on equal terms
Continue Searching - Oppose - time is critical, want a steady base as soon as possible
Prepare a Clearing - Oppose - time is critical

For Housing Type
Continue Makeshift - No Opinion
Wooden Palisades - No Opinion
Stone Construction - No Opinion

[sickler]

Ben mostly daydreams during the discussion. He doesn't care too much for what others seem to consider "intellectual talk".


Option - View - Reasons
Leadership
Himmerhardt - Oppose - Old people aren't going to survive, so we'll just have to repeat this process later
Mara - Support - She seems to know what she's doing
Roostin - Support - Old enough to be a smart leader, young enough to not croak tomorrow
Imbrallius - Support - Bookworm types are good at these sorts of things
All non-humans - Oppose - General mistrust
exception Ovias - Neutral - Trusts him enough from diving
All others - No opinion


For Housing Location
Stay on Beach - Support - Can still fish there, chance of spotting passing boats, boiling sea water for drinking water
Move to Clean Water Pond - Mild support - Water
Move to Fire Clearing Hilltop - Support - Sounds like some shelter and curiousity gets the better of Ben
Continue Searching - No opinion - Others do the searching

For Housing Type
No opinion - Whatever keeps the water off his head and wind out of his face will suit him just fine

[jagadaishio]

Maria sits quietly most of the time, eyes focused intently on whoever is speaking. When it comes time to voice her opinions, they are as follows:

Option - View - Reasons
Leadership
Himmerhardt - No Opinion - Has rarely interacted with him.
Epswitch - Strong Oppose - Seems antagonistic and completely stubborn
Ovias "Grey" - Support - Always manages to keep/get people working
Gil - Strong Oppose - Can't vocalize directions
Maria - Strong Oppose - Dislikes giving orders, dislikes interacting with most people
Mara - Support - Level headed
Zalvulon - Weak Oppose - Currently injured, otherwise no opinion on his leadership
Roostin - Weak Support - Was in somewhat of a position of authority before the ship sank.
All Others - No Opinion

For Housing Location
Stay on Beach - No Opinion - Has proved adequate so far
Move to Clean Water Pond - Support - Gives more direct access to most resources
Move to Fire Clearing Hilltop - No Opinon - Need search and survival results to come back before an opinion can be formed.
Continue Searching - No Opinion - A cave would be ideal but searching is somewhat time consuming. Supports continuing to let the hunters search as they forage.

For Housing Type
Continue Makeshift - No Opinion
Wooden Palisades - No Opinion
Stone Construction - No Opinion

Maria thinks that their best bet is finding a cave. We could then build a cavas, wood, and stone construction at the front of it, connected to the entrance. This would give us a much larger housing space than the cave alone or a structure alone would.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Ovias waits for people to arrive, and then walks next to the fire and speakes his initial statement:

"Good evening to you all. We need to decide what to do about housing and, it seems, about leaderrship. I find farr morre imporrtant housing, so I will get rright to it. We have not find any apprropiate place for it. Building close to the lake, while convenient, given the amount of waste we generrate, is a fast way to foul the waterrs we have to drrink."

Pausing for air, he continues, "Some have suggested a hilltop with a stone cirrcle, but that sounds to me like a rreligious place, and if therre arre indeed locals, I do not think it wise to trransforrm theirr sacrred offerrings place into housing. They would likely take it the wrrong way. So would I, and I will not have any parrt of it. Now, I have yet to see it forr myself, but I will soon, time perrmiting, so if it turrns to be differrent frrom what I picturre, I rreserrve my rright to change my mind."

"So, the issue rremains: we have slowly accumulated the rresourrces to build housing, but we have nowherre to put it. Master Currunda would prreferr it if we did not cut down trrees, but being rrealistic we would have to crreate ourr own clearring. I have not explorred, so I will gladly hearr frrom those that know the terrain. Wherre can we build, that has the space forr a common house and is not too farr frrom sea orr frresh waterr, but not too close to this one eitherr? The answer so farr is nowherre, as farr as I have hearrd frrom explorrers, and I'd rratherr not commit to a bad place now if therre is a good place coming. We still may have some time beforre we trruly need the rrefuge."

"On the issue of leaderrship, I prropose Masterr Himmerrharrdt and Mara Herrbswife, forr rreasons of my own. Make of that what you will. Howeverr, I do not believe they should make all decisions. So farr we have done well to decide as a grroup, and I believe we can continue to do so. They would be Arrbitrrers, as we call them amongst dwarrves, rratherr than Directorrs."

With those final words, Ovias sits down, waiting for others to make their own proposals.

OOC:OK, it seems that I'm the only one that has read this (http://www.anotherurl.com/travel/ireland/images/6/stone_circle.jpg) in the DM's description of the hilltop stone circle - but the more I read it, the clearer it becomes he is describing it. If it turns out to be something else, I'll have Ovias apologise.

[storyteller]

OOC:

Nice job! This thread is a really good idea!

The stone circle: Grey, yes a bit like that, only a lot smaller. Heh, almost like the one in Spinal Tap.. :smallbiggrin:

[Grey_Wolf_c]

OOC:

Nice job! This thread is a really good idea!

The stone circle: Grey, yes a bit like that, only a lot smaller. Heh, almost like the one in Spinal Tap.. :smallbiggrin:

OOC: Well, that was the best one I could find in a quick Google check. And yeah, good to know that at least three people are wanting to use the unholy temple of ritual human sacrifice in a world where evil gods not only exist but like to participate in wordly events. Sort of reminds me of the story of the opening of the Three Jolly Luck Take-away Fish Bar on the site of the old temple in Dagon Street on the night of the Winter solstice when it also happens to be a full moon...

[Lonna]

Ovias waits for people to arrive, and then walks next to the fire and speakes his initial statement:

"Good evening to you all. We need to decide what to do about housing and, it seems, about leaderrship. I find farr morre imporrtant housing, so I will get rright to it. We have not find any apprropiate place for it. Building close to the lake, while convenient, given the amount of waste we generrate, is a fast way to foul the waterrs we have to drrink."

Pausing for air, he continues, "Some have suggested a hilltop with a stone cirrcle, but that sounds to me like a rreligious place, and if therre arre indeed locals, I do not think it wise to trransforrm theirr sacrred offerrings place into housing. They would likely take it the wrrong way. So would I, and I will not have any parrt of it. Now, I have yet to see it forr myself, but I will soon, time perrmiting, so if it turrns to be differrent frrom what I picturre, I rreserrve my rright to change my mind."

"So, the issue rremains: we have slowly accumulated the rresourrces to build housing, but we have nowherre to put it. Master Currunda would prreferr it if we did not cut down trrees, but being rrealistic we would have to crreate ourr own clearring. I have not explorred, so I will gladly hearr frrom those that know the terrain. Wherre can we build, that has the space forr a common house and is not too farr frrom sea orr frresh waterr, but not too close to this one eitherr? The answer so farr is nowherre, as farr as I have hearrd frrom explorrers, and I'd rratherr not commit to a bad place now if therre is a good place coming. We still may have some time beforre we trruly need the rrefuge."

"On the issue of leaderrship, I prropose Masterr Himmerrharrdt and Mara Herrbswife, forr rreasons of my own. Make of that what you will. Howeverr, I do not believe they should make all decisions. So farr we have done well to decide as a grroup, and I believe we can continue to do so. They would be Arrbitrrers, as we call them amongst dwarrves, rratherr than Directorrs."

With those final words, Ovias sits down, waiting for others to make their own proposals.

Mara Herbswife


After waiting a moment to see if anyone else would speak, Mara stood. Looking at the survivors - less than half the number of souls who set out on the ship - Mara met each person's eyes as she spoke.

"Thank you all for coming. It has been a trying week, and I'm sure many of you would rather be sleeping. However, as Ovias mentioned, there are pressing issues of housing and leadership which concern all of us.

"I agree with Ovias' suggestion as to the nature of the leadership positions. Rather than one or two people, however, I suggest that we give three persons that power. A single person in power may become biased and fail to make decisions in the interest of the group as a whole. Two people may disagree about the best path and become unable to reach any decision. A group of three is small enough to reach decisions quickly and large enough to ensure decisions will benefit all the survivors.

"I'm flattered that Ovias believes I would be a good candidate for such responsibility, but I disagree. I suggest that the three Arbitrers be Master Himmerhardt, the wise man who called for this meeting, Master Imbrallius, the good clerk who has been keeping track of our supplies, and Ovias Greybeard, the person who has been organizing our efforts at survival here since we arrived.

"As for the question of where to build our shelter, I have little opinion, being neither an architect nor a worker of wood or stone. The stone circle Maria and Gil discovered today seems as though it would be ideal for transforming into a shelter, if only for our supplies, but I am hesitant to do anything until we discover whether the site is in fact some sort of religious location for natives we have yet to directly encounter.

"The pond is a good water source, and if nothing better presents itself we should build our shelter close to it, but I am concerned about contaminating the water. In fact, reguardless of where we ultimately end up, I wish to go and set aside areas to hygenically deal with our waste. Our current method of simply wandering into the forest and doing what is necessary will not suffice for long.

"My personal feeling is that we have not yet found an area adequate for our needs. My ideal would be to find a large, empty cave near a source of running water. Such a location would be easy to convert to adequate shelter, and running water would reduce most problems of contamination. However, since we have found neither caves nor running water so far, I suggest we continue looking. Any large amount of running water will have no choice but to let out in the sea. If we sent a party down the beach, we could determine both the general size of this island and whether it has any major sources of running water."

Realizing she had just made a speech, Mara returned to her seat abruptly, the firelight making her cheeks appear even brighter red than they actually were.

Option - View - Reasons

Leadership

Ovias "Grey" - Strong Support - Good organizer, took charge at first
Janson Himmerhardt - Support - Old and wise
Imbrallius - Support - Good organizer
Roostin - Weak Support - Has shown some leadership tendencies

Epswitch - Strong Oppose - Antagonizes almost everyone
Mara - Oppose - Doesn't think she can handle the responsibility
Gil - Weak Oppose - Can't give directions vocally
All Others - No Opinion

For Housing Location

Stay on Beach - No Opinion
Move to Clean Water Pond - Weak Support
Move to Fire Clearing Hilltop - Weak Oppose
Continue Searching - Support

For Housing Type

Continue Makeshift - Oppose
Wooden Palisades - Support
Stone Construction - No Opinion

[smartaleq]

After hearing Mara speak, Gil is now even more inclined to want her to lead. He is also generally favorable to the three leaders concept, and is more interested in Imbrallius, having heard her speak highly of him. Gil's opposition to Grey is also slightly reduced.

Based on the information that the fire is weeks old, Gil moved to Strong Support for occupying that area. To Gil, making contact may be the first step to continuing on the colony's mission.

[jagadaishio]

OOC:
Remember, everyone, the stone circle itself is only five feet in diameter. It's about the size of a small fire pit, for a camp fire or funeral pyre.

[Sicarius]

Imbrallius

Waiting patiently for his turn, Imbrallius stands up to speak. "Comrades, we have turned a terrible tragedy into life. We have survived here for one week, no easy feat, because we have worked together. I ask that no matter what, we continue together in the name of unity. No problem is so great that our combined wills and efforts cannot address it."

"Now, onto business. We must give ourselves a more permanent dwelling. The beach's ground is too weak to support buildings, and the firepit on the hill suggests that it is a place for natives to pray or to deal with their dead. I cannot support these plans as they would potentially lead to the deaths of many. Ideally, we would find running water to base our new settlement on, but if that is the case, we must continue with our temporary housing until such a location makes itself available to us. Moving toward the pond could also be considered a temporary measure, but I've little doubt that others, whether beast or native, also use this pond as a water source."

"For resources, I have done the tallying of our resources, we may also wish to distribute the resources of the recently deceased. My suggestion is to appoint someone in charge of distributing resources fairly and equitably, and keep most things for common use. I volunteer for the position, if it will be so."

"Lastly, in the issue of leadership, I am honored that some of you think of me so highly. I've no experience in leadership matters, I was supposed to be a minor town hall functionary, not a mayor. I will strive to be a productive member of the Arbiter Council putting the interests of ourselves at the forefront, and promise to hear your concerns and voice them to the Council, if you would have me. In my opinion, Master Greybeard and Master Himmerhardt make excellent canididates, and I fully support them as members of the council. Miss Herbswife, I believe you would also make an excellent leader, and hope that you both reconsider your reluctance for the position as well as believe more completely in your exceptional abilities." Imbrallius looks at each of the three candidates he proposed with a smile and nod.


Members of the Arbiter Council
Ovias Greybeard - Strong Support - Has proven himself effective thus far.
Imbrallius - Support - Believes he would make an excellent leader.
Mara - Weak Support - Likes her practicality, doesn't want to give her the position if she doesn't want it.
Himmerhardt - Weak Support - Hasn't interacted with him much, believes in Ovias and Mara's recommendation. Would be support, but worried for his health.
Roostin - Weak Support - If nothing else, gets the job done with a minimum of complaints. Heard that he had decent initative on his own, but has not directly witnessed it. Believes he would make a fine delegate for a small group.
Tano - Weak Support - Works actively for the good of the whole.

Epswitch - Strongly Oppose - Needlessly antagonistic and selfish. Doesn't want to give someone power if he'd misuse it.
Gil - Oppose - Cannot vocalize thoughts. Makes debate and deliberation impossible.
All others - Weak Oppose - If they haven't shown the leadership initative now, they might not be good as leaders.

Housing
Stay on the Beach - Weak Oppose - It's a good temporary measure, but storms will come soon
Move to Clean Water Pond - Weak Support - A very good temporary measure.
Move to Hilltop - Oppose - The last thing Imbrallius thinks the colony needs are angry natives.
Search for a Better Location - Support - The most important things are location, location, location.

Continue Makeshift Housing - Oppose - As a temporary measure, it's worked so far. But permanently, absolutely not.
Wooden Palisades - Support - It will be much better than what they have and take a little effort, but the long-term benefits are great until they can build actual buildings.
Stone Construction - Weak Oppose - Believes the stone would take too long to work to be useful, prefers to have it used to help reinforce.

[Yeril]

"I would like to make it heard that I support Ovias, Imbrallius, and Mister Himmerhardt for the positions as leaders. Ovias has already shown great leadership skills and was quick to get everyone busy when we first arrived here, and more importantly, everyone followed him and did as he said. Imbrallius has shown that he is smart, well prepared, and has planned ahead and kept close tracks on what is going on. Mister Himmerhardt has somthing that none of us have, Experience. Mister Himmerhardt has lived longer than any of us here, seen more than any of us here, experienced more than any of us here, For his qualities of insight, wisdom, and experience I think he would make a great addition to the leadership of this island." He finishes, seeming unusaly vocal and charismatic, you can only assume he has had this "speech" prepared for quite some time.

"This aside, somthing else, a task, I would like to suggest." He glances around at the faces of his listeners. "If, by a stroke of luck we have been stranded on a island already inhabited by civilised people, we can all be assured that there is one thing that they will have that we can look for easily, a port. I would like to suggest that some of us take some food and supplies and then walk down the beach, following it for perhaps a day or two and at worst they find nothing and head back."

Option - View - Reasons
Leadership
Himmerhardt - Support - See above
Ovias "Grey" - Strong Support - See above
Mara - Support - Has shown leadership abilities even in times of stress and panic.
Imbrallius - Strong Support - Smart, Practical, Prepared, See above.


For Housing Location
Stay on Beach - Oppose - Can't build on sand.
Move to Clean Water Pond - Mild Support - Practical, but others have expressed a risk of contamination
Move to Fire Clearing Hilltop - Strong Oppose - Dont wana annoy the natives
Continue Searching - Support
Prepare a Clearing - Support - we will need to cut down trees for wood, so lets make a clearing at the same time.

For Housing Type
Continue Makeshift - No Opinion
Wooden Palisades - Strong Support - Easy, Quick, and Practical
Stone Construction - Mild Oppose - Alot of long, rather tedious work, perhaps at a later time.

[lawful_evil]

Epswitch


{{ I'm a bit lost here, but want to voice his opinion... especially on the camp thing. I got the impression we had already moved the camp to be near the water source.. so I'm a bit confused about the discussion. }}

Epswitch doesn't care who claims to be the leader because he isn't the sort of person to be lead. Neither does he want people to complain to him all the time. No thanks.

Leaders

Ben - Opposed - Too Violent
Brady - Okay - Don't know much about him
Elias - Okay - Don't know much about him
Epswitch - Strong Opposed - Don't want to have to deal with people whining.
Eric - Okay - Don't know much about him
Feln - Okay - Don't know much about him
Gil - Okay - Seems fine
Imbrallius - Opposed - Too isolated, doesn't get involved.
Janson - Opposed - the writing guy? Come on.
Joseph - Okay - Seems fine
Larry - FAVOR - Seems perfect.

Epswitch can't tell these two apart, so they both get a bad rep.
Mara - Strong Opposed - too emotional, possibly not right in the head.
Maria - Strong Opposed - too emotional, possibly not right in the head.

Ovias - Strong Opposed - Stone this and Stone that.. do we really want to live under dwarven law?
Ray - Okay - Don't know much about him
Roostin - Strong Opposed - It is partially his fault that we are here.
Tano - Okay - Don't know much about him
Zavulon - Opposed - Orcs can't be trusted.


For Housing Location

Move back to Beach - Strongly Opposed
Stay at Clean Water Pond - Support - No point in moving again
Move to Fire Clearing Hilltop - No Opinon - I don't know anything about this, I've been hunting piggies. Hilltops are good, but lack water which we need everyday.
Continue Searching - Strong FAVOR - Maybe find an existing community.


For Housing Type

Continue Makeshift - For now, but we should build a house or 3 eventually.
Wooden Palisades - Maybe eventually, what do we have to worry about?
Stone Construction - Too time consuming, too difficult to maintain, too heavy

[Daryk]

... Mister Himmerhardt has somthing that none of us have, Experience. Mister Himmerhardt has lived longer than any of us here, seen more than any of us here, experienced more than any of us here...

[COLOR="DarkGreen"]Tano

Tano coughed lightly into the back of his hand at mention of the human's age. When an opportunity to speak presented itself, he said, "I'm really not sure why we need to worry about 'leadership' at all. Things seem to be progressing just fine in that vein: when someone has a good idea, we cooperate. As far as a camp site, wherever it is, it should be near the sea so we can keep an eye on the life boats. And as I said to Master Greybeard before, I'm not opposed to harvesting what we need from the forest. I'm opposed to waste, and unnecessary work."

[smartaleq]

Procedural OOC:

I'm going to insist we end this discussion by 24hrs from this post time. We should have decent decisions/indecision made, and the longer we discuss, the more difficult it is to stay semi-chronological.

As it is we're discussing moving to the pond while Epswitch is dealing with living alone at the pond.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

After hearing the halfling, Ovias takes the word again:
"Why arre you even herre, halfling? You have alrready stated you will neitherr collaborrate in the buildings norr listen to any voice but yourr own, and do not want to lead - not that anyone herre would want you in that position eitherr. Morreoverr, you neitherr sharre norr help the grroup, but have chosen to live elsewherre. You have no business in this meeting, and yourr opinions so farr clearrly say as much."

"Grraverr yet, you volunteerred forr watch duty, then abandoned the duty without letting anyone else know. You put the grroup in dangerr for no rreason - parrticularrly since no vow tied you, all you had to do was let us know and a substitute would've been found. If we werre in dwarrven land, you would be hung to death. I believe many human lands would do similarrly - consider yourrself lucky you arre not being punished forr yourr decision. That said, I now considerr you <Persona Non Grata>, an undesirrable perrson. I will have nothing furrtherr to do with you, and call to everryone else to do samewise."

Deliberately turning his back to him, Ovias addresses the rest of the gathered, "This meeting grrows long. We have yet to decide much, but we have yet to listen to everyone. Several of you have considered me for Arrbitrrerr, and I am honourred by yourr trrust. If you feel that you can listen to a dwarrf, I will be pleased to accept."

"Also, afterr listening to yourr worrds, I am now hoping that the cliffs to the east will have caves we can use, but I am not one to sit and hope. I prropose we starrt a deliberrate efforrt to clearr a section of forrest, away frrom the cirrcle - if it is rreligious, the furrtherr the betterr - and rreasonably close to both clean waterr and sea. If we find a cave, orr a betterr place, we can rreconsiderr it. If not, we will have a place rready."

"Finally, I want to note that severral of you speak against stone building. I am the best, likely the only, builderr in the grroup. We have a ship carrpenterr and a bowyerr, but only I have built housing. Indeed, that was the rreason I was called to this expedition! I will worrk fasterr with stone than with wood, and in any case, the best way is a mix of both, since we do not have so much rresourrce of any one kind to build entirrely with it."


Procedural OOC:

I'm going to insist we end this discussion by 24hrs from this post time. We should have decent decisions/indecision made, and the longer we discuss, the more difficult it is to stay semi-chronological.
I'll be PMing Zed's Dead in case he is not aware of this thread - we really are mostly missing his input. That said, we are already jumping around quite a bit in IC anyway, so taking a few days with this shouldn't be a problem. DM did say to have a decision by yesterday, though, which does worry me.

[smartaleq]

After hearing the halfling, Ovias takes the word again:
"Why arre you even herre, halfling? You have alrready stated you will neitherr collaborrate in the buildings norr listen to any voice but yourr own, and do not want to lead - not that anyone herre would want you in that position eitherr. Morreoverr, you neitherr sharre norr help the grroup, but have chosen to live elsewherre. You have no business in this meeting, and yourr opinions so farr clearrly say as much."

"Grraverr yet, you volunteerred forr watch duty, then abandoned the duty without letting anyone else know. You put the grroup in dangerr for no rreason - parrticularrly since no vow tied you, all you had to do was let us know and a substitute would've been found. If we werre in dwarrven land, you would be hung to death. I believe many human lands would do similarrly - consider yourrself lucky you arre not being punished forr yourr decision. That said, I now considerr you <Persona Non Grata>, an undesirrable perrson. I will have nothing furrtherr to do with you, and call to everryone else to do samewise."

Deliberately turning his back to him, Ovias addresses the rest of the gathered,

Hearing this acid laced diatribe directed at Epswitch, Gil jumpst to his feet and kicks sand at the fire to draw everyones attention. As Ovias Greybeard slowly turns to him, Gil gives him a pointed glare. Gil looks around the campfire, judging the reactions of everyone faces to Ovias's speech. He sees some faces in quiet agreement with Ovias, but not everyone wholeheartedly agrees with the Dwarf to the letter. Gil, staring again at Ovias, makes his two hands into a single ball, and then throws them apart, as though an accusation.

Turning to look at Epswitch, Gil points at the Halfling, and then points his thumb over his shoulder "Let's Go". Gil looks to Mara, and gives her an encouraging smile, muted by his pained countenance. He looks to Maria, points to the woods, and nods - as an invitation. Gil then turns, and heavily walks away.

He goes to collect his things, two days of food from the berries he and Maria had picked, and a piece of cloth for tenting, and then trudges off into the woods towards the pond where Epswitch has his tent.

To Imbrallius If you come to stop me from taking those items, you'll need to leave the circle to do so. If you do, I'll leave without an argument or the items
To Epswitch/Maria/Others who might leave If you also leave in protest, I will assist in carrying gear, etc.

[Sicarius]

To Gil
If you go near the items, Imbrallius will shout a warning at you, something along the lines of: "Do not steal anything. Theft is a serious crime." If you continue, he will ask a few people to come with him and stop the theft of items.

[Zed's Dead]

Janson Himmerhardt, venerable human writer

Janson rises slowly from the ground where he has been sitting cross-legged for the entire length of the meeting. Some might have thought he was sleeping, he was so still, but he is surprisingly energetic when he rises.

He calls out to those leaving.

Wait! We can still make this right!

I have listened long, and heard you all. There must be strong leadership here for us to survive. Of that, the majority of us are in agreement.

I believe a leader should serve as someone who senses the general will of the people and uses their support to protect and direct the community.

I am honored by your nominations for leadership. However, I propose another option, besides that of the triumverate. It seems to me that two leaders have already emerged here, and we would be foolish not to support them in their efforts to make this island liveable.

Master Greybeard has a knack for building and working. He naturally organizes those who build and who work. Those who will work are drawn to him because he leads by example.

Mara Herbswife is a kind, caring, and yet strong-willed woman. She has made many necessary decisions already, and she is willing to do what she says she will do. We are also drawn to her for her knowledge and willingness to take a stand for practicality above all else.

My proposition is this: Master Greybeard should make decisions regarding all matters regarding the construction and maintenance of our shelter and any other public works we decide to create or labors we decide to undertake.

Mara Herbswife should make decisions regarding the arrangements of living here in our little community, based on both her knowledge of the body and her knowledge of the heart.

I, myself, do not wish to don the mantle of authority, but I will freely give my advice to any who wish it, whether leader or worker. I will also keep a record of the events of our lives here, as long as I am able.

Janson Himmerhardt sits back in his place, and is silent.

[smartaleq]

To Gil
If you go near the items, Imbrallius will shout a warning at you, something along the lines of: "Do not steal anything. Theft is a serious crime." If you continue, he will ask a few people to come with him and stop the theft of items.

As Gil does not consider the division of food stocks equitably to involved participants to be stealing, he will continue to pack up both his belongings and the two days supply of berries he helped gather with Maria (Note that the two of them had collected food for 3 people while foraging, so Gil would be taking things that he had recently put 'in' to the stocks)

[Grey_Wolf_c]

As Gil does not consider the division of food stocks equitably to involved participants to be stealing, he will continue to pack up both his belongings and the two days supply of berries he helped gather with Maria (Note that the two of them had collected food for 3 people while foraging, so Gil would be taking things that he had recently put 'in' to the stocks)

OOC: Actually, since you failed the aid another check DC10 (you rolled a 2), Maria only collected food for two people, and you were in the way rather than help. At best, and only if she allows it, you'd be right to take one day's worth of food, and that's by stretching the definition of "helped" and "yours":


:smallannoyed: Pardon me. Gil will attempt to [roll0](2) Maria

[smartaleq]

OOC: Actually, since you failed the aid another check DC10 (you rolled a 2), Maria only collected food for two people, and you were in the way rather than help. At best, and only if she allows it, you'd be right to take one day's worth of food, and that's by stretching the definition of "helped" and "yours"

Noted

accompanying could qualify as helped, and as haven't defined the socialist-economy to be "one big pile" or "everyone shares when asked", Gil takes the approach that he brought two rations into the camp, he should leave with similar. I'm hoping this discussion is mooted by another character leaving as well.

[lawful_evil]

Epswitch

Epswitch tries to control a laugh while the fat Dwarf rambles on and on. Once allowed to speak, Epswitch says, "I am hear to voice my opinion, the same as all the others. Are you saying my opinion is not welcome? I'm so glad to see you are open to hearing opposing opinions, that is a mark of a good leader. Oh wait..."

Epswitch raises an eyebrow and says, "True, I did not show up to watch you sleep, but neither did you ever come to watch me sleep. In fact, I spent a week and half helping you and the group with nightly watches, gaining nothing in return. I have choosen to live at what I consider a better location. I have not claimed the land as my own and welcome anyone who wishes to live there. The guard shift was doubled up, so no one was unattended and the guard, if he felt that he was incapable of carrying out his duties should have woken up someone to help."

Epswitch then adds, "We are not in dwarven lands, nor are we in human lands. You have no divine providence or any other acknowledged power to give you the right to command me around. I do not call you king, nor would I call you Arrbitrrerr. You do not know how to consider facts and situations and keep them separate from your feelings and friendships."

Epswitch finally adds, "Finally, I do provide a service. I am willing to trade. Communal societies do not work. Someone always feels slighted. I have some possessions and skills which I am willing to barter. If you anyone needs my help, I am willing to trade. I do not give things away, nor will I just take them even if I think it is right." Epswitch turns to walk away and then adds, "I thank you all for listening. You know my opinion. The group can decide whatever they wish."

Epswitch walks off, back towards the lake. He does swing by the pile of 'found' stuff from the shipwreck. He doesn't take anything, but makes plans to return tomorrow with food to trade.

[edit]
Not to mention risking my life so that y'all can eat pork.

[Lonna]

Janson Himmerhardt, venerable human writer

Janson rises slowly from the ground where he has been sitting cross-legged for the entire length of the meeting. Some might have thought he was sleeping, he was so still, but he is surprisingly energetic when he rises.

He calls out to those leaving.

Wait! We can still make this right!

I have listened long, and heard you all. There must be strong leadership here for us to survive. Of that, the majority of us are in agreement.

I believe a leader should serve as someone who senses the general will of the people and uses their support to protect and direct the community.

I am honored by your nominations for leadership. However, I propose another option, besides that of the triumverate. It seems to me that two leaders have already emerged here, and we would be foolish not to support them in their efforts to make this island liveable.

Master Greybeard has a knack for building and working. He naturally organizes those who build and who work. Those who will work are drawn to him because he leads by example.

Mara Herbswife is a kind, caring, and yet strong-willed woman. She has made many necessary decisions already, and she is willing to do what she says she will do. We are also drawn to her for her knowledge and willingness to take a stand for practicality above all else.

My proposition is this: Master Greybeard should make decisions regarding all matters regarding the construction and maintenance of our shelter and any other public works we decide to create or labors we decide to undertake.

Mara Herbswife should make decisions regarding the arrangements of living here in our little community, based on both her knowledge of the body and her knowledge of the heart.

I, myself, do not wish to don the mantle of authority, but I will freely give my advice to any who wish it, whether leader or worker. I will also keep a record of the events of our lives here, as long as I am able.

Janson Himmerhardt sits back in his place, and is silent.

Mara Herbswife

When Gil smiled at her, encouraging her to join him, Mara had felt as though her heart was being squeezed, threatening to split in two even as the group was splitting. If only Ovias had not been so harsh! she thought in anguish. Though she had agreed with some of what he said, it was too severely delivered. She could understand why Gil was leaving, and half wished she could not. Indecision weighed on her - where did she belong? Where was she more needed? The pressure eased a bit when Master Himmerhardt began to speak, but she could see that the others were not convinced. Her previous reluctance to make speeches forgotten, she stood and addressed those who were preparing to leave the fire, the pain in her voice evident as she spoke on the heels of Master Himmerhardt's words.

"Please, reconsider! I understand that harsh words have been spoken, and once said they cannot be unsaid. But think! Our chances of survival lessen each time one of us leaves. At the very least, if you feel you must go, do not go angrily, unwilling to work with those of us who remain. To make such a decision may truely doom us all.

"I... I cannot go, though my heart cries out. I must remain with the larger group, where my skills are more likely to be needed. Be assured that should any of you who leave be wounded, I will care for you without need of a reward or payment - as I have been caring for all who needed my services since we washed up on this island. Perhaps in time this rift will heal." Turning to the rest of the group, she continued wearily, resignation weighing heavily in each word.

"I have made my opinions known. If you wish me to have some sort of power or take some sort of leadership, so be it. Otherwise I will simply continue as I have, giving advice and aid where I can."

With that Mara sat back down, burying her face in her hands.

[Daryk]

Tano

When Ovias started talking about hanging watchmen who didn't show up to their watch, Tano's face darkened. He waited for the conversation to die again, then added, "And this is exactly why I oppose formal leadership. And not to say what the halfling did was right, but it was the previous watch that left without a proper relief that is truly at fault. Now, no offense to Master Himmerhardt, but I've seen a few more seasons than he, and the path he recommends I fear will not work. I for one will not undertake anything I judge to be ill advised. Giving anyone here formal authority over me is one of those things. If that makes me an outcast, so be it. I can gather food for myself if I must."

I may have been that previous watch, but being that we skipped to the morning before I realized what was going on, I didn't make a retroactive post.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Tano

When Ovias started talking about hanging watchmen who didn't show up to their watch, Tano's face darkened. He waited for the conversation to die again, then added, "And this is exactly why I oppose formal leadership. And not to say what the halfling did was right, but it was the previous watch that left without a proper relief that is truly at fault. Now, no offense to Master Himmerhardt, but I've seen a few more seasons than he, and the path he recommends I fear will not work. I for one will not undertake anything I judge to be ill advised. Giving anyone here formal authority over me is one of those things. If that makes me an outcast, so be it. I can gather food for myself if I must."

I may have been that previous watch, but being that we skipped to the morning before I realized what was going on, I didn't make a retroactive post.

"Which is prrecisely why no-one is suggesting forrmal leaderrship, elf", answers Ovias, "but centrral coorrdination. Say Imbrrallius is chosen, and he deterrmines that to get housing constrructed two must worrk on the constrruction whilst thrree otherrs prrovide those two with materrials, and at least fourr otherrs gatherr food. You arre frree to choose to help orr not, and so long as you do not, say, prromise to help and then do not like the halfling did, noone will think less of you."

"Let us be clearr about this: we arre in a verry big mess. Some of you arre optimistic about otherr inhabitants to the island being frriendly, but a society that burrns humanoids and leaves theirr bones uninterred does not sound frriendly to me. We have no way off this place by sea as farr as we know, and we don't even know if we arre in an island orr not. In the best of times, to continue to feed ourrselves we need about a thirrd of ourr numberrs, and if we also want to everr get out of this place, the rrest of us need to be coorrdinated. Without a centrral figurre, we will continue like the last week to each do ourr own thing, accomplishing close to nothing. If instead we each go ourr own way, like severral herre seem rready to do, we will all be busy trrying to gatherr food and we will neverr leave."

"I have made my choice, and I will help as I have done so farr, to crreate as much as I can to allow us to surrvive. I, unlike the halfling, ask for no payment norr expect anything in rreturn. I rrequirre food, of courrse, but if therre is not enough I can prrovide forr myself. I have trried to do what is best forr the grroup, but without someone prroviding overview guidance, all my efforts, single as they arre, will be forr naught. Whetherr that perrson is me or Mara or Imbrrallius is of little rrelevance, so long as that perrson will, indeed, trry to do what is best."

"It is, and has always been , yourr choice. But it is a choice you must make, because if not we will all die herre, neverr again seeing anything but whateverr dangerrs this savage land brrings"

Tired from the fruitless discusion, Ovias walks away from the fire. Picking up one of the stones he had worked so far to locate, he starts to shape it. He had been optimistic about the others at the start, but clearly the fundamental human -and elven- tendency to individuality was returning. It was up to them, and Ovias was certain he could do no more than what he had already done to try and make them see what had to be done.

[Zed's Dead]

to Imbrallius:
Janson walks over to Imbrallius.

For what it's worth, I am quite impressed with your willingness and ability to take care of so many details with such alacrity. I'm even more impressed with the way you dealt with Epswitch. This is no place or time for selfishness. He'll come around when his belly is empty and he hears bumps in the night.

I'd hope that whether you become leader or no, I see your abilities and mark them as some of the most important for our daily survival. Please let me know if I can help you in any way. I have many parchment sheets, and if we bound them somehow, they could be a kind of ledger for you.

[Daryk]

Tano

As Ovias walked off, Tano said, "Well, I for one haven't heard a single 'coordination' proposal designed to get us off this island, and I won't agree to one without examining it. If anyone has such a plan, let's hear it. I think we have sufficient shelter, and have proven we can bring in enough food to feed ourselves. That leaves only the leaving."

[jagadaishio]

Maria stands and states, "I think that Mara and Ovias would be the best leaders, but only if they consult with each other before decisions are made. I'm going to spend most of this week exploring with Gil. I will sleep in a tree until I think that one camp or the other is in the right. I will still provide information to both camps and excess food to the larger camp, but I'm more at home in the forest, away from conflict. Good night to you all."

Before leaving, Maria lightens her pack by dumping all 318 of her copper pieces down next to the camp fire. "In case anyone ever makes a forge."

"I will still take nightly watch guarding the beach camp. I assume it will remain largest."

Maria finds as large of a tree as she can between the camp on the beach and the one at the fresh water. In her free time when she isn't hunting, foraging, and exploring, she'll be building herself a tree house lean-to up in the tree. She'll help Gil assemble one in the same tree or a nearby one if he chooses to be unaligned as she is.

[Zed's Dead]

Janson Himmerhardt, venerable human writer
LISTEN!

The voice eminating from the aging man belies his frame. He begins walking around the circle, calling out to all within earshot, even those who have already walked away.

ALL OF YOU MUST LISTEN TO YOURSELVES! DIVIDED, WE DIE! Only together will we have a chance to live! If natives attack, WE MUST BE READY! If foul weather force us to ration or extend our foraging, WE MUST BE READY! If we are to spend months, years, or even decades here, WE MUST PREPARE! NOBODY'S FEELINGS ARE IMPORTANT! It is only the needs of the whole which must be considered.

I nominated Greybeard and Herbswife not because I want them to dominate me! I chafe at the idea of someone--anyone--telling me what to do! But if we don't band together and make ourselves safe, WE WILL DIE HERE!

I have already lived my threescore and ten. But most of you haven't! And you, elf. Considering the fact that your people are renowned for their incredible perception, you haven't heard the tone of my speech--I believe we need leaders. Serving at the WILL of the people. Coordinating tasks that the survivors of the fire see a need to do! Are you going to tell me that the elves have no leadership? That every elf is an island unto himself? No! Your tree-houses would never have been built, were that the case. You'd still be hunting in the woods, as we are, living in makeshift huts.

YOU MUST ASK YOURSELF THIS: DO YOU WANT CIVILIZATION, OR DO YOU WANT SAVAGERY?

DO YOU WANT TO SURVIVE, OR DO YOU WANT TO DIE?

DO YOU WANT TO BE PEOPLE OR ANIMALS?

At that, Janson dropped to his knees, his breath coming in quick gasps.

[Daryk]

Tano

Tano looked down on the wheezing human. In a cold voice, he said, "Speak not of that which you don't know, human. I will agree to any proposal I judge to be for the end of getting us off this island. Your hysterical raving is less than helpful. I will say it again: if anyone has a proposal to get us out of here, speak! Raving about savagery is itself savage. We should talk about what must be done, not who will decide what. The who is all of us, together. If one has an idea, bring it forth so it can be discussed. Not dictated. The dwarf believes we must build in stone. That bespeaks staying here. I say we must leave, and that means a ship, not a castle."

[lawful_evil]

{{ Hey, stop bad mouthing the halfling. At this point in the timeline he has done everything he signed up to. He doesn't stop doing watches for several days yet. }}

{{ That and he has contributed some food(not much), helped with the piggy thing, offered sage advice, etc all while taking nothing away from the group. He has used no resources(food/wood/etc). }}

[Zed's Dead]

Janson Himmerhardt

Janson's breathing has slowed a bit. He speaks a beautiful, refined Elvish:

/Why do you assume I am ignorant of your ways? I have spent time with your people, as an honored guest, and I have heard your stories. I have met many elves with more years than you, and certainly more wisdom. I called out to bring the young ones back together, not because I am a savage. Tell me, truthfully: did you or did you not have a leader in your villiage? Have you or have you not seen the benefits of cool, levelheaded, prompt decisionmaking in your life? You call for a plan at a moment when the entire group is going their separate ways? You may have seen more winters than me, elf, but life's lessons are slow to seep inside your thick skull.

But, if, on the other hand, you can be civil to me, I'll be quite interested in your idea of boat-building./

[Daryk]

Tano

Tano stiffened a bit when Himmerhardt spoke elvish, but replied in common: "If you're going to insult me, do so in a manner all can understand. And if you want to call the others back do so plainly. You are correct on but one point. The elves do have leaders. But among a group as small as this, consensus rules. You speak of knowing the ways of my people. I say you have seen only a small piece of our society. And if you want me to be civil to you, I say I spoke not the first uncivil word. None of us here are 'animals'."

[Zed's Dead]

Janson Himmerhardt

I...am sincerely sorry for the insult. Of course, I am not an elf, and I may not claim knowledge that is not mine. such was not my intent.

I am angry and frustrated, and I believe that this meeting did more harm than good. Not one meaningful solution to any problem was agreed upon, though many were suggested.

We are not animals, but we are acting like children. Is this what we should do when our very survival is at stake?

Again, please accept my apologies.

Janson walks over to the fire, grabs a burning stick to use as a torch, and walks into the woods away from the fire and from the camp.

[Daryk]

Tano

As Janson bent down to pick up a torch, Tano said, "Apology accepted, Master Himmerhardt. Before you go, I would ask that you stay. Unless it was just another rhetorical device, you seem to think our survival is at stake. I have seen no evidence of this. We have shelter, and sufficient sustenance. What imminent threats do you think we face? Certainly, there may be hostile natives, or monsters, but they do not seem close at hand. Did you see something up the beach that led you to this conclusion? I see about us the means of our escape: there are many trees near the sea. What do you see?"

[Lonna]

Tano

Tano stiffened a bit when Himmerhardt spoke elvish, but replied in common: "If you're going to insult me, do so in a manner all can understand. And if you want to call the others back do so plainly. You are correct on but one point. The elves do have leaders. But among a group as small as this, consensus rules. You speak of knowing the ways of my people. I say you have seen only a small piece of our society. And if you want me to be civil to you, I say I spoke not the first uncivil word. None of us here are 'animals'."

Mara Herbswife

Mara was trying to stay out of the argument, but it's increasingly hostile tone put her on edge. When even Tano - the elf whom she had previously considered a cool head - began berating Master Himmerhardt, she stood abruptly, keeping her eyes down.

"I have had enough," she said firmly. She raised her head and looked around. Those who knew her back home would have been shocked to see the uncharacteristic anger blazing in her eyes. "Is this what we have come to?" she asked bitterly. "This meeting was intended to unite our efforts, to bring us together, yet all it has done is divide us. I will no longer participate in such a counterproductive action. Perhaps Gil had the right of it. If all we can do is hurl insults and accusations at eachother, perhaps it is better if we each go our own way. I stand by what I said before; I will stay with the larger group. However, I will not, by all that is good and holy, I will not watch our small group of survivors tear itself apart. Good evening." With a final emphasis on the last phrase, Mara turned her back on the fire and went to take her customary position for the first watch without speaking another word.

[Zed's Dead]

Janson Himmerhardt, venerable human writer


Ah. Yes. There must be some sort of fire wielding natives on this island. Otherwise, the burned bones would not have been left at that "altar." I realize they might not be dangerous, but considering the way Master Greybeard and the "hobbit" are acting, I don't think it's stretching the facts at all to assume that we should be in readiness to defend ourselves against attack.

I have faced an unseen enemy before, but it was always with my weapon in my hand and my fellow soldier by my side. There is no discipline here, and I perceive that as dangerous.

Now, you tell me--how does one go about making boats?

(edit) Janson turned his full attention to Mara when she began speaking, and once he saw that Mara was headed into the woods in a huff, he put up his hand.

Sorry, friend elf, but our further communications will have to wait until morning. I must follow the lady. I owe her much.

Janson takes his burning stick with him and heads off as best he can to follow Mara.

[Lonna]

Janson takes his burning stick with him and heads off as best he can to follow Mara.

Mara Herbswife - Near bonfire but out of earshot

When Janson caught up with Mara he found her breathing deeply of the cool evening air, the anger and frustration drained from her visage to reveal a weary sadness, tinged with resignation. The expression made her appear far older than her 19 years. Seeing him, she forced a rather pitiful smile onto her face.

"I'm sorry about that," she said softly. "I lost my temper. That almost never happens, but I always hate it when it does."

[Sicarius]

Imbrallius

The clerk hated conflict. He was not afraid to confront someone when the matter was clear-cut, but this was the legendary dwarven stubbornness with Epswitch's characteristic behavior. Then Mara, Ovias, Jason all walked off."Well, this has quickly gone downhill." He followed Gil to see exactly what he was taking.

Gil:
Imbrallius will allow you to take only what is marked on your sheet as yours. The food you put in, he will state that you were working for the community, and you benefitted from everyone else's labor. He is more than happy to allow you to bargain that your worth was more than any other person's.

[Zed's Dead]

Janson Himmerhardt

Lady, you have been a paragon of patience and virtuous, if not downright heroic, action these weeks. I am amazed by your resolve and am inspired by your courage. Even a heroine must let her guard down from time to time. You're human. You deserve to act like one from time to time.

I've never known a woman of your strength of resolve.

Here, Janson's bright grin can be seen, even in the torchlight.

Despite my age, I know I would have remembered.

Janson looks up at the stars and exhales slowly towards the sky.

I, too, have acted out my frustration. I don't know why I thought shouting into the dark after our lost companions would change anything. The elf was right. I was acting a savage. Age cools the blood, true, but I certainly don't yet feel ice in the corridors of my body.

This anger could simply be our frustration at being without control of any aspect of our lives since washing up on this strange shore. If we could return home, I'd imagine a good feast or fair day would be enough to return us all to rights...but it might be some time before we can do that.

Perhaps we'll have cause for a celebration of our own sometime soon. We can work toward it, at least.

[Lonna]

Mara Herbswife

Master Himmerhardt's words brought a more genuine smile to Mara's face. "Thank you, Sir," she said quietly. "Perhaps we cannot convince our companions to return, but at least we can continue our discussions with those who remain. Later I may speak to the others, try to persuade them to return. For now, will you seek out Master Imbrallius? I believe he followed Gil to make sure only Gil's own possessions were taken from the communal supplies. I'll see if I can't persuade Ovias to return to the fire. Then perhaps we can actually decide something constructive."

Returning to the fire briefly, Mara took up a branch to use as a torch. Looking around at those still sitting by the fire she said, "I apologize for my outburst a moment ago. If anyone else feels bound either to follow Gil and Master Shortoe or to join Maria, now may be the best time. If, on the other hand, you wish to remain with the rest of us, please be patient a little while longer. Master Himmerhardt and I will return shortly, and then we can hopefully come to some useful decisions rather than fighting amongst ourselves."

By the light of the makeshift torch, Mara sought out Ovias and addressed him in the Dwarvish tongue, her words more formal than previously. <Your handling of the situation lacked grace,> she informed him. <When spite is returned for spite, none profit. Nevertheless, what is done is done. Will you not return to the fire? Tempers have cooled somewhat - let us attempt to keep whole that which threatens to break, and has already cracked.>

[Zed's Dead]

Janson Himmerhardt

As you wish, Lady.

Himmerhardt heads into the brush (after re-igniting his makeshift torch) to look for the recordkeeper Imbrallius.

[smartaleq]

Imbrallius

The clerk hated conflict. He was not afraid to confront someone when the matter was clear-cut, but this was the legendary dwarven stubbornness with Epswitch's characteristic behavior. Then Mara, Ovias, Jason all walked off."Well, this has quickly gone downhill." He followed Gil to see exactly what he was taking.

Gil:
Imbrallius will allow you to take only what is marked on your sheet as yours. The food you put in, he will state that you were working for the community, and you benefitted from everyone else's labor. He is more than happy to allow you to bargain that your worth was more than any other person's.

In response to Imbrallius insisting I not take any community gear, Gil simply shrugs. He nods good night to you, and sets off into the woods.

In response to Maria's suggestion of setting up between the two sites, in a tree, Gil seems uncomfortable. Having spend much of the last 10 days in his company, you recognize that he seems agitated while setting up his bedroll about 20 feet from the halfling's lean-to. Maria also notices that he does not unpack his gear, but keeps everything tightly bundled and ready for travel.

[jagadaishio]

In response to Maria's suggestion of setting up between the two sites, in a tree, Gil seems uncomfortable. Having spend much of the last 10 days in his company, you recognize that he seems agitated while setting up his bedroll about 20 feet from the halfling's lean-to. Maria also notices that he does not unpack his gear, but keeps everything tightly bundled and ready for travel.

Maria raises an eyebrow and hands Gil her dagger for writing in the dirt. "What's the matter?"

[smartaleq]

Response in PM

[Sicarius]

Imbrallius

Once he is sure that Gil will not be taking anything that doesn't belong to him, Imbrallius lets out a deep sigh. "Does everyone want to be king of the pile, but dead?" When Jason approaches, Imbrallius keeps himself composed. "Good evening, Master Himmerhardt. I think I need to get back to the meeting." Imbrallius begins to walk back to the fire.

[Zed's Dead]

Janson Himmerhardt

Right...

[TwoCents]

Roostin

OOC:

I am also posting this in the IC thread. I can't keep track of what's where and when any more and I wanted to get this out there.

Continuity:Like some of the rest of you, I have trouble with the continuity in this game. Until THE DM clarifies the issue of how it is going to work, we are going to have to muddle along. If players have the opportunity to post multiple times in a day, and choose to post several successive actions, they must expect that either a) no action which involves other players happens, or b) there will be backtracking and realignment enough to make Dr. Who dizzy.

I realize that it can be very boring to post and then wait for someone to respond, and then post and then wait. That is the primal curse of this type of gaming. It is veryy slowwwwww. But it is the only fair way to allow all the people to actually participate.

If the DM wants me to post every day, I will examine my schedule and decide if it is possible, and when it is possible. I do not, have not, and will not have the time in any conceivable future to post several times a day to a series of different actions. If that is what the game needs from its players, I need to leave now. Part of the reason I haven't posted is that every time I come on with twenty minutes or so to post, I need more than that time just to parse through all the other posts on all the threads.

Location:
In my ignorance, I thought everyone had done what I though was obvious -- left the beach. We have a water source, which we can either lay claim to as upright bipedal tool users, or argue ownership with random wild animals on an nightly basis. We can live on the beach/treeline and be subject to every major storm, or we can build our makeshift shelter in the trees and have additional weather protection. I thought it was a no brainer, and in fact, somehow thought that's what we had done. Obviously, I was wrong. Had I realized my efforts last week were to help build a house in the sand, I would have said something.

Metagaming:
I had a long section about Epswitch and Ovias, but it all boiled down to: quit picking on the halfling because his sheet says LE.

Having tossed all that gasoline on the fire, on to IC actions and another barrel of Premium:

Roostin stood up and spoke, "Ah need to say some things. First of all, Ah have no intention of living here any longer than Ah have to. If Ah am going to spend a year building something, it's going to be a boat. In fact, 'fore I do that, Ah'm gonna take mah chances in one of them lifeboats over there. With a sail, some water, and fishhooks, Ah figure Ah have a chance. But Ah am not spending the next two years building a dang stone tower on this dang island. Y'all can help me, and have a place on the boat, or y'all can throw me out and ah'll work till Ah drop."

"Second, why are y'all living on the dang beach? Do you want to be washed away by the next big storm? Ah thought we was moving to the water, and ah think we need to pick a spot we can defend from both critters and the weather and just do that."

"Third, why are y'all so sure that hilltop is all about 'human sacrifice'? Didn't y'all want to cremate our people not ten days ago? Mebbe whatever lives here does that too. Ah'm not saying don't be ready if'n something wants to have steak a la Roosty; Ah'll be ready to fight, but Ah don't see why y'all getting your tights twisted. Ah don't think we should live there, though, until we find out more about it."

"Fourth, ah do think we need to figure out who's in charge, but Ah don't think we figured it out yet. Maybe the elf is right and we can work it out among us a job at a time, sort of 'you do this and you do that' kind of thing. But Ah have to say, Ah have a real problem with picking one of y'all to be captain cause Ah don't think any one person here is up to the job. Ah include mahself in that. Ah know Ah cain't lead you folks, mostly 'cause Ah don't have the patience for all this talkety talk talk, but Ah can build you a boat to get off this sand heap, Ah tell you whut."

"And it seems to me that if we're gonna have a commitee of four, we can just have a committee of twenty and listen to everybody. Yeah, Ah know that in a crisis there has to be somebody in charge, but we can just do that as part of the jobs. I nominate Zev for head of the guard and um, well me for in charge of building the boat. Mara should be in charge of keeping us alive, and we should listen to her unless we're under attack. Then we do what Zev says. Imbrallius is good at keeping track of stuff, and Jensen can keep track of whut happens and who knows whut. Maria should be in charge of hunting, and Ovias can be in charge of building the shelter that ALL OF US decide on. Ah know you're gonna think Ah'm silly, but Ah think Epswitch should be in charge of distributin' stuff. He ain't never cheated nobody, and he don't care if people like him so he ain't gonna give out more that a fair share to somebody 'cause they're his friends."

"Oh, yeah. Ain't nobody hanging nobody. Y'all ain't never cared what happened to that there halfling and now you notice? How come y'all didn't rouse the camp when he never showed up? You never figured maybe he was hurt or dead all alone up there next to the chickens?"

"Sixth, clerky guy over there needs to get a grip. If'n everything I put IN the pile has to stay there even if Ah need it back, then maybe Ah won't be putting anything into the pile, and maybe Ah need all mah stuff back now. Ah guess Ah'll just trade with Gil and Ep for food and you can count all your stuff over and over every day."

"Finally, if'n you want to find out what's down the coast of the island, what say Ah take three or four of y'all and we row around the dang island and just look? Give me some time, and Ah can rig a sail to help, although we're still gonna have to do a lot of rowing."

[Yeril]

As Roostin begins his speech, joseph sits and listens, Up until the point where he begins suggesting maria to be in charge of hunters.

"Hold on a minute, no offense to the Girl, shes preety good an' all, but I've years of experience over her, prob'ly more than shes lived, and the meat I put in the cookpot, compared to the handful of berries she brought back shows this." He frowns slightly, but then shakes his head.

"Thats not Important, what is important is that we come to a decision by tonight, preferably one that gets us off the beach and to work on a more suitable shelter. You know my thoughts and opinions, now good night" he nods, and heads out into the darkness to oncemore continue his hunt.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Roostin

Continuity:If the DM wants me to post every day, I will examine my schedule and decide if it is possible, and when it is possible. I do not, have not, and will not have the time in any conceivable future to post several times a day to a series of different actions. If that is what the game needs from its players, I need to leave now. Part of the reason I haven't posted is that every time I come on with twenty minutes or so to post, I need more than that time just to parse through all the other posts on all the threads.
Noone expects you to port every day. As described in OOC thread, you can get away with posting once a week and still participate further when you feel like it. However, sparse posting is not conductive to certain parts of this game, like the quests or decision making. If you don't want to post often, you can post once to say what you are doing during the next n days, or even just give generic "I'll do whatever X tells me to, so long as it doesn't risk my life"


Location:
In my ignorance, I thought everyone had done what I though was obvious -- left the beach. We have a water source, which we can either lay claim to as upright bipedal tool users, or argue ownership with random wild animals on an nightly basis. We can live on the beach/treeline and be subject to every major storm, or we can build our makeshift shelter in the trees and have additional weather protection. I thought it was a no brainer, and in fact, somehow thought that's what we had done. Obviously, I was wrong. Had I realized my efforts last week were to help build a house in the sand, I would have said something.
We have yet to build anything, in the beach, the treeline or elsewhere. Ipswitch has a "tent" (no idea where he got canvas from, but nevermind) and the rest sleep in a makeshift "shack" made from the boat and canvas stretched over a wooden frame. We have not yet started to build anything at all permanent -indeed, half the purpose of this meeting was to decide where to build the bloody thing - and I am fairly certain that not a single person has even hinted at building in the beach at any point. I've no idea where you're pulling that out of. The options are, and have always been: build close to the water, likely turning drinkable water into undrinkable, build away from the water, by making a clearing (since we have found none) or finding a cave. All the other "options" are very nice strawmen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strawmen) you and others have pulled out from where the sun doesn't shine.


Metagaming:
I had a long section about Epswitch and Ovias, but it all boiled down to: quit picking on the halfling because his sheet says LE.
I must be mistaken, since I'm fairly certain I clearly stated the reasons Ovias was angry at Ipswitch - abandoning the watch without telling anyone (Ovias wouldn't have cared less if Ipswitch had told him he was not going to watch anymore, since he was already predisposed to thinking the worst, but stopping without telling anyone is a different issue), and I have yet to see an argument in his favour that doesn't relay on metagaming reasoning like "I though we were close to the chikens". But, as I say, I must be mistaken. I'm sure that twocents somehow knows better than reasoning skills and has determined that, just like Ovias somehow suggested building a castle in the beach, he must have somehow made Ipswitch post that thing about abandoning the watch so he could pick on him because of some random aligment issues.[/sarcasm]

Look, think of me what you want, do whatever the hell you want in this game, but crossing the line to putting words in my mouth - or thoughts in my head - I am not going to take gracefully. You have clearly not bothered doing any more than briefly scan the posts. You're busy. I can understand you not taking the time. But giving *me* lessons without bothering to actually reading what has been going on, that's beyond pale. I am not, nor have I ever, picked on Epswitch for whatever he has as aligment in the sheet, since I don't understand aligments. I have always responded to his actions.


Mara Herbswife
<Your handling of the situation lacked grace,> she informed him. <When spite is returned for spite, none profit. Nevertheless, what is done is done. Will you not return to the fire? Tempers have cooled somewhat - let us attempt to keep whole that which threatens to break, and has already cracked.>

Ovias "Grey" Greybeard (http://www.thetangledweb.net/addon.php?addon=Profiler&page=view_char&cid=8590) - Dwarven mason, smith and engineer journeyman

<I am a dwarf, and an ungraceful one even by the loose standards of my race. I cannot deliver honneyed words or tell people what they want to hear. I am not, in short, a politician. I see reality, and tell it how I see it. I may be heavy handed, but you are all treating this like some nice holiday that we will be delivered from. That is the worst kind of hubrish, and tonight has shown as much. I will go back to the fire, but I sincerely distrust the ability of this group to understand what our situation is at this point>

Returning to the fire in time to hear the words of the sailor does little to improve Ovias' humour.
"A boat? That's yourr idea? Humpf. We have a small lifeboat that sits 8 people, with no rroom forr waterr orr food and over 20 people to sit in it, all of which rrequirre both. A biggerr boat will rrequirre more than wood: irron nails, which we have prrecious few, tarr and experrt knowledge, and morre I don't even know about. Even if you arre a good carrpenterr - although you look as grreen as I am - being good is not enough: you need masterr carrpenters worrking through months to ensurre the keel is waterrtight enough, even morre so without tarr! Also, a boat big enough to carry us all will rrequirre at least a basic dock, too. Now, you may be thinking of taking the boat, yourr two best frriends and leave us all behind. That plan would worrk, had we not turrned the boat into a shelterr, likely destroying its sea worrthiness, but I hope you underrstand that I will not be helping with that"

"I want to get off this place too. But to do that, we do need to rrebuild a small piece of civilization. We need a prroperr place to sleep, and a smithy, and likely otherr facilities I am not yet awarre of - maybe even docks. And if we each decide to do only what we will, we will neverr get anything done. You seem to think we achieved grreat things in the last two weeks, but this is what we did: we collected some baubles and knick-knacks, and 10 units of wood and 15 of stone. Afterr two weeks, we do not have enough for even the most simple of boats, and yet you seem to think that at this rrate, we will accomplish something. Eitherr someone coorrdinates, or we will worrk at crross purrposes. Those arre the only choices."

"Also, I have hearrd many of you make fun of my stone gatherring, calling it "building a castle" and other such ridiculous notions. I am a dwarf. I build in stone fasterr than a human builds in wood. If it cannot get through to yourr heads that when building something on land, stone is going to be betterr than wood because it will be done fasterr, and will save wood for those times when stone is unadvisable, I am afrraid that I am fighting a lost cause and we will all die herre. We need shelterr, and I'd like it to be a cave, but lacking a cave, we must build in the forrest, and since I suspect it will fall to me to build it, it makes sense that I build in those materrials I am most familiarr with."

[Sicarius]

Imbrallius

Imbrallius makes his way back to the fire at the tail end of Roostin's little speech.

"Let me explain why I stated that Master Gil could not get an equivalent amount of food that he placed in. He benefitted from everyone's labor on the things he did not do. This is not a matter of him inputting material and receiving nothing in return. He put in his efforts, as did we all, and everyone received the same amount. He slept in our temporary housing, just as we ate some of the food he brought back. Now, that he disagrees with Master Greybeard's outburst, he wants to get his input back after he has already benefitted. I can not, in good conscience, consider that fair to the rest of us, including yourself, Master Roostin. Would you find it fair if I contributed nothing, yet received everything? His own personal property is his, and so I allowed him to take it, but I cannot allow him to receive something for nothing. If that happens, I foresee starvation and anarchy."

"Now, if the majority wishes him to have his contribution back, I will gladly submit to the will of the people. Master Roostin, I believe you echo a common sentiment. We all want to get off this island. But in order to do that, we'll need shelter and food. No one wants you to build a boat until you die. But when we leave, I want to ensure that we are not taking a wild chance by packing us in like sardines on a tiny keelboat with a week's worth of provisions. We need to work together to escape, and in good faith, that means we need to keep everyone together. I am not trying to malign or marginalize anyone, including Master Shortoe. But I know that organization is key to getting off this island faster, and that means we need to have a forum for discussion, and not try to do everything on our own."

[Grey_Wolf_c]

With the flame having long since been reduced to embers, Ovias finishes speaking. A chill wind coming off the water reminds everyone of how late it is, and those assembled dissipate and prepare for bed. The discussion still hangs heavy in the air, and everyone has much to think about.



OOC: From now on, no speeches are assumed to address the group, if you want to continue discussions, do it in PMs amongst a few instead of this thread.
Hopefully the time-warps work themselves out by week 3. I just want to say that this RP was frickin' phenomenal. We essentially have a dozen people across the world writing a community story that is both compelling and fun. Kudos all!

OOC:While I agree it is likely a good place to stop (although having got the last word, I'm biased), I'm somewhat out of sorts with you calling the shots - that should really be the DM. Then again, storyteller has been MIA for a while, so you as the thread starter are a good second choice.

Re: RP, I agree, this is being great fun, although I'm starting to fear that playing a CHA 6 dwarf is going to have serious and permanent effects on my reputation. Several people seem unable to tell apart Ovias from Grey Wolf at this point.

Edit: the post I'm answering to seems to have disapeared...
Edit two: nevermind, it seems it did some time-travel of its own. See below. At least I can now say I still stand by my feeling it is a good place to stop, even when I did not get the last word :)

[smartaleq]

Procedural OOC:

I'm going to insist we end this discussion by 24hrs from this post time. We should have decent decisions/indecision made, and the longer we discuss, the more difficult it is to stay semi-chronological.


With the flame having long since been reduced to embers, Ovias finishes speaking. A chill wind coming off the water reminds everyone of how late it is, and those assembled dissipate and prepare for bed. The discussion still hangs heavy in the air, and everyone has much to think about.



OOC: From now on, no speeches are assumed to address the group, if you want to continue discussions, do it in PMs amongst a few instead of this thread. This post was deleted and replaced because it ninja'd Imbrallius, and it should be after.
Hopefully the time-warps work themselves out by week 3. I just want to say that this RP was frickin' phenomenal. We essentially have a dozen people across the world writing a community story that is both compelling and fun. Kudos all!

[Sicarius]

Agreed, the RP'ing was nice. Really a more mature Lord of the Flies-esque feel

[Zed's Dead]

I think we're all mature enough to know that the characters we play are just that--characters--parts of ourselves or others, but not ourselves. Survivor and Lost ain't got nothin' on this, bizatches!