PDA

View Full Version : BoEF Builds



Pages : [1] 2 3

Fax Celestis
2008-03-04, 06:11 PM
Yes, yes, I spelled that correctly. We're talking the BoEF (Book of Erotic Fantasy) here.

We're all adults, and we all know the rules of the forum, so please refrain from the "you got your sex in my D&D/you got your D&D in my sex" complaints: this is not a bad-but-funny Reeses' Peanut Butter Cups parody (http://goats.com/archive/980313.html).

I'm interested in hearing about what people think about the mechanical aspects of the book. Are the classes and PrCs worthwhile? Are any of the feats interesting? Are there any particularly potent spells or spell combos? I have several players interested in introducing this book to the game and I want to know what I should watch out for and/or what I should encourage, beef up, or warn against.

Rachel Lorelei
2008-03-04, 06:19 PM
Sorry, Fax. I can't really take the book seriously enough to actually build with it.

Serpent
2008-03-04, 06:21 PM
I always thought druids got a lot of cool RP stuff from it.

Fax Celestis
2008-03-04, 06:24 PM
Sorry, Fax. I can't really take the book seriously enough to actually build with it.

Really? I'm getting quite a different impression reading through it. For a book about Sex In D&D, it's remarkably laid-back, well thought-out, and very much geared against "zomgelftits". It handles sexuality in a mature manner--which, considering what it could have been is remarkable.

Of course, it doesn't help that one of it's authors is one of my favorite designers: Gwendolyn Kestrel.

Lord Lorac Silvanos
2008-03-04, 06:25 PM
Are there any particularly potent spells or spell combos?

Liar's Curse seems quite potent...

Sorry Fax, I could not help it.
I think there is some potential for the fertility spells, especially the cursed/blessed ones that will yield a fiendish/celestial offspring, respectively.

Rutee
2008-03-04, 06:26 PM
I.. recall there being one ludicrously useful spell that searches the target /party's/ minds for their deepest sexual fantasy, then when it finds one you like, polymorphs you into that. Almost immediately thereafter, said use? Insinuation into the party. I guess now that there's all these splatbooks with tons of new spells that's not so impressive, come to think of it, but I recall thinking that was pretty handy.

But seriously, the book is for comedy, not for use in builds.. XD


Really? I'm getting quite a different impression reading through it. For a book about Sex In D&D, it's remarkably laid-back, well thought-out, and very much geared against "zomgelftits". It handles sexuality in a mature manner--which, considering what it could have been is remarkable.

Of course, it doesn't help that one of it's authors is one of my favorite designers: Gwendolyn Kestrel.
Yeah, but the humor comes from ponderring the application of the book in your games. At least, most of the people I play wtih would be humorous to ponder that with.

...Also is that the girl who wrote Queen of Wands? Because that was really awesome.

Collin152
2008-03-04, 06:28 PM
I.. recall there being one ludicrously useful spell that searches the target /party's/ minds for their deepest sexual fantasy, then when it finds one you like, polymorphs you into that. Almost immediately thereafter, said use? Insinuation into the party. I guess now that there's all these splatbooks with tons of new spells that's not so impressive, come to think of it, but I recall thinking that was pretty handy.

But seriously, the book is for comedy, not for use in builds.. XD

What school is that spell in?
I know a wizard who needs that spell.

Cuddly
2008-03-04, 06:35 PM
Just think about how bizarre sexuality must be in a world with polymorph and wildshape and alter self.

Collin152
2008-03-04, 06:36 PM
Just think about how bizarre sexuality must be in a world with polymorph and wildshape and alter self.

Bizzare? It just makes things a lot easier.
Damn, now I have a new fantasy. And I'm not talking about swords and sorcery.
Well, not swords and sorcery...
Man, there's just too much to get by.

Fax Celestis
2008-03-04, 06:37 PM
I.. recall there being one ludicrously useful spell that searches the target /party's/ minds for their deepest sexual fantasy, then when it finds one you like, polymorphs you into that. Almost immediately thereafter, said use? Insinuation into the party. I guess now that there's all these splatbooks with tons of new spells that's not so impressive, come to think of it, but I recall thinking that was pretty handy.

But seriously, the book is for comedy, not for use in builds.. XD
Only if you use it in a comedic manner. I can see using it in a noncomedic manner very easily.


Yeah, but the humor comes from ponderring the application of the book in your games. At least, most of the people I play wtih would be humorous to ponder that with.

...Also is that the girl who wrote Queen of Wands? Because that was really awesome.Nah. Gwendolyn Kestrel is, however, rather well-written (http://www.gwendolynkestrel.com/Publications/publications.htm). She's got a lot of widely-considered "very good" books under her belt, not the least of which are the XPH, Frostburn, and ToM.

ColdBrew
2008-03-04, 06:40 PM
Just think about how bizarre sexuality must be in a world with polymorph and wildshape and alter self.
About as bizarre as sexuality on the internet, which is the only place certain acts are possible.

...oh, wow. That's pretty bad.

Rutee
2008-03-04, 06:43 PM
Only if you use it in a comedic manner. I can see using it in a noncomedic manner very easily.

I know like, 3 people I could play a game that used BoEF with and trust to not turn it into an aspect of hilarity, though. I mean, I won't object to it being /possible/, just, when you get past the theory..

AKA_Bait
2008-03-04, 06:45 PM
I dunno about the BoeF. Some of it makes me... unhappy to contemplate in fluff terms and some of it is not well balanced imho. I haven't looked at it in a while (and needed to bleach my eyes) but I recall a feat in there called 'satisfied glow' or something similar which gave a +4 to Charisma so long as the character got some nookie in the last 24 hours that was not balanced.


...Also is that the girl who wrote Queen of Wands? Because that was really awesome.

I'm pretty sure it's not but not 100%. In the Queen of Wands FAQ she says the only Con she has attended is the one in San Diego where she lives. I'm pretty sure that Gwendolyn Kestrel lives in the Seattle area. And no, I'm not a stalker, I just assume she lives near WotC...

Illiterate Scribe
2008-03-04, 06:48 PM
About as bizarre as sexuality on the internet, which is the only place certain acts are possible.

...oh, wow. That's pretty bad.

You got /b/ in my D&D.

RebelRogue
2008-03-04, 06:52 PM
IIRC correctly the Metaphysical Spellshaper might be somewhat potent, especially if you've got a high level healer to back you up. Quite interesting PrC concept as well.

Frosty
2008-03-04, 06:53 PM
This book allows for many, many strange, bizarre, and depending on your outlook, plain hilarious situations or plain disgusting situations. There are prestige classes and options within the book which allows one to give/gain major stat increases for a day by making good enough Perform (Nookie) rolls for 20 minutes or something. If you really stretch the wording and the meaning, you could make a case that the no-sex restriction for a Beloved of Valarian only applies to other creatures from the material plane. Since you summon the Unicorn, technically, having Nookie with the mount isn't banned. So, there could potentially be a BoV/Sacred Prostitute combination to give the Unicorn insane stats.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-04, 06:56 PM
If two players teamcheese by having one take Sacred Prostitute, you effectively double the borkenness of any caster. That says 'nuff about it.

Also, it outlines the true purpose of the monk, which rocks. The monk has a purpose! It is the definitive end of any monk argument.

Also, if you abuse the lulz potential of the book, you can win a game by causing death by laughs (As well as another kind of death by, but let's not get into that).

Illiterate Scribe
2008-03-04, 07:01 PM
If two players teamcheese by having one take Sacred Prostitute, you effectively double the borkenness of any caster. That says 'nuff about it.

Also, it outlines the true purpose of the monk, which rocks. The monk has a purpose! It is the definitive end of any monk argument.

Also, if you abuse the lulz potential of the book, you can win a game by causing death by laughs (As well as another kind of death by, but let's not get into that).

Still, it's got nothing on form of doom.

Four tentacles.

:smallamused:

Frosty
2008-03-04, 07:03 PM
Also, it outlines the true purpose of the monk, which rocks. The monk has a purpose! It is the definitive end of any monk argument.

Are you referring to the fact that a Monk can't contract and can't spread any disease, or the fact that a Monk has Flurry of Blows?

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-04, 07:04 PM
Pity that, if I read the wording correct, you can't get power points back. Hey, it would be the perfect payback!


Though for that purpose, I can one up it: Carrion crawler. Even MORE tentacles, and with paralysis, for the kinky!

Edit: Better, frosty. Six words: Tongue Of The Sun And Moon.

Frosty
2008-03-04, 07:05 PM
Better, frosty. Six words: Tongue Of The Sun And Moon.

So Monks can talk dirty in all languages known to man (and some not known to man!)

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-04, 07:06 PM
Tack on mindflayer, polymorph and you get...


Oh, great agnostic gods, I'm munchkining Naughty Tentacles!

Frosty
2008-03-04, 07:07 PM
I wonder if you can get some extra ring slots with BoEF equipment...

Rutee
2008-03-04, 07:08 PM
This is why I don't consider BoEF to be a valid book for games.

Collin152
2008-03-04, 07:08 PM
Edit: Better, frosty. Six words: Tongue Of The Sun And Moon.

That's why succubi have a Tongues ability, right?

Indon
2008-03-04, 07:09 PM
Edit: Better, frosty. Six words: Tongue Of The Sun And Moon.

Also, monks are equally capable with all parts of their body.

Edit: In terms of unarmed strikes, of course.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-04, 07:10 PM
Right. You nailed.

On a side, note, now shamelessly embracing the munchkinism, imagine the fun you could have with a planar shepherd. 10:1 ratio, anyone?


Note to self: I have a spectacular "Derail a Thread" Skill bonus.

streakster
2008-03-04, 07:10 PM
Fax, I hope you didn't want a serious discussion, 'cause you ain't gettin' one round these parts...

Well, actually, it seems fairly OK, but needed to be proofread more. Too many unintentional exploits - the CO boards would have a field day.

Rutee
2008-03-04, 07:11 PM
That's why succubi have a Tongues ability, right?

No, no, that's for other reasons that you can have explained to you when you're older.

Frosty
2008-03-04, 07:18 PM
Rutee, your new sig image is very cute as well! I like it. And I myself would be ok with using the book in my games if allt he players are mature enough.

Collin152
2008-03-04, 07:19 PM
No, no, that's for other reasons that you can have explained to you when you're older.

Does this have anything to do with the Succubi's lack of immunity to disease?
Or the fact that they can be either male or female or both at the same time?
Or the fact that their Charisma score is high enough that they could bluff a paladin out of his clothes?

Fax Celestis
2008-03-04, 07:23 PM
I dunno about the BoeF. Some of it makes me... unhappy to contemplate in fluff terms and some of it is not well balanced imho. I haven't looked at it in a while (and needed to bleach my eyes) but I recall a feat in there called 'satisfied glow' or something similar which gave a +4 to Charisma so long as the character got some nookie in the last 24 hours that was not balanced.

There's one of those for each stat, and they provide enhancement bonuses (which therefore means that they don't stack with items or $Animal $Stat spells).

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-04, 07:28 PM
So yeah, those are lousy (Except if you REALLY want that enhancement and don't want to waste the belt slot on a belt of magnificence so that you can use it instead for a belt of battle).

Speaking of which, imagine what happens if a Planar shepherd time stops, and uses a belt of battle in each round. The idea is frightening...or frighteningly effective, depends on your view.

KillianHawkeye
2008-03-04, 07:30 PM
Reverse Gender + Permanency

Seriously, though, most of the book's contents only cover noncombat situations, so I'm not sure how effectively you can "build" with it.

Chronos
2008-03-04, 07:32 PM
She's got a lot of widely-considered "very good" books under her belt, not the least of which are the XPH, Frostburn, and ToM.Wait, so you mean there's something in Frostburn which isn't hideously overpoweringly broken? It seems like the only time I ever hear that book mentioned, it's prefaced by "No sane DM would allow this, but..."

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-04, 07:35 PM
Maybe Snowflake Wardance and Blue Ice weps are balanced...

And maybe....


AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHH! I'm mindraping myself!

Collin152
2008-03-04, 07:36 PM
AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHH! I'm mindraping myself!

It builds character. Suck it up.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-04, 07:39 PM
When you're using modify memory to add crit potential and the Immunizing Trauma nullifies it?

DO NOT WANT!

Collin152
2008-03-04, 07:42 PM
When you're using modify memory to add crit potential and the Immunizing Trauma nullifies it?

DO NOT WANT!

What about a nice Programmed Amnesia?
It doesn't have the Evil Descriptor, so it takes 9 minutes and 9 rounds longer to cast. But at least it isn't evil.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-04, 07:44 PM
This Is My brain On Evil. I regret to inform that I must be healed, or I'll have to open a portal to the cosmic horror that is /tg/, which shows the horror in D&D at it's finest.


This Is My Brain on Good after the Mindrape. Hey, what happened? We were discussing something about munchkining tentacles, amirite?

Fax Celestis
2008-03-04, 07:45 PM
Wait, so you mean there's something in Frostburn which isn't hideously overpoweringly broken? It seems like the only time I ever hear that book mentioned, it's prefaced by "No sane DM would allow this, but..."

Yeah. Uldra, snow elves, and urskan are great. There's a bunch of feats that are terrific, and 90% of the materials are actually usable. Even the weather and environment rules are actually helpful. It's just the spells that have given the book a bad rap.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-04, 07:49 PM
Now being serious, I always saw Frostburn as being rather UNDERpowered, spells aside. That, or too cosmetic of a variant.

The Extinguisher
2008-03-04, 07:52 PM
There are a lot of interesting and useful spells in there.

Bardic Hiding, for one, is the most useful spell I think. Being able to hide anywhere? Very useful.

Squash Monster
2008-03-04, 08:15 PM
Pink Tentacles
Conjuration, Sor/Wiz 5

Functions as Black Tentacles, except as noted. Instead of crushing a grappled opponent, Pink Tentacles removes one AC worth of armor per round. Once a target has no AC from armor, the tentacles instead do 1d6+4 points of nonlethal damage per round. If a target is reduced to 0 hitpoints by Pink Tentacles, their attitude towards the caster changes to Helpful, or, if it was already Helpful, to Fanatical.

(I don't have the book. Is this actually in there?)

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-04, 08:39 PM
Oh, please, don't continue. It'll trigger my brain on evil, and it'll unleash the horror!

Rutee
2008-03-04, 08:46 PM
Pink Tentacles
Conjuration, Sor/Wiz 5

Functions as Black Tentacles, except as noted. Instead of crushing a grappled opponent, Pink Tentacles removes one AC worth of armor per round. Once a target has no AC from armor, the tentacles instead do 1d6+4 points of nonlethal damage per round. If a target is reduced to 0 hitpoints by Pink Tentacles, their attitude towards the caster changes to Helpful, or, if it was already Helpful, to Fanatical.

(I don't have the book. Is this actually in there?)
I'm pretty sure tentacle sex is in there, somewhere, yesh.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-04, 08:49 PM
Let's not even talk about specific unimorphs (10 bucks to a succubus learning how to lolishape).

SilverClawShift
2008-03-04, 08:54 PM
If it makes you feel any better Fax, I've actually played with a prestige class from the book, and was doing so seriously.

Except I was a gnome Bard/Thrall of Graz'zt/Rake. Which is really mechanically unsound, it was just for the thematic ties that made me play it.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-04, 09:10 PM
That build makes me feel as if I'm missing something, but I just can't nail it...

SilverClawShift
2008-03-04, 09:16 PM
...No, you probably could have nailed it without much trouble. But you would have given up all your secrets afterwards.

Wow, I hate myself for that one. :smallsigh:

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-04, 09:19 PM
I have been quadruple vibrating touchéd. I must avenge my honour. Call the VoP CW samurai!

Rutee
2008-03-04, 09:33 PM
This is why we can't have nice things. Or naughty things, whichever.

Collin152
2008-03-04, 09:38 PM
Mmm, voluntary tenetacle rape.

ShadowSiege
2008-03-04, 10:22 PM
Sorry Fax, but I'm with the others on this subject. I have a hard time getting a serious D&D session going as is, let alone throwing in the BoEF. Maybe if it were a one-on-one game with a girlfriend I could manage it, but otherwise I typically play with 2 other males and one female and that would lead to awkward events like http://www.shamusyoung.com/twentysidedtale/?p=951, or just plain awkward.

Annarrkkii
2008-03-04, 10:38 PM
The command spell elaboration that forces the target to begin Finding Nemo seems somewhat on the broken side for their, as does disrobe, due to the high prevalence of magic items. The two both allow saves, and are therefore not extremely broken, but you could still force a target to dispense with its magic item articles, and run off with them. Of course, the two are made obsolete by dominate person and the like, but they do seem like they could be situationally overpowered.

Callos_DeTerran
2008-03-04, 10:55 PM
I'm capable of having a serious discussion, but I could never actually use the BoEF in my IRL game. Would get side-tracked way way too fast.

As for actual builds...dunno. Might have to download and take another gander at it.

Tengu
2008-03-04, 10:57 PM
I know that this book has at least one class that can be used seriously in a game without any sexual elements - a PrC for arcane casters that specializes in scrying. It took me a minute to figure out this class is in this book because it's supposed to be for magical Peeping Toms.

FlyMolo
2008-03-04, 10:58 PM
Maybe if it were a one-on-one game with a girlfriend I could manage it.snipped for content.

This sounds like something which would either rapidly devolve into not playing DnD anymore, or something which would rapidly devolve into rampant sexual frustration, and therefore not fun. And nobody wants be reminded of that while playing DnD, anyway. That's where you go to get away from this kind of thing, isn't it?

Collin152
2008-03-04, 11:02 PM
snipped for content.

This sounds like something which would either rapidly devolve into not playing DnD anymore, or something which would rapidly devolve into rampant sexual frustration, and therefore not fun. And nobody wants be reminded of that while playing DnD, anyway. That's where you go to get away from this kind of thing, isn't it?

Rapidly devolving into not-DnD? Well, that makes it twice as useful.

Rutee
2008-03-04, 11:04 PM
snipped for content.

This sounds like something which would either rapidly evolve into not playing DnD anymore, or something which would rapidly devolve into rampant sexual frustration, and therefore not fun. And nobody wants be reminded of that while playing DnD, anyway. That's where you go to get away from this kind of thing, isn't it?

Fixed that for you. 'cause I'm pretty sure I know which'll be more fun, and it involves cuddling :P

ZeroNumerous
2008-03-04, 11:15 PM
I've used it once in an IRL game between friends. None of us took it seriously and it was all about the lulz.

Like someone else said in this thread: You can't expect a serious conversation to come from BoEF.

RTGoodman
2008-03-04, 11:17 PM
Rutee, your new sig image is very cute as well! I like it. And I myself would be ok with using the book in my games if all the players are mature enough.

Ay, there's the rub. From the groups I've played with, at least.



From what I've read of BoEF, which isn't much, it doesn't seem all that great. Of course, most of what I read was the fluff stuff (I didn't know there was actual crunch in it until I read this thread), so I guess that wouldn't be hard to use.

I think the best chance would be to use it in a more roleplaying-centric campaign (as I can't imagine much serious combat-oriented "erotic fantasy"), and only with people that can be mature. To me, it seems like it'd be an interesting book (*in a non dirty-old-man sense*), but not one that I (or most others) could use all the time.

After seeing this though, I may actually browse through it if the still have a copy in the Borders bookstore at home (which in itself shocked me upon first finding it).

ShadowSiege
2008-03-04, 11:24 PM
Fixed that for you. 'cause I'm pretty sure I know which'll be more fun, and it involves cuddling :P

Haha, actually I had though of putting a bit in there regarding the likely outcome of such a situation. It actually came to mind while I was making the post and added in the "maybe I could handle it".

Really, if it comes down to naughty fun or D&D, I'll go with the naughty fun. Mixture of both would simply go right into naughty fun and maybe D&D during the refractory period. Did anyone else just think of the following Family Guy scene?
Lois (dressed in a Catholic schoolgirl uniform): I've been a naughty girl.
Peter: I'm a seventeenth level paladin wearing a Helm of Destruction.
Lois: Paladins can't wear a Helm of Destruction.
Peter: Oh, well then I'm a black guy.

Edit:

Ay, there's the rub. From the groups I've played with, at least.

As Stephen Colbert once said as Phil Ken Sebben, "HA HA... RUB!"

Lord Iames Osari
2008-03-04, 11:25 PM
I think the problem with the BoEF not being taken seriously might be that including it as part of a game is a Big Deal.

For ex, the game I just started running last Friday has a brothel in it, a prime candidate for use of some BoEF material. Do I make a big deal about it? No. It's just there, staffed with moderately fleshed-out NPCs, both employees and a few regulars. There's been maybe 1 joke made about it so far.

Seriously, why does everyone have this idea that by using the BoEF, you're automatically making it the focus of the game?

Hal
2008-03-04, 11:34 PM
Seriously, why does everyone have this idea that by using the BoEF, you're automatically making it the focus of the game?

Because, Dude . . . elf boobies.

Fax Celestis
2008-03-04, 11:35 PM
Seriously, why does everyone have this idea that by using the BoEF, you're automatically making it the focus of the game?

Well, the reason I ask this at all is because I'm going to be running an espionage/intrigue game, and sex is a valid form of getting information from one's target.

ZeroNumerous
2008-03-04, 11:38 PM
Seriously, why does everyone have this idea that by using the BoEF, you're automatically making it the focus of the game?

Because if none of the players use it, then you're not actually involving the book at all?

For example: Lets assume I'm DMing a game and I make this really fleshed-out desert with Sandstorm, fill it with every mechanical application for the book. If my players never go to that desert, then I'm not actually using Sandstorm. I've just got a desert idea in my head that will never be implemented.

Thats a problem inherent in all of the "campaign" books(Ghostwalk, Sandstorm, Frostburn, etc). If it isn't the focus of your campaign at any point in the game, then it doesn't get used.

Rutee
2008-03-04, 11:38 PM
Seriously, why does everyone have this idea that by using the BoEF, you're automatically making it the focus of the game?

I dunno. It's more like, if you're not going to make it a focus, why bother digging through the book? Heck, why stat the NPCs if they're not a focus?

ZeroNumerous
2008-03-04, 11:45 PM
I dunno. It's more like, if you're not going to make it a focus, why bother digging through the book? Heck, why stat the NPCs if they're not a focus?

Rutee summed up my point in less words.

Collin152
2008-03-04, 11:48 PM
Peter: Oh, well then I'm a black guy.


That's "Blackguard", dear.

Lord Iames Osari
2008-03-04, 11:48 PM
Because if none of the players use it, then you're not actually involving the book at all?

For example: Lets assume I'm DMing a game and I make this really fleshed-out desert with Sandstorm, fill it with every mechanical application for the book. If my players never go to that desert, then I'm not actually using Sandstorm. I've just got a desert idea in my head that will never be implemented.

Thats a problem inherent in all of the "campaign" books(Ghostwalk, Sandstorm, Frostburn, etc). If it isn't the focus of your campaign at any point in the game, then it doesn't get used.

So the DM doesn't count somehow?


I dunno. It's more like, if you're not going to make it a focus, why bother digging through the book? Heck, why stat the NPCs if they're not a focus?

I don't know why I would bother digging through the book. It obviously couldn't be for a reason similar to the reason why I dig through books for the grapple rules, or the disarm rules, or the bull rush rules, or the rules on what exactly happens when someone gets bitten by a werewolf.

And I never said the NPCs were statted. I said they were "fleshed-out". There's a difference.

Rutee
2008-03-04, 11:51 PM
I don't know why I would bother digging through the book. It obviously couldn't be for a reason similar to the reason why I dig through books for the grapple rules, or the disarm rules, or the bull rush rules, or the rules on what exactly happens when someone gets bitten by a werewolf.
...So you needed hard mechanics? I do hope you'll forgive that /not/ being the first thought on my mind, given the subject matter.

Starsinger
2008-03-04, 11:56 PM
...So you needed hard mechanics? I do hope you'll forgive that /not/ being the first thought on my mind, given the subject matter.

Sorry.. can't resist, but I'm pretty sure BoEF has hard mechanics. I recall the Grope spell being of semi use to interrupt casting. Likewise, if I remember right, there's some pretty useful prestige classes in there. Tantric Mage is it? Or is that a ravenloft prestige class?

Rutee
2008-03-04, 11:57 PM
There's an entire new system of hard mechanics in BoEF. It is not something I imagine /ever seeing actual use/ though.

Hint: What is the purpose of the book

Collin152
2008-03-05, 12:03 AM
There's an entire new system of hard mechanics in BoEF. It is not something I imagine /ever seeing actual use/ though.


Suppose the Rogue really needed a dagger after being stript and thrown into prison...

Lord Iames Osari
2008-03-05, 12:03 AM
...So you needed hard mechanics? I do hope you'll forgive that /not/ being the first thought on my mind, given the subject matter.
Have you read the book? Or even glanced at the Table of Contents? The first chapter is called "Love, Sex, and Roleplaying". It has very little mechanical content that I can recall. From the second chapter ("Rules, Skills, and Feats") on, it's practically all mechanics. I mean, yes, there are the little bits of fluff, like the vignettes and the ecologies for the monsters, but really, the point of the book is the mechanics.

Rutee
2008-03-05, 12:07 AM
I read it two years ago, yes. That doesn't change that your comparison really only applies if you were digging for the mechanical rules on sex. If you weren't statting NPCs, I can't imagine any other mechanics you actually would have needed in a Brothel.

Collin152
2008-03-05, 12:13 AM
I read it two years ago, yes. That doesn't change that your comparison really only applies if you were digging for the mechanical rules on sex. If you weren't statting NPCs, I can't imagine any other mechanics you actually would have needed in a Brothel.

The ability damage done by herpes?

Swordguy
2008-03-05, 12:14 AM
OK Fax, since the thread seems to mostly be exactly the kind of response you DON'T want...I've used it in games, in serious games, and it hasn't been a problem.

The key really is the players though. If your players are prone to reacting in the manner as most of the responses here, it's gonna flop. My players are theatre people - we don't have a "squick factor". Every single one of the women in my group as been involved in a rape scene onstage (heck, I choreographed my wife's gang rape in Man of la Mancha) - so we can generally discuss this stuff at a mature level. I'd be very hesitant about using it without such an outlook from my PCs.

With all that said, there's some decent mechanical things from the book. It will give you solid rules for sex and for getting information out of sex partners via pillow talk. The toughest part is the addition of the Appearance stat and its effects on the game (which do make sense - nymphs, for example, have almost all their abilities keyed off of appearance). There's an assortment of magic items that do make sense. In fact, there a LOT of stuff that makes sense if you accept the premise of "species like to have sex, and they exist in a high-magic world. Therefore, how would they use magic to improve/modify their sexual activity?"

Decent classes are the Kundalas, and Tantrists (full caster, duh) - but the Tantrists really, really need another party member who's sexually open with them - which means that they need another player who's willing to have that happen.

Good PrCs are the Disciple of Aaluran, Frenzied Disciple (I had somebody stack it with Frenzied Berserker once...ouch), and especially for your campaign...RAKES. In any sort of spy/espionage campaign, rakes are awesome. If anti-scrying isn't a heavy thing in your game, the Voyuristic Seer isn't bad - but it's so easy to counter (Mind Blank) as to be useless. Still, it's a 3-level dip with no loss in caster levels.

Spells: Spell Meld is pretty cool (share spell pools with another willing full caster). Now your cleric can cast Time Stop/Prismatic Whatever and your wizard can cast True Res. There's a few utility spells, but there's not a whole lot that's really combat heavy - since sex isn't generally something associated with the battlefield. The Pillow Talk spell will probably see heavy use in your game.

In general, this book is about RP, NOT combat optimization.

Also, half-demon nymphs with appearance scores in the mid-40 are VERY nasty opponents when you run them with the old-school "save or die" disrobing.

skywalker
2008-03-05, 12:49 AM
This thread makes skywalker wail. I literally wailed somewhere in the middle of page 2.

On the other hand, I'm happy to see a new thread from fax.

One of my groups has it, it sits on the bottom of the stack of books and never gets touched during sessions, and it's only ever been mentioned once(someone made a joke about contracting STDs from toilet seats).

In the few times I've perused the book, I found some useful stuff, but was turned off by the pictures.

I think having mechanics for flirting is awesome, because, as the posted link shows, these situations often come down to "Is this a bluff, diplomacy, or plain charisma check?" I think having mechanics for STDs and the like could be helpful. I agree with swordguy about the relationship that should naturally arise from magic and sex. At least, the relationship I think would arise.

Finally, I found the mechanics for actual sex horrible. IMO, they emphasized the wrong things and left a lot of stuff out.

This post checked and double-checked for possible exploitable words/phrases before posting.

EDIT: Found a review that mentions that the "disrobe" spell only removes nonmagical clothing and items.

The Gilded Duke
2008-03-05, 02:07 AM
As far as a serious discussion of mechanics goes..

I like the Imagist. The whole beauty based casting thing is a little weird, and they don't have too many offensive spells. A full spontaneous caster though, with some really nice spells, shape change, planar ally etc, and healing. Also it has a built in cohort. I really like cohorts, unfortunately it wouldn't work into a Thrallherd that well.

Inspired Smite Evil though is absolutely worthless.

The Kundala is better then the standard monk, gaining spell casting and wisdom bonus to all saves. I imagine a Kundala with the True Submissive feat could be amazing. A Monk with shapeshifting, healing, self-buffing and rage.

Tantrist is incredibly dull.

Hadrian_Emrys
2008-03-05, 03:10 AM
The spells:
Grope
Touch Me Not
Kiss of Life
Healing Sphere
Succor
Engorged Strike
Pheromones
Calm Weather
Fecund Growth

Each has been used in games I've been party to sitting in on so decent effect. I'll have more to add when I finish going over the book again to trigger the memory. The previous mention of Grope to disrupt casting was a hilarious scene in the game I saw it used in. The players were all several years my senior seeing as how it was a college gaming group and I was 15 at the time I attended that campus (don't tell them that they let a minor in on that campaign).

Dragonmuncher
2008-03-05, 03:28 AM
You might want to check out the Harem Guard (Harem Protector? Brothel Guard?) PrC for an NPC or two, Fax. They have some nice abilities for a fighter PrC, and are immune to sexual wiles besides. If you do end up having a PC who sleeps with everyone to get info, it might be a neat way to throw a wrench into the works.

And I second the Rake- it seems to be exactly what you're looking for, in sexy-spy terms.

As for a lot of the other stuff... eh. The classes are neat and flavorful (especially the PrCs), but nothing's particularly cheesed out, as far as I can tell.

I didn't check out the spells while I was boning up (hah!) on the classes, but the other posts in this thread have convinced me they're worth a second look.

Cuddly
2008-03-05, 03:31 AM
My friend has a copy of Nymphology, a hilarious splat book about sex. It's full of huge boobs and engorged nipples. And a definite porno- I did it for the lulz quality.

There is a very nice spell in there- power word orgasm. No save, everyone stunned for like 3d6 rounds.

There's also a pimp PrC, and a plane of sex.


You got /b/ in my D&D.

lol
Dinosaur porn. Druids.


snipped for content.

This sounds like something which would either rapidly devolve into not playing DnD anymore,

You mean LARPing?


"species like to have sex, and they exist in a high-magic world. Therefore, how would they use magic to improve/modify their sexual activity?"

Hmm, yes, interesting to think about. For, uh, academic reasons, of course. Hmm, haa, shmee shmee. *Lecherous chuckling*

Dhavaer
2008-03-05, 03:32 AM
I've given a mage NPC Orbs of Enlightenment, a Rod of the Erotic Spirit and three Tantric feats. Yay +10 Intelligence!

Also, some of the spells are good. I think there's one that stuns 1/caster level creatures?

Kami2awa
2008-03-05, 04:00 AM
That's why succubi have a Tongues ability, right?

And an extra +2 to Use Rope checks for bindings :smalleek: Lots of in-jokes in the Succubus stats I think, especially given that the graphic picture of the succubus in the original MM got some people even more riled than the rest of the game.

weenie
2008-03-05, 04:07 AM
Don't know if anybody else noticed this, but Metaphysical Spellshaper has some incredible powers. Metamagic Mastery is the equivalent of Improved Metamagic, the strongest ability of the strongest PrC for arcane spellcasters out there(Incantatrix). Not to mention the cheese that Metamagic Manipulation could achieve if the character had immunity to ability damage(Stone Body(SC)).

JBento
2008-03-05, 05:30 AM
I'm surprised no-one has mentioned this yet. BoEF has the virtue of being owned by everone's favourite mage, Vaarsuvius.

EVAN'S SPIKED TENTACLES OF FORCED INTRUSION!!!!!!!!!!

:smallbiggrin:

Dan_Hemmens
2008-03-05, 06:06 AM
I've not actually read the BoEF (since I don't actually own any D&D supplements, since I don't actually play D&D) but from everything I've seen it seems to be mostly a bunch of "sex themed" D&D stuff. The thing about D&D stuff is that it is, basically, D&D stuff.

It strikes me that if you wanted to introduce - say - sacred prostitutes into your campaign, a prestige class would be the worst way to do it. Leaving aside the fact that it basically makes all of them at least sixth level - and therefore probably making the Temple Prostitutes of the Goddess Astara the most formidable military force in whichever game setting they happen to be in - it's also just another example of Classic D&D Point Missing.

If you want to include sex, sexual themes, romance, passion, love and seduction in your game, you can do it perfectly well without a bunch of spells allowing you to use your leet sex powers to get combat bonuses. It simply doesn't strike me as remotely mature or serious to view sex as having to be justified with Feats and Prestige Classes.

raygungothic
2008-03-05, 11:54 AM
(I've just given mine away, offer ends)

Frosty
2008-03-05, 02:03 PM
It strikes me that if you wanted to introduce - say - sacred prostitutes into your campaign, a prestige class would be the worst way to do it...it basically makes all of them at least sixth level - and therefore probably making the Temple Prostitutes of the Goddess Astara the most formidable military force in whichever game setting they happen to be in.

I find that mental picture very, very amusing. Thanks for making my day.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-05, 02:46 PM
The sad thing is, if the temple has at least one caster among it's ranks, it probably IS the most formidable force, because prostitutes that max the PrC can refill the spell slots of anyone they do the deed with once per day.

Frosty
2008-03-05, 06:55 PM
Well it *is* a temple. There's bound to be a few clerics around, so having spell slots to refill isn't a problem. The bigger problem is this: You need at least 20 minutes to perform a refill. How many Sacred prostitutes do you think one Cleric gain recharges from? Sure they've got good fort saves, but still...

Illiterate Scribe
2008-03-05, 07:38 PM
This Is My brain On Evil. I regret to inform that I must be healed, or I'll have to open a portal to the cosmic horror that is /tg/, which shows the horror in D&D at it's finest.

Does the Escape Artist's Ability to squeeze into extremely tight spaces while in spiked armour, then cast 'enlarge', have anything to do with this?

I quote:


F*** smuggling, I'd use this in combat. Nobody would dare face me when they knew I'd jump up their asses in the first round.

Weirdlet
2008-03-05, 08:16 PM
The Metaphysical Spellshaper actually really fits with my concept of a sorcerer, as someone who's using their own inherent magic and could improve it by draining themselves, physically or mentally.

Chronos
2008-03-05, 08:53 PM
And an extra +2 to Use Rope checks for bindings Lots of in-jokes in the Succubus stats I thinkThat one isn't a special bonus for Succubi and Erinyes, but just the +2 synergy bonus that anyone gets from ranks in Escape Artist. Though the Erinyes does have some bondage-themed special abilities.

dyslexicfaser
2008-03-05, 10:51 PM
Kundala makes a solid alternative to a character I like, the cleric/monk. They might also more easily progress into Sacred Fist, but I'd have to check into that.

The Pierced Mystic seems extraordinarily powerful - a full spellcasting PrC, with the ability to imbue piercings with a spell of your choice (1, then 2, then 3/day) and cast it as a move action. By level 4, the Pierced Mystic can also wear items in the body slots they have their magic piercings in, so there seems to be no drawbacks.

Sounds break-able.

EDIT: Sorry to backslide into lowbrow humor, but Sacred Prostitute just seems like a lot of fun in an all-male group. I want to play a beefy male Sacred Prostitute - see if the other guys want their extra spell slots or Cure Serious Wounds or Remove Curse badly enough to proposition 'Bubba' for them. Let the sexual healing begin.

Roland St. Jude
2008-03-05, 11:54 PM
Sheriff of Moddingham: Please keep it PG-13 in here and that includes links.

Frosty
2008-03-06, 02:48 AM
That one isn't a special bonus for Succubi and Erinyes, but just the +2 synergy bonus that anyone gets from ranks in Escape Artist. Though the Erinyes does have some bondage-themed special abilities.

They get to control ropes via magical powers or something...

Swordguy
2008-03-06, 03:08 PM
Fax, any thoughts?

Rift_Wolf
2008-03-06, 03:36 PM
There were some interesting feats which gave you bonuses to your attributes if you had sex in the morning. Combine this with leadership to get a concubine (So the DM can't rule 'You're out in the wilderness so getting your pork on will be difficult') and you could boost up your strength immensely (Human Barbarian 6 could take the strength boost feat 3 times and get +6 to strength, as well as rage bonuses)

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-06, 03:42 PM
And why do that when you could just get an item that increases STR? If I'm correct, they have the same type of bonus, so they don't stack.

Rutee
2008-03-06, 03:43 PM
You're trading Feats for Item Slots. As I don't know the mechanics behind this game terribly well, I can't comment on the effectiveness of the trade.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-06, 03:45 PM
Generally, the feat is extra suboptimal, moreso because you're spending THREE feats out of the 7 you get for ONE boost, when with a single item slot you can get the same boost for all the stats, though at a gross cost.

AKA_Bait
2008-03-06, 03:45 PM
There's one of those for each stat, and they provide enhancement bonuses (which therefore means that they don't stack with items or $Animal $Stat spells).

In a high end game, they aren't that good. In a low level game they are possibly brokenly good. It's like spending a feat for a +4 bonus when you wouldn't otherwise be able to get one.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-06, 03:47 PM
+2 bonus. It's +2 per time you take the feat and gets to +6. Unless you're playing a fihgter that gets a 2 feats every level or summat, doesn't seem too good.

Rift_Wolf
2008-03-06, 04:19 PM
A 6th level PC with a +6 bonus to strength is pretty good. If you were to take it to 20th level, then yes, it is a waste. However, thats what feat retraining is for.

Dan_Hemmens
2008-03-06, 04:33 PM
A 6th level PC with a +6 bonus to strength is pretty good. If you were to take it to 20th level, then yes, it is a waste. However, thats what feat retraining is for.

Feat retraining? You can retrain Feats now? I've been away from this game for too long.

Again, though, this sort of highlights my problems with the BoEF.

"I thought I'd take this feat because it says a lot about what my character's sexual identity and his relationships with others. But I decided against it because it's underpowered at high levels."

Mature handling of sexual themes != Stat Boosts.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-06, 04:39 PM
Not to mention, if you bring feat retraining, either the DM is dumb or is going to make you his little female dog, to use a crappy euphemism. It's brokened, and that's the end of the story. No ifs, ands, or buts.

Frosty
2008-03-06, 04:41 PM
I allow feat retraining, bt only if it makes sense, or if the player just plain made mistakes, or if the charatcer is just too damned weak. "Hi, I'm Mr Samurai with Great Cleave!"

Dan_Hemmens
2008-03-06, 04:43 PM
I allow feat retraining, bt only if it makes sense, or if the player just plain made mistakes, or if the charatcer is just too damned weak. "Hi, I'm Mr Samurai with Great Cleave!"

Possibly you might want to consider class retraining in that case...

dyslexicfaser
2008-03-06, 04:46 PM
Yes, I don't doubt 'Mr. Samurai' has more serious problems than his Cleave feat.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-06, 04:53 PM
Yeah. Like attacking Gazebos.

Frosty
2008-03-06, 05:10 PM
Possibly you might want to consider class retraining in that case...

Actually, he *is* considering a class change. He wanted try Truenamer but I didn't allow it because I wasn't too familiar with it.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-06, 05:13 PM
God, that guy/gal is trying to break him/herself on purpose! Stop him, that class sucks! Give him a Factotum to play with, and tell him to take Font of Inspiration at every chance, except level 6 to get leadership, because he won't be able to do bad with that.

SilverClawShift
2008-03-06, 05:15 PM
Samurai with Great Cleave retraining to become a Truenamer?

That's out of the frying pan, and into the frying-pan-with-a-slightly-different-handle.

Zincorium
2008-03-06, 05:23 PM
Samurai with Great Cleave retraining to become a Truenamer?

That's out of the frying pan, and into the frying-pan-with-a-slightly-different-handle.

And both of these frying pans are on fire.


In explanation for those who may wonder:

Samurai is a mashed-up fighter with terrible class abilities and an actively gimped suggested attack style. They're also horrible representations of medieval samurai (only one on record ever used a katana and wakizashi at the same time, and he sure as heck wasn't first level).

Truenamer quickly finds it flat-out impossible to use the class's only real feature on enemies. Or only possible past the low levels with severe cheese. If it takes questionable rules interpretations and custom items to have an action worth taking in combat, something is wrong.

Frosty
2008-03-06, 05:45 PM
The other thing he wanted to try Monk because he likes oriental flavor (hence Samurai). I'm trying to steer him away from that though.

I wonder if a gestalt Monk/Samurai would make him on par with the others...

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-06, 05:49 PM
No. He would only seem MORE pathetic. If he wants a semi effective samurai, get 'im an OA samurai. Or, if he's just a plain "easternophile", an OA ninja.

Frosty
2008-03-06, 05:50 PM
How can a gestalt character be more pathetic then the non-gestalt versions?

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-06, 05:56 PM
It DOUBLES the suckitude. It can't do anything well, and it's DOUBLE the amount of class levels than anyone else. It can't get more pathetic than that, being more pathetic than the sum of your parts. You should seriously consider making him look into Wu Jen or the OA classes.

Collin152
2008-03-06, 05:57 PM
How can a gestalt character be more pathetic then the non-gestalt versions?

They get patheticness as a class feature. Getting it twice only makes it worse.

Dan_Hemmens
2008-03-06, 06:03 PM
They get patheticness as a class feature. Getting it twice only makes it worse.

To be fair, that only means that their patheticness progresses at the faster rate. Unless it's two incompatible forms of patheticness.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-06, 06:05 PM
Ya got it, brotha! Dem patetiknez izz difrent!

Rachel Lorelei
2008-03-06, 06:07 PM
To be fair, that only means that their patheticness progresses at the faster rate. Unless it's two incompatible forms of patheticness.

It is. Complete Warrior Samurai fight with two weapons in heavy armor. Monks fight with no weapons without armor.

Dan_Hemmens
2008-03-06, 06:09 PM
It is. Complete Warrior Samurai fight with two weapons in heavy armor. Monks fight with no weapons without armor.

True. At least you wind up with a monk with full BAB and Stardown bonuses.

Frosty
2008-03-06, 06:14 PM
Well, I don't have OA, so that's out of the question.

However, a gestalt monk/samurai can't be *that* bad can it? At the basics, you've got someone with all good saves, TWF, and flurry of blows and all that. Or can you only use the TWF with a katana and wakazashi? Hmm....being able to do it in heavy armor won't help since monks can't use them. And there is super MAD, since you need charisma for Kiai shout I think?

So you've got a Monk with full BAB and more HP. Still not very good I guess...

Zincorium
2008-03-06, 06:16 PM
To sum up why it would still suck horribly:

You now need 5 of the 6 ability scores to be fairly high to use many abilities or survive combat (intelligence is the one you don't need, and I think that's fitting). Granted, getting a high charisma to use the samurai's 'angry shouting' abilities which are worthless against anything that you'd want it to affect, is like building a garage for a junked car, but I'm just puttin' it out there.

Neither Katitanas or Wakizashis are monk weapons. You can't wear heavy armor and still use the monk abilities. You still don't have magic or many skill points.

A. Tome of battle, you really can't screw that up. And from what I hear, it's 'anime'. Whatever that actually means.

B. Play a fighter or paladin. Call him a samurai. Point out the OoTS strip with the relevant discussion of Miko if neccessary.

C. Ask him what he wants to be able to do and build a character for him, then explain how to play it.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-06, 06:34 PM
Basically, an OA samurai gets a free Ancestral weapon that goes up to +10, doesn't figure into WBL, and he also gets a big skill list (I can find it if you want it), full bab, and a good will save to boot. The downside is that he doesn't get heavy armor proficiency and shield proficiency. And in fact, a big deal of the Warblade (Maneuver mechanic aside) was ripped off of the OA samurai. Similarly, the Ninja is also more pwnsome.

Frosty
2008-03-06, 06:34 PM
Aren't Fighters and Paladins considered Underpowered anyways?

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-06, 06:36 PM
Nah. More like niched and requiring you have splatbooks, methinks. The first one only works as a tripmonkey and ubercharger, the second one requires battle blessing, and maybe sword of the arcane order.

FlyMolo
2008-03-06, 08:01 PM
Aren't Fighters and Paladins considered Underpowered anyways?

Only compared to any class with full casting.

Is it depressing that the most broken classes are the core ones? Druids, cleric, Wizard.

Frosty
2008-03-06, 08:07 PM
Speaking of full casters, a more seasoned player from the group wants to go into Dweomer keeper. I have no idea what book it's from. He and I managed to talk the first person out of Monk, and the seasoned player suggested to that person to play an Incantatrix or Planar Shepherd instead.

Zincorium
2008-03-06, 08:13 PM
Speaking of full casters, a more seasoned player from the group wants to go into Dweomer keeper. I have no idea what book it's from. He and I managed to talk the first person out of Monk, and the seasoned player suggested to that person to play an Incantatrix or Planar Shepherd instead.

So... you're playing with both a person who can't optimize into the paper bag to then optimize out of...

And a person who's looking at dweomerkeeper, incantatrix, and planar shepherd, which are all arguably the most broken prestige classes available without Dragon or third party material.


Some days I realize I should be thankful for the groups I've had.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-06, 08:36 PM
And lemme guess your other group members: One of them's a drama EMPRESS that makes William Shatner's overacting look tame, and the last one is a dream player who roleplays really well, knows how to optimise, and is generally the kind of player a DM would have an idyllic session with.

streakster
2008-03-06, 08:59 PM
Planar shepherd isn't arguable. It's "Hi, take ten turns everytime your enemy takes one, wildshape into a laundry list of outsiders, and you know what? You can have all their abilities too. Yep,that's right, Wish as an SLA! Outsiders with casting! Woo! Oh, and you are immune to a whole plane!"

It's as if a drunken madman decided to prove the overpoweredness of druids by illustrating how powerful a druid prestige class would have to be to make them stronger - and it then got published.

Sorry for the out of nowhere rant.

Oh, and the Samurai dude? Give him a Swordsage, call it a Samurai, call it a day. By the way, is he purposely picking weak classes to be interesting (Samurai? Truenamer? Monk?).

Arbitrarity
2008-03-06, 09:03 PM
Incantatrix: Free metamagic.
Dwenomerkeeper: Low cost metamagic, and FREE WISHES! (up to 5/day?)
Planar Shepard: Wildshape into solar, take 10 turns each time you take 1, etc.

Madness!

streakster
2008-03-06, 09:11 PM
More!

By the way, PS gets free wishes too, provided he has someone else ask for them. Unlimited, by the way. And can get free metamagic based on his home plane. Or be completely immune to all magic. ALLof it. And incorporeal. And invisible. And fly. And have druid casting. All at the same time, all day long! Or hey, raise undead, with no HD limit. What's that? Free arcane casting too? Sure! Here's 17th level sorcerer casting. And you can fly. And all your friends can fly. And they can all take the 10:1 turns things too. At the same time!

Sure it can't do all of that - it has to pick which mindbendingly gamebreakingly stuff it can do. That list doesn't even include the little stuff, like at will polymorph or geas.

Don't let them be a PS. Please.

Frosty
2008-03-06, 09:24 PM
Planar shepherd isn't arguable. It's "Hi, take ten turns everytime your enemy takes one, wildshape into a laundry list of outsiders, and you know what? You can have all their abilities too. Yep,that's right, Wish as an SLA! Outsiders with casting! Woo! Oh, and you are immune to a whole plane!"

It's as if a drunken madman decided to prove the overpoweredness of druids by illustrating how powerful a druid prestige class would have to be to make them stronger - and it then got published.

Sorry for the out of nowhere rant.

Oh, and the Samurai dude? Give him a Swordsage, call it a Samurai, call it a day. By the way, is he purposely picking weak classes to be interesting (Samurai? Truenamer? Monk?).

I didn't say I'm allowing these classes. I don't have the books for Incantatrix/Dweomer Keeper/Planar Sheperd, he'll just have to keep on using his Spontaneous Divination Wizard. As for the Samurai, I'm suggesting to him my homebrew Fighter with bonus feats every level, a good save he chooses himself, and a customizable skill list. He gets 4+int, and get one craft, profession, one knowledge skill, jump, climb, balance, tumble, and 3 additional skills of his choice.

The other players ar ealso somewhat new, but they have more knowledge of the game. The Samurai mostly just looks at fluff when deciding on classes.

Chronos
2008-03-06, 09:27 PM
I dunno... A player who's so bad at optimizing that he's trying to decide between Samurai, Monk, and Truenamer just might be able to turn Planar Shepherd into something resembling balanced. I have no idea how he might do that, but it'll be an interesting experiment.

If you want a real nightmare, I sometimes contemplate the possibility of a druid somehow getting a casting of Genesis (UMD a scroll, maybe?) just before taking Planar Shepherd. Yes, I'd like my plane to have 100:1 timeflow and be strongly dominant for all four elements and positive energy, please. Oh, and I'll have a side of strongly aligned to match my own alignment.




Wait a minute... We've somehow drifted away from talking about sex, to instead talking about how unbalanced Samurai and Planar Shepherd are?

BRC
2008-03-06, 09:28 PM
Wait a minute... We've somehow drifted away from talking about sex, to instead talking about how unbalanced Samurai and Planar Shepherd are?

This is the internet, arn't conversations supposed to go the other way?

Frosty
2008-03-06, 09:30 PM
I dunno... A player who's so bad at optimizing...


It's not that he's extremely bad at the game. It's more he's new and seems to have an aversion to spending too much time learning the nuiances of the games. He doesn't like spending too much effort I guess.

Collin152
2008-03-06, 09:41 PM
Wait a minute... We've somehow drifted away from talking about sex, to instead talking about how unbalanced Samurai and Planar Shepherd are?

A planar shepard can have so much more sex with his time manipulating bubbles.

Besides, according to Freud, it's all about sex anyways.

Frosty
2008-03-06, 09:53 PM
He'd need 20 minutes of subjective sex to get benefits. 10 Rounds is a minute... so he even with a 10:1 time compression he'd need 20 real rounds. Not very viable in combat unfortunately.

Collin152
2008-03-06, 10:02 PM
True. Unless you did the aforementioned cheese of making your own plane, it wouldn't help much for getting it on right before fighting.
So unless the Shepard just wants the night to last all night...

Rutee
2008-03-06, 11:11 PM
This is the internet, arn't conversations supposed to go the other way?

Welcome to nerd-dom.

Rift_Wolf
2008-03-07, 03:10 AM
This is the internet, arn't conversations supposed to go the other way?

I think over a long enough period of time, every thread in these forums turns into an imba or monk-hating argument.

And re: feat retraining, we're allow it so long as we don't take stupidly powerful feats, or get rid of prerequisite feats and keep the good ones (Retrain dodge and mobility but keep spring attack, for example)

Kioran
2008-03-07, 03:57 AM
As for the Samurai, I'm suggesting to him my homebrew Fighter with bonus feats every level, a good save he chooses himself, and a customizable skill list. He gets 4+int, and get one craft, profession, one knowledge skill, jump, climb, balance, tumble, and 3 additional skills of his choice.

The other players ar ealso somewhat new, but they have more knowledge of the game. The Samurai mostly just looks at fluff when deciding on classes.

Fitting. By the way, it´s also very similiar to what I´ve done with my fighters (4 skill ranks, +2 class skills of their choice, good will save). If he just wants to be the generic Katana-slinging madman, point him towards Exotic weapon master for Uncanny blow later on (2*strength to two handed weapon damage? Yes please!). But keep him away from Frenzied berzerker. That class is powerful, but it requires serious cheese to be controlled (Grease, voluntarily failing saves etc.)....

Frosty
2008-03-07, 11:24 AM
Can you voluntarily fail saves while berserked?

Maerok
2008-03-07, 11:37 AM
Hmm. Where do I remember seeing the Mystic Pimp prestige class... I think there was another splatbook like BoEF out there that was substantially more tongue-in-cheek.

Frosty
2008-03-07, 11:53 AM
Nymphology?

Maerok
2008-03-07, 12:14 PM
The moment any (any BoEF object)-wielding fiend comes after me in game, that's when I decide to burn the world down with a vengeance.

Or gods forbid some psycho with a vorpal something-or-another is headed my way; I'd set a helm of brilliance upon my head and cast burning hands at my own face...

Jerthanis
2008-03-07, 12:54 PM
My biggest problem with the BoEF isn't that there are mechanics for sex, but that despite having oodles of information on sex with shapeshifters, which pairings can produce children between everything from practically Troglodytes to Minotaurs, despite there being extensive rules for the average sexual process, there's practically only a handwave of, "eh, not really important, ad-hoc something" concerning fetishes. The best information is something along the lines of, "People with a fetish for something get a +2 to their sex rolls while the fetish is present, and a -4 when it's gone." Oh, and there's a reference to the equipment chapter, which has some basic equipment used in the Bondage & Domination fetish, as if that's the only one.

The whole book seems to have a laser-tight focus on sex in terms of two aspects: Frequency and duration. If you have sex often, you take one of these classes, if you don't have sex at all, you take these classes. If you sex up for 20 minutes, you get a bonus, 40 you get 2a bonus, and if you manage to keep it up for an hour, you get 3a bonus.

Yes, Chapter one is about sex, love and romance, and covers all aspects not related to frequency or duration with a wide brush, but it's all information that someone would have already heard or was aware of if they were mature enough to take the book seriously in the first place. Yeah, infidelity is a breach of trust, and yes, pregnancy can occur because of sex.

There's little focus on a person's sexual identity, things like homo/bi/transexuality are for the most part skimmed over in terms of personality and identity traits, and seems to fold them in with "sexual openness" when they're a lot more complicated than that. So my personal reasons for using the book, to greater build upon the character's sexual identity and have the character become more fully fleshed out, is pretty much gone. I can understand without the book that Charisma and Constitution are important to the act of sex.

At least that's my opinion on it. Perhaps I wanted the wrong thing out of the book. I was looking for a toolkit to helping make characters with developed sexual identities, and BoEF seems to be meant to be used in a BoEF centered game.

ColdBrew
2008-03-07, 05:41 PM
Naturally, we can't use BoEF without this table from 1e:

http://gadgets.boingboing.net/gimages/random_harlot_table.jpg

Talya
2008-03-07, 05:54 PM
The book needs erata, badly. There are spells missing, crunch missing, fluff missing, in various places. That said, Fax is right. The book is very nicely written.

Crunch-wise, I have gotten permission from my DM to use parts of it on my character (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=69461) in his FR campaign. As you can see, it's somewhat appropriate. That said, we're not using it all.

I do have issues with it.
I don't like adding another ability score. Last thing D&D needs is more MAD.
I don't like adding another type of perform skill. The more skills in the game, the more skill points you need.

A lot of the feats and spells are great. A few of the PrCs and classes are quite viable.

Frosty
2008-03-07, 06:06 PM
Mmm...Vow of Nudity Sacred Prositute...

I like your character background by the way. Warm welcome...hehe.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-07, 06:07 PM
I pity your DM. He doesn't know who he's messing with.

Kioran
2008-03-07, 06:25 PM
Can you voluntarily fail saves while berserked?

There´s nothing explicitly stating you can´t - allthough it clearly violates the spirit of the frenzied berzerker. Perhaps it has been errata´ed, but anyway.....Yeah.

Talya
2008-03-07, 06:33 PM
I pity your DM. He doesn't know who he's messing with.

He really does.

...

No, not that way!

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-07, 07:43 PM
I just hope you play Iron heroes. 'Cause if not, he'll be left crying, a miserable being whose hopes and illusions have been crushed and left bleeding.


Hey, I've just made the new description of the sacre prostitute's tricks!

Talya
2008-03-07, 07:45 PM
What's iron heroes?

Solo
2008-03-07, 07:50 PM
Exposition (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_Heroes)

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-07, 08:01 PM
Solo's visit reminds me of something: If your DM realizes the gorgonzola of Sacred, use some magnificent pigments and a Helm of opposite alignment, and bring a succubus monk to life to use as a bargaining chip.

Corolinth
2008-03-07, 08:53 PM
The Book of Erotic Fantasy, like any other optional supplement, is best used in pieces.

I approach any sourcebook this way. If a new book comes out, there's an understanding in my games that not everything in that book is going to be available for use. Some things fit, and some things don't. I've found that BoEF adds a lot of flavor to a campaign, but the youngest player in any of my groups is 22 or 23. I'm sure that changes things a lot.

One of the PCs in my OpenRPG campaign is getting married. I think it's reasonable to assume the PC and his bride to be are poking, and that possibly leads to pregnancy. That could become important. How does it affect the PC's career? How does it alter his motivations? It certainly provides an added danger, as now villains can strike at the PC through his family. So does the PC get his wife pregnant? There are mechanics given for that in the BoEF, and that's fairly helpful.

I've also involved a few succubi in my campaign. They're a fitting foil to Taly's firebunny sorceress. Rather than presenting a threat to her person, it's a threat to her soul. She's not likely to die from it, but she will go to the Abyss when she does, and she may take the rest of the PCs down with her. The BoEF doesn't provide much mechanical assistance, but the concepts behind the rules provides a lot of inspiration. For example, I've had an archfiend provide her with access to one or two of the... fancier spells in the book as incentive to embrace evil.

I don't think I'd build a campaign entirely around the material presented in the Book of Erotic Fantasy, but bits and pieces of it can really help characters come alive. And I don't whip out the book at the table. I generally reference tables and such in between sessions. It's a lot like the Book of Vile Darkness in that regard: it's most effective if your players don't really know for certain you're using it, or what you're using it for.

GrassyGnoll
2008-03-07, 08:57 PM
Two horrifying words: Wooden dildo

Imagine if it wasn't mastercraft. Or if it was...

Solo
2008-03-07, 08:59 PM
Solo's visit reminds me of something: If your DM realizes the gorgonzola of Sacred, use some magnificent pigments and a Helm of opposite alignment, and bring a succubus monk to life to use as a bargaining chip.

Remember kids, always use protection! A latex condom is effective in protecting against STDs, pregnancy, and level drain from negative energy effects.

Corolinth
2008-03-07, 09:01 PM
Two horrifying words: Wooden dildoTwo more to make it less horrifying: sand paper

Collin152
2008-03-07, 09:08 PM
Remember kids, always use protection! A latex condom is effective in protecting against STDs, pregnancy, and level drain from negative energy effects.

Man, I see some lawsuits coming from the deaths that will be sure to follow that advertising slogan...

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-07, 09:09 PM
The bad thing is, it works!

Solo
2008-03-07, 09:16 PM
Man, I see some lawsuits coming from the deaths that will be sure to follow that advertising slogan...

Not if they're condoms made by clerics with the Craft Wondrous Item feat and Deathward.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-07, 09:22 PM
Or if the person who uses them can sincerely leave this scribbled in the mirror:

A Wizard Did It.

GrassyGnoll
2008-03-07, 09:26 PM
Two more to make it less horrifying: sand paper

It'd have to be one thorough sanding.

Solo
2008-03-07, 09:31 PM
Eventually, AK and I are going to have some sort of campaign involving Condoms of Deathward, Vow of Nudity Sacred Prostitute Monk Succubi, and about 50 ccs of pure awesome.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-07, 09:36 PM
And do not forget it, everything will end being Asmodeus' wet dream, and he's a pimp who Doesn't Xanatos Gambit people, and is constantly saying "I told ja, sucka!"

Collin152
2008-03-07, 10:15 PM
Not if they're made by clerics with the Craft Wondrous Item feat and Deathward.

Damn, expensive condoms.
I'll just become a lich. Not only will I be immune to negetive levels, but I can't get anyone pregnant!
Course, once I'm dead, there's still he question of why I'm having sex... can't imagine it's still any fun without any flesh-parts...
It still beats paying Clerics to have safe sex.

Solo
2008-03-07, 10:22 PM
It's a wondrous item. It's rather.... durable.

Collin152
2008-03-07, 10:23 PM
Just throw in a complimentary prestidigitation; it's multi-purpose.

Solo
2008-03-07, 10:24 PM
Who needs flavor or lubrication when you have Prestidigitation?

Collin152
2008-03-07, 10:27 PM
Not to mention its cleaning function.
Though not as enticing to some, others will find it... condusive to the nature of a magic condom.

Rutee
2008-03-07, 10:28 PM
Again, this is why we can't have nice things.

Solo
2008-03-07, 10:30 PM
You're welcome.

Collin152
2008-03-07, 10:35 PM
What would you call a warlock who, instead of making wands and scrolls, used his magic item creatign prowess to create Solo's Enhanced Condoms, Belts of Gender Changing, and crystal balls?

Sstoopidtallkid
2008-03-07, 10:43 PM
What would you call a warlock who, instead of making wands and scrolls, used his magic item creatign prowess to create Solo's Superior Sex Shields, Belts of Gender Changing, and crystal balls?Fixed. filler

Collin152
2008-03-07, 10:50 PM
That's like, 12 kajillion times better. Thanks, Sstoopidtallkid.

Solo
2008-03-07, 11:32 PM
Sexilicious.

SurlySeraph
2008-03-08, 12:55 AM
*whacks Solo and Collin with the morality-bat*

That's enough of those filthy plans of yours! You may now go back to discussing any other filthy plans.

@V: Gahh! I made a double entendre without realizing it! There's no escape! *cuts own tongue out to reinforce purity*

Solo
2008-03-08, 01:27 AM
*whacks Solo and Collin with the morality-bat*

That's enough of those filthy plans of yours! You may now go back to discussing any other filthy plans.

I'd call dibs on the filthy plans that involve whacking on people but you beat me to it.

Keld Denar
2008-03-08, 08:56 AM
So, I was just perusing through that Nymphology book, and I must say, a couple of things stood out. 1st, Power Word Orgasm....wow. 7th level spell, all the same stuff as the other power words, except it checks CON score instead of HP. CON less than 10 means 3d6 rounds of bliss (stunned), between 10 and 20 is 2d6, and above 20 is 1d6. 1d6 stun no save? That's silly good.

Now, 3d6 has a max of 18 rounds. 18 rounds is just shy of 2 minutes. 2 FREAKIN MINUTES! STRAIGHT! That's INTENSE! I dunno about you, but I'd get a Greater Rod of Maximize, chug some Wyvern poison to drop my CON under 10, and blast myself!

Imagine the intesting social situations tossing up a couple of Silent PW:Orgasms. You look real intently at the queen of the land at a grand ball and all of the sudden, she falls to the ground screaming. Outstanding party trick!

Oh, and I totally want one other spell from that book. Musical Accompaniment. Its a wiz/sorc 1 spell and creates a disembodied bass groove with a faint Bow Chicka Bow Wow every where you go. That has style written all over it if you ask me.

Rutee
2008-03-08, 09:25 AM
I should probably voice displeasure at being reminded of this, but isn't there a Prismatic Dildo that also induces Orgasm, and who's duration is lengthened the more you try to take it out? Sounds more useful for that sort of thing.

WHY DO I REMEMBER THIS

Pie Guy
2008-03-08, 10:24 AM
My group doesn't have BoEf.
This is either luck or a curse. One of the players is a nymph-cleric-prostitute.
That being said, prostitute is just his job, and although he's a cleric he's never cast a single spell. Ever.
It's really annoying.

Me: Help! I'm at It's really -2 hp!
Him:Well, what do you want me to do about it?
Me: Heal me! you're a f***ing cleric!

And so we go on to win a battle. Then I get healed by resting.
Oh, and I'm a sorcerer, so this has happened a few times.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-08, 10:26 AM
Wow...We HAVE to start producing Solo's superior sex shields of Azerian Kelimon's great stimulus. I can just imagine a succubus' fortune going to getting a few of those.

Solo
2008-03-08, 12:31 PM
Ok, AK, see if you can find some sort of DM crazy and twisted enough to do this...

I can see Warlock/Sorcerer being a perfect Succubus class. Just gotta homebrew a lesser Succubus without heavy LA.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-08, 12:37 PM
I'll be willing to DM. Now, who wants to be matched up to a nymph assasin that will munchkin Unholy Lust and will have a bodice of enervation?

Collin152
2008-03-08, 04:52 PM
I call necromancer pimp.
Maybe I should actually buy this book, though.

Solo
2008-03-08, 05:59 PM
I call necromancer pimp.


Woah there!

Collin152
2008-03-08, 06:01 PM
Woah there!

Oh, come on! How else are people going to qualify for lichloved?

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-08, 06:05 PM
And I wonder who's going to play the slutty half elven lesbian princess.

Come on! It's a staple of NORMAL high fantasy, can't be missing here!


Even the second god of the playground, the Logic Ninja, Acknowledges it!

Collin152
2008-03-08, 06:27 PM
And I wonder who's going to play the slutty half elven lesbian princess.

Come on! It's a staple of NORMAL high fantasy, can't be missing here!



What if I played a slutty half elven gay necromancer prince?
I don't do chicks.

Hey, double entrade.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-08, 06:30 PM
Will do. But remember to put ranks into Disguise to do a Wholesome Crossdresser. Or use Disguise self, because it doubles the chances to get a date in a single night.

Solo
2008-03-08, 06:33 PM
And I wonder who's going to play the slutty half elven lesbian princess.

Come on! It's a staple of NORMAL high fantasy, can't be missing here!


Even the second god of the playground, the Logic Ninja, Acknowledges it!

I'm a succubus. I'm everything and then some.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-08, 06:34 PM
I is twisted!

Collin152
2008-03-08, 06:50 PM
I'm a succubus. I'm everything and then some.

Which reminds me; if a succubus is transformed into a male, is it an incubus, or are they male in their default form?
Oh, also, succubi makes an excellent lyric for any song. Especially if the song is by nightwish.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-08, 07:11 PM
Yeah. Though incubus, the band...Whole 'nother matter.


Additionally, I have now decided I shall start measuring Awesome by Solo's. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/member.php?u=21855)

Examples:

Cult of personality: 9 Solos.

The devil went Down to Georgia: 10 Solos.

Paradise City: 11 Solos.

Collin152: N-1 +1/2 Solos.

Solo: N Solos. And then some. And then a broken measure of awesome.

Collin152
2008-03-08, 07:19 PM
Yeah. Though incubus, the band...Whole 'nother matter.


Additionally, I have now decided I shall start measuring Awesome by Solo's. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/member.php?u=21855)

Examples:

Cult of personality: 9 Solos.

The devil went Down to Georgia: 10 Solos.

Paradise City: 11 Solos.

Collin152: N-1 +1/2 Solos.

Solo: N Solos. And then some. And then a broken measure of awesome.

So... if Solo= N solos, and I equal N-1 +.5 solos... that makes me slightly inferior to him?
Wooh! I'm The Dragon!

(For those who don't browse TV Tropes in their leisure time:
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheDragon

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-08, 07:20 PM
Yeah. You get firebreath, while he gets hadoken. Which means that, returning to the thread theme, you can do it more than once per day!

Collin152
2008-03-08, 07:27 PM
Oh, don't get me started on the "do it" jokes.
Chemists do it periodically on tables, you know.

Cuddly
2008-03-08, 07:34 PM
Mature handling of sexual themes != Stat Boosts.

In a world where doing just about anything, from fluttering your hands and mumbling (arcane casting), singing (bards), to shaking your sword furiously and shouting out noun verb adjective! gives you magical abilities, why not sex?

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-08, 07:35 PM
I dunno, because it would model some people's RL?

FlyMolo
2008-03-08, 07:37 PM
I dunno, because it would model some people's RL?

Certainly not mine. Or if it does, I don't remember it.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-08, 07:38 PM
See! THAT is the reason! D&D NEVER models RL!


Except for a few people who apprently took the Break The Rules Feat...scary.

Collin152
2008-03-08, 07:40 PM
Some people like thinking sex makes them stronger.
This book aparently lets them play that way.

Rutee
2008-03-08, 07:45 PM
His point was a mature handling of sex. And no, BoEF doesn't do that, by definition. It's well written, and not done in an overly immature way, but..

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-08, 07:50 PM
Nymphology.

Also, THE BOEF! IT DO NOTHING!

Collin152
2008-03-08, 07:53 PM
His point was a mature handling of sex. And no, BoEF doesn't do that, by definition. It's well written, and not done in an overly immature way, but..

A mature handling of sex is nigh impossible in a typical game where all the players are guys and mildly to extremly inebriated.
BoEF was clearly not designed to do that. Well, as clearly as it can be to one who hasn't read it, such as myself.

Rutee
2008-03-08, 07:54 PM
I've never heard of people roleplaying while inebriated off of these boards, tbh.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-08, 07:55 PM
Still, it shows why D&D is one of the best systems out there, right after GURPS.

'Cause, ofr this gone wrong...one word: Wraeththu.

FlyMolo
2008-03-08, 08:08 PM
Still, it shows why D&D is one of the best systems out there, right after GURPS.

'Cause, ofr this gone wrong...one word: Wraeththu.

Except for monks.

This thread has got a mite off topic, no?

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-08, 08:08 PM
Yeah. And next thing you know, we'll be going an Ant offtopic.

Collin152
2008-03-08, 08:10 PM
You're right, it kind of has.
What's our topic? Sex?
Just quote sometihng by Frued.
Also, did you know just how similar a female pig's reproductive tract is to a human's?

purple gelatinous cube o' Doom
2008-03-08, 08:11 PM
I have looked through the book before for kicks ,and I must say, I actually kind of like the sacred prostitute class. Especially if you're a casting class of any sort, and have leadership and get a follower. That way, you get to have a little fun, and get twice the number of spells in the same day.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-08, 08:11 PM
Catoblepas

There. We have restored balance in the farce.

FlyMolo
2008-03-08, 08:12 PM
You're right, it kind of has.
What's our topic? Sex?
Just quote sometihng by Frued.
Also, did you know just how similar a female pig's reproductive tract is to a human's?

Yeah. Don't go there. But if were going to, think about dolphins. Do not have sex with dolphins. They will kill you.

several feet long, prehensile, and aggressive. I'll say no more.

Collin152
2008-03-08, 08:14 PM
Were we serious about that game idea?
With AK as Dm, and Solo as kick ass succubus?
We might want to split that off from it's parent thread if we want that to go somewhere.
After all, according to the title, this thread is about builds for the BoEF.


Yeah. Don't go there. But if were going to, think about dolphins. Do not have sex with dolphins. They will kill you.

several feet long, prehensile, and aggressive. I'll say no more.

Did you know Dolphins are the only other mammal besides humans to engage in sexual intercourse for pleasure?

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-08, 08:14 PM
Then, Dolphins equal Do Not Want, but Dolphin Entertainment equals Do Want?

Edit: Agree. I shall DM. You Shall Pass! If you can make kickass humour, that is!

SilverClawShift
2008-03-08, 09:47 PM
I have looked through the book before for kicks ,and I must say, I actually kind of like the sacred prostitute class. Especially if you're a casting class of any sort, and have leadership and get a follower. That way, you get to have a little fun, and get twice the number of spells in the same day.

That's actually flipping brilliant. A 12th level caster with 14 CHA can have a cohort who follows them around 'replenishing' them. And a bunch of first level NPCs at their beck and call to boot.

Solo
2008-03-08, 11:25 PM
That's actually flipping brilliant. A 12th level caster with 14 CHA can have a cohort who follows them around 'replenishing' them. And a bunch of first level NPCs at their beck and call to boot.

Bard, with groupies.

GrassyGnoll
2008-03-08, 11:32 PM
Yeah. Don't go there. But if were going to, think about dolphins. Do not have sex with dolphins. They will kill you.

several feet long, prehensile, and aggressive. I'll say no more.

That guide was hilarious as disturbing.


His point was a mature handling of sex. And no, BoEF doesn't do that, by definition. It's well written, and not done in an overly immature way, but..

I agree, especially on the "but". You can worship a god of hermaphrodites, goblin nookie, and of course, rape. There's a druid spell designed specifically to give people crabs and an entire series of "engorged" spells. There are command word hand party and orgasm. If you got through this paragraph without formulating a joke, you are Peabody McIronsides.

Collin152
2008-03-08, 11:34 PM
Can bards take ranks in Perform (Sexual Acts)?

Solo
2008-03-08, 11:36 PM
And Use Rope, and Ride...



PS. AK, SMBG thread time?

GrassyGnoll
2008-03-08, 11:45 PM
Don't forget UMD for superior sex shields.

Solo
2008-03-08, 11:49 PM
It's a wondrous item. Anyone can use it.

GrassyGnoll
2008-03-09, 12:01 AM
Aw, missed that.

GammaPaladin
2008-03-09, 12:16 AM
Did you know Dolphins are the only other mammal besides humans to engage in sexual intercourse for pleasure?
Nyet. Go look up Bonobo chimps.

Collin152
2008-03-09, 12:27 AM
Nyet. Go look up Bonobo chimps.

Okay, so I've been caught. Counting all apes as a single group, though, Dolphins are the only others.

GrassyGnoll
2008-03-09, 12:34 AM
Nyet. Go look up Bonobo chimps.

I once heard something about lesbian bonobos falling out of trees cause they were scissoring too hard. NPR was having a slow news day I think.

Lyndworm
2008-03-09, 12:58 AM
I once heard something about lesbian bonobos falling out of trees cause they were scissoring too hard. NPR was having a slow news day I think.

This did indeed happen. In fact it's probably happened a few million times over the course of Bonobo history.

So long as we're on the subject, did you know that virtually all known mammals have members that participate in homosexual activities? With some species, (such as elephants and lions) it is considered average and healthy for males to mate with each other. Birds are also known to engage in homoerotic acts, especially female parrots. Homosexuality is not only natural, it may be essential to the balance of nature.

I also know way to much about genitals themselves, if anybody cares to be amazed/disgusted. :P

VerdugoExplode
2008-03-09, 01:15 AM
Well, after having read the thread in it's entirety I must say it resembles a massive train wreck. A massive, beautiful if not slightly disturbing train wreck that fills me with mixed feelings, mainly bordering on vague feelings of discomfort tinged with a kind of horrid curiosity. I would compare it to a train filled with fireworks and petting zoo animals colliding head on with with a train filled with festive paint and ecdysiasts.

The resulting chaos and destruction would closely mimic my current mental status which isn't helped with the mental image of the stereotypical D&D player (250+, neckbeard, unclassifiable body odor etc.) muttering the words "I use my feminine wiles on him" which fills me with a very horrifying mental image which no amount of drinking will cleanse from my subconscious.

Also. to quote the D&D PSA's "I put the romance back in necromancer"

Dan_Hemmens
2008-03-09, 08:02 AM
In a world where doing just about anything, from fluttering your hands and mumbling (arcane casting), singing (bards), to shaking your sword furiously and shouting out noun verb adjective! gives you magical abilities, why not sex?

As Rutee has already pointed out, the key word here is "mature". The BoEF is a mature handling of sexual issues in the same way that the Cleric class is a thoughtful discussion of the implications of a life of faith.

Which is to say, it isn't.

To put it in 4E terms, the BoEF is basically the book for the "Sex" power source (dibs sexual striker!) it's not a book which gives you a number of ways to perform a mature exploration of the nature of sexuality in a fantasy setting, any more than the Complete Divine is a book which gives you a number of ways to perform a mature exploration of religion in a fantasy setting.

Chronos
2008-03-09, 02:34 PM
Did you know Dolphins are the only other mammal besides humans to engage in sexual intercourse for pleasure?I don't know why everyone always says this. All animals have sex for fun. Humans are one of the very few animals who ever have sex for any other reason.

Collin152
2008-03-09, 06:23 PM
I don't know why everyone always says this. All animals have sex for fun. Humans are one of the very few animals who ever have sex for any other reason.

Fine, how about this:
Dolphins, in a manner similar to humans, engage in secual intercourse regardless of the female's present fertility.
Ie, whether or not it's in heat (I forget whether or not Dolphins do that, I know that humans aren't the only ones)

Illiterate Scribe
2008-03-09, 07:03 PM
Then, Dolphins equal Do Not Want, but Dolphin Entertainment equals Do Want?

Edit: Agree. I shall DM. You Shall Pass! If you can make kickass humour, that is!

So, thread? :smallamused:

I'm considering applying those epic 'climb into tight spaces rules'. Y'know, the /tg/ ones.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-09, 07:11 PM
If someone else recruits. 'Cause I suck, suck, suck at playing the face. Unless we're talking bards and musical duels, where I Cult of Personality and Paradise City to victory.

Collin152
2008-03-09, 07:14 PM
If someone else recruits. 'Cause I suck, suck, suck at playing the face. Unless we're talking bards and musical duels, where I Cult of Personality and Paradise City to victory.

Your unusual music selection is no match for my Perform (Unspeakable acts).

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-09, 07:16 PM
I counter with a crowd rousing Knockin' on Heaven's door and a healthy usage of Knowledge (Dirty little secrets you don't want anybody to know).

Collin152
2008-03-09, 07:19 PM
I counter with a crowd rousing Knockin' on Heaven's door and a healthy usage of Knowledge (Dirty little secrets you don't want anybody to know).

Oh yeah?
Wel this boy says "My name's Jhonny, and it may be a sin, but I'll take your bet, you're gunna regret, cause I'm the best theres ever been!"
So Jhonny, resin up your bow, and play that fiddle hard, cause hells broke loose in Georgia, and the devil deals tha cards.
Hmm... I'm undecided. Do I really want to play a necromancer, or a bard?
I could go the thriller route. Michael Jackson's got a ton of innapropriate sexual behavior about him.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-09, 07:23 PM
What about a necromantic bard thanks to an expanded spell list? Little zombie boys!

Oh, and fo' tha' bes' thin' evah' i' musi':

"Sitting in the darkest pits of hell..."

Illiterate Scribe
2008-03-09, 07:24 PM
Oh yeah?
Wel this boy says "My name's Jhonny, and it may be a sin, but I'll take your bet, you're gunna regret, cause I'm the best theres ever been!"
So Jhonny, resin up your bow, and play that fiddle hard, cause hells broke loose in Georgia, and the devil deals tha cards.
Hmm... I'm undecided. Do I really want to play a necromancer, or a bard?
I could go the thriller route. Michael Jackson's got a ton of innapropriate sexual behavior about him.

What about Buffalax style (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6BN0NA5lB8) thriller?

Also, I waste both of your 'Knowledge (Dirty little secrets you don't want anybody to know)' and 'Perform (Unspeakable acts)' checks with a single casting of Mud to That's Not Mud.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-09, 07:26 PM
Hey! MY name is Mud!

Collin152
2008-03-09, 07:52 PM
What about a necromantic bard thanks to an expanded spell list? Little zombie boys!

Oh, and fo' tha' bes' thin' evah' i' musi':

"Sitting in the darkest pits of hell..."

As cool s having a voice to wake the dead would be, a bard really doesn't support undead as well as a cleric can.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-03-09, 07:53 PM
If you PrC into sublime chord, I'm letting you unlock one necromancer spell per level, both of bard and chord.