Which humanoid form as flight?

[Frosty]

When using Alter Self, I remember there is a monster in the MM that has wings and also tons of natural armor. Does anyone remember what that monster is?

[RTGoodman]

I'm not sure about both (and the SRD's monster search isn't coming up with anything), but I know that Lizardfolk or Troglodytes are the common forms to get a bunch of Natural Armor (+5 and +6, respectively). For flight, that's tougher, but I guess Avariel (those winged elves from some FR book) or Raptorans from RotW would work, though Raptoran wings aren't that great until higher HD.

[Dr Bwaa]

I didn't notice anything in a quick skim through the MM just now

[Frosty]

Hmm...then why did everyone say Alter Self is so great? Granted, +6 NA is nothing to sneeze at for a level 2 spell...

[Bag_of_Holding]

Combined with Outsider type, you can use AS to shapeshift into Dwarf Ancestor (or something like that) to get +26 to natural armour. Interested?

[RTGoodman]

Combined with Outsider type, you can use AS to shapeshift into Dwarf Ancestor (or something like that) to get +26 to natural armour. Interested?

I just remembered that and came back to point it out. The problem with alter self is that you can turn into anything of your type. With the addition of new sourcebooks, you can turn into any 5HD or less Construct (as a Warforged), Monstrous Humanoid (if you're a Goliath), Outsider (as a plane-touched race), or anything else you can match. Hey, with RotW, you can even turn into Fey if you play a Killoren. Well, you're still limited by size, but I'm sure you can find good stuff that'll work.

[kpenguin]

If you're a warforged, try alter-selfing yourself into a adamantine statue with wheeled feet.

60 ft. speed and DR 20/-!

[Frosty]

Do you gain Warforged immunities while using Alter Self?

[Talya]

Hmm...then why did everyone say Alter Self is so great? Granted, +6 NA is nothing to sneeze at for a level 2 spell...

Averiel work as someone mentioned. Also, Raptorans would work fine, as once you become one, it makes sense that it functions as a raptoran with YOUR hit dice, not the level 1 raptoran you immitated.

[Frosty]

Better than Fly I guess. Lasts longer.

[The_Snark]

It's great because you can use it to get good natural armor (and natural weapons) OR flight OR use it for a disguise OR get water breathing and a swim speed OR abuse it with alternate creature types.

That is way, way too many options for a second-level spell, and some of them are too good even if that was all the spell did. +6 natural armor is more than a 2nd-level spell should be giving you; Barkskin has a maximum of +5, and only at higher levels. Similarly, Fly is higher level and yet only lasts one minute per level. And that's leaving out the things you can do if you're not a humanoid.

Speaking of which, elans are abberations. Turning into, say, a grell will give you 11 natural attacks, flight with perfect maneuverability, and reach.

[Zincorium]

At level 5, a humanoid can shapeshift into a were-[dire]bat. 40ft (good) fly speed, +5 natural armor. The other lycanthropes are on your list too, but I'm not sure how good most of them would end up being, considering the large amounts of hit dice for anything good.

It does get crazy once you get into forms other than humanoid, yeah.

[Bag_of_Holding]

Do you gain Warforged immunities while using Alter Self?

No, you can only AS into the same type of creature as you are.



At level 5, a humanoid can shapeshift into a were-[dire]bat. 40ft (good) fly speed, +5 natural armor. The other lycanthropes are on your list too, but I'm not sure how good most of them would end up being, considering the large amounts of hit dice for anything good.

It does get crazy once you get into forms other than humanoid, yeah.

Meh, that'd be too good. You can't take any forms with a template, unfortunately.

[Zincorium]

Ach, you're right, didn't remember that caveat. Seemed too strange to be allowed, and now I know why.

[kpenguin]

No, you can only AS into the same type of creature as you are.


Unless, of course, you're a construct. Of course, then you'd be ASing into a form with far fewer immunities.