Uec
2008-03-23, 08:48 AM
I've been lurking for a while, mostly interested in reading, but none the less, I decided to post this.
Okay, this is mostly a thought exercise, I'm not really sure I'm going to implement it myself (not sure that conservative players will like it).
The basic idea is that I want to give the fighter a niche to fill (okay, my first assumption is that people agree with the notion that a fighter in general are sub par, except maybe for the first few levels), and as the "me blue fighter, me smash you" niche is already taken by the barbarian, I want to turn him into more of a strategic planner type, still strong in combat, but valued at least as much for his planning. When he goes "okay guys, here's the plan" people actually listen!
My comments are going to be in spoilers, the fluff for the rules are going to in italics, the meat (what most of you will likely find most interesting) is going to be in standard text.
New class Skills
Knowledge (Arcana, dungeoneering, local, nature, relegion and the planes, geography)
Diplomacy
Skill points goes to (4+int)X4 at first lvl, 4+int at other levels.
Not going to explain too much here, should be obvious further down. But in spite of the added two skill points per level, there is definitely not enough skill points to utilise all of those new skills
Know thy enemy - level 3 base ability
Joern and his party had been hired to take out a outlaw band of mostly half elves, bitter at the world for the resentment they have suffered, know to take on only half elves. The night before at the dinner table their wizard exclaimed "great, I'll prepare sleep!" before getting cut off by Joern, "no, they're immune to that - look, they will likely try to ambush us here and here" he said, while digging out a map
When using knowledge checks to remember useful combat related information about creatures (such as remembering certain immunities resistances), the fighter get a competence bonus of +1/fighter level.
Taking this knowledge test is a standard action, that cannot be taken untrained. It is not possible to retry this test
The basic idea here is to make the fighter more capable of eleborate planning in advance, or even in the midst of battle remember and yell out useful information to his party.
Coordinated attack - level six base ability
Yelling out to his party, Joern made the wizard hurry to throw the fireball before the rest of the party charged into melee, hitting the enemy at the points where they had orders to
The fighter takes a intelligence test as a standard action, with a +1/three fighter levels, DC 15. If he succeeds and are able to make himself heard (ie, not during a harsh tornado, or under the effect of a silence spell and so on) the fighter can lend his fellow party members within 60 feet his initiative count (ie, they get his initiative roll instead of their own) if they wishes to use it. If the fighter dies, goes unconscious or moves more than 60 feet away, they revert to their own original initiative count.
Yes, I know that this makes improved initiative almost mandatory, but honestly, with the fighters amount of feats, he's already taking it anyway. The basic idea here is that a coordinated well planned attack is much more dangerous than uncoordinated. Take note that even though they have lend his initiative they can still delay, so this just brings them all to the same baseline. One can easily imagine the casters and the archery support staying at the fighters initiative (or higher) and the melee combatants delaying just slightly to get SOME of the shooting out of the way before they charge
Spot the ambush - level nine base ability
As the fighter gets more experienced he is able to spot ambushes from far away, almost supernaturally it appears to his fellow party members - but in truth he merely knows where HE would put the ambush
Beginning at level nine, if the fighter has been able to study the local geography at some time in the past, either through maps, being there himself or seeing it from the air, he can take a DC20 geography test, if he succeeds he gets +1/two fighter levels to spot and listen checks to detect ambushers.
If planning an ambush this allow fellow party members gets +1/two fighter levels bonus to hide and move silently if he succeeds at a DC20 geography test.
Ambush is not merely the realm of rangers or rogues, they are the realm of every single competent military leader. Not to utilise them. And not only can he plan ambushes properly, the knowledge of how to do just that, also makes him able to spot them
Lock down for flanking - lvl12 base ability
Joern strode intro the fray, swinging around him with his greatsword, catching the attention of all enemies he encountered - so that only the bravest would dare to turn their attention away from him, thus stopping the enemies from running down to stick the wizard full of holes, or stopping them from turning around to face the rogue sneaking up on them.
As a free action in any round he makes at least one attack he can attract the attention of his enemies, enemies in squares adjacent to his own must succeed a will save DC 10+1/fighter level to turn away from the fighter or even move away from the square that they are currently occupying. The effect last until the fighters next action.
Powerful, ohh yes, make no mistake on that, even at the cost that he WILL be hurt by the attacks at him. But one of the fighters bigger problems is as far as I can see that when he goes into combat to head of the McStabbityStab rogue going for the wizard the rogue merely yells "tumble!" and now the fighter can do nothing at all to stop him.
The will save DC is on the high side, but honestly, at lvl12 most people have a more than fair chance to make a DC 22 will save. None the less, I've been thinking, that maybe 15+1/two fighter levels) could be more reasonable, makes it start out at DC21, and progress to 25 over the next eight levels. What do you say people?
I don't want to tie this into intimidate, his skill points are pressed enough as it is.
Cowards and traitors shall perish - lvl15 base ability
More than anyone the fighter knows that if he flees, or betrays his party, the battle plan are doomed, and with no plan, all is lost. He can instil this knowledge in even the most fearsome of his allies
The fighter himself are immune to fear and charm effects. If it was possible to discuss the battle plan with his allies before the battle, he can with a DC20 diplomacy check give them +1/five fighter levels to their will save against fear and charm effects. Retry is not possible.
The basic idea here is that when he has made a plan, he wont be deterred by fear. He might change the plan if necessary (such as if the ambush he leads are spotted) but he will never fail it by fleeing in panic. I'm not sure that this is too overpowered, it could be changed to a bonus instead.
Shattering reputation - lvl 18 base ability
As he shows himself on a battlefield, his enemies take one look and recognises him, rumours of his skill at arms and planning reaches even the farthest places, and even the deepest part of hell knows fear. As they lay eyes on him, they immediately shakes with fear, and even the smallest surprise becomes a ambush by his planning, the rabbit hopping by? A clear sign of ambushers hiding to the right, a raven flying by? Clearly a sign that there is flying archers in the sky, waiting to rain down death.
Any enemy with a int of 3+ must take a DC 15+int as soon as they see him on the field, if they fail they will be Shaken (as in the fear effect) and any further fear effects will prompt them to flee.
A lvl 18 is one of the most fearsome guys alive, rightfully should the enemies shake with fear. I've purposely made the DC a bit on the low side for such a high level ability (btw, I tied it into int for one single purpose, to make sure that they only get afraid of him if he actually IS a good planner), otherwise it would shatter enemies left and right.
Okay, the basic idea here is to make the fighter a competent planner, to give him a niche other than "Smash things". Combat is his job, and he's not going to blunder about doing stupid things. I know I have introduced a bit of MAD-syndrome, but I do not think that it's all that bad, particularly as even a low intelligence fighter will benefit from this, although not as much as a higher intelligence fighter.
I've deliberately stayed away from the "inspire X" effects to avoid crossing into the bards domain
His fairly dependant on skills, so rogue levels would be tempting yes. However, the cost of taking a rogue level or two is obvious, many of those new abilities are tied into his fighter levels, not to mention that to avoid MAD he will often be clad in heavy armour, unsuited to the rogues sneaky way.
I've tried to keep the mundane flair of a incredible competent fighter and planner, but he's no magic boy. I know I've made him stronger, but that's fine, that was the purpose of this. I also know that he's no match for the batman, but have I made him too strong compared to classes such as the rogue or ranger (some of the more balanced classes IMO)
Okay, this is mostly a thought exercise, I'm not really sure I'm going to implement it myself (not sure that conservative players will like it).
The basic idea is that I want to give the fighter a niche to fill (okay, my first assumption is that people agree with the notion that a fighter in general are sub par, except maybe for the first few levels), and as the "me blue fighter, me smash you" niche is already taken by the barbarian, I want to turn him into more of a strategic planner type, still strong in combat, but valued at least as much for his planning. When he goes "okay guys, here's the plan" people actually listen!
My comments are going to be in spoilers, the fluff for the rules are going to in italics, the meat (what most of you will likely find most interesting) is going to be in standard text.
New class Skills
Knowledge (Arcana, dungeoneering, local, nature, relegion and the planes, geography)
Diplomacy
Skill points goes to (4+int)X4 at first lvl, 4+int at other levels.
Not going to explain too much here, should be obvious further down. But in spite of the added two skill points per level, there is definitely not enough skill points to utilise all of those new skills
Know thy enemy - level 3 base ability
Joern and his party had been hired to take out a outlaw band of mostly half elves, bitter at the world for the resentment they have suffered, know to take on only half elves. The night before at the dinner table their wizard exclaimed "great, I'll prepare sleep!" before getting cut off by Joern, "no, they're immune to that - look, they will likely try to ambush us here and here" he said, while digging out a map
When using knowledge checks to remember useful combat related information about creatures (such as remembering certain immunities resistances), the fighter get a competence bonus of +1/fighter level.
Taking this knowledge test is a standard action, that cannot be taken untrained. It is not possible to retry this test
The basic idea here is to make the fighter more capable of eleborate planning in advance, or even in the midst of battle remember and yell out useful information to his party.
Coordinated attack - level six base ability
Yelling out to his party, Joern made the wizard hurry to throw the fireball before the rest of the party charged into melee, hitting the enemy at the points where they had orders to
The fighter takes a intelligence test as a standard action, with a +1/three fighter levels, DC 15. If he succeeds and are able to make himself heard (ie, not during a harsh tornado, or under the effect of a silence spell and so on) the fighter can lend his fellow party members within 60 feet his initiative count (ie, they get his initiative roll instead of their own) if they wishes to use it. If the fighter dies, goes unconscious or moves more than 60 feet away, they revert to their own original initiative count.
Yes, I know that this makes improved initiative almost mandatory, but honestly, with the fighters amount of feats, he's already taking it anyway. The basic idea here is that a coordinated well planned attack is much more dangerous than uncoordinated. Take note that even though they have lend his initiative they can still delay, so this just brings them all to the same baseline. One can easily imagine the casters and the archery support staying at the fighters initiative (or higher) and the melee combatants delaying just slightly to get SOME of the shooting out of the way before they charge
Spot the ambush - level nine base ability
As the fighter gets more experienced he is able to spot ambushes from far away, almost supernaturally it appears to his fellow party members - but in truth he merely knows where HE would put the ambush
Beginning at level nine, if the fighter has been able to study the local geography at some time in the past, either through maps, being there himself or seeing it from the air, he can take a DC20 geography test, if he succeeds he gets +1/two fighter levels to spot and listen checks to detect ambushers.
If planning an ambush this allow fellow party members gets +1/two fighter levels bonus to hide and move silently if he succeeds at a DC20 geography test.
Ambush is not merely the realm of rangers or rogues, they are the realm of every single competent military leader. Not to utilise them. And not only can he plan ambushes properly, the knowledge of how to do just that, also makes him able to spot them
Lock down for flanking - lvl12 base ability
Joern strode intro the fray, swinging around him with his greatsword, catching the attention of all enemies he encountered - so that only the bravest would dare to turn their attention away from him, thus stopping the enemies from running down to stick the wizard full of holes, or stopping them from turning around to face the rogue sneaking up on them.
As a free action in any round he makes at least one attack he can attract the attention of his enemies, enemies in squares adjacent to his own must succeed a will save DC 10+1/fighter level to turn away from the fighter or even move away from the square that they are currently occupying. The effect last until the fighters next action.
Powerful, ohh yes, make no mistake on that, even at the cost that he WILL be hurt by the attacks at him. But one of the fighters bigger problems is as far as I can see that when he goes into combat to head of the McStabbityStab rogue going for the wizard the rogue merely yells "tumble!" and now the fighter can do nothing at all to stop him.
The will save DC is on the high side, but honestly, at lvl12 most people have a more than fair chance to make a DC 22 will save. None the less, I've been thinking, that maybe 15+1/two fighter levels) could be more reasonable, makes it start out at DC21, and progress to 25 over the next eight levels. What do you say people?
I don't want to tie this into intimidate, his skill points are pressed enough as it is.
Cowards and traitors shall perish - lvl15 base ability
More than anyone the fighter knows that if he flees, or betrays his party, the battle plan are doomed, and with no plan, all is lost. He can instil this knowledge in even the most fearsome of his allies
The fighter himself are immune to fear and charm effects. If it was possible to discuss the battle plan with his allies before the battle, he can with a DC20 diplomacy check give them +1/five fighter levels to their will save against fear and charm effects. Retry is not possible.
The basic idea here is that when he has made a plan, he wont be deterred by fear. He might change the plan if necessary (such as if the ambush he leads are spotted) but he will never fail it by fleeing in panic. I'm not sure that this is too overpowered, it could be changed to a bonus instead.
Shattering reputation - lvl 18 base ability
As he shows himself on a battlefield, his enemies take one look and recognises him, rumours of his skill at arms and planning reaches even the farthest places, and even the deepest part of hell knows fear. As they lay eyes on him, they immediately shakes with fear, and even the smallest surprise becomes a ambush by his planning, the rabbit hopping by? A clear sign of ambushers hiding to the right, a raven flying by? Clearly a sign that there is flying archers in the sky, waiting to rain down death.
Any enemy with a int of 3+ must take a DC 15+int as soon as they see him on the field, if they fail they will be Shaken (as in the fear effect) and any further fear effects will prompt them to flee.
A lvl 18 is one of the most fearsome guys alive, rightfully should the enemies shake with fear. I've purposely made the DC a bit on the low side for such a high level ability (btw, I tied it into int for one single purpose, to make sure that they only get afraid of him if he actually IS a good planner), otherwise it would shatter enemies left and right.
Okay, the basic idea here is to make the fighter a competent planner, to give him a niche other than "Smash things". Combat is his job, and he's not going to blunder about doing stupid things. I know I have introduced a bit of MAD-syndrome, but I do not think that it's all that bad, particularly as even a low intelligence fighter will benefit from this, although not as much as a higher intelligence fighter.
I've deliberately stayed away from the "inspire X" effects to avoid crossing into the bards domain
His fairly dependant on skills, so rogue levels would be tempting yes. However, the cost of taking a rogue level or two is obvious, many of those new abilities are tied into his fighter levels, not to mention that to avoid MAD he will often be clad in heavy armour, unsuited to the rogues sneaky way.
I've tried to keep the mundane flair of a incredible competent fighter and planner, but he's no magic boy. I know I've made him stronger, but that's fine, that was the purpose of this. I also know that he's no match for the batman, but have I made him too strong compared to classes such as the rogue or ranger (some of the more balanced classes IMO)