Five man band

[Tass]

The Giant knows his tropes. The OoTS is a five man band. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/FiveManBand)

:roy: The Hero (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheHero)
:elan: The Lancer (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheLancer)
:durkon: The Big Guy (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheBigGuy)
:vaarsuvius: The Smart Guy (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheSmartGuy)
:haley: The Chick (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheChick)
:belkar: The Sixth Ranger (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SixthRanger)

[Jayngfet]

I think you need some counting assistance there buddy.

[aapje]

The Chick - (tambourine, vocal effects) - usually the band's "heart" or moral center and usually the most innocent and/or emotional of the group.

Haley the moral center?

[Kurald Galain]

:elan: The Lancer (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheLancer) "The right-hand man and go-to guy for The Hero. He has the same well-rounded skill set as his counterpart," - er, I don't think so.


:durkon: The Big Guy (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheBigGuy) "The Big Guy will often be the band's "tank"; a Mighty Glacier who serves as the strongest physical fighter, but also the slowest and least proficient at magic." - doesn't look so fitting either.


:haley: The Chick (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheChick) "Traditionally the token female, and usually the most emotional or innocent member of the group" - Hah! Most innocent, our dear thief?


:belkar: The Sixth Ranger (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SixthRanger) "Then, mid-season, a mysterious new character appears, fighting the protagonists and antagonists alike! " Yeah, that's not Belkar either.

So, er, no. The Giant certainly knows his tropes, but these aren't them.

[Deuce]

Haley the moral center?

I thought Elan was the heart - maybe he's the Chick, and Haley is the Lancer? She is the second in command. Not sure about a Dwarf being the Big Guy either, except when he casts Thor's Might.

[Tass]

I think you need some counting assistance there buddy.

Well Belkar doesn't count, he's the sixt ranger.

...He's a ranger at least.


Haley the moral center?

I have quite a few good replies to that. I can't deside, so here are a few:

1: http://www.thefreedictionary.com/usual
2: Well I think she is.
3: Well she is a chick.
4: Come on, next you will claim that Belkar won't be revealed to be a good character. :p


"The right-hand man and go-to guy for The Hero. He has the same well-rounded skill set as his counterpart," - er, I don't think so.

"The Big Guy will often be the band's "tank"; a Mighty Glacier who serves as the strongest physical fighter, but also the slowest and least proficient at magic." - doesn't look so fitting either.

"Traditionally the token female, and usually the most emotional or innocent member of the group" - Hah! Most innocent, our dear thief?

"Then, mid-season, a mysterious new character appears, fighting the protagonists and antagonists alike! " Yeah, that's not Belkar either.

So, er, no. The Giant certainly knows his tropes, but these aren't them.

Bah, you're just fishing the worst parts. :)


I thought Elan was the heart - maybe he's the Chick, and Haley is the Lancer? She is the second in command. Not sure about a Dwarf being the Big Guy either, except when he casts Thor's Might.

Good point.


# The Hero - (lead singer) - the leader of the group; can be clean-cut and upstanding, bold and charismatic, serious and driven, or some combination of the three.
# The Lancer - (lead guitarist) - the second-in-command, usually a contrast to The Hero. If the Hero is clean-cut, the Lancer is a grizzled Anti Hero; if the Hero is the driven and straight-laced type, the Lancer is more relaxed and level-headed. In a comedy situation, the Lancer is often The Straight Man or a Deadpan Snarker.
# The Big Guy - (bassist or drummer) - the strongman of the team, often dumb. Or mute. Sometimes a Genius Bruiser instead.
# The Smart Guy - (keyboardist) - the physically weak, but intelligent or clever member, often annoying or for comic relief; often a Trickster and a buddy of the Big Guy.
# The Chick - (tambourine, vocal effects) - usually the band's "heart" or moral center and usually the most innocent and/or emotional of the group. This role is usually taken by the token female of the group, hence the name, and if there's a royal in the band, it's usually her: see Princess Allura (Voltron), and Princess Leia Organa (Star Wars). If done wrong, the poor Chick is little more than a useless tag-along who gets in the other heroes' way. If done right, she can become a secondary Lancer or Smart Guy, or perhaps the Team Mom. The Hero and Lancer are usually in a Love Triangle with her at the center.

[Spiryt]

The Hero and Lancer are usually in a Love Triangle with her at the center.


Can I ask why are you bolding it?
If there is any Love Triangle in OotS, I am obviously in other universe, reading some different OotS...

[Yiuel]

I agree with Tass that the OotS might be a five-men band, but the roles are certainly different.

Roy clearly is the Leader. Here, there's no questioning.

Haley is not the Chick, Elan is. Even though he's male, he clearly acts as the Charisma holder of the group, is some kind of an emotional support (though a very bothering one, at times). He's also closer to a royal than any other (he served some great guy, and is the son of an Evil overlord.)

Now then, Haley. She is the Lancer. She is a girl and it would be too easy to let her be the Chick. But she isn't. She has a lot more character than Elan. She has been more useful, and on a lot of occasions, where Roy failed, she was there to make him right. (Red strikes true, Lord Shojo, the Con Game)

Now, is there a love triangle between these? No, but Elan seems to admire Roy a lot, which somewhat implies a love problem for Haley. But still, she ultimately got the Chick (if only because she's the girl).

Now, who's the Tough guy and who's the Smart guy? It was all to easy to fall into V's intelligence's trap. V's brilliant in learning, but V doesn't have much common sense. So, my guess would be that Vaarsuvius is the Tough guy (as counterintuitive as it may seem). Look at how V manages to be overkilling with the Elementals and the huge army. And V is proficient in strenght, yet through deep magic.

So Durkon is the Smart guy. It doesn't show up because of V's pure knowledge, but he does show a lot of common sense. His use of the Control Weather scroll was brilliant. And look at how he scolds Julia and how proactive he is in the situation. Masterful.

Finally, Belkar is the wild sixth element. He doesn't fight against them, be he clearly is an opponent to deal with. Look at how Roy defends him not for being good, but for having been loyal despite all the possibilities he got to just backstab all of his team. Because he still could do it, at any time.

[Belkar Rocks]

Hmm, interesting idea, Tass, but I've gotta go with Yiuel's line of reasoning on who best fits which "type".

Of course, none of them are perfect fits, but it does make for a fun bit of conjecture. :smallsmile:

[Tass]

I agree with most Yiuel says. Elan taking a lot of the chicks roles makes sense. There haven't been true love triangles, but Haley has often been jealous of various chicks elan has made out with.

I'm not sure about switching Durkon and V though. The smart guy does not always have common sense.


In fantasy settings, he'll usually be skilled at magic -- Particularly of the offensive variety, in which case he serves as the team's "Nuker". (...) Note that in recent years, as casts have become more gender-balanced, The Smart Guy is the one most likely to swap genders. Since the character type is outwardly sexless and non-masculine, turning him into The Smart Girl is not that big a stretch.

Deffinitely V.

(On a side not, in the cast page Elan is more clearly a Lancer and Haley the chick, but there Roy is not the hero...)

[Yiuel]

I did have a lot of problems with V and Durkon. They do exchange places a lot during the strip.

However, we can't say much about Durkon's masculinity. Not that V is anything masculine, but at least, V is married. Durkon first had sex in the strip (while all others had before).

The Smart one is usually a Deus ex machina when all other solutions have failed. Durkon, not V, will be the True Resurrection caster. Durkon, out of nowhere, was able to kick the Gnome's ass, V failing powerlessly.

Also, The Strong, as I feel it, ia always a strength seeker. V's question to the kobold is clear : V has been very strightforward. Also, V's androgynity is actually a feature here. It makes V even less a stereotype of the Strong.

[Dervag]

I thought Elan was the heart - maybe he's the Chick, and Haley is the Lancer? She is the second in command.That actually makes a lot of sense.


Now, who's the Tough guy and who's the Smart guy? It was all to easy to fall into V's intelligence's trap. V's brilliant in learning, but V doesn't have much common sense. So, my guess would be that Vaarsuvius is the Tough guy (as counterintuitive as it may seem). Look at how V manages to be overkilling with the Elementals and the huge army. And V is proficient in strenght, yet through deep magic.I think you have a point. But when you say "huge army" do you mean "army that is huge" or do you mean "army that may be small, but is composed of individually huge units?":smallbiggrin:


I did have a lot of problems with V and Durkon. They do exchange places a lot during the strip.Yeah. I'd say that they both alternate between "big guy/smart guy" roles through the strip.


However, we can't say much about Durkon's masculinity. Not that V is anything masculine, but at least, V is married. Durkon first had sex in the strip (while all others had before).Yes, but we can at least say confidently that he is in fact male. He also seems to be relatively young (in that he hasn't spent very much time living in the outside world), which explains the "first having sex" bit. Fellow lives a sheltered clerical lifestyle, y'know?


The Smart one is usually a Deus ex machina when all other solutions have failed. Durkon, not V, will be the True Resurrection caster. Durkon, out of nowhere, was able to kick the Gnome's ass, V failing powerlessly.There can certainly be siutations where the Smart Guy fails and the Strong Guy comes in and saves the situation.

[Morgan Wick]

Once upon a time, TV Tropes itself claimed:
:roy:: The Hero
:haley:: The Lancer
:durkon:: The Big Guy
:vaarsuvius:: The Smart Guy
:elan:: The Chick
:belkar:: The Sixth Ranger

I would vouch for Belkar as the Big Guy, believe it or not, and discard his homicidal tendencies for filling out the group. I would discard Durkon to the Sixth Ranger as he's by far the least fleshed out of the group. Alternately, make Elan the "tagalong kid", Haley the Chick, and Belkar or Durkon the Lancer, at least for the early strips.

Don't read too much in the cast page... Rich is just subverting the fact that normally you'd expect Haley to be the Chick and Roy the Big Guy if you were going stereotypically - characterizations both of them object to.

[David Argall]

The relationships are more or less accidental. We have a large number of elements that can be more or less randomly attached to any of the heros and the result will be a "5 man band" [which does not always number 5].

We might note we are told Roy was originally going to be the mage of the group. This degree of rewriting should tell us the gang was not modeled on any particular source.

[hanzo66]

I'd say that Belkar is the Toblerone (tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/main/TheToblerone) of the group (IE the Korgan).

[BarnZarn]

I agree with Tass that the OotS might be a five-men band, but the roles are certainly different.

Roy clearly is the Leader. Here, there's no questioning.

Haley is not the Chick, Elan is. Even though he's male, he clearly acts as the Charisma holder of the group, is some kind of an emotional support (though a very bothering one, at times). He's also closer to a royal than any other (he served some great guy, and is the son of an Evil overlord.)

Now then, Haley. She is the Lancer. She is a girl and it would be too easy to let her be the Chick. But she isn't. She has a lot more character than Elan. She has been more useful, and on a lot of occasions, where Roy failed, she was there to make him right. (Red strikes true, Lord Shojo, the Con Game)

Now, is there a love triangle between these? No, but Elan seems to admire Roy a lot, which somewhat implies a love problem for Haley. But still, she ultimately got the Chick (if only because she's the girl).

Now, who's the Tough guy and who's the Smart guy? It was all to easy to fall into V's intelligence's trap. V's brilliant in learning, but V doesn't have much common sense. So, my guess would be that Vaarsuvius is the Tough guy (as counterintuitive as it may seem). Look at how V manages to be overkilling with the Elementals and the huge army. And V is proficient in strenght, yet through deep magic.

So Durkon is the Smart guy. It doesn't show up because of V's pure knowledge, but he does show a lot of common sense. His use of the Control Weather scroll was brilliant. And look at how he scolds Julia and how proactive he is in the situation. Masterful.

Finally, Belkar is the wild sixth element. He doesn't fight against them, be he clearly is an opponent to deal with. Look at how Roy defends him not for being good, but for having been loyal despite all the possibilities he got to just backstab all of his team. Because he still could do it, at any time.

Personally, this is the one I agree with the most. However, I do believe that Durkon is the big guy and V is the smart guy. The big guy isn't usually the overkiller. The big guy is usually the loyal, friendly type (like Durkon).

[Peelee]

The Mod on the Silver Mountain: The band is playing a dirge for this thread.