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Crazy Scot
2008-04-10, 04:10 AM
I couldn't find any reference in the books that I have, so I am opening this up to the board to see if anyone else knows if there are any RAW that would hinder this idea.

I was looking in the Spell Compendium at the spell Girallon's Blessing and the wording thereof. It says that the spell gives the touched creature "an additional pair of arms". My question is: are there any rules out there that would stop a caster from using this spell multiple times to gain more arms? (i.e. spell x2 => +4 arms)

I know that in the DMG it says that different types of bonuses always stack (i.e. enhancement and inherent) and that untyped bonuses stack with everything. This spell doesn't describe the extra arms gained with a specific type of bonus, so would it be stackable? Or would that be up to each DM to adjudicate? Or does the fact that no bonus type is listed not even matter?

Thanks.

Nebo_
2008-04-10, 04:12 AM
I couldn't find any reference in the books that I have, so I am opening this up to the board to see if anyone else knows if there are any RAW that would hinder this idea.

I was looking in the Spell Compendium at the spell Girallon's Blessing and the wording thereof. It says that the spell gives the touched creature "an additional pair of arms". My question is: are there any rules out there that would stop a caster from using this spell multiple times to gain more arms? (i.e. spell x2 => +4 arms)

I know that in the DMG it says that different types of bonuses always stack (i.e. enhancement and inherent) and that untyped bonuses stack with everything. This spell doesn't describe the extra arms gained with a specific type of bonus, so would it be stackable? Or would that be up to each DM to adjudicate? Or does the fact that no bonus type is listed not even matter?

Thanks.

It's from the same source, therefore it does not stack.

Erebus
2008-04-10, 04:44 AM
Its excatly the same as casting Bull's Strength on yourself twice :) the bonuses do not stack... :D

Khanderas
2008-04-10, 04:46 AM
What they said.
Generally unless otherwise stated the same thing dont stack with itself
(exceptions will be mentioned in the spell/feats description, such as multiple uses of the toughness feat)

Crazy Scot
2008-04-10, 04:49 AM
It's from the same source, therefore it does not stack.

Do you have a good reference for this?


Its excatly the same as casting Bull's Strength on yourself twice :) the bonuses do not stack... :D

No, the difference between your example and mine is that Bull's Strength specifically states that it is an "enhancement" bonus. Typed bonuses do not stack with a bonus of the same type, but they would if they were different bonuses. So if you had Bull's Strength and used Wish to get an Inherent bonus to Strength, they would stack as the bonus types would be different. My thought was that since in the spell description there was no type listed, it might stack.

Sstoopidtallkid
2008-04-10, 04:55 AM
Spells that provide bonuses or penalties on attack rolls, damage rolls, saving throws, and other attributes usually do not stack with themselves. More generally, two bonuses of the same type don’t stack even if they come from different spells (or from effects other than spells; see Bonus Types, above).

Different Bonus Names
The bonuses or penalties from two different spells stack if the modifiers are of different types. A bonus that isn’t named stacks with any bonus.

Same Effect More than Once in Different Strengths
In cases when two or more identical spells are operating in the same area or on the same target, but at different strengths, only the best one applies.

Same Effect with Differing Results
The same spell can sometimes produce varying effects if applied to the same recipient more than once. Usually the last spell in the series trumps the others. None of the previous spells are actually removed or dispelled, but their effects become irrelevant while the final spell in the series lasts.

One Effect Makes Another Irrelevant
Sometimes, one spell can render a later spell irrelevant. Both spells are still active, but one has rendered the other useless in some fashion.The bolded portions are the ones I think actually matter to this discussion. It's a bit unclear. Most of the statements support the "doesn't stack" interpretation, but the one line about untyped bonuses stacking may invalidate all of the others. :smallconfused:

Fun.

Erebus
2008-04-10, 04:55 AM
Argh missed the part of no-type...Still I do not think it can stack unless it says so in the description as Khanderas said earlier...My example was a bad one apparently :smalltongue:

Crazy Scot
2008-04-10, 05:06 AM
Sstoopidtallkid I see what you mean. While they are definitely not typed, they do come from the same spell source. And while they are not of differing strengths, nor are they producing different effects, I think the last rule applies the best. Basically, a spell can render a different one irrelevant. They are still both in effect, but they just overlap. I just thought it would be an interesting idea, but now that I think about it more. What would you do as a PC if you DM threw a monster at you with 16 arms each one carrying a longsword? Like I said, I thought it might be a good idea, but now I don't think it works. Thanks for all the help everyone!

Nebo_
2008-04-10, 05:09 AM
What would you do as a PC if you DM threw a monster at you with 16 arms each one carrying a longsword?

Cast Dispel Magic and wonder why he didn't cast Fuse Arms.

martyboy74
2008-04-10, 06:50 AM
Could you cast Girallon's Blessing, then Fuse Arms, then Girallon's Blessing again?

KillianHawkeye
2008-04-10, 07:40 AM
I don't get why this is even a discussion about bonus types. The spell doesn't grant you "a +2 bonus to the number of arms you have." You just grow two extra arms.

Burley
2008-04-10, 08:45 AM
It's not about what type of bonus. It's more about it being the same bonus, and people are saying "typed bonuses don't stack, so, this shouldn't either." I think. Anyways, this should be one of those spells where casting it a second time just restarts the duration. Besides, if you're in a fight and spend more than one round...growing limbs...something is gonna come stab you. I would.

And, no. You couldn't cast Girallon's Blessing, then Fuse Arms, then Girallon's Blessing again. Well, you could, but to no effect. Girallon's Blessing is still in effect, so, casting it again wouldn't do anything. However, I could see the usefulness of casting Girallon's Blessing again after Fuse Arms to extend the duration. I'd hate to have Girallon's Blessing wear off before Fuse Arms did, and just have one big arm growing from my chest. :smalltongue:

valadil
2008-04-10, 10:01 AM
Do untyped bonuses from the same source stack? I don't think they do but I could be wrong. As Killian pointed out, two extra arms aren't strictly bonuses.

Seriously, this one is probably up to your GM. And I don't know a single GM that would allow this to stack with itself.