PDA

View Full Version : Advice for a TWFighter and a CCleric.



Helios Sunshard
2008-04-12, 02:25 AM
So, we are starting a new campaign thursday, we are 5 players, yet only 2 have played for more than 3 sessions. the party members are:


-Dwarf Fighter (going to dwarf defender).
-Human Druid.
-Human Sorcerer or Wizard.
-Human Fighter (using TWF).
-Human Cloistered Cleric (me).


I wanted to know if you had any tips for the last 2 characters, like feats, spells, possible Prcs or anything noteworthy.

Additional character info:
The TWF wants to focus on damage (yeah, i know, Two handed weapon is considered better, but he wants to play that... most of his experience has come from BG2) so any good way to increase it would be appreciated.

I choose as domains Travel, luck and the bonus domain Knowledge, i am playing a support role, also i was thinking about using reach spell and focusing on healing or debuffing from far away using DMM, yet it didnt seem useful at all when i thought about it again.


Oh right, we are using the same stats for all the characters: 16 14 13 12 12 10 we can move those on a 2 by 2 basis, we are starting at level 3 and anything outside core must be seen by the DM.

JaxGaret
2008-04-12, 02:33 AM
Human Fighter tips: use 2H Greatsword/Armor Spikes TWF. Think about using Warblade instead, or Fighter/Warblade multiclass.

Tips for you: good domain choices, you seem like you know what you're doing. Anything more specific that you have questions about?

Definitely focus on debuffs before healing, particularly if you can coordinate with the Wizard and Druid for battlefield control efforts.

Eldariel
2008-04-12, 10:08 AM
There're few other options for TWFighter, such as OTWF with Power Attack (albeit Greatsword does it just fine; doesn't go for Armor Spikes or Unarmed Strikes though), or going Dervish for massive bonuses to hit and relevant damage points along with great improvements to defensive fighting and so on. Also, Bloodclaw Master-based Tiger Claw-wielding character works very well.

Cloistered Cleric - just pick some boost spells. Thanks to Divine Power, you'll still be able to kick ass, so around level 9 you could start to fight just as a normal Cleric. Until then, you'll indeed want to focus on battlefield control and maybe summons or some such.

Also, please kick the Dwarf Fighter in the crotch before he takes a level in that class. Maybe he'll realize how stupid he feels as large enemies hit him from 10' away and he can't hit back as he sits in his defensive stance, while important enemies walk past him straight to party casters before he picks levels in the class. At least make him realize that using Defensive Stance is a bad idea. He'll thank you later. Deepwarden, Hammer of Moradin or similar PRCs would do the Dwarf Warrior (defensive, as applicable) flavour just as well as Dwarven Defender while not giving you an ability that stops you from defending your party. Just a suggestion.

Jack_Simth
2008-04-12, 10:12 AM
So, we are starting a new campaign thursday, we are 5 players, yet only 2 have played for more than 3 sessions. the party members are:


-Dwarf Fighter (going to dwarf defender).
-Human Druid.
-Human Sorcerer or Wizard.
-Human Fighter (using TWF).
-Human Cloistered Cleric (me).


I wanted to know if you had any tips for the last 2 characters, like feats, spells, possible Prcs or anything noteworthy.

Additional character info:
The TWF wants to focus on damage (yeah, i know, Two handed weapon is considered better, but he wants to play that... most of his experience has come from BG2) so any good way to increase it would be appreciated.

I choose as domains Travel, luck and the bonus domain Knowledge, i am playing a support role, also i was thinking about using reach spell and focusing on healing or debuffing from far away using DMM, yet it didnt seem useful at all when i thought about it again.


Oh right, we are using the same stats for all the characters: 16 14 13 12 12 10 we can move those on a 2 by 2 basis, we are starting at level 3 and anything outside core must be seen by the DM.
Sounds like your Cloistered Cleric will do fine. One thing though... a CLOISTERED cleric with the TRAVEL domain? Perfectly legal, but... um... thematically? DMM(Reach Spell) isn't overly broken, although it is a rather strong choice - once you get Slay Living (5th level spell). Before then, it lets you heal from across the battlefield, or zap (by way of Inflict spells) from same. Most of your lower-level save or suck spells are ranged effect anyway.

TWF Fighter:
There's a couple of ways to do it that'll work.
1) Focus on +X equivalent weapons, and +damage stuff that applies equally to both; two +1 Frost Shocking shortswords, with both Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization (shortsword) can do better than a single +4 Greatsword (especially if you can beg a couple of Greater Magic Weapon spells off the party casters)... until you run into a situation where you've got a single attack (charge, AoO, slow effect), DR, or energy resistence. Rogues make better two weapon fighters in this regard, due to the sneak attack damage.
2) Cheat. Use a two-handed weapon as your primary and a no-handed weapon as your secondary. Greatsword (or other two-handed weapon) and Armor Spikes or Improved Unarmed Strike (armor spikes are easier to improve, though). Focus on the primary weapon for your budget, beg (Greater) Magic Weapon off the party casters for the secondary.

Helios Sunshard
2008-04-12, 02:05 PM
Sounds like your Cloistered Cleric will do fine. One thing though... a CLOISTERED cleric with the TRAVEL domain? Perfectly legal, but... um... thematically?

A bit of backstory: since kid he heard tales, legends and heroic adventures, so he grew up thinking that they would come to him someday, yet nothing happened for years, so he grew reading them over and over. Until one day, a group of clerics of Fharlanghn/Oghma (i have not chosen yet, oghma seems better for the "spread knowlegde as much as you can" while Fharlanghn seems better for "never stop traveling") came to the town, he was surprised by their way of living and decided to become a cleric himself, yet, as he isnt a fighter he spend most of the time exploring and learning. He is only cloistered on the name, but it seems better for his concept.

Thank you all for your advice, i also wanted to know how to increase my turning attempts and stat distribution, i was thinking on: 16 17 14 10 10 10 for the fighter and 10 14 14 12 17 10 for my cleric, i want to keep my int, but i dont know if lacking on cha will hurt my TU, what do you think?.

Nebo_
2008-04-12, 05:38 PM
Also, please kick the Dwarf Fighter in the crotch before he takes a level in that class. Maybe he'll realize how stupid he feels as large enemies hit him from 10' away and he can't hit back as he sits in his defensive stance, while important enemies walk past him straight to party casters before he picks levels in the class. At least make him realize that using Defensive Stance is a bad idea. He'll thank you later. Deepwarden, Hammer of Moradin or similar PRCs would do the Dwarf Warrior (defensive, as applicable) flavour just as well as Dwarven Defender while not giving you an ability that stops you from defending your party. Just a suggestion.

QFT. Kick hard and aim well.

Jack_Simth
2008-04-12, 06:52 PM
A bit of backstory: since kid he heard tales, legends and heroic adventures, so he grew up thinking that they would come to him someday, yet nothing happened for years, so he grew reading them over and over. Until one day, a group of clerics of Fharlanghn/Oghma (i have not chosen yet, oghma seems better for the "spread knowlegde as much as you can" while Fharlanghn seems better for "never stop traveling") came to the town, he was surprised by their way of living and decided to become a cleric himself, yet, as he isnt a fighter he spend most of the time exploring and learning. He is only cloistered on the name, but it seems better for his concept.

Okay.


Thank you all for your advice, i also wanted to know how to increase my turning attempts and stat distribution, i was thinking on: 16 17 14 10 10 10 for the fighter and 10 14 14 12 17 10 for my cleric, i want to keep my int, but i dont know if lacking on cha will hurt my TU, what do you think?.
As a Cloistered Cleric, you don't really need much in the way of Int, simply because you've got a base six skill points per level, and nobody will really expect you to be a skill monkey. A ten goes there.

As you'll primarily be buffing/debuffing the party (at least, you said that's your plan...) and you're squishy with a d6 HD, you don't want to be in melee, so you don't need much in the way of strength - a ten goes there, as well.

After that, it's Wis first, Con second. You only get light armor proficiency, so you want some Dex (unless you plan on investing feats into medium or heavy armor proficiency). Then Charisma.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-04-12, 07:03 PM
And as for the TWF'er...

Three words: Two. Weapon. Pounce.

Whoa. Did a fighter suddenly get a lot more useful?

Then, pick up Rend for the extra punch. Get the DM to houserule Spring attack so that it gives you as many attacks as you'd get from a full attack, and ask him if taking Dual strike would stack with that. That should give him enough powah so as not to be useless.

And take System Shocker to make the dwarven defender lose all actions if you hit hard enough, Donnae change anything, but it's fun.

JaxGaret
2008-04-12, 09:41 PM
A bit of backstory: since kid he heard tales, legends and heroic adventures, so he grew up thinking that they would come to him someday, yet nothing happened for years, so he grew reading them over and over. Until one day, a group of clerics of Fharlanghn/Oghma (i have not chosen yet, oghma seems better for the "spread knowlegde as much as you can" while Fharlanghn seems better for "never stop traveling") came to the town, he was surprised by their way of living and decided to become a cleric himself, yet, as he isnt a fighter he spend most of the time exploring and learning. He is only cloistered on the name, but it seems better for his concept.

You could say that he personally worships Oghma, but saw in the Clerics of Fharlanghn something that he was missing in his life, so he now follows that path.

There's nothing that says you can't worship two gods.

Adonis1x23
2008-04-13, 08:41 AM
And as for the TWF'er...

Three words: Two. Weapon. Pounce.

Whoa. Did a fighter suddenly get a lot more useful?



Why not just dip a level into Lion Totem Barbarian(CC)?

Pounce is far more useful(and less feat exhaustive) than TWPounce. Also the d12 is pretty handy.

Yvian
2008-04-13, 09:38 AM
This may not be the best advice,

But I would recommend a swashbuckler/rouge for the TWF, then maybe head into Devish PrC. If you are going to go with something sub par like TWF, then you might as well grab a class that gives you a ton of skill points and dance all around the board.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-04-13, 11:03 AM
Why not just dip a level into Lion Totem Barbarian(CC)?

Pounce is far more useful(and less feat exhaustive) than TWPounce. Also the d12 is pretty handy.

Because we don't know if the player wants to be Chaotic and a Barb (I certainly wouldn't), and thus I'm suggesting a fitting and still useful approach.

Yvian: Three words: Not 'nuff feats.

Yvian
2008-04-13, 11:58 AM
[QUOTE=Azerian Kelimon;4186071

Yvian: Three words: Not 'nuff feats.[/QUOTE]

Power Attack
Darning Outlaw
Combat Expertise
Dodge
Moblity
Weapon Focus

I mean, what, a human could get them by 12th level. O.K., maybe mix in a few fighter levels....

I guess my point being is that one can get a good TWF with a swashbuckler/rouge. Not optimal - but than again anything with TWf is not going to be optimal. But with all of the extra skill points [and if you play with skill tricks] then one can build something that is fun.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-04-13, 12:07 PM
Look at that. 5 feats. Not one of them TWF. You START having TWF by level 12. You max it at 18. That's simply a bad build.

And a Pouncer or ToBBer CAN be effective. You just need to know how to build.

Helios Sunshard
2008-04-13, 07:22 PM
After a bit of research, i came upon the practical metamagic feat, now, this could increase the number of reach spells i could use without having to spend too many feats on Extra turning, so i could focus on other supporting feats too (could you suggest any? augment healing seems worthless by the level i could start taking other ones). Yet it seems a bit cheesy and i dont know if it will apply to the DMM version.

Tomorrow i will talk to the future Dwarf Defender and suggest another Prc, i hadnt seen it before... it is... well, they are walls... with the drawbacks of being a wall. As for the TWF, i will suggest magical weapons with extra damage, maybe some levels in rogue (have not seen dervish yet, what do they do?) TWRend, TWPounce (i dont know if him or the dm may be ok with Lion Totem) and mmm... what else?.

Thank you all again, if you have any other suggestion please tell me :smalltongue:.