Uratha [Class Concept]

[Primal Fury]

Greetings all! some time ago, I heard about a White Wolf game called Werewolf: the Forsaken, and I thought to myself "Hey thats really awsome, I'd like to try that in my group." But then I looked over the stats and mechanics and realized that no one would be willing to make such a huge change to the way that we game, and I wasnt really willing to do so either to tell you the truth. So I was thinking about making a class or some such thing to at least simulate the Uratha, rather than just play a D&D style werewolf. I don't think it should be a template or a race, it's far too complicated and the LA would be WAY too high. So what does everyone think at first glance? If I get some good responses, or a lot of questions, I'll start posting some information and ideas.

Thank you for your time. :smallsmile:

[Onryou]

Monte Cook's Word of Darkness has that very class. Although it may not be that balanced starting with a BaB of +4 and all.

[Primal Fury]

?!?!?:smalleek: what the... how was i not informed about this?! let me take a look at that. i'll be back afterwards.

[Stycotl]

that could be interesting. i don't know anything about the uratha; i hated it when white wolf killed off the old world of darkness. but there is certainly precedence for a shapeshifter class.

you would base it kinda off of sorcerer or warlock, with the idea that they were humans with supernatural blood. in that sense, just like warlock or sorc, the werewolf would be almost more of a racial class, not a profession that was chosen (wiz, fighter, etc).

i would probably give some sort of shapeshift ability at early 'pup' levels, with minor magical talents. as they increase in level, you could give them full shapeshifting, more powerful homid/war/lupin forms, and more powerful gifts.

stepping sideways would be comparable to planar travel, but would probably be limited to specific planes. astral or ethereal seem decent. plus those two give you access to other planes.

i loved the ww games; thought they had by far the best background and storylines to any of the rpg's out there. sigh.

aaron out.

[Primal Fury]

thats pretty cool Stycotl, but i meant the Forsaken, i believe your thinking of the Apocalypse.
and i'm not too sure about the Monte Cook version, there doesnt seem to be... enough. I like how they did the auspices, and the bonus when changing under your own. Theres only two different forms other than the base one (contrary to the standard 5, which are Hinshu[human], Dalu, Gauru[hybrid], Urshul, and Urhan[wolf]) And the werewolves in this version are described as aliens rather children of a primordial earth. The Rites are... okay, the majority of the rites are actually Gifts in the WW version, whereas rites are rituals that summon spirits, heal your allies, or unleash devastation.

and to Onryou, i see what you meant about the BAB, as well as the hit die.

All in all: I think Monte Cook's version is a good way to start, but I don't particularly want to use it the way it is.

EDIT: OH! at earlier levels i can make them like shifters! gaining a specific attribute (but no more than one at lvl 1) each time they shift, that would work a lot like the Partial Change gift!

[Rutee]

I know this is somewhat counter to the point.. but maybe you should just try and learn a new system, neh? If you decide you don't like it after learning it, that seems one thing.. but if people show an unwillingness to learn new things, it's going to be so much harder for new things to actually be made =/

[Stycotl]

i was definitely speaking of apocalypse. i even specified that in my post. as i said, i have not touched the new one, and am not planning on doing so. curse the whole thing.

[Rutee]

tbh, the new one is better set up. I miss old factions, but the mechanics behind nWoD are more solid.

[loomsimoo]

well this is highly convenient. i've working on trying to use uratha style werewolves in dnd for some time now. i've started making a class for each auspice instead of one class for the uratha as a whole. i have the basics of a rahu class written up. its no where near done but if you have any interest in it i'll post it here. its sort of based on the barbarian but with cool little tricks thrown in for the gifts and such.

[Stycotl]

in my sig's homebrew link, i have the wild avatar, which was loosely based off of werewolf the apocalypse. but it's a template, not a class.

[Primal Fury]

well Rutee... more than anything its an unwilling-ness to learn new things, my group and I stuck with 2nd edition D&D till just last year, i doubt they'd be willing to make such a change so soon, so while i would love to try a new system, i think i would be best to wait a while before changing again.

and loomsimoo! that is awsome! i would love to see it! i hope you post it soon. and i may have to look at how exactly you're separating the Uratha by auspice, it sounds a little... wonky.

[Primal Fury]

i've got an idea. rather than creating a whole new mechanic (namley essence) which would only be used by a small amount of characters anyway, why not use an existing source of energy? Incarnum. basically the same as essence, used by more people as well.

I like that the auspices would be classes loomsimoo, very distinct roles, and it stops certain wolves from being overpowered. The Rahu is a barbarian, so rage rage and more rage. The Irraka (my favorite) is a rouge/ninja, so sneak-attacks (or sudden-strikes) out the wazoo. The Cahalith is a bard/prophet, so some bardic music-like abilities, and maybe impromptu divination spells. The Ithaeur are shamans, so they should get more gifts than any of the other auspices, and i'm rolling the idea of spontaneus rejuvination variant for druids in my head, allowing them to heal wounds from silver weapons. i'm not too sure about the Elodoth... i think... marshal maybe?

and as far as the Uratha's healing ability. Incarnum powered fast healing outta do the trick. multipiling damage from silver weapons by 1.5. oh! and instead of making gifts little tricks and whatnot, i'd like them to work kind of like invocations, like Stycotl said, cuz there are a lot of them.

all of the Uratha classes should have an uncontrollabe variant of rage, but the Rahu should be the only one who's able to induce such a state. i dont know about going as far as Death Rage though...

woo! thats a lot. glad i got it all out.

[dyslexicfaser]

I just thought I'd point out, since no one has yet:

'Uratha' is far too close to the word 'Urethra' for me to be comfortable playing as one.

[Primal Fury]

Alright, I finally got some fluff on the Irraka, tell me what you guys think. and thats real funny dyslexicfaser.

Irraka
“Took you long enough to find me. Too bad I’ve already killed all the guards and poisoned your king. I hope you have fun explaining how you weren’t able to stop me. Bye.”
-An unknown Irraka.

You shouldn’t be surprised that those born in shadow are adept at using it. Irraka are swift, silent and unseen. They are scouts, the first to catch sight or scent of their prey. They are wolves who hunt without howling and kill without growling. For some reason, Irraka spend more time in human form — and are more adept at dealing with humans, and other races — than other werewolves. In this form, Irraka learn trickery and deceit, so they remain stealthy physically, mentally and socially.

Adventures: An Irraka can adventure for any number of reasons. They may quest for wealth, power, or just to make a name for themselves.
Characteristics: Among all the Uratha, the Irraka are the most introverted. They were reborn on a night with no moon; because of this, they always feel alone, even when surrounded by allies. Strangely enough, they are the most social of all the auspices when it comes to other races. They enjoy making people believe they’re still human, or whatever race they were before the change.
Alignment: Irraka run the entire gamut of alignments. Lawful Irraka sometimes work for a specific government as a spies and informants, whereas chaotic Irraka live as mercenaries, and sell their skills to the highest bidder. Evil Irraka are almost always assassins, willing to kill anyone for a price. Good Irraka are the silent defenders of their chosen territory.
Religion: A good number of Irraka, along with most other Uratha, worship the spirit of the moon, Luna. They believe that she is their ancient mother. Those few who do not worship Luna mostly worship deities of nature, or those of stealth and cunning.
Background: Before their first change, Irraka were quiet and introverted, now that trait has been amplified. More than any other auspice, they have the desire to hold on to what they were before the change. Though they are the most adept at this eventually they may lose control, and injure or even kill those close to them
Races: To date, most Uratha have been human, though any humanoid race could presumably become one.
Other Classes: Irraka sometimes do not get along well with other classes. They are always plotting and scheming off by themselves, and often the plots involve ways to show up their allies. The eternal rival. If told they can’t do something, they’ll do their damndest to prove that person wrong. They are often at odds with rouges, claiming they can do a better job than them, and are willing to go quite far to prove that. Though, when it comes down to it, there are few friends that are better to have when a situation goes to hell.
Role: An Irraka can make an excellent rouge, they have a good sneak-attack, a decent number of skill points, and higher survivability. This, coupled with their gifts and shape changing, can make an Irraka a very dangerous opponent, in and out of combat.

[loomsimoo]

hot damn i love it! blows my sorry excuse for a class right out of the water. sorry i never got around to posting it btw. and i love your idea for splitting up the classes. elodoth always has been the one i struggled with. i just never understood their place.

now for the incarnum part, what all would you need essentia for? would there be system for fueling the invocations with it? or would it just be for the fast healing? depending on the auspice you might want to give them an incarnum feat for a bonus feat, like cobalt rage for rahu.

[Primal Fury]

what? i got that idea from you loomsi! i was gonna make it one whole class.
i'm thinking of using a variant of Incarnum, where you actually spend it, and then it refills overnight, kind of like spell points. this way you can use incarnum based feats as well. but it will still work the same as enssentia, meaning theres a limit to how much you can use based on the level you're at. and theres a lot more that it can be used for other than healing.

here i'll give you a couple of the Irraka's gifts, and i think you'll see what i mean.

Auspice Abilities: Starting at level 1, an Irraka draws power from the darkness of the new moon; he gains the following abilities at the specified level.

Pathfinders Sense: Of all the auspices, the Irraka have the keenest senses. At level 1, an Irraka gains a bonus equal to half their class level (rounded down) on Spot, Listen, and Search checks (minimum 1). This bonus applies to Survival checks as well, but only when tracking.

Gifts:

Sense Weakness: At level 2, you gain the ability learn a specific weakness of the target, such as a physical flaw, like poor eyesight or a limp. This could also include some sort of compulsion, phobia, or other mental disorder. The target resists with a Will save (DC 10 + your Hit Dice + your Charisma modifier); if they roll a 1 on their save, you learn two weaknesses instead of one. The DM ultimately determines what weakness or weaknesses you learn.
You can use this gift on a particular creature once per day. Each time you use this gift, you learn a different weakness (if any). Using this gift is a standard action that costs no essence.
Boost: For every point of essence you spend on this gift, you may increase the DC by +1.

Slip Away: At level 5, you gain the ability slip out of any physical bond, leaving the item behind unharmed and unchanged (rope still tied, manacles locked and so on). If you are in a grapple, you can use standard action to automatically escape as if you had successfully used the Escape Artist skill or broken the grapple by winning an opposed grapple check. This gift does not work on binding supernatural effects, mundane bindings supernaturally enhanced for this purpose or on enclosed spaces such as prison cells, or chests.
Using this gift is a free action that costs 1 point of essence. If used to escape a grapple, then it is a standard action.


And i've got a few traits for the uratha as well:
Uratha Traits: All Uratha have certain traits in commom. Upon starting this class, the character gains the Shapechanger sub-type, along with the following:

Ability Increases: Like all werewolves, Irraka are hardier than others of their previous race. They gain a +2 bonus to constitution at 1st level. When they first learn to control their shape changing, they gain an increase based on their auspice. Irraka gain a +2 bonus to their dexterity at level 3.

Silver Vulnerability: Regardless of their current form, all damage from weapons made of pure silver is multiplied by 1.5. This damage cannot be healed naturally, or by the werewolf’s regeneration.

Lunacy: Starting at level 5, a werewolf unlocks the secret of Luna’s madness. Any creature that has less HD than the werewolf that perceives them in Dalu, Urshul, or Gauru form must make a will save with a DC of 10 + 1/2 Class level + Cha modifier. If the creature fails their saving throw, then they are shaken. If they roll a natural 1, then they are panicked. If they succeed, then they are immune to that werewolf’s lunacy for the next 24 hours. When the Uratha is in Dalu form, all creatures get a +4 bonus on this save. When in Urshul form, this bonus is decreased to +2. When in Gauru form, no such bonuses are given. This affects allies as well. Uratha and other lycanthropes are immune to lunacy. This is a mind-affecting fear effect.


EDIT: Added Lunacy, a new gift: Slip Away, and a new Auspice ability: Pathfinders Sense

[Primal Fury]

Okay, I'm having a little trouble ironing out the bumps for essence. BUT! i came up with the Uratha's Regeneration ability. tell me what you think.

Regeneration: Starting at level 4, an Uratha gains the ability to heal wounds that would kill a lesser creature. They gain Faster Healing as a bonus feat. Also, if they choose to, they can gain 1 point of fast healing for each point of essence they invest in this ability. This lasts for a number of rounds equal to the werewolf's Con modifier +2. They can only heal a number of hit points equal to twice their HD in a single day with this method.

[loomsimoo]

ok now i understand. i really like the gifts you have so far too. what gift lists do you want to use for each auspice? just their auspice list and the other two they get? sorry if it seems like i'm asking a lot of questions but i'm trying to wrap my head around how you want this all to work so i can start making classes.

and a few things about lunacy. first thing is that you need to say something about other uratha and even regular werewolves and lycathropes (if they still exist after the uratha are introduced) gaining immunity to lunacy. secondly having it effect your allies will be a real pain to a party with a mix of uratha and regular characters. maybe a feat to gain immunity or a bonus to the save?

[Primal Fury]

CRAP! i knew there was something i forgot! thanks loom. i'll fix that.

and yea, i'll be including other gifts. Some other lists might include: Strength, Stealth, Dominance, Mother Luna's (my favorite), maybe... Eclipse gifts from Blasphemies, uh... Elemental Gifts, probably not Father Wolf's though, he won't be in the fluff.

what other lists would you include?

[loomsimoo]

well i think that each auspice should have access to its auspice specific gifts. so rahu would get gifts from Dominance, Full Moon, and Strength; Cahalith would get gifts from Gibbous Moon, Inspiration, and Knowledge, etc. but also allow them access to stuff like Mother Luna.

now the way you seem to be doing the gifts, they are just class abilities you gain at certain levels. correct me if i'm wrong. the way i thought they should work would be exactly like warlocks invocations, choossing a certain number from specific gift lists that each class has or from general lists that all the uratha have access to. you would also need to get the gifts from a certain list in order, just like you do in Werewolf: The Forsaken. i'll use the irrakas New Moon gifts as an example. an Irraka could take the New Moon gift sense weakness when he can choose his first gift but in order to get slip away he would have to hae sense weakness, he couldnt just skip it over.

[Primal Fury]

hm... i had planned on using auspice gifts as class abilities... but i guess that could work.

but how would they gain them? would they get a specific one each level? wait... that makes sense, have level requirements for gifts. alright, i gotcha loom.:smallsmile:

[loomsimoo]

auspice gifts as class abilities could work but the one thing i love about the gifts is all of the options. the fact that you dont have to pick your auspice gifts, though you usually do anyway.

[Primal Fury]

okay... i am ALMOST done with the Irraka, all i need to do is come up with a few Special Abilities, ya know like the rouges. i'm thinkin Stalker's Fang which allows you to make a full-attack when you charge a flat-footed opponent, Evasion and Improved Evasion of course, maybe Death Attack. i've got to think of a few more that give a werewolf-ish feel.

oh! and i've got an origin story for the Uratha, and from that i was able to create an apex ability. becoming an avatar of stealth, cunning, and darkness for the Irraka, strength, combat prowess, and power for the rahu, and so on.

EDIT: okay, here's a more complete version of the shapeshifting:

Alternate Form: Beginning at 3rd level, an Uratha learns to control their shape-changing. They gain the following forms at the specified level:

Urhan (Wolf): At level 3, they gain the ability to take the form of a wolf. When they take this form, the following changes are made: They loose the ability to speak, but gain a bonus of +4 bonus to diplomacy checks when dealing with canines. They gain Scent, Low-Light vision, and a +4 bonus to Listen checks. They gain a +2 bonus to dexterity. They gain a bite attack that does 1d6 damage. Their speed becomes 50 ft.

Dalu (Near-Man): At level 6, they gain the ability to adopt wolf-like features. When they take this form, the following changes are made: They gain a +2 bonus to strength and constitution. They gain 2 claw attacks that do 1d4 damage. They suffer a -2 penalty to all charisma based checks when dealing with humanoids, with the exception of intimidate, which they gain a +2 bonus on. They gain a +2 bonus to handle animal checks when dealing with canines. They gain Scent, and a +2 bonus to Listen and Spot checks. They gain a 10 ft bonus to their base land speed. They can still use their weapons, and retain the benefits of any armor they were wearing.

Urshul (Near-Wolf): At level 9, they gain the ability to take the form of a large, feral-looking wolf. When they take this form, the following changes are made: They loose the ability to speak. They gain Scent, and a +4 bonus to listen checks, and a +2 bonus to spot checks. They gain a +4 bonus to strength, dexterity and constitution. They gain a bite attack that does 1d6 damage, and two claw attacks that do 1d4 damage. They gain a 50ft bonus to their base land speed. Due to the frightening appearance of this form, most wolves will flee when confronted with it, making communication with them all but impossible.

Gauru (War Form): At level 12, they gain the ability to merge their human form and their wolf form into the perfect killing machine, if only for a while. When they take this form, the following changes are made: They loose the ability to speak in complex sentences, but they can form snippets such as “Fresh meat” or “Die now” or something equally as threatening. They gain Scent and Low-Light vision. They loose the ability to make charisma and intelligence based skill-cheacks. You gain a bonus of +6 to Spot (when color is not important), Listen, and Survival while tracking. They gain a +8 bonus to strength, and constitution; as well as a +6 bonus to dexterity. They gain a bite attack that does 1d8 damage, and 2 claw attacks that do 1d6 damage. Every round on his turn, a werewolf in Gauru form must attack or move toward an enemy; if the werewolf can’t see a living foe, he has to strike out at something nearby (a tree, fallen foe and so on). He can still discern friend from foe, fallen foes from living ones, and can decide between multiple available foes. To do anything other than move, attack or activate an allowed gift (even to exit Gauru form), the werewolf must make a DC 20 Will save. A werewolf can remain in Gauru form for a number of rounds equal to his (current) Constitution bonus (minimum 1); when this time is up, he must change to one of his other forms. Once a werewolf leaves hybrid form, he cannot return to it for at least an hour.

[jagadaishio]

System conversions are always challenging, especially when it's converting between things as different as d20 and the storytelling system. I think that you're doing a great job with the Irraka. The snippets that you've been showing look to be fairly playable and befitting the flavour of the Uratha.

[loomsimoo]

all right primal, as soon as you post your Irraka i'll start working on rahu. I just wanna see how youre setting up the class so i can get a read on how you want the uratha to work exactly.

[Primal Fury]

thanks jagadaishio, thats means a lot, considering this is my first homebrew ever.:smallbiggrin:

alright, i dropped the str and con bonuses of Gauru down to +6 and dex to +4 so the capstone ability wouldnt be too overpowered.

here's the Step Sideways ability:

Step Sideways: Once an Uratha reaches level 15, their half-spirit natures manifest themselves. They gain the ability to use Ethereal Jaunt as a spell-like ability twice per day; except with a duration of Instantaneous.

and the capstone ability for the Irraka is finished. it doesnt fit in the original storytelling system cuz i had to whack Father Wolf, but as soon as i get out all the bumps i'll post the origin story.