MiTD and learning

[Fussy]

The MiTD is learning... draughts (checkers)? Apparently it's learning 'quickly. Very quickly'.

They can't play monopoly because it lost a lot of money on a useless bet

It was tricked by a roach. And thought the letter 'O' in scrabble was a miniature donut.


Those 3 facts would suggest that the MiTD is a little bit simple (as we know), childish and optimistic. However, the fact that it's learning draughts very quickly would suggest that it does have a keen mastery of logic.

So while being very naive and not having a lot of common sense, it understands logic and puzzles. Or is it that it learns very quickly?


Er... yup. That's my point. Minor but I thought it was interesting. Think about it (Think think about it).

On a side note, if we keep up this discussion long enough I bet that game (I bet that that game) will be mentioned in the future. Rich blatantly reads these forums - not for ideas, but to see what we're interested in. Those two paladins that got married - I thought them having names was just to make a joke. Then they got married? I was confused. I read the forums and it turned out lots of topics were made about them -> Rich knew the 'diehard' fans were interested in them -> they became recurring characters. The forum posters may not be the largest % of his readers, but they definitely up the traffic to his website a fair bit. And everyone loves traffic. If all of these discussions and guesses were in vain, would you still be here?

Or is my saying this just a sneaky way to get people to read this topic? Raise a tired and controversial topic and people will read what you say. Will Rich read this? Will he care? Will YOU care? Will you put this sentence in a quote and write 'no' underneath? (Go on, it would be funny).


Seriously though, does the fact that the MiTD can learn very quickly/ understand logic very well teach us anything?

[Mauve Shirt]

I think he just learns quickly.


On a side note, if we keep up this discussion long enough I bet that game (I bet that that game) will be mentioned in the future.

I just lost the game.


Will you put this sentence in a quote and write 'no' underneath?
No. :smalltongue:

[Catskin]

The MiTD is learning... draughts (checkers)? Apparently it's learning 'quickly. Very quickly'.

Go, a Japanese (or is it Chinese?) game, makes more sense to me.


Seriously though, does the fact that the MiTD can learn very quickly/ understand logic very well teach us anything?

There's definitely some foreshadowing going on. I don't know what it portends, but probably some kind of switch of sides on the part of MitD, right?

It seems to be very literal, with no notion of symbolism or irony. If it ever learns the difference between good and evil, someone better watch out.

[Nerdanel]

Based on O-Chul's expression and the small font type, I think "Very quickly." might be O-Chul commenting sarcastically to himself about how :mitd: is actually very slow at learning Go, and the previous word balloon was simply meant to be encouraging.

[hamishspence]

I wondered if it was a little concern about it being very good at it, but poor at thinking out anything else.

But it could be either serious or sarcastic, I suppose.

[d'Bwobsling]

I wondered if it was a little concern about it being very good at it, but poor at thinking out anything else.

But it could be either serious or sarcastic, I suppose.


Ochul doesn't strike me as a very sarcastic person

[DreadSpoon]

I'm not sure that we're likely to see the MitD defect against Team Evil. This is no different than Thog befriending Elan, really.

Far more likely, we'll see Redcloak defect. Remember the geas that Xykon put the MitD under near the end of SoD? That is real foreshadowing. Redcloak and the MitD are going to have a throw-down someday.

[warmachine]

The monster's incredibly naive, childlike understanding of people suggests an idiot but a reported ability to learn a game, probably Go, very quickly suggests a potential genius at mathematics. The monster seems to be a functioning autistic.

[hamishspence]

hmm, now that sounds more interesting: where on the spectrum would we put it from autistic to Aspergers?

[Pellias]

It was tricked by a roach. And thought the letter 'O' in scrabble was a miniature donut.



It was NOT tricked by a roach. It was the monster who tricked the roaches. Check the comic.

Monster: "Oh yeah. Wanna play Scrabble?"
O'Chul: "You lost all of the "g" and "p" tiles when you tricked the demon roaches into accepting your wager for "2gp's".

The fact that the Monster lost the wager doesn't negate the fact that it first tricked the roaches into accepting game-tiles as money. That shows that the Monster has some sort of capacity for being cunning, although it doesn't fit into the Monsters psychological profile as shown up to this episode. Of course, it coould've also happened that the Monster sincerely believed that "2gp's" were acceptable money, and the roaches got caught unprepared for such naivety and accepted the bet on that account.

O'Chul's remark about the monster learning "Quickly. Very quickly" might have been a direct statement (the last two words being said silently as an expression of disbelief), or as sarcasm (O'chul's facial expression supports that), meaning that the monster is a very slow learner. It could be either one.

It would be interesting if the Monster would show some sort of extreme intelligence, especially when combined with it's naive streak. It would be even more interesting if the Monster would turn out to have a selfish or negative side as well, because this way it is still a goofy one-dimensional character.

[Zeitgeist]

O-Chul is very honest, and not particularly sarcastic. And he's very kind to the MitD. He would not sarcastically say he's learning quickly. The MitD is learning very quickly. Perhaps he meant that in the sense that for his seemingly low mental capacity, he's learning it quickly, but he's definitely learning it quickly nevertheless.

The MitD is like a genius child that never got to attend any kind of school. You couldn't find their intelligence potential until you tried to teach them.

[FujinAkari]

I'm not sure that we're likely to see the MitD defect against Team Evil. This is no different than Thog befriending Elan, really.

Far more likely, we'll see Redcloak defect. Remember the geas that Xykon put the MitD under near the end of SoD? That is real foreshadowing. Redcloak and the MitD are going to have a throw-down someday.

While I appreciate you spoiling this, can you please mark it in some way? People will simply assume it speculation, not knowing its an -actual- spoiler unless you put "SoD Spoiler" above it.

Thanks!

[Ironlich]

Is it just me that thinks its obvius that MitB is a child? Oh, sure, he is overly strong and powerfull, but its more likley that he is simply a child, that naturaly has a higer learning rate tha adults, than "mentaly disabeled" of some kind.

[Arkenputtyknife]

Is it just me that thinks its obvius that MitB is a child? Oh, sure, he is overly strong and powerfull, but its more likley that he is simply a child, that naturaly has a higer learning rate tha adults, than "mentaly disabeled" of some kind.
Yes, I think it's becoming very obvious. Naive, simple and open, and quick to learn. And if that is Go, or something very similar, that they're playing, it would make a lot of sense that he's improving quickly if he is a child. As a rule, children advance very rapidly in Go; adults take much longer.

[Roderick_BR]

Ochul doesn't strike me as a very sarcastic person
He's actually a lot sarcastic. Remember the "I thought charisma was a safe dump?". I see him as a sarge type of character. An interesting take for a paladin.

As for the game they mentioned, at first time, I misread it, and thought they were talking about tic tac toe :smalltongue:

[Lupy]

I think that the MitD has abysmal WIS and CHA, but that Go is serving as a form of intellectaul encounter, raising his level so his INT will go up. :smallconfused:

[Swordlol]

It was NOT tricked by a roach. It was the monster who tricked the roaches. Check the comic.

Monster: "Oh yeah. Wanna play Scrabble?"
O'Chul: "You lost all of the "g" and "p" tiles when you tricked the demon roaches into accepting your wager for "2gp's".

The fact that the Monster lost the wager doesn't negate the fact that it first tricked the roaches into accepting game-tiles as money. That shows that the Monster has some sort of capacity for being cunning, although it doesn't fit into the Monsters psychological profile as shown up to this episode. Of course, it coould've also happened that the Monster sincerely believed that "2gp's" were acceptable money, and the roaches got caught unprepared for such naivety and accepted the bet on that account.

O'Chul's remark about the monster learning "Quickly. Very quickly" might have been a direct statement (the last two words being said silently as an expression of disbelief), or as sarcasm (O'chul's facial expression supports that), meaning that the monster is a very slow learner. It could be either one.

It would be interesting if the Monster would show some sort of extreme intelligence, especially when combined with it's naive streak. It would be even more interesting if the Monster would turn out to have a selfish or negative side as well, because this way it is still a goofy one-dimensional character.

Yeah I thought MitD tricked the roaches...

[David Argall]

Rich blatantly reads these forums - not for ideas, but to see what we're interested in. Those two paladins that got married - I thought them having names was just to make a joke. Then they got married? I was confused. I read the forums and it turned out lots of topics were made about them -> Rich knew the 'diehard' fans were interested in them -> they became recurring characters.

While our writer ought to read these postings for ideas, etc, this is not really a likely case where he did. Every time you put a female character in a story, the immediate question is who she is going to shack up with. [If the audience is male, the physical details of how get most of the space. If the audience is female, those get less space and may happen entirely off the pages. But she is there for romance.] There are the exceptions of course, but any glance at a rack of paperbacks shows they are exceptions. So when Miss Kato flees into our sight and ends up in the tower with one suitable male, their pairing up becomes highly predicatable. Exactly how was a wild guess, but that they would was a pretty safe one.

Oh yes, neither was, nor apparently is, a paladin.

[BisectedBrioche]

hmm, now that sounds more interesting: where on the spectrum would we put it from autistic to Aspergers?

You do know that "autism" is the spectrum and Asperger's isn't at any notable point (unless you count it as being notable as the position Asperger's syndrome is at of course :smalltongue:).

[Querzis]

He's actually a lot sarcastic. Remember the "I thought charisma was a safe dump?". I see him as a sarge type of character. An interesting take for a paladin.

I dont see how thats supposed to be really sarcastic. Charisma is a safe dump for a fighter (unless you are Roy). Either way, O-chul is kind and honest. Why the hell would he lie about that?

And yes, its also quite obvious to me that the MiTD is not just childlike but really a child. Not knowing much about the world and being naive but also being a very fast learner is natural for a child.

[hamishspence]

I got the impression that Aspergers occupies the grey area between average and autistic, which is why I cited it as one end of the spectrum.

[busterswd]

I took it to be a nudge from Rich to forum speculators that it's not supposed to be a baby Tarrasque, since they usually have low intelligence, even on adulthood.

Edit: Then, again, Go is reputed to not only test your strategy and ability to memorize, but also your general "feel" and intuition for the game, which is a measure of wisdom maybe?

[danielmayer]

Being simple/naive but having a quite good mind of logic was and is always the best sample for high INT and very low WIS.
But may be that the low WIS gives additional CHA for being "aaaaaawwwwwwwwwwwwwww" :)

Greetings!

[Corwin Weber]

I got the impression that Aspergers occupies the grey area between average and autistic, which is why I cited it as one end of the spectrum.

They're actually different axes, so to speak. Asperger's is a high functioning form of autism, so with Asperger's you can have someone who is severely autistic yet can still basically function in society. With more typical autism you can have someone who is only slightly autistic, yet still can't function in society. All aspies have autism, not all autistics are aspies.

[Rasagal]

Am i the only one who thought of the movie WarGames when he saw that? I think the game o'chul taught him is tic-tac-toe just like in the movie. It would make more sense for Rich to use this kind of geeky (if kinda obscure) humor.
Tic-tac-toe guys.
The MiTD will understand that he doesn't have to devour the OOTS in the end. It's got the choice not to make a move.
Or something.

[Khanderas]

It was NOT tricked by a roach. It was the monster who tricked the roaches. Check the comic.

Monster: "Oh yeah. Wanna play Scrabble?"
O'Chul: "You lost all of the "g" and "p" tiles when you tricked the demon roaches into accepting your wager for "2gp's".

The fact that the Monster lost the wager doesn't negate the fact that it first tricked the roaches into accepting game-tiles as money. That shows that the Monster has some sort of capacity for being cunning, although it doesn't fit into the Monsters psychological profile as shown up to this episode. Of course, it coould've also happened that the Monster sincerely believed that "2gp's" were acceptable money, and the roaches got caught unprepared for such naivety and accepted the bet on that account.
Bolding mine.
Well unless we are being sarcastic (hard to say over the internet), the roaches were not "tricked" into accepting the bet. The roaches sigh at the big stupid MITD, say 'fine' and accept the bet since they simply dont want to argue with him. Afterall what is 2 gp anyway when you are playing high stakes with epic character (Xyklon) ?

As to the thread in general. Decent or above Int, but very very poor Wisdom as well as some inability to register some things (like the gates). So while "book-smart" he is not "street-smart". Or it could be that he just recently came into being / society and everything that happens around him is "normal" as far as he knows.




O'Chul's remark about the monster learning "Quickly. Very quickly" might have been a direct statement (the last two words being said silently as an expression of disbelief), or as sarcasm (O'chul's facial expression supports that), meaning that the monster is a very slow learner. It could be either one.I thought it ment that the MITD is learning remarkably fast, and is beginning to beat O'chul (or will soon). This together with the MITD childlike personailty and general bimboheaded comments could be kinda unsettling to O'chul. Like if you teach a kid chess and before the day is over he beats you at it hard. Cool for the kid, but kinda harsh for an average int guy who played it for 20 years.

[NENAD]

I support the MitD-as-child theory. He gives off so much childishness now it's not even funny...He always gave off childishness. This stuff about learning fast may just be Rich smacking himself in the head and saying "Mentally retarded? How did that epileptic tree get embraced by half the forums community?!?" Now he's trying to prove that the MitD isn't stupid, just young and naive.

[[Insert Neat Username Here]]

Go, a Japanese (or is it Chinese?) game, makes more sense to me.

Definitely Go, which I think was invented in China but has gained popularity in much of Asia. It's also very hard to master.

[skeeter_dan]

MiTD is definitely a child, possibly female (recall the tea party with O-Chul).

[Trizap]

MiTD is definitely a child, possibly female (recall the tea party with O-Chul).

yea has anyone thought about that? the MitD could be female :smalleek:

but then a couple strips later the :roach: told the monster to stomp the ground like when :xykon: wouldn't give the MitD Transformers, :mitd: could be just as androgynous as :vaarsuvius:

[Tredrick]

MiTD is definitely a child, possibly female (recall the tea party with O-Chul).

Odd then that she would, just one comic ago as I type this, start a club girls can't join.

[Nychta]

Little boys have tea parties too. Especially those who aren't around other little boys. No peer pressure.

[Beholder1995]

I don't really see where the argument in this thread is. As far as I can tell, people are just restating the same stuff over and over.
1. It's quite clear that MitD is a boy.
2. There is overwhelming evidence that it is a child. (For those that doubt: is there any real chance that it's an adult?)

And as for the main issue (is the MitD really intelligent) everyone's depending on one muttered sentance by O-Chul. I don't think anything can be determined at this point. (Still, this is an interesting thread. Keep posting :smallbiggrin: )

[OITS]

Monster-san learns very quickly -> Monster-san gains many XP -> Monster-san has a low Level. That's all. Of course, HE is a child, too.

[Khanderas]

Monster-san learns very quickly -> Monster-san gains many XP -> Monster-san has a low Level. That's all. Of course, HE is a child, too.
If learning was tied that close to Xp, then why doesn't PC's get XP bonuses for having high int ?
MITD is smart (high int) but not very confident or worldly (low cha and wis... very low wis... problebly because he is a child).

[OITS]

Well...to gain experience means to learn something, even if it mostly only is how to fight, but that is only one aspect. For me, learning and getting XP is more or less the same.

[Niknokitueu]

Well...to gain experience means to learn something, even if it mostly only is how to fight, but that is only one aspect. For me, learning and getting XP is more or less the same.
Heh. Images of really high-level aged scholars beating up on youthful first level fighters spring to mind :smallbiggrin:

Have Fun!
Niknokitueu

[OITS]

You don't need to try to understand.