Arena Tournament, Round 35: Llince vs Grushnak

[ArenaManager]

Arena Tournament, Round 35: Llince vs. Grushnak

Map:http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z123/TheChilliGod/Giantitp/Arena4ii.gif

Extra notes: Houses are on average 20 feet high (just use that average figure all over the house), hay piles are up to 10 feet high against the walls. And, I don't care whether you're immune to sanctuary effects, you are not immune to the arena's sanctuary effect. Creatures summoned during the 1st round are also affected by the sanctuary effect.

XP Award: 300 XP
GP Award: 300 GP

Flymolo - Llince (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheets/view.php?id=43700)
LtKeen - Grushnak (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheets/view.php?id=43672)

All Combatants, please roll initiative.

[FlyMolo]

Here I am. Wot Wot.

[roll0]

Considering purchases. Are you going to buy anything?

I'm going to pick up another tattoo. Anything you want to buy?

[LtKeen]

I bought myself some psionic tattoos, they're much more convenient than potions :smallsmile:

Initiative: [roll0]

though the place where my character sheet is stored is acting a bit weird, It's fine now, purchases are at the bottom

[FlyMolo]

I start in D10, my emberling in D11.

Where do you start? I'd like to know. It might be important later.

[LtKeen]

Oh, sorry, forgot to put that in last post

Since Grushnak's name is blue, I'm assuming HE'S starting on the blue dot, so Grushnak will begin in C11. He has his crossbow in hand, bayonet attached.

[FlyMolo]

Oh, sorry, forgot to put that in last post

Since Grushnak's name is blue, I'm assuming HE'S starting on the blue dot, so Grushnak will begin in C11. He has his crossbow in hand, bayonet attached.

You know, I took special note to remember to be on the right dot, too. Fail. :smallredface:

W10 and W11, then. First round's actions! Yay!

Single move to Q10/Q11. (Me in Q10.) Simultaneously, me and mah emberling tap our tats. They hop off and run to, oh, E11. They're tiny, so they both can fit in the same space.
I tap a hungry touch, my emberling taps an entangling ectoplasm.

[LtKeen]

Grushnak's Turn 1
Grushnak moves to B6, tapping the tattoo on one of his arms. It disappears.

Refs:Tattoo of Psionic Levitate(created by Lurk), 30 minute duration

That'll be all.

[FlyMolo]

Well, to kick things off, those tattoos make it to you.

You get to make an AoO against one. Pick a door, any door. Behind both doors is a tattoo, no goats or sports cars here.
A:Engtangling Ectoplasm[roll0]AC 16
B:Hungry Touch[roll1]AC 16

[FlyMolo]

And roll a fort save. DC 15.

[roll0] damage for him, and temp hp for me. half if he saves. assuming the tat isn't destroyed by his bayonet, (Oh duh. It can't be.)

My emberling moves to F8, I move to G8. Cover doesn't stack, so it's a flat +4 despite the fact I'm behind it, right? I fall prone, giving +8 total, so about AC 23.

[LtKeen]

How about a washer machine? Grushnak could use one of those. Do you have any idea how bad goblins smell? :smallbiggrin:

He'll make the AoO against tattoo B.
Attack [roll0]
Damage [roll1]
Fort save [roll2]

If that doesn't hinder him, then
Grushnak's turn 2
Grushnak, with a double move action, will move 20 ft into the air, using his limbs to assist his scaling the wall onto the roof on D6. (1 move 20 ft into the air(due to the tattoo), another move spent getting on the roof. (10 ft onto it))
Other than one question I have for the refs, that'll be all. No harm in you seeing it too Flymolo, the spoiler box is for sake of space.
question for refsTiny, Diminutive, and Fine Creatures
Very small creatures take up less than 1 square of space. This means that more than one such creature can fit into a single square. A Tiny creature typically occupies a space only 2½ feet across, so four can fit into a single square. Twenty-five Diminutive creatures or 100 Fine creatures can fit into a single square. Creatures that take up less than 1 square of space typically have a natural reach of 0 feet, meaning they can’t reach into adjacent squares. They must enter an opponent’s square to attack in melee. This provokes an attack of opportunity from the opponent. You can attack into your own square if you need to, so you can attack such creatures normally. Since they have no natural reach, they do not threaten the squares around them. You can move past them without provoking attacks of opportunity. They also can’t flank an enemy. Do Tiny or smaller creatures threaten the square they're in, knowing they have a reach of 0 ft? When it says "You can move past them..." does that include through their squares? If not, I'm about to provoke some AoOs :smallsigh:

[FlyMolo]

You can't provoke AoO's because they're dead. The both hit you, I'm afraid. Tiny critters only threaten the square they're in, so you do provoke for leaving it to go up. Logically, it doesn't make sense. But hey, RAW.

You're entangled and take 1 damage. (Damn your fort save!)

I dunno how that affects your actions.

[LtKeen]

Well the vertical movement was by mental action, so that'd be unaffected.
By the power he's using, it defines horizontal movement normally at half speed(and only possible when there's a surface available), which was why he'd moved 10 ft(outta 15).half speed for moving horizontally using a surface, half again for entanglement.

1/4 of 30 ft, rounded down, is 5 feet. so that would put him instead on C6, but his moves are otherwise unaffected, other than entanglement and 1 damage. Guess I shoulda expected it though, since it gave you the winning edge last time, huh? :smallwink:

[chilepepper]

ref chilepepper

Yes, creatures with 0' reach still threaten the square they are in. If you leave that square, it provokes an AoO. Inanimate (dead) things don't threaten anything, except maybe your sense of smell if they were originally organic and it's been awhile.

[FlyMolo]

Well the vertical movement was by mental action, so that'd be unaffected.
By the power he's using, it defines horizontal movement normally at half speed(and only possible when there's a surface available), which was why he'd moved 10 ft(outta 15).half speed for moving horizontally using a surface, half again for entanglement.

1/4 of 30 ft, rounded down, is 5 feet. so that would put him instead on C6, but his moves are otherwise unaffected, other than entanglement and 1 damage. Guess I shoulda expected it though, since it gave you the winning edge last time, huh? :smallwink:

Ah, okay. I thought you'd rounded weirdly for a second there, then I realized you weren't wearing any armor. :smallredface:

Lesee, you're within 25 feet... Can I make a 5FS prone? Like, a 5-foot roll?

In any case, roll a DC 15 will save or take [roll0] damage. Various displays happen.

Fire comes out of my emberling. [roll1] AC 14 [roll2]

I stand up, move 1 square southwest as a five foot step. I should be in F9. Emberling still in F8.

[stats]AC standard(+cover, soft cover: 19) my hp 6/5, pp 7/8, Emberling AC standard +cover(20). 1 energy ray used.

[LtKeen]

Before Grushnak takes his next action, let me see his will save. Add 1 to the save if it is a compulsion.
Will [roll0]

[Talic]

High Ref Talic


Crawling

You can crawl 5 feet as a move action. Crawling incurs attacks of opportunity from any attackers who threaten you at any point of your crawl.


You can only take a 5-foot step if your movement isn’t hampered by difficult terrain or darkness. Any creature with a speed of 5 feet or less can’t take a 5-foot step, since moving even 5 feet requires a move action for such a slow creature.

No, prone characters cannot take 5 foot steps. However, standing up does not count as movement, so, if you do, you can take a 5 foot step afterwards.

[LtKeen]

Ow. painful :smalleek:
Grushnak's Turn 3
Grushnak will move backwards to what I assume is out of LoS(will need a LoS check just to make sure, since the roof is 20 feet high. If it is, then read the spoiler, but the not the one within the spoiler)
He moves to D4, tapping the tattoo on his neck. It fades.Tattoo of Vigor, +5 HP, current hp 6/11

As stated above, a to-be-safe LoS check is needed

[Talic]

High Ref Talic

Correct. Grushnak moves north, breaking LOS as he moves north out of D5.

[FlyMolo]

Wait. What? How'd he move north out of D5? That's gotta put him at the far side of the building, right?

Grushnak was at C6, and has a 5' speed atm, right? 1/4 of 30 rounded down is 15/2 is 5'. So that's 10 feet...

Oh. Of course. Double move. Right. Okay then. Time to press the attack.

Emberling moves to A6.

I'll go fetch a LoS check, not done yet.

[LtKeen]

My speed was only 5 feet while I was in the air. Since I only moved up 20 feet, when I moved to c6 I'd be walking on a solid surface. That'd give me just the speed penalty for entanglement, reducing it to 15 ft

[FlyMolo]

Are you sure about that?


You cannot move the recipient horizontally, but the recipient could clamber along the face of a cliff, for example, or push against a ceiling to move laterally (generally at half its base land speed). That's SRD.

I'm given to understand that means you move at half because of levitate, cuz you can't use your hands and suchlike. The second halving from entangle makes that 5', and you can't move sideways on your own at all.

Ref?

[LtKeen]

Though I did use levitate to get up there, I only moved up 20 feet.
The roof is 20 feet high.
Meaning when I moved onto the roof(with the 5 ft move), My feet would be level with the ground, meaning I'd no longer need to hover. I suppose I didn't specify that. However, it doesn't change the fact that I only moved up 20 feet, and the buildings are 20 feet high. I didn't think I needed to explain that, but oh well.:smallconfused:

[Talic]

What Flymolo is trying to stay is the following.

Moving horizontally from beside the roof to on top of it is a 5 foot movement, wherein you are still levitating.

That 5 feet is governed by the words:
...the recipient could clamber along the face of a cliff, for example, or push against a ceiling to move laterally (generally at half its base land speed).
Since Levitation halves this horizontal movement (each square costs 2 movement), and is then halved again for entangle (now each square costs 4 movement), it becomes more difficult to move. The relevant question is, does the character have 4 squares worth of movement remaining at this point of the action? I believe so, though I'm open to any reasoning as to why this should not be so.

Additional Source Used:
Double Movement Cost
When your movement is hampered in some way, your movement usually costs double. For example, each square of movement through difficult terrain counts as 2 squares, and each diagonal move through such terrain counts as 3 squares (just as two diagonal moves normally do).

If movement cost is doubled twice, then each square counts as 4 squares (or as 6 squares if moving diagonally). If movement cost is doubled three times, then each square counts as 8 squares (12 if diagonal) and so on. This is an exception to the general rule that two doublings are equivalent to a tripling.

[LtKeen]

Though I see what is trying to be argued, I'm trying to point out the fact that once Grushnak used Levitate to get to C6 (via post 12) Grushnak would no longer need to use the levitate power to move horizontally (on Grushnak's turn 3, post 17) due to the fact that being exactly 20 feet up constitutes to a flat surface(the roof of the place) being directly below his feet by definition of how far he traveled upwards.

In summation, once he got to C6, he no longer needs to use levitation to stand, and I assumed(though I may be wrong) that dropping the force of holding himself up with that power(like dropping a weapon) was a free action.

Without needing levitate to move on the roof, the only thing hampering speed would BE the entanglement. It doesn't sound too unreasonable, seeing as he moved up 20 ft and the flat roof surface is exactly 20 feet up. :smallconfused: Levitating on that roof once he was on C6 would be like uneccesarily levitating on the ground, with nobody nearby and entangled. Unnecessary and hampering.

The reason why I'm even discussing this is because I used a desperately-needed standard action at the end of my move action in Grushnak's Turn 3 (post 17).

An unreleated-to-the-argument final note: I wish there was another way for Grushnak to avoid his emberling, but Alas, this was my first arena character :smallsigh:

[FlyMolo]

I'm not disputing the getting to c6 part. That's perfectly legal. I hadn't realized you'd dismissed the power. you moved 20 feet up, then you're 20 feet up. You sort of finagle yourself onto the roof.

Makes sense.

Unfortunately, Psionic levitate takes a standard action to dismiss, I think. Yup. SRD says it takes a standard action to dismiss a power. Until then, you sort of bob in midair, which makes it hard to nab things like the ground, halving your speed(again, to 1/4)

So by RAW, you're levitating and have your speed quartered until you dismiss levitate, which costs a standard action.

And don't feel bad if your first Arena character gets completely owned. Mine did. A warlock with shatter as his invocation. Interesting idea, but got completely owned by a warmage with sudden maximise, sudden empower, and sudden widen. Empowered Maximised Magic Missile=death. No save. No attack roll. Just death. :smallannoyed:

[LtKeen]

Alright then, well I guess it would make sense, on that basis to revise my round then. Though I didn't mean dismiss the power. I was meaning that once he's on the roof, levitate's not holding him up; he's effectively on a ground, just a higher one. The roof is. But whatever, this match needs to continue. >_>
Grushnak's Turn 3, Revised
Grushnak dismisses the power(standard action), then moves out of sight to the same spot(move action).
That'll be all, I suppose.

[FlyMolo]

I'll go fetch that los check we needed but never got.

[Talic]

High Ref Talic

Levitate allows you to raise and lower yourself. It does not require it. If you're on ground level, you don't have to be floating. It's like a fly spell. Just because you have one on doesn't mean you CAN'T walk.

EDIT:
Llince:No Los
Emberling:No Los
Grushnak:No Los

[FlyMolo]

Levitate specifies you can't move sideways, only up and down. While you have levitate on, you can only move sideways if you have something to push off of, and even then only at half.

Fly is a method of propulsion in and of itself. Levitate is very specific about horizontal movement.

Edit: I suppose I should give up, hey? It could be taken either way, I suppose. I had always thought it was a sort of tradeoff, you could go up and down for only a 2nd level spell/power, in exchange for annoying penalties and a halved land speed.

[FlyMolo]

Round Whatever (4?)

I move to J5, and ready an action. I read to manifest mind thrust, triggered by LoE/LoS(with Grushnak) within 25 feet. Emberling does the same, but within 30 feet and manifest matter agitation if levitation needs to be dismissed, and energy ray otherwise.

All done. What's the consensus on your actual actions? It's really 50/50 on whether levitate slows you down even on level ground. It's one of those things that the rules don't really cover, I guess.

[LtKeen]

Talic restated what I was trying to say, in post 28. However, for sake of simplicity on this match (there has been too many non-combat posts) I dismissed the power on my last turn, instead of doing the other standard action I mentioned. Though that inconveniences me a bit =S
Grushnak's Turn 4
Grushnak will pull potion of Cure Light Wounds out of his backpack and imbibe it.
Cure Light Wounds [roll0]
Current hp:8/11
That'll be all.

[LtKeen]

What I was trying to say was restated by Talic in post 28, though for simplicity's sake (there are too many non combat posts in this thread) I dismissed the power instead of performing the other standard action, though losing levitate is slightly inconvenient. Oh well.

Grushnak's Turn 4
Grushnak will take one of the potions out of his backpack, imbibing it.
Cure Light Wounds: [roll0]
Current hp: will be updated
That'll be all. double post ><

[FlyMolo]

Righty then. Round 5?

Emberling uses 20 feet of movement to get to B2.(a6-B2, 20') I single move to H1 (J5-H1, 30'). Both of us stop if at any time LoS is established.

Another LoS check. Bah.

[SamTheCleric]

Initiate Ref Sam

@LtKeen
Ok, I tried to read through all the rules lawyering, but I can't seem to figure out where exactly you are. Could you please let me know that so I can proceed with the LOS check?

LOS check will commence upon clarification.

[LtKeen]

to SamtheCleric or other refs:
I am on the roof(20 feet up) in square D4(as originated in post 17 before all the rules lawyering
I hope that clarifies. :smallsmile:

[SamTheCleric]

Thanks :)

@FlyMolo
Emberling established line of sight between A3 and B2. He is on the roof at H4

[FlyMolo]

H4, you say? Okay then. My emberling spots you from B2.

Hmmm, you're actually kinda far away. He moves to C3, maintaining LoS.

That's all.

I also move to G1, but he can't see that.

[SamTheCleric]

Erm, that H is a type.

D4. D4 D4

EDIT: That "Type" is a typo.

Gods.. What is wrong with me today.

[LtKeen]

Grushnak's Turn 5
Seeing as the emberling is within LoS, Grushnak might as well attempt an attack. I guess 20 feet up and 5-10 feet away would be within 30 feet.
(+10 base, +1 PBS, -4(overall entanglement))
Atk [roll0]
Dmg [roll1]
Atk if it threatens [roll2]
Dmg if it crits [roll3]

After that, Grushnak moves to what may or may not be out of LoS (need another LoS check)
refs: He moves to F5
That'll be all.

[FlyMolo]

Erm, that H is a type.

D4. D4 D4

EDIT: That "Type" is a typo.

Gods.. What is wrong with me today.

D4? That changes everything. Grushnak, do you mind if I change my actions?

My emberling finishes his move at C3, then manifests his last energy ray. [roll0] [roll1]

I move to G1 still, hiding. Hide: [roll2]

[FlyMolo]

Assuming you don't change your actions, my emberling takes 6 damage.

stats I'm hiding at G1, Hide check above. 6/5 hp, pp 7/8, IIRC. My emberling has manifested both his energy rays, in C3, hp 7/13

Edit: I'm done, you can go now.

[LtKeen]

Grushnak's actions don't change for turn 5, though I still need a LoS check. It's fine to take appropriate actions according to oint-of-view, though I believe you may not be looking forward to seeing Talic as much as I would, if he don't move outta LoS :smallwink:

[SamTheCleric]

Initiate Ref Sam

@FlyMolo
He steps back towards the center of the roof, breaking line of sight

@LtKeen
Line of sight is broken to the emberling.

[FlyMolo]

Ref question: What's the climb DC for the walls of the buildings? There should be one, no? Your "average wall in a dungeon or ruins" is a DC 20... Also, can my emberling light the haystacks on fire? It would sure be cool.

Also, which direction did Grushnak step in?

[SamTheCleric]

@Flymolo
You may need a more experienced ref for the climbing question. I was told on the sinking island map that since no DC is listed for the climb, it isn't possible without magical means (spiderclimb, etc)...

He stepped backwards to the center of the roof as he broke line of sight. (using the rules of the map, treating the whole roof as 20', even though it clearly is intended to be a peaked roof.)

[FlyMolo]

@Flymolo
You may need a more experienced ref for the climbing question. I was told on the sinking island map that since no DC is listed for the climb, it isn't possible without magical means (spiderclimb, etc)...

He stepped backwards to the center of the roof as he broke line of sight. (using the rules of the map, treating the whole roof as 20', even though it clearly is intended to be a peaked roof.)

Southeast? South? East? All are conceivably towards the center. I'm leaning towards southeast, I guess. So how do I get at him...

And no climb DC is kinda bogus. Way to exploit a forgetful mapmaker.

Edit: My emberling moves C3-D2 as a 5FS. If he can't see Grushnak, he's making it into a move action, all the way to E1.

LoS goodness?

[SamTheCleric]

@FlyMolo
South.

And as for the climb... get someone else to check. I think it should be the standard DCs listed in the SRD... but I'm not big enough to make those kind of decisions

[FlyMolo]

Can I get a LoS check for the actions above? It looks exactly like Sam did it, but that was a different question...

[LtKeen]

:smallconfused: ???
Just let me know when it's my turn.

[SamTheCleric]

Line of Sight-Man to the rescue!

Give me a second to triangulate the distances and get sonar online and I'll edit this post with the LOS.

@FlyMolo:

I'm going to say your Emberling gains line of sight when getting to E-1, as he is in the center of the roof at F5. 20ft up, 25ft out that puts the emberling at a distance of 32ft (hooray pythagorean theorum!)

@LtKeen:
You see the emberling move to E1 and look up at you.

[Talic]

High Ref Talic

@Flymolo:It's been ruled previously that if climb DC's aren't given, then it is not possible to climb without magical aid or other similar special ability. Also, to give the D&D distance to correlate with the pythagorean answer above, a character 20 feet up, and 25 feet distant, is 35 feet away. (diagonally up costs 1 square, then 2, then 1, then 2, and then 1 square horizontally. 7 total squares = 35 feet, for purposes of anything that requires range.)

[FlyMolo]

Hypothetically, would the emberling lose LoS if he advanced one square south? How about Southeast? Am I allowed to even ask that?

And I assume my hiding self can see him. Because he's equally far, just more over than me, right? So how far from F1 to F5? F4? Is there LoS from F5 to F4?

Clarification, then I'll get on with my turn.

[SamTheCleric]

High Ref Sam

@FlyMolo:
Yes, you have line of sight to him. It would be a tough call wether or not the emberling would lose line of sight one square up, I would say no, because the roof is -not- sloped, it is all 20'. yes there is line of sight from F4 to F5. Distance from F1 to F5 is 35' as stated by Talic. Distance from F5 to F4 is only 5' (in melee). I hope that clears everything up.

[FlyMolo]

Okay then. My emberling shoots the crossbow he's holding at you, then falls prone.

[roll0]AC 18 [roll1]

All done.

[LtKeen]

Grushnak's Turn 6
Grushnak fires another bolt towards the emberling, gently coaxing his bow to defeat the wood-eater(emberling)
Atk [roll0]
Dmg [roll1]
Atk if it threatens [roll2]
Dmg if it crits[roll3]

Action that requires a LoS check(refs)
Grushnak then moves on the roof to H5
After a LoS check, that'll be all.

[SamTheCleric]

@LtKeen
You can still see the Emberling, and its still looking up at you... but you do not have LoS to your opponet.

[FlyMolo]

Okay, that was too close. Thank goodness he was prone, otherwise that would have hit.

Can I still see you? I mean, my emberling?

[LtKeen]

Sorry, didn't realize that you didn't know, but it was in a spoiler. :smallredface:
The emberling and Grushnak have LoS, though Llince and Grushnak do not.
Also, it's your turn :smallsmile:

[FlyMolo]

Are you still in the same place? I don't really feel comfortable poking through spoilers. Unless there's not anything in there I shouldn't know?

[LtKeen]

It was a move action. Grushnak is standing in a different place, though still in the emberling's LoS.

The spoiler on my turn determines the location, though only the Emberling can see it, if that affects anything.

[FlyMolo]

1 mile telepathy. Always on. :smallbiggrin:

So where you at?

[LtKeen]

He's at H5. :smile:

[FlyMolo]

H5. Okay then.

I, llince himself, hide as I sneaky sneak sneak east. G1-J1, if no LoS(there won't be) to K2-L3, stopping if LoS is established. In theory, I'll still have cover in that first peeking, and still be able to hide. and my emberling moves to G1.

My emberling rushes off east(after standing up, of course). I'm not sure exactly where you lose LoS, but he passes it.

That's all, I'm done. Might need won't need LoS. I know where I am, I know where you are, and you can't see me. Great. Your go.

[LtKeen]

Seeing as Grushnak was affected by entangling ectoplasm originally in turn 2, the duration of entangling ectoplasm expires.
Grushnak's Turn 7
oh yeah, outta LoS again, to the spoilers!
Grushnak, no longer entangled, will take a move action to move to I2
If I see Llince or the emberling, I will make an attack with my crossbow(priority si in listed order).
If I see neither of them, I will ready an action. Whenever one of them comes into LoS, I will shoot them. Anywho, here's the attack roll for either condition.
+1 to hit and dmg if within 30 ft
Atk [roll0]
Dmg [roll1]
Atk if it hits [roll2]
Dmg if it crits [roll3]
Need a ref/LoS check for my final action, then my turn will end.

[SamTheCleric]

@LtKeen
As you get to I2, you can see him in L3

@Flymolo
You see him come to the ledge at I2 and looks down at you (no longer have cover or concealment vs him)

[LtKeen]

Well then a bolt fires at Llince: if 17 hits your AC you take 7 damage. And it's now your turn.

[FlyMolo]

It does. I burn some pp to make it hurt less.

5/8pp now, after mind thrust. 3/6 health.

I move to I1, you can still see me. My emberling loads his bow, F5S to H1, fires it at you. Then he and I fall prone, and I manifest at you.

DC 15 will save or take [roll0] Damage.

[roll1] [roll2] No idea what your AC is.

[LtKeen]

Will save [roll0]
If Grushnak makes the save then
Grushnak's Turn 8
Cursing to himself as he sees Llince fall onto the ground again, Grushnak tests his luck by shooting a crossbow bolt at him
Atk: [roll1]
Dmg:[roll2]
Atk if threat:[roll3]
Dmg if crit: [roll4]

He moves then out of LoS, disappearing at H3 (based on previous rulings)
He moves to G6
End of turn

if he doesn't succeed the save, I'll make a different post for the turn Wow, 1 point away from a critical. that's 6 damage then >_> On a final note, my AC's the standard 18 right now.

[FlyMolo]

Ow. Wait, how are you loading your bow?

That's a move action, right? Yeah, you have an xbow. So if you fired last turn, and moved, and fired and moved again this turn, you're missing a move action in there somewhere.

Must be. I swear. *gibber*

[SamTheCleric]

His move was legal. He has Rapid Reload, lowering it from a move action to a free action.

[FlyMolo]

I knew I was missing something. I have no idea what to do now, other than burn another pp.

pp4/8, hp 1/5

[FlyMolo]

Hiding, me and my emberling move to J3/J2. I'm in J3. We both ready an action. The action is to manifest a power(on grushnak), mind thrust for me, Psionic Daze for him. As a connected free action, we both will drop prone. The trigger for both actions is LoS on Grushnak firing at us.

[FlyMolo]

Stuff I forgot: Hide me[roll0] Emberling [roll1] By my reading of the cover rules, I have cover to Grushnak standing atop the building. strictest RAW, I'm afraid.

[SamTheCleric]

@Flymolo:
Does that complete your turn? No line of sight.

@LtKeen
No line of sight for you!

@Everyone
Spoilers are.. fun!

[FlyMolo]

That would be the thing I forgot to include in my forgotten things post.

I'm all done.

[LtKeen]

Grushnak's Turn 9
Grushnak imbibes his other potion of Cure Light Wounds that was in his backpack, preparing for another assault.
Cure Light Wounds [roll0]
Current HP: 11/11
That'll be all.

[FlyMolo]

LLince Round 9+-1 My emberling and I move to L/K9, and my emberling reloads the bow. I prepare an action to manifest mind thrust on Grushnak if he shows up within range of it. LoS trigger, 25 feet.

Done.

[LtKeen]

Grushnak's Turn 10
Grushnak will activate his tattoo of Metaphysical weapon on his crossbow, increasing its damage by 1. He will then take a 5 ft step to H6. He will ready the action of falling prone under the condition that either Llince or the emberling regain LoS before his next turn.
Need another LoS check. Also, this is a pretty interesting match even if it is long :smallsmile:

[SamTheCleric]

High Ref Sam

Line of Sight established!

Grushnak steps to the ledge at H6. Llince and his Emberling are in L/K 9 (which one is you, flymolo?)

Llince had a readied action on the establishment of LoS... as did Grushnak. Llince's resolves first....

Llince?

[FlyMolo]

Wait... I was in J3, so I'm in *alphabetical counting...* L9.

I mainfest mind thrust! Phzow! [roll0] DC 15, as always.

Wait, I am within 25 feet, right?

[LtKeen]

Well Grushnak is 20 feet up. That would likely make you you more than 30 feet away.
As for the Will Save: [roll0]
Watch this one fail. Grushnak seems pretty much immune to Mind Thrust :smalleek:

Also, Grushnak's readied action was to fall prone.

Oh, sorry. It's your turn now.

[FlyMolo]

It's actually impossible for me to be in L/k 9. More like L/k 7. In any case, it matters not at all.

I manifest. Roll another DC 15 will save. But this time It's for Psionic Charm! Bwahahahaha.

Rest of actions predicated on your save.

[LtKeen]

Well let's hope the almighty forum rollers are not angered by my Levitation symantecs discussion. Add +1 to the result if it is a compulsion.
Grushnak's Will Save [roll0]
*crosses fingers* either way, I fail. Do you ever run out of PP? :smallconfused:

[FlyMolo]

I have like 8. And I only have to spend one to take much less damage. I'm down to... something. 3 or 4.

You're charmed, bru. I shout up that we should go get a drink, on me, in honor of it being saturday. I recommend jumping off into the haystack. Since you're my best friend now, you jump off, and we go get a drink in the Arena bar. I insist that you exit first. "No really, after you." I win on a technicality, and we both go get totally sloshed.

[Bayar]

Ref Bayar

Going out of the arena would tehnically be something against the nature of a gladiator, since it results in a DQ. So I think that a charsma check would be in order.

Precedent:

GM Kyeudo

Someone just had to pull the Charm spells out of the box, didn't they. :smallannoyed:

Alright, since this is going to be setting precedent, might as well be me doing it.

Since your request is such a large one, Blaize will have to win an opposed Charisma check against Frizz to get him to surrender. Getting someone to agree to such a request seems like it would be a the very edges of the spell's power.

If that fails, Frizz will just try to be fairly helpful for the duration of the spell, meaning he'll do things like vouch for you, give help with a task, etc., but not something like giving you his stock of potions or gear.

[FlyMolo]

[roll0]

Here goes nothing. I have another 600 rounds of charmed time. Can I keep trying?

[LtKeen]

Charisma check [roll0]

as it reads here (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/charmPerson.htm)
Charm Person, since they are both effectively the same ability.
This charm makes a humanoid creature regard you as its trusted friend and ally (treat the target’s attitude as friendly). If the creature is currently being threatened or attacked by you or your allies, however, it receives a +5 bonus on its saving throw.

The spell does not enable you to control the charmed person as if it were an automaton, but it perceives your words and actions in the most favorable way. You can try to give the subject orders, but you must win an opposed Charisma check to convince it to do anything it wouldn’t ordinarily do. (Retries are NOT allowed.) An affected creature never obeys suicidal or obviously harmful orders, but it might be convinced that something very dangerous is worth doing. Any act by you or your apparent allies that threatens the charmed person breaks the spell. You must speak the person’s language to communicate your commands, or else be good at pantomiming.

Retries aren't allowed, though he may still fail. *gulp* Well, let's hope he gets it.

[LtKeen]

Well he won the Charisma check, somehow. Assuming that is his final action in his turn:
Grushnak's Turn 11
Grushnak will continue lying prone, watching Llince. "It sure is great to be up so high. This must be how the tall folk feel." :smallsmile:
That'll be all.

[FlyMolo]

"Aren't you going to come down? How are you going to get down, anyway? You had that tattoo to get up, but now what?"

Oooh, idea. I'll go and get backup. Backup inconclusive. Carry on.

[LtKeen]

Assuming that's your actions on your turn...
Grushnak's Turn 12
"Well, If I win, then I'll just get someone to fetch me a potion of Levitate. :smallsmile: If I don't win... well... getting down shouldn't be a problem."

[Uthug]

Sorry for interrupting here but there was something I thought I should point out. Since Grushnak is being threatened by Llince, shouldn't he receive a +5 bonus on his will save, which means that he passes it and is not charmed?

[LtKeen]

Well the charm spell happened when we reestablished LoS, and we weren't really within each other's threat range, or even attacking when LoS was established. Also nothing else was in LoS. Whether or not Grushnak is being threatened by the definition of Psionic Charm Person though, would be up to a ref. I assumed it wasn't, given the circumstances.

I'll go fetch a ref though, just in case.

[SamTheCleric]

High Ref Sam

I don't believe there's any strict ruling one way or the other on "threatening" someone. As this is an arena and the goal is to rip each other's face off and commit acts of nature on one another... I would say that... yes, you would get the +5 to your will save. There may be precedent ruling the other way, so if you are unsatisfied with my ruling, we can get another ref in here to weigh in on it.

[FlyMolo]

The question is what threatened means in this context. It does have a very specific meaning in combat.

[SamTheCleric]

High Ref Sam

For the sake of simplicity, do you guys want to just keep playing it out as is... it seems as though you both are ok with the way it was going... even LtKeen defended the failure...

[Bayar]

High Ref Sam

I don't believe there's any strict ruling one way or the other on "threatening" someone. As this is an arena and the goal is to rip each other's face off and commit acts against nature on one another... I would say that... yes, you would get the +5 to your will save. There may be precedent ruling the other way, so if you are unsatisfied with my ruling, we can get another ref in here to weigh in on it.

Fixed it for you. Wow, my quotes are popular around here :smallbiggrin:

Threaten means holding a weapon in a threatening mode, being in an adjactent square to another enemy and wielding a weapon does that. Threatened squares, remember ?

[FlyMolo]

"Okay, look. I don't really want to fight you, you don't really want to fight me. It hurts. Toss me your xbow and I'll meet you by the haystacks for a rousing game of Rock Paper Scissors."

Best of all, we're still in the middle of my turn. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TalkingIsAFreeAction) :smallbiggrin:

[LtKeen]

From here (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsincombat.htm)
Speak
In general, speaking is a free action that you can perform even when it isn’t your turn. Speaking more than few sentences is generally beyond the limit of a free action.
A few sentences, a few sentences =)

"I don't know about you, but I'm a goblin. We live for combat. How else do we stand out from our millions of brothers and sisters? Silly tall folk."

Finally, lol at Bayar's sig :smallsmile:

[FlyMolo]

That's okay, I really just wanted to link to Tv tropes.

"Well, come the hell down and play some rock paper scissors! We can even play War if you've got cards on you."

[LtKeen]

I don't think that Grushnak would regard the emberling as friendly.

"Not now, I'm supposed to be fighting you.... though I can't bring myself to do it now. That moving crossbow eater, however..." clenching his fists a bit more tightly around his weapon, "He must be taken care of."

[Talic]

There is an arena precedent for Charm Person.

@refs:In the first match charm was used to win, the +5 bonus was denied because the caster had taken no threatening actions. By the SRD entry, I'd interpret "being threatened" beyond the "in a square that the player threatens". It should also include: Previously attacked this match, brandished weapons, intimidate, and the like. Posting by Chilligod in aforementioned match seems to support the brandished weapon directly.

[LtKeen]

so what's the ruling? :smallconfused:

[Talic]

@refs:Actions which qualify as Llince or his ally acting in a threatening manner were taken in post 67 of this thread.

Grushnak gains the +5 bonus to his saving throw, on account of having been threatened/attacked by Llince or his ally this match.

[LtKeen]

that would make the overall result 19 (13 result, +1 compulsion, +5 circumstance), meaning the charm would've failed. The attempting charming happened on Llince's turn, which was after Grushnak's 10th Turn, so we should continue competing on whatever actions Llince will make for the remainder of his turn

[FlyMolo]

I resign. This isn't working, and I'd rather not drag this on longer than it needs to.

Good luck with Talic's Bobo. He's a beast.

The real question. Wipe the char and start over as a kineticist, or shoot for level-up?

[LtKeen]

This is getting pretty drawn out. I'm a bit eager to compete against someone with as much study into the game as Talic undoubtably has, and it was great match, Flymolo. If we ever meet in the Arena in the future, hopefully it won't be as tedious :smallsmile:

Lessee, I used up all 3 tattoos, 2 potions of CLW, and 4 bolts, I'll update them when this match is declared


As for the question, I personally believe that you should just make a warmage. The orb spells don't require saves, only attack rolls. I'm not overly familiar with psionics, but I do know their strength shows at the higher levels, and all I see with a level 1 psion is complication. Maybe Wilder if you want to stay psionic, for the extra manifester level.

[SamTheCleric]

High Ref Sam

Grushnak is the winner by way of forfeit.