Warforged Paladin?

[poignant123]

Well I was considering creating a Warforged Paladin. however, it's likely the campaign will start low level (level 3) and I wonder whether this would be a good idea.

Then again it might be more feasible to put it in fighter first than paladin and maybe cross into other prestige classes if I want to.

So can anyone suggest anything that would help make a level 3 warforged fighter or paladin?

[reorith]

cross classing fighter and paladin will only gimp your paladin abilities as things such as lay on hands and smite evil are dictated by paladin lvl.

[poignant123]

Both seem to get pretty good stuff for racial sub levels as a warforged. Paladin allows warforged to heal himself, while fighter warforged can get other bonuses like +3 to initiative and fear saves and such...

[MeklorIlavator]

Well, as a paladin, you already get immunity to fear, and your Cha to all saves, so that's better than a simple boost to will saves. Really, I'd go for either one or the other, as a Paladin's abilities do get better with more levels. Of course, once you get to 5th level the class goes down hill fast, so you may want to multiclass out of it at that point.

[poignant123]

Well depends on racial sub levels too. Warforged are a bit different in terms of paladin levels. They take -2 to charisma and wisdom, so will saves will be very crappy. Plus charisma would not be a main stat, since I'm concentrating on dealing damage. Instead I can replace Divine Grace with the racial sub levels and get increase to will save equal to con bonus, which warforged get a + 2 in.

True though, after level 5 when you get immunity to fear, paladin doesn't have as much appeal. Either I could multiclass into fighter or take a prestige class (naturally to avoid XP penalties)

[ShneekeyTheLost]

I would suggest Paladin to start out with. Pal3 nets you Cha to all saves, immunity to fear, Lay on Hands (which can be used to heal yourself with the racial sub-levels), and Detect Evil at will.

From there, you have two choices:

1) Continue Pal to 5th, then do something else. And by something else, I really mean just about anything else, because the class starts to really stink after that.

2) Dip a couple levels in Fighter for a couple extra feats. It means you may never go back to being a Paladin, but that's okay, the only thing you've really lost is the Turn attempts for powering various feats and the mount.

A suggested direction to build for:

Pal5/Warpriest10/Pious Templar 5. This build is all about being a holy war machine. You don't really care about the half casting progression, since your spells suck anyways, so you get a whole bunch of nifty abilities, including Haste, Hero's Feast, and Mass Heal. Finish off with something that has full BAB and nifty abilities you want. On top of that, Mettle from Pious Templar gives you effectvely Evasion for your Fort and Will saves, and a bonus feat to replace a feat requirement with.

[Project_Mayhem]

If you're using ToB, I've found that warforged make rather good Crusaders, a class with similar fluff to a Paladin.

+2 to con, a starting AC of 20 odd, and DR 2/Adamantium, combined with the awesome defensive abilities of a crusader has worked very well in the low level camaing i'm in at the moment.

[Tsotha-lanti]

cross classing fighter and paladin will only gimp your paladin abilities as things such as lay on hands and smite evil are dictated by paladin lvl.

Lay on hands sucks anyway.

Paladin 5 (charging smite)/fighter X/pious templar 10/something else Y. Smite that!

Paladin is a 4 or 5 level class anyway, then you have to PrC out to something good.

[mithrandir86]

If you're using ToB, I've found that warforged make rather good Crusaders, a class with similar fluff to a Paladin.

+2 to con, a starting AC of 20 odd, and DR 2/Adamantium, combined with the awesome defensive abilities of a crusader has worked very well in the low level camaing i'm in at the moment.

I agree; the Crusader is a good choice for the party role that you're looking for. They can heal themselves and the party with their manuevers and stances, something sorely needed at lower levels. They do decent damage as well.

If that is not enough, they are just much more fun to play. Rather than spend every turn attacking, you have a number of cool manuevers that you can use.

[Chronos]

Lay on hands sucks anyway.

Paladin 5 (charging smite)/fighter X/pious templar 10/something else Y. Smite that!

Paladin is a 4 or 5 level class anyway, then you have to PrC out to something good.Y'know, if you take more than 4 or 5 levels in paladin, Lay On Hands doesn't suck any more. It never quite compares to Heal, but it's still a mighty big chunk of healing to let loose in a single action. It'll also insta-kill (or at least gravely injure) most undead, with no save or SR.

[mithrandir86]

True enough.

I should mention that Warforged Paladins have racial substitution levels in Races of Eberron, which, oddly enough, affect the first 3 levels of Paladin.

1) You can smite constructs (which costs nothing in terms of trade-offs).

2) You can add your Constitution bonus to Will Saves instead of taking Divine Grace. You also get Repair Damage instead of Lay on Hands. This allows you to repair your Con bonus x your Paladin level damage, or heal living creatures half that. You can't use it to attack undead.

3) You are immune to stunning. This replaces Divine Health (because you're immune to diseases and poisons anyway).

If you do decide to go with the Paladin, I highly recommend you consider the racial substitution levels.

[Tsotha-lanti]

Y'know, if you take more than 4 or 5 levels in paladin, Lay On Hands doesn't suck any more. It never quite compares to Heal, but it's still a mighty big chunk of healing to let loose in a single action. It'll also insta-kill (or at least gravely injure) most undead, with no save or SR.

It's still not anywhere near worth taking paladin levels. And if you are big on lay on hands, you can find PrCs that increase it but are otherwise better than paladin levels.

[poignant123]

Thanks for the advice guys, so I think I might take the racial sub levels and then paladin level 4, then start shifting into other classes, depending on campaign turn. In terms of character story development, I was thinking gray guard so he becomes cynical. Just a thought though. :smallbiggrin:

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Thanks for the advice guys, so I think I might take the racial sub levels and then paladin level 4, then start shifting into other classes, depending on campaign turn. In terms of character story development, I was thinking gray guard so he becomes cynical. Just a thought though. :smallbiggrin:Paladin 4 is bad. Be 3 or 5.

[The_Snark]

It's still not anywhere near worth taking paladin levels. And if you are big on lay on hands, you can find PrCs that increase it but are otherwise better than paladin levels.

If you're going for Smiting Charge, it is; there are no prestige classes that advance Smiting Charge. If you take Battle Blessing and use the Spell Compendium, paladin levels after 5th become fairly decent.

There are some fun prestige classes out there, though; Eberron's Exorcist of the Silver Flame is a pretty good one.

[mithrandir86]

Thanks for the advice guys, so I think I might take the racial sub levels and then paladin level 4, then start shifting into other classes, depending on campaign turn. In terms of character story development, I was thinking gray guard so he becomes cynical. Just a thought though. :smallbiggrin:

Ack.

The Gray Guard is not that interesting for a Warforged. No one really expected you to be so pious in the first place, and acting in a cold, machine-like manner all of a sudden is not going to surprise anyone. You say you're a Paladin, but most people will still see you as a cold, heartless relic of the Last War.

Seriously though, give the Crusader a try. Please. It'll be worth it, trust me. Or a Warblade. Warforged Warblades are awesome.

[axraelshelm]

okay the best smacker class for warforge in my point of view is the totemist of the Incarnum book loads of natural attacks plus projectiles lightening breath anyone? and the plus on con means you don't get gimped because your Soul melds are relative to con modifiers. I'm thinking of using the combination in the future games aswell as warforge/soul knife.
But if it's only core books then go with barbarian.

As stated paladin/ warforge gets gimped because of the mental stat minuses.

fighter warforge good but I never liked to play fighters plus that level 3s a killer!.

Anyway that's my views.

Now I need to TRANSFORM and ROLL OUT!!!

[Bag_of_Holding]

My favourite Eberron paladin build is: Paladin (charging smite, spell-less variant) 5/pious templar of the Silver Flame 8/Exorcist of tSF 7.

Full BAB, full smiting progression, better (and faster) spell progression + higher CL, more bonus feats (feats spent to qualify for PT compensated for the bonus feat from spell-less variant and 2 bonus feats from PT), and all exorcist of the silver flame goodness (your weapon considered silvered, good, etc etc).

[Hacktor]

consider reading "Races of Eberron" and selecting a few warforged paladin substitution levels :D

[quick_comment]

Ill second the crusader. Arguably, the healing strikes heal you just as well as repair spells, because they arent magical healing.

[woodenbandman]

cross classing fighter and paladin will only gimp your paladin abilities as things such as lay on hands and smite evil are dictated by paladin lvl.

But as a paladin those things are gimp anyway. As a warforged they are also gimp.

You, warforged paladin, will have terrible charisma, awful smites, and your lay on hands won't even be worth using on yourself. However... you have style. And I like that.

Paladin is usually worth a dip for Divine Grace, but you have trash charisma and wisdom. I suggest you decide if you want it or not. Definitely check out those sub levels. In any case, take Sword of the Arcane Order and Battle Blessing, no doubt. Even if Battle Blessing doesn't apply to Sword of the Arcane Order spells, having wizard spells as a paladin is sweet. It means that, among other things, you qualify for the Master Spellthief feat (a feat all half casters should cheat their way into) to get you full caster level. You will probably want to start out as a spellthief if you go for that, meaning that your build will be very weird. Spellthief1(or 2)/Paladin2(Or 1) to start with, and at like level 9 with SotAO, you take Master Spellthief.

I agree with above poster suggesting a Totemist. If you can, shoot for Dragonborn, and take Adamantine Body anyway. That makes you win at life.

[Kaiyanwang]

Ill second the crusader. Arguably, the healing strikes heal you just as well as repair spells, because they arent magical healing.

Wow. Never thinked about it. Another reason, IMHO, to consider Devoted Spirit badly designed.

[kamikasei]

This thread is from over a year ago, guys. I suspect the OP has his answer.

[Roland St. Jude]

Sheriff of Moddingham: Please don't resurrect old threads (see the Forum Rules). This thread was almost a year and a half old.