Help with rougelikes

[Inhuman Bot]

I've been intreseted in rougelikes, especially tales of middle earth and Nethack. I don't understand how to play them very well. Any advice? I don't seem to be able to "E"at stuff in tome. Any advice would be appreciated.

[Bleen]

Play slowly and carefully. Expect to die a lot. Read the documentation, and read it thoroughly. It helps to know what all the commands are; a lot of them might have unexpected uses. I like Nethack; it has some flaws, but it's solidly-made, popular, and adequately kill-you-a-lot, too.

[Flickerdart]

Rouge-likes? Like...mascara?

Anyways, I hear Shinen the Wanderer is a decent roguelike-like game for the DS.

[endoperez]

I suggest that you start by playing DoomRL. It's got fewer items and fewer monsters, but it's very fast to play.

To survive in roguelikes, you must learn how to survive in the spesific roguelike (e.g. the controls, what you can eat safely, where you can find that, how can you heal, how can you identify stuff without a cursed item killing you, etc), but there are also lots of tactics and strategies that are common between the various games.

As an example: if you save all your good stuff until "a bad day", you're less likely to survive. Use what you have if you need it, there's always a chance of finding more.

Heal to max health if you can do so without losing anything. In DoomRL, use any healthpacks left in the level, in most fantasy roguelikes wait until you're fully healed before you continue, etc.

Learn when to drop the stuff that you don't need anymore.

Try to avoid open spaces, and try to have a way to retreat out of enemy line of sight.

[Blayze]

Play Castle of the Winds first. It's a Roguelite, especially since I hear other, more serious games have a way of deleting your savegames if you die.

[Penguinizer]

I'd recommend starting with simpler games like Stone Soup's graphical version of Dungeon Crawl, to get the basic idea of the controls and such. And then DoomRL, which is also good for getting the hang of it.

[endoperez]

Play Castle of the Winds first. It's a Roguelite, especially since I hear other, more serious games have a way of deleting your savegames if you die.

I'd advice AGAINST this. Don't get too attached to your characters. When a single mistake can kill them, you'll have to run away. When a single mistake means that you'll have to reload and try again, you won't learn when to run, and that will hamper you for a long time.

Knowing when to run away is perhaps the most important thing to know in a fight, at least in roguelikes. If you cannot win, get away.

[pendell]

There's a heap of good information on this site and multiple threads discussing Nethack.

Here is one (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=78633&highlight=nethack)

Expect to die a lot.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

[Inhuman Bot]

This will sound noobish but.... How does one go down stairs in Nethack? :smallredface: Walking over them doesnt give a y/n option.

[Cainen]

> is down.

< is up.

[Inhuman Bot]

Thanks, Cainen!

Edit: Floor 5: Someguy attacks bat! bats 1-8 attack someguy! Someguy dies... I check my posseions, and what do you know: I drank a potion of water, having no clue what it was. T urns out I had a full healing potion AND a healing potion in my inventory, I just did'nt have them I dentified. *SIGH* back to the drawing board.

[pendell]

Don't feel bad. 50% of the stuff you find in Nethack is harmful, so caution in drinking unidentified potions is warranted.

You were playing nethack, right? Some free advice (very spoilerish) that could have saved you:


1) Engrave "Elbereth" on the ground. Most non-human monsters (including bats) will not attack you as long as you're standing on that word. To do this, press "E" (capital E -- caps count). When you're asked what to engrave with, enter "-" to write in the dust with your hands. You can engrave Elbereth in 1 turn this way, but it will be very temporary. Further discussion follows:

A) With a low dexterity (<14) you will not be able to engrave "Elbereth" in 1 turn. Instead, you should engrave in 2 turns. In turn 1, engrave "Elber", then in turn 2, add to the engraving "eth".

B) Now that you've done this, stand absolutely still or you will smudge the engraving and be attacked. Do this by pressing the "." key repeatedly. If your pet is still alive, it will eventually kill the bats for you .. as long as you don't starve.

C) Want a more permanent engraving that will allow you to attack while standing on the square? Most sharp tools (daggers, swords) can be used to Engrave. It takes 1 turn a letter, so you should prepare the ground *before* you need it. But once done, you will have a couple of moves on the square without smudging the engraving.

D) Some artifacts allow you to engrave "Elbereth" in 1 turn. In addition, wands of digging, wands of fire and wands of lightning all permit the engraving of Elbereth in 1 turn. A wand of digging will be smudged if you move around on it too much, but a wand of fire or a wand of lightning will make a permanent "Elbereth" that cannot ever be removed, giving you a permanent safe square on the level.

E) Not all creatures respect Elbereth. Humans do not, nor do elves. But orcs, most animals, and all demons do. This will prove very handy later...

======================

Other hints:

B) If you haven't prayed recently, use the enhanced command "#pray". If you are low on hit points (and you are on good terms with your god), there is an excellent chance you will be given a quick burst of HP. However, to prevent abuse you can only pray once every thousand turns or so. Prayer is a last resort, since it can also be used to save you if you are weak from hunger. Food is hard to come by in the upper levels, so prayer is best saved for this eventuality.



These hints are spoiled because there are people who prefer to discover these things in game and not simply be told them. It took me ten years to learn this stuff, so I say the more spoilers the better.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

[Inhuman Bot]

Thanks!. My wizard is now doing great. Exp level 6 on floor level 8. A uncursed full heal and a pair of blessed heal, and a pemenant elberath on a chokepoint. Life is good. Which means I'll get eaten by a grue or something aaannny minute now.

[pendell]

Since I'm bored, let me fill you in on some of the dangerous characters you may encounter at this depth:

1) Team Ant.
#1 killer of players in Nethack.These are identified by 'a' if you're playing the text version. Killer Bees, Soldier Ants. They hit hard, they are faster than you, and they carry poisonous stings. Remember that all poison has a small chance of making an instakill!

To defeat:

Early warning, invisibility/displacement, Elbereth, use of pets, and just plain cowardice.

2) Mumaks

These are large elephant creatures. They are very slow but hit HARD. 4d48 damage, IIRC.

To defeat:
Be careful in dark place so you don't just blunder into them. They are strong but slow. Run away and engage at range with something like thrown daggers or arrows.

3) Nymphs.
Annoying creatures, they cause no physical damage but if they hit will steal one item from you. I have lost a number of creatures from being robbed blind. Fortunately, they start off asleep.

To defeat:
A) Don't do anything on the level that might make noise and wake them up (play a bugle, bang a drum , ring a bell, set off an exploding trap).

B) Use some form of early warning to know where they are so you don't blunder into them.

C) Attack them from a distance and do not let them get in range.

D) If you do wake one up, leave the level unless you have some form of early warning which will allow you to know where they are at all times.

Nymphs are low on hitpoints, and thus can be defeated fairly easily if you can just stay out of melee.

E) One last thing -- do not attack a nymph with wand of striking or the spell force bolt. If they nymph is carrying a mirror (which they frequently do), the mirror will shatter and the game will punish you. The game punishes you for breaking mirrors.


4) Werejackal/Wererat/Werewolf
The game will warn you when one of these is on your current level by occasionally printing the message "you hear a <were> howling at the moon". This is your cue to take extra care, especially around werewolves.

They are dangerous for two reasons: A) They can transmit lycanthropy and B) they can summon other creatures -- but only if they are in melee with you. Neither attack works at range.

Lycanthropy confers a number of useful attributes but is also problematic because you will periodically turn into a jackal, wolf, or rat, and when you do you will suddenly become heavily burdened (your current form is not as strong as your human one) and most of your armor will fall off.

Summoning monsters is an annoyance with jackals and rats, but is terrifying when it comes to werewolves. Why? Because they can gate in winter wolves as well as regular wolves, each of them capable of casting cone of cold.

To defeat:

The were's monster summoning and lycanthropy attack only work in melee range. So stay out of melee range and shoot them with wands/daggers/arrows/crossbow bolts/darts/rocks.


5) Elves.
Elves hit hard, do not respect Elbereth, travel in groups, often carry bows and arrows and often have multishot capability with same bows. Just stay away from them until you've got your armor class down low. Or play chaotic alignment. Elves are chaotic and will not typically attack another chaotic.

One advantage to killing them is they have some of the best armor in the game. You may also find it useful to eat one or two if you're not playing an elf yourself.

Respectfully,

Brian P.