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View Full Version : Need help making a 20+ character (4e)



xirr2000
2008-06-01, 02:28 AM
Its kinda making my head spin trying to make a 23rd level conversion for a wizard I was playing. I kinda don't like that he can only cast one fireball per day, seems weird but I do like the system overall. Anyhoo, any examples of higher level toons out there for me to look at as a meter stick?

I'm also trying to figure out what level/how many magic items he should have so any advice on this would be nice as well, thanks.

InaVegt
2008-06-01, 02:41 AM
Its kinda making my head spin trying to make a 23rd level conversion for a wizard I was playing. I kinda don't like that he can only cast one fireball per day, seems weird but I do like the system overall. Anyhoo, any examples of higher level toons out there for me to look at as a meter stick?

I'm also trying to figure out what level/how many magic items he should have so any advice on this would be nice as well, thanks.

According to the DMG, a level X (With X being higher than 1) character starts with as much mundane items as he wants (within reason), gold equal to a magic item of level X-1, and three magic items (levels: X-1, X, and X+1)

Anyway, creating higher than level 1 character shouldn't take much more time, in fact, I'm gonna try creating one now.

JaxGaret
2008-06-01, 02:54 AM
I kinda don't like that he can only cast one fireball per day, seems weird but I do like the system overall.

There's also Fire Burst and Combust, which are basically Fireballs by a different name (except for the half damage on a miss mechanic), and are Encounter powers to boot.

xirr2000
2008-06-01, 02:57 AM
Well I'm making a wizard and writing down all hits spells and stuff, dailys and utility is taking some time. I'm having to make a list of what he would have gotten as he leveled, then I still have to go back and see if there are any he would have swapped out along the way as he levelled and was able to do so. It is a bit time consuming. Here is a list of what I came up with so far, i'm sure this can be improved on:

Daily: Acid Arrow, Sleep, Web, Fireball, Lightning Serpent, Wall of Fire, Blast of Cold, Resilient Sphere, EBT, Disintegrate, Cloudkill, Destructive Salutation,

Utilitiy: Expeditious Retreat, Feather Fall, Dimension Door, Invisibility, Blur, Resistance, Soul Burn, Arcane Gate, Displacement, Stoneskin, Mass Fly, Timestop

Encounter: Chain Lightning, Mesmeric Hold, Crushing Titans Fist, Prismatic Burst


23re level wizard, blood mage paragon tier. I'll take any suggestions I can take :) Seems weird he only has a few encounter, then must hit up dailys or be forced to use his at-wills.

InaVegt
2008-06-01, 03:26 AM
Remember, you exchange lower levels for higher levels. Even a 30th level character has just 4 dailies, 4 encounters, and 2 at wills. And all of these are the 'upgrade' level or lower.

So, the dailies would be:

1 of 29 or lower
1 of 25 or lower
1 of 20 (your pp daily)
1 of 15 or lower

The only ones you just keep getting more of are the utility powers.

xirr2000
2008-06-01, 03:36 AM
Remember, you exchange lower levels for higher levels. Even a 30th level character has just 4 dailies, 4 encounters, and 2 at wills. And all of these are the 'upgrade' level or lower.

So, the dailies would be:

1 of 29 or lower
1 of 25 or lower
1 of 20 (your pp daily)
1 of 15 or lower

The only ones you just keep getting more of are the utility powers.

It is my understanding that every time a wizards hits a level where he gets a new daily/utility or can learn a different one, he can learn 2 of them, even though he can only memerize fewer, he still gets them in his spellbook which he can then use to decide when he "memorizes" his daily allotment. So he will still have quite a few to choose from.

Or am I reading that wrong?

JaxGaret
2008-06-01, 03:37 AM
Seems weird he only has a few encounter, then must hit up dailys or be forced to use his at-wills.

Don't forget that you get 3 Daily powers from your items, plus 1 more item Daily every Milestone.

You can also glean extra Encounter powers from racial features.

xirr2000
2008-06-01, 03:42 AM
Also, I've noticed that some "utility" spells are also encounter. Do these count as utility spells or encounter for purposes of being in yoru spellbook and what they take up from the spells you can cast ?

InaVegt
2008-06-01, 03:46 AM
It is my understanding that every time a wizards hits a level where he gets a new daily/utility or can learn a different one, he can learn 2 of them, even though he can only memerize fewer, he still gets them in his spellbook which he can then use to decide when he "memorizes" his daily allotment. So he will still have quite a few to choose from.

Or am I reading that wrong?

From the wizard class:


If you replace a spell because of gaining a level or through retraining, the previous spell vanishes from your spellbook and is replaced by the new spell.

So, you won't.

Also, for the purposes of learning (and I think also how other powers interact with them), utility spells are their own distinct category, no matter how often you can use them.

xirr2000
2008-06-01, 03:59 AM
Ya, but I'm not replacing spells when I get access to a new one, I learn it and add it to my spell book.


Each time you gain a level that lets you select a
daily spell or a utility spell, choose two different daily
spells or utility spells of that level to add to your book.

There is no replacing here, just adding to the spells available in the spell book. If I do decide to replace a spell when I level, then ya, it goes bye-bye.

Anyhoo, are there any high level character examples that have been posted?

InaVegt
2008-06-01, 05:36 AM
Ya, but I'm not replacing spells when I get access to a new one, I learn it and add it to my spell book.



There is no replacing here, just adding to the spells available in the spell book. If I do decide to replace a spell when I level, then ya, it goes bye-bye.

Anyhoo, are there any high level character examples that have been posted?

And if you don't replace spells, you don't get higher level ones.